The Myth That Refuses To Die

[Flanders]

Teachers are underpaid.

The fact is that:

. . . teachers actually do quite well for themselves when you consider the economic realities of their profession.

XXXXX​

Then there is the matter of demand — or lack of it. According to Andrew Coulson at the Cato Institute, since 1970 the public-school workforce has roughly doubled, from 3.3 million to 6.4 million (predominately teachers), while over the same period, the enrollment of children rose by only 8.5 percent — or a rate that was 11 times slower. Recently, the National Council on Teacher Quality found that schools are training twice as many elementary-school teachers as they need every year.

With this kind of surplus, the question we really should be asking is: How are teachers’ salaries so high?

Are teachers underpaid? Let’s find out
By: David Harsanyi
7/25/2014 08:33 AM

Are teachers underpaid? Let's find out | Human Events

This is the secret Democrats guard like Fort Knox. Open-borders will increase the education industry’s tax dollar funded customer base by tens of millions which converts to hundred of billions paid to the economic and intellectual foundation of the parasite class. And that is on top of the tens of billions of tax dollars education industry parasites already get. In precise terms the salaries of everybody in the education industry from teachers to bloated administrative staffs to building maintenance personnel will further enrich the government middle class at the same time it destroys the private sector.

It’s for children is the lie that feeds the myth.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Interesting, Flanders. I do know that teachers are very well paid and that they also get a very long vacation - all summer long!

 

[initforme]

Nice Troll thread. Teachers are destroying the private sector. Nice try. The real myth is that you expect good teachers but don't want to pay them. Overpaid? I say underpaid for putting up with all the problems kids today come in with.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Oy vey. First they create the problem with nonsense teaching of evolution and banning God from the classroom and now they want to complain they have a discipline problem. Please make up your minds!

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

Next it will be our fault that the children didn't learn anything from "Common Core" education! Meanwhile back in 2010 you were getting this warning which you all ignored............

 

[Flanders]

Teachers are destroying the private sector.

To initforme: True in that the parasite class is destroying the private sector, the country, individual liberties, and everything else that made America great. Teachers created the parasite class.

The real myth is that you expect good teachers but don't want to pay them.

To initforme: Exactly what is a good teacher?

And the only thing I expect is teachers paid with tax dollars being limited to teaching the three R’s. Public-school teachers already destroyed three generations of children with Socialist garbage instead of building the solid foundation the three R’s provide. The record shows that reading and ‘riting skills are so bad that many high school graduates from the public-school system can barely function, and I won’t even get into the third R —— ‘rithmatic —— à la Common Core.

After children learn the three R’s it should be the responsibility of their parents to continue their educations in private sector schools including trade schools.

NOTE: American children are not taught the truth about America’s founding; so it would be better to teach them nothing rather than to teach them Socialism’s lies. The curriculums in private sector schools being run by the profit motive cannot do worse than did the curriculums in public-schools dictated by the government.

The salaries of teachers in private sector schools should be determined by this:

Alas, neither liberal think tanks nor explainer sites have the capacity to determine the worth of human capital. And contrasting the pay of a person who has a predetermined government salary with the pay earned by someone in a competitive marketplace tells us little. Public-school teachers’ compensation is determined by contracts negotiated long before many of them even decided to teach. These contracts hurt the earning potential of good teachers and undermine the education system. And it has nothing to do with what anyone “deserves.”

So if teachers believe they aren’t making what they’re worth — and they may well be right about that — let’s free them from union constraints and let them find out what the job market has to offer. Until then, we can’t really know. Because a bachelor’s degree isn’t a dispensation from the vagaries of economic reality. And teaching isn’t the first step toward sainthood. Regardless of what you’ve heard.

Are teachers underpaid? Let’s find out
By: David Harsanyi
7/25/2014 08:33 AM

Are teachers underpaid? Let's find out | Human Events​

​

Overpaid? I say underpaid for putting up with all the problems kids today come in with.

To initforme: There are no problems with the youngest children learning the three R’s that a competent teacher cannot handle. The real problems come with older children being pumped full of Socialist garbage like multiculturalism and diversity.

Finally, aside from being unconstitutional, subsidizing higher education with tax dollars is the biggest ripoff of all. Liberals always talk about the children but they never justify one adult being forced to pay for another adult’s education.

