The Myth Of China Inc.

[NATO AIR]

fascinating reading from the Economist....

http://www.economist.com/business/displayStory.cfm?story_id=4352026

Reasons to be fearful
Foreign fears about the expansion of Chinese firms are often compounded by the murkiness of their ownership. Take Huawei, a telecoms firm that is the most global of any Chinese company, and also among the least transparent. Although technically private, its shares are probably owned by local state telecoms customers. It also has a $10 billion credit line from China Development Bank, famed for its loans to support state policy. Its founder, Ren Zhengfei, was a former People's Liberation Army officer. But the fact that no one knows who runs Huawei could weaken it. It has grown fast in a booming market, but its unclear ownership means it cannot easily get a stockmarket listing, nor reward staff with stock options. It may also hinder plans for overseas expansion—like a rumoured bid for Britain's Marconi—since potential foreign partners will be wary of a firm with such an opaque ownership structure.

Fears that Chinese firms are acting as the commercial arm of an expansionist state are thus belied by a more complicated and disorderly reality. The real reason to fear China's overseas expansion is quite different. Because Chinese firms have grown up in an irrational and chaotic business environment, they may export some very bad habits. As Mr Gilboy puts it: “when Japanese companies took over American ones, they mostly made them better. If the Chinese run foreign firms like they operate at home, driving prices down, misallocating capital and over-diversifying, that is genuinely something to fear.”
CONTINUE ARTICLE AT LINK

 

[rtwngAvngr]

My ex-wife just went to china to source fabric for her ribbon factory in India. she said the prices weren't great, the selection sucked, the language barrier was bad, and the food was ungood, even though everything looked like Bladerunner.

 

[NATO AIR]

My ex-wife just went to china to source fabric for her ribbon factory in India. she said the prices weren't great, the selection sucked, the language barrier was bad, and the food was ungood, even though everything looked like Bladerunner.

That's interesting. Chinese regime respect for the environment and replenishable resources is nil... something that will be a serious problem for them in the future (as it is for the former Soviet Union now). the environmentalists in this country think the US is bad, we're green and great compared to what China, North Korea, Russia, etc etc have done and continue to do to their lands.

China's rise may yet be overstated.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

That's interesting. Chinese regime respect for the environment and replenishable resources is nil... something that will be a serious problem for them in the future (as it is for the former Soviet Union now). the environmentalists in this country think the US is bad, we're green and great compared to what China, North Korea, Russia, etc etc have done and continue to do to their lands.

China's rise may yet be overstated.

Yeah, but hey, they're authoritarian, hence the left automatically loves them. What's up with that? It's so sick.

 

[Said1]

Yeah, but hey, they're authoritarian, hence the left automatically loves them. What's up with that? It's so sick.

That's so funny! On another board, I was reading that they (meaning the posters) think that China will naturally adopt all sorts of environmental measures since their economy is booming and they can afford it, unlike your Prez.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

That's so funny! On another board, I was reading that they (meaning the posters) think that China will naturally adopt all sorts of environmental measures since their economy is booming and they can afford it, unlike your Prez.

Oh god. Of COURSE they will. They're just naturally good people, as opposed to the bad white people.
:duh3:

 

[ekrem]

That's so funny! On another board, I was reading that they (meaning the posters) think that China will naturally adopt all sorts of environmental measures since their economy is booming and they can afford it, unlike your Prez.

Yes, Germany selling them alot of energy systemsbased on envireonmet-friendly technology.
EU and China need themself as EU sees future there.
over 100 mio pieces of chinese textiles were lying at European custom, and EU not letting in. Now this has been solved...

Solana, foreign Ppolitician of eu says they will exit the arms-selling ban to china.
Chirac and schreder gavt this promise months ago, and it seems, that now with EU-China talks over Textile dispute, this arms-ban was discussed too and solved in pro-Chinese way.
http://english.people.com.cn/200509/01/eng20050901_205816.html

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Yes, Germany selling them alot of energy systemsbased on envireonmet-friendly technology.
EU and China need themself as EU sees future there.
over 100 mio pieces of chinese textiles were lying at European custom, and EU not letting in. Now this has been solved...

Solana, foreign Ppolitician of eu says they will exit the arms-selling ban to china.
Chirac and schreder gavt this promise months ago, and it seems, that now with EU-China talks over Textile dispute, this arms-ban was discussed too and solved in pro-Chinese way.
http://english.people.com.cn/200509/01/eng20050901_205816.html

There you have it; China must be a morally superior Green Superpower after all. The EU couldn't be more misguided.

