The Milgram Experiment..The Power of Authority

[Procrustes Stretched]

I guess is what I'm trying to say is the Progressives have taken some tactic's the Nazi used and redesigned them to fit their agenda of "Change"

Edit to add: Sorry this went off topic. I will refrain and not hijack the thread.

well that's a leap in logic as well as reality.

nobody is going to be using Nazi tactics or methods, and nobody is using the Nazi playbook.

 

[Diuretic]

those were the days (sighing nostalgically)

you could perform an experiment without caring about the well being of the subjects and the results were more telling than today's namby pamby psych experiments where you have to worry about everyone's "feelings"

AND you have to run everything by the *spit* - "Ethics Committee"

 

[garyd]

Yet the resistance within Germany was as much founded by Christians as any other group. Dietrich Bonhoeffer a Lutheran pastor died in that Resistance.

By the way I've quit more than one Job when If felt they were engaging in abject stupidity or worse. Once I was shown the layout I would have left without ever participating.

This sort of reminds me a bit of an old joke:

A man walks up to this good looking gal in the bar and says, "Would you sleep with me for a million bucks?"

She thinks for a moment and says, "Well yeah I guess."

He replies, ":Hmm, would you sleep with me for five bucks?"

She Responds, "Say listen mister what kind of gal do you think I am?"

That, Dear lady, we've already determined. Now we are haggling over price.

 

[Valerie]

Originally Posted by YWN666 View Post
I remember studying this experiment in my college days. Amazing that some people can so easily be lead to harm others.




Drastic lengths? No one was actually hurt in the experiment. The subjects thought they were harming others but they really were not.

Yeah, when I learned of this experiment, that was my reaction. With a full understanding of all the implications of the results, I just couldn't get past the idea that it was some sort of sick version of candid camera or something.

Hey, Folks! Don't be disturbed, you can stop crying and shaking and vomiting now, you didn't really harm any one in the name of science, you've been punked!

 

[Ravi]

Hey, Folks! Don't be disturbed, you can stop crying and shaking and vomiting now, you didn't really harm any one in the name of science, you've been punked!

Yeah, much better to leave them thinking they caused physical harm or even death to the actor.

No one held a gun to these peoples' heads and forced them to participate in the study.

Who would be stupid enough to believe that they were actually killing or harming people in the name of science...that is a question I'd like to see studied.

 

[Valerie]

Yeah, much better to leave them thinking they caused physical harm or even death to the actor.

No one held a gun to these peoples' heads and forced them to participate in the study.

Who would be stupid enough to believe that they were actually killing or harming people in the name of science...that is a question I'd like to see studied.

No, what I'm saying is it would have been much better to not have done such a twisted experiment in the first place. For what?

In my opinion, the end does not justify the means of this experiment. You think it's okay because the people were stupid? I don't.

They were PAID volunteers who were duped and coerced. You don't think that's a sick scientific method? I do.

 

[Ravi]

No, what I'm saying is it would have been much better to not have done such a twisted experiment in the first place. For what?

In my opinion, the end does not justify the means of this experiment. You think it's okay because the people were stupid? I don't.

They were PAID volunteers who were duped and coerced. You don't think that's a sick scientific method? I do.

Not sure what being paid has to do with anything. One of them wrote to Milgram years later and thanked him for teaching him a valuable lesson...which in his opinion was to question authority. The guy applied for CO status so he wouldn't be forced to fight in Vietnam (a war he disagreed with) and planned on being a draft dodger if his status wasn't granted.

Anything that makes people able to resist something they consider evil can't be all bad.

 

[Valerie]

Not sure what being paid has to do with anything. One of them wrote to Milgram years later and thanked him for teaching him a valuable lesson...which in his opinion was to question authority. The guy applied for CO status so he wouldn't be forced to fight in Vietnam (a war he disagreed with) and planned on being a draft dodger if his status wasn't granted.

Anything that makes people able to resist something they consider evil can't be all bad.

That's a wonderful story of what one participant felt about the experience, but the end result for him does not justify the method of the experiment in my mind. He could have still learned to question authority.

The experiment itself proved only that people in 1974 (or whatever year it was) could be paid, duped and coerced into harming others, as if there was a shortage of other forms of such proof already in existence?

I agree it is scary people continued to participate and there is a lesson to be learned there, but my instinct goes even further to question the twisted method in the first place. Just my opinion, for what it's worth.

 

[YWN666]

Yeah, when I learned of this experiment, that was my reaction. With a full understanding of all the implications of the results, I just couldn't get past the idea that it was some sort of sick version of candid camera or something.

Hey, Folks! Don't be disturbed, you can stop crying and shaking and vomiting now, you didn't really harm any one in the name of science, you've been punked!

It was legitimate research of a very real phenomenon.

 

[Diuretic]

It's probably upsetting because it revealed a lot about human nature. But Zimbardo's experiment was even more upsetting and had many more detrimental effects on the participants than Milgram's experiment. But that revealed much about us as well.

 

[Missourian]

In general, more submission was elicited from "teachers" when:

• the authority figure was in close proximity
• teachers felt they could pass on responsibility to others; and
• experiments took place under the auspices of a respected organization.

Obeyed but justified themselves. Some obedient participants gave up responsibility for their actions, blaming the experimenter. If anything had happened to the learner, they reasoned, it would have been the experimenter’s fault. Others had transferred the blame to the learner: "He was so stupid and stubborn he deserved to be shocked."

When, in my mind, I honestly placed myself in this experiment, I could see myself following the experimentor's prompts. That is what truly terrified me about this experiment.

I know that I would have ceded my personal responsibility to the authority figure. I would have rationalized that the experimentor was an expert and knew that no harm would come from the experiment and that if harm did come, the experimentor, by overcoming my objections, would be held accountable for that harm.


Being presented the findings of this experiment gave me a better insight into my own predisposition to submit to authority. For that I am very greatful, for knowledge is indeed power in this circumstance.

 

[Sunni Man]

The German people had good reasons to do what they did.

They wern't brain washed or forced.

Someday America will reach that point.

 

[Anguille]

The German people had good reasons to do what they did.

They wern't brain washed or forced.

Someday America will reach that point.

Why don't you more clearly what you mean by that?

 

[KittenKoder]

Why don't you more clearly what you mean by that?

Basically:

Sunni is insane and so separated from reality that he sees things in a very skewed and altered light.

 

[Sunni Man]

Basically:

Sunni is insane and so separated from reality that he sees things in a very skewed and altered light.

Look who is talking!!!

 

[garyd]

Ever told a white lie? the difference is only in degree...

 

[Missourian]

The movie Compliance being released on DVD bought this topic to the surface in my home, and as a result, it is also being dredged from the depths here as well.

 

[daveman]

That explains why the Democratic and Republican Parties are so popular. It amazes me how many people get sucked-in to these 'cult-like' organizations. Once indoctrinated, it is exceptionally difficult to deprogram these people.

funny, most of the wingnuts here and elsewhere will tell you they dislike both parties. they usually only back a party position and that is always out of convenience, not loyalty to authority.


go figure

Actually, most of the "moderates" here rigidly follow leftist doctrine.

 

[Missourian]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZwfNs1pqG0]The Stanford Prison Experiment - YouTube[/ame]