 

[initforme]

I respectfully disagree with the premise of the post. Blaming teachers for creating a parasitic class is quite out there. Teachers where I live top out at fifty some thousand dollars which to me is, a small income for what they provide. In fact I don't know of one wealthy teacher. I see the Cato institute mentioned, red flag for me right there. Blaming teachers is nothing but using an easy scapegoat. I see your problem is purely related to money. Why should a public worker make a wage that they can live on right? Destroying the private sector is because of teachers? The teachers where I live onlystrengthen the private sector by providing and prepping kids for college so they can be successful. No socialism is taught.

 

[Flanders]

Blaming teachers for creating a parasitic class is quite out there.

To initforme: Not really when you know how it was done.

Start with the earliest Socialists in the late 19th century, and try to imagine a Supreme Deity priesthood doing the things Socialists get away.

Organized religions in America operated on voluntary contributions. Many churches ran charitable institutions, hospitals, soup kitchens, etc., while the recipients of religion-based charities could hardly be called parasites, and certainly not a parasite class.

NOTE: The Salvation Army is a 19th century religion that did the things American Socialists could have done to help the poor if Socialists admitted to being priests. At that time teachers were the intellectual force that kept their beliefs from morphing into another religion. There was one major problem with their agenda. Religions openly proselytize when they hand out bread. Rice Christians in China is the most obvious example of how it works.

Nobody was going to donate to Socialism’s priesthood so long as it avoided the label of religion not to mention having to compete in a crowded field. That meant that Socialists could hardly proselytize since they swear Socialism is not a religion, yet if Socialists did not compete their religion would die on vine. So they had to find a way to acquire the reputation of traditional priests without running afoul of the First Amendment. Forcing Americans to support their “good works” was the only way the Socialist priesthood could get the respect generally accorded to men of the cloth. The XVI Amendment (1913) provided the machinery Socialists needed to proselytize without actually being required to defend their religion. Teachers do just that even if the individual teacher might not be a Socialist.

Teachers where I live top out at fifty some thousand dollars which to me is, a small income for what they provide. In fact I don't know of one wealthy teacher.

To initforme: I do not know of one teacher who is not well-off in retirement.

Extraordinary wealth is not the issue. The wealth of the nation is slowly being transferred to the parasite class, primarily parasites in the education industry. No other group living on tax dollars comes close to the amount of money that goes to the education industry. I doubt if the parasites who get seats at the public trough through the Affordable Care Act —— 1/6th of the nation’s economy —— will absorb more wealth than the parasites in the education industry. Education industry parasites already control AND INFLUENCE far more than 1/6th of the nation’s economy —— and they’ve been at it a lot longer than healthcare hustlers.

NOTE: Teachers have been the driving force pushing socialized medicine as far back as Teddy Roosevelt.

I see the Cato institute mentioned, red flag for me right there.

To initforme: You and Harry Reid.

Blaming teachers is nothing but using an easy scapegoat. I see your problem is purely related to money.

To initforme: My problem is the difference between voluntary and coercion. Liberals pretend there is no difference.

Why should a public worker make a wage that they can live on right?

To initforme: Necessary civil servants deserve top pay. Tax dollar parasites deserve nothing.

Destroying the private sector is because of teachers? The teachers where I live onlystrengthen the private sector by providing and prepping kids for college

To initforme: Wonderful! One level of teachers indoctrinating children so they can feed them to their parasite pals in higher education.

so they can be successful.

To initforme: Preparing kids for a government job is not success. The other kids will be successful without the indoctrination.

No socialism is taught.

To initforme: Deny it if you must, but American teachers are teaching the joys of a Socialist theocracy.

 

[regent]

Teachers spend four or five years in college learning to be a teacher and then almost half quit teaching in the first five years they teach.

 

[initforme]

That is correct because when one becomes a teacher they have forfeited their ability to earn a lot more in the private sector. They have sacrificed their earning potential big time.

 

[Mad Scientist]

One of my Community College teachers said that very thing; "Thanks you guys for saying that we Teachers should be paid more but believe me my paycheck is just fine!"

 

[Unkotare]

I think the argument can be made that compared to those working in other essential professions such as medicine and law, those in education tend to be less well-compensated. This is due to the notion of "public" education, of course.

 

[pismoe]

if teachers don't like the pay then why do they go to school to get jobs as teachers Unkatare ?? Teachers are s'posed to be smart but getting a [supposedly] low paying job as a teacher doesn't sound very smart to me . Maybe teachers oughta get jobs where they like the pay scale !!

 

[pismoe]

and a comment on medicine because it was mentioned as essential . Doctors always did good as Doctors but it'll be interesting to see how well they do in this age of obamacare . I hear that lots of experienced Doctors are retiring / leaving because of obamacare [HEARD] .