 

[ekrem]

There you have it; China must be a morally superior Green Superpower after all. The EU couldn't be more misguided.

i do not say they are green-energy heaven, but they are investing a lot in these technologies, otherwise china will be toxious with some day growing energy consumption.

To eu:
money lies there in china. they have same interests.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

i do not say they are green-energy heaven, but they are investing a lot in these technologies, otherwise china will be toxious with some day growing energy consumption.

To eu:
money lies there in china. they have same interests.

No. The money is here. China is nothing without the U.S. as a customer. And their growth will be hampered until they understand that the international community will not invest in chinese corps with mysterious management practices and inconsistent governmental interference. Did you read this article? What they have in common is a bad case of AMerica-envy, just like everyone.

 

[ekrem]

No. The money is here. China is nothing without the U.S. as a customer. And their growth will be hampered until they understand that the international community will not invest in chinese corps with mysterious management practices and inconsistent governmental interference. Did you read this article? What they have in common is a bad case of AMerica-envy, just like everyone.

it doesn't matter without american consumption of chinese goods, china will not grow 10% but 5-8%.

money lies in USA too from EU-Standpoint. but EU-USA trade-relations are developed.
So EU wants to do the same with China. That this could confront with american interstes is sure but not a holy-law for Europeans.

 

[ekrem]

Solana says EU still wants to lift China arms ban
http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/new...Z_01_SPI611923_RTRUKOC_0_UK-CHINA-EU-ARMS.xml


China-EU relations growing mature
http://english.people.com.cn/200509/06/eng20050906_206923.html

in EU supporters of lifting arms ban are argumenting: " china does not want to buy weapons, it is for them only prestige and gettinng out of discrimination"

 

[Said1]

There you have it; China must be a morally superior Green Superpower after all. The EU couldn't be more misguided.

No kidding. Kill the little guy and arm China. I guess manufacturing arms is "in" and making cars and stuff is "out".

Not a bad exchange though, buy our environmentally friendly tech AND our arms. Go Germany.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

No kidding. Kill the little guy and arm China. I guess manufacturing arms is "in" and making cars and stuff is "out".

Not a bad exchange though, buy our environmentally friendly tech AND our arms. Go Germany.

Stupid socialist fools!

 

[deaddude]

Yeah, everyone is pretty short sighted, giving arms to china is about as idiotic as us installing and funding the taliban awile back. In short, yes germany is probalby doing somthing they will regret, however the US calling them idiots is the pot calling the kettle black.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Yeah, everyone is pretty short sighted, giving arms to china is about as idiotic as us installing and funding the taliban awile back. In short, yes germany is probalby doing somthing they will regret, however the US calling them idiots is the pot calling the kettle black.

Those were different political times. we were fighting russian influence in the region. The real world is complex, with shifting alliances and decisions to be made. Your constricted and rigid thinking only illustrates the depths of your antiamericanism. Thanks for playing. You are dismissed.

 

[deaddude]

How is willingness to admit that we made a mistake antiamerican? If you think that America can do no wrong then you view is just as limited as the Michael Moore Robots who think that Amercia does nothing but wrong.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

How is willingness to admit that we made a mistake antiamerican? If you think that America can do no wrong then you view is just as limited as the Michael Moore Robots who think that Amercia does nothing but wrong.

The things we did may have not actually been mistakes, GIVEN THE CONTEXT IN WHICH WE DID THEM. You seem to perceive the world as some sort of static state.

What we did may have been the optimal solution at the time. Everything done in life can confound future events. If I could flash forward to the end of time and look backwards and figure out the one move which would solve all problems and then flash back to the beginning of time and do that thing, I guess I would do it. But I cannot do it, because I am not god. Also If I could do it, I would open a restaurant which exists at the end of time and continually loops itself through the destruction of the universe to the delight of it's diners.

We are time bound, however. I have Kissingers head in a jar. I put a turban on it.
:arabia:

 

[no1tovote4]

The things we did may have not actually been mistakes, GIVEN THE CONTEXT IN WHICH WE DID THEM. You seem to perceive the world as some sort of static state.

What we did may have been the optimal solution at the time. Everything done in life can confound future events. If I could flash forward to the end of time and look backwards and figure out the one move which would solve all problems and then flash back to the beginning of time and do that thing, I guess I would do it. But I cannot do it, because I am not god. Also If I could do it, I would open a restaurant which exists at the end of time and continually loops itself through the destruction of the universe to the delight of it's diners.

We are time bound, however. I have Kissingers head in a jar. I put a turban on it.
:arabia:

Milliways... Mmmmmmmm..... I am hungry for a steak, I wonder if you would introduce me to dinner?