 

[Flanders]

if teachers don't like the pay then why do they go to school to get jobs as teachers Unkatare ?? Teachers are s'posed to be smart but getting a [supposedly] low paying job as a teacher doesn't sound very smart to me . Maybe teachers oughta get jobs where they like the pay scale !!

To pismoe: Exactly.

and a comment on medicine because it was mentioned as essential . Doctors always did good as Doctors but it'll be interesting to see how well they do in this age of obamacare . I hear that lots of experienced Doctors are retiring / leaving because of obamacare [HEARD] .

To pismoe: I read similar accounts of doctor’s bailing out in substantial numbers, while I never heard of teachers bailing out en masse because of income. Democrats are ignoring the facts and spinning the ACA like a top hoping their disaster will go away before November:

In a bit of dubious cherry-picking, a new Bloomberg article concludes that the Affordable Care Act is losing its effectiveness as a political issue for Republicans and is diminishing as a major issue. How do we know the end is near-ish? Well, so many Americans are “benefiting from the law,” theorizes Heidi Przybyla, that political ads are simply not doing the job anymore.

The spin stops when the insurance industry’s premium and deductible increases are released a few weeks before the election:

. . . GOP groups have plans to refocus on the ACA as soon as premium increases for 2015 are announced. As with any issue, the political impact of Obamacare is hitched to events surrounding the law. An ebb is not a capitulation. And there will be more Obamacare events.

Are Republicans abandoning the ObamaCare issue? Doubtful.
By: David Harsanyi
8/22/2014 10:19 AM

Are Republicans abandoning the ObamaCare issue Doubtful. Human Events

 

[pismoe]

Hey Flanders , I know Doctors and I have always had the best personal Doctors pre obamacare and I've never been rich so as a blue collar commoner I was able to afford the best Doctors for me and family . Now I see what obamacare will be in the future as I see [as examples] clinics in drugstores and I see electronic machines taking blood pressure and silly BMI on machines and the machines speak to you through little television screens on the machines that are in Wal Mart [humorous to see] . Previously Doctors were seen as being rich and that never bothered me as I figured that they got rich through their work of [Socratic oath] and education . Now some Doctors will retire if they prepared for national healthcare and many will get out due to all the rules being forced on them , from what I hear and read . I oppose obamacare simply because of the MANDATE which I see as being un-American . I also see more immigration bringing in foreign ' dokters ' that will be good enough for the rabble .

 

[pismoe]

OFF TOPIC but related to rates of pay . --- I knew a young 25 to 30 year old guy that was looking to join a big city police force . He was in the process of qualifying for the police . In a conversation he told me that he could understand corrupt thieving police [drug money] as police only make a sub standard rate of pay . At the time that rate for starting police was 56,000.00 dollars a year . I know this as at the time the big city had advertising billboards stating rates of pay . Like I say OFF TOPIC but related to rates of pay for so called essential services .

 

[Flanders]

I also see more immigration bringing in foreign ' dokters ' that will be good enough for the rabble .

To pismoe: This excerpt from a previous thread touches on your prediction:

Now, another horrible fact can be added:

Half of foreign doctors are below British standards

Half of foreign doctors would not be able to practise in Britain if they were subjected to the same level of scrutiny as British doctors, a study by University College London has found
By Sarah Knapton, Science Correspondent
12:01AM BST 18 Apr 2014

Half of foreign doctors are below British standards - Telegraph

Before the ACA was passed I said the it was an affirmative action program. “You can keep your own doctor” was an obvious lie at the time. Forcing white Americans to see non-white doctors irrespective of their competence was the goal. The predicted shortage of doctors guarantied that medical schools would lower standards in order to rush “doctors” into the system.

Admittedly, I did not see that the doctor-shortage would be partially filled by incompetent foreign doctors. That is exactly where the ACA is heading.

Standard Operating Hypocrisy US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

 

[initforme]

Insurance companies will come out just fine. They always have and they decide if someone gets care or not. If one single person in this country goes broke because they get ill, the system is flawed. If that happens we are valuing money over life.

 

[pismoe]

there you go , good to see my thinking being backed up Flanders . As a 64 - 65 year old I really don't care and I have good health anyway but I think that many young and older Americans will suffer . My parents are both gone so I don't worry about them , I worry about my Grandkids though . And yep , England is a mess with their NHS because [as one reason] many imported employees and docters don't recognize or won't comply with Western Standards of sterile conditions but these same imported work for less . By the way , I spent years over on UK , British , English / fureign message boards and had a lot of fun messing with the blokes , bloketes and wankers from blighty .