The Market Wants More Stimulus

oh dear Lord I just gave you the list: police courts laws regulations etc.

You may not realize it, but "etc" is not a specific term.

why be so afraid to go with the first four terms???? Do you have any idea what point you are trying to make? Why not just admit you cant explain how a liberal stimulus would help people and then become a Republicans.

I'm trying to figure out what you're advocating. So many on the right talk about the free market. When you point out the downside of the free market, they immediately start carrying on about how they didn't mean this and they didn't mean that.

IOW, you're one of many. :eusa_angel:
 
Of course Obama would want another stimulus, without all this fake money floating the markets we would see the economy for what it is, true shit.
 
Of course Obama would want another stimulus, without all this fake money floating the markets we would see the economy for what it is, true shit.

What's the real value of a dollar?
 
You may not realize it, but "etc" is not a specific term.

why be so afraid to go with the first four terms???? Do you have any idea what point you are trying to make? Why not just admit you cant explain how a liberal stimulus would help people and then become a Republicans.

I'm trying to figure out what you're advocating. So many on the right talk about the free market. When you point out the downside of the free market, they immediately start carrying on about how they didn't mean this and they didn't mean that.

IOW, you're one of many. :eusa_angel:

If freedom has a downside please explain what it is. Also when will you finally explain how a liberal stimulus can help people.
 
The Market Wants More Stimulus: Why Oh Why Can't We Have a Better Press Corps?: Yes, Rita Nazareth of Bloomberg News, We Are Looking at You Funny Because We Know You Can Do Better Department

But if you read the Bloomberg piece carefully, what it actually says is that market players fear that the absence of a debt deal means no stimulus. So the actual fear is not that spending won’t be cut enough, it is that it will be cut too much — which actually makes sense, and is consistent with the action in stock and bond markets.

But how many readers will get that? The way it’s presented reinforces the false notion that the deficit is the problem.

More at the link.

I tend not to take advise from people like yourself who don't even know what a bond is
 
why be so afraid to go with the first four terms???? Do you have any idea what point you are trying to make? Why not just admit you cant explain how a liberal stimulus would help people and then become a Republicans.

I'm trying to figure out what you're advocating. So many on the right talk about the free market. When you point out the downside of the free market, they immediately start carrying on about how they didn't mean this and they didn't mean that.

IOW, you're one of many. :eusa_angel:

If freedom has a downside please explain what it is. Also when will you finally explain how a liberal stimulus can help people.

No sidetracks. I want you folks to explain what you want the US government's role in the economy to be.
 
I'm trying to figure out what you're advocating. So many on the right talk about the free market. When you point out the downside of the free market, they immediately start carrying on about how they didn't mean this and they didn't mean that.

IOW, you're one of many. :eusa_angel:

If freedom has a downside please explain what it is. Also when will you finally explain how a liberal stimulus can help people.

No sidetracks. I want you folks to explain what you want the US government's role in the economy to be.

Depends on the state... But in all to make sure the laws are being upheld. Stimulus and Bail-outs are not laws, they are unfair and massivly destructive.
 
But of course the markets want stimulus, and dont care about our debt atm.

If the markets were concerned about debt you would see the following:
Interest rates climb as our borrowers became less willing to lend, and stocks would fall as interest rates constrain growth.

But what we see is that interest rates and stocks are low. Suggesting interest rates are being driven down by people that would rather invest in low yielding bonds than in risky equities.

In short we should spend to full employment, or until we become constrained by the bond market.

BTW, nice krugman copy-pasta. Half of the people here will crucify you for citing him, the other half think hes a brilliant economist. Count me in with the latter.
 
If freedom has a downside please explain what it is. Also when will you finally explain how a liberal stimulus can help people.

No sidetracks. I want you folks to explain what you want the US government's role in the economy to be.

Depends on the state... But in all to make sure the laws are being upheld. Stimulus and Bail-outs are not laws, they are unfair and massivly destructive.

Bailouts are massively destructive?

So somehow letting AIG, goldman sachs, GE, JP morgan, BoA, CitiGroup, american express, GM, chrysler, and discover card all fail would have been constructive? because without TARP thats what would have happened. With Federal Reserve lending, that list grows to include companies like mcdonalds.

If the government hadnt bailed out those companies the entire world would be in a depression right now.

As for stimulus, your just wrong. Government should always pursue countercyclical fiscal policy in a depression, that is econ 101. Look at what we see now. Governments that practice austerity (ours included) harm the economy, basic fact. Greeces debt to GDP ratio has actually gotten worse since they cut spending.
 
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why be so afraid to go with the first four terms???? Do you have any idea what point you are trying to make? Why not just admit you cant explain how a liberal stimulus would help people and then become a Republicans.

I'm trying to figure out what you're advocating. So many on the right talk about the free market. When you point out the downside of the free market, they immediately start carrying on about how they didn't mean this and they didn't mean that.

IOW, you're one of many. :eusa_angel:

If freedom has a downside please explain what it is. Also when will you finally explain how a liberal stimulus can help people.

Freedom does have downsides. Do you think the freedom to sell meth on street corners would have a slight downside??

How can liberal stimulus help people? Regardless of whether its a good idea, the government could borrow enough money to employ every unemployed person repairing and building things.

Do you somehow doubt that the government could hire the unemployed?
 
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Bailouts are massively destructive?

So somehow letting AIG, goldman sachs, GE, JP morgan, BoA, CitiGroup, american express, GM, chrysler, and discover card all fail would have been constructive? because without TARP thats what would have happened. With Federal Reserve lending, that list grows to include companies like mcdonalds.

If the government hadnt bailed out those companies the entire world would be in a depression right now.

As for stimulus, your just wrong. Government should always pursue countercyclical fiscal policy in a depression, that is econ 101. Look at what we see now. Governments that practice austerity (ours included) harm the economy, basic fact. Greeces debt to GDP ratio has actually gotten worse since they cut spending.

Freedom does have downsides. Do you think the freedom to sell meth on street corners would have a slight downside??

How can liberal stimulus help people? Regardless of whether its a good idea, the government could borrow enough money to employ every unemployed person repairing and building things.

Do you somehow doubt that the government could hire the unemployed?

:clap2::clap2::clap2::clap2::clap2:
 
But of course the markets want stimulus, and dont care about our debt atm.

If the markets were concerned about debt you would see the following:
Interest rates climb as our borrowers became less willing to lend, and stocks would fall as interest rates constrain growth.

But what we see is that interest rates and stocks are low. Suggesting interest rates are being driven down by people that would rather invest in low yielding bonds than in risky equities.

In short we should spend to full employment, or until we become constrained by the bond market.

BTW, nice krugman copy-pasta. Half of the people here will crucify you for citing him, the other half think hes a brilliant economist. Count me in with the latter.

Krugman is dumber than you are.

The Markets are huge flight to safety right now. They care about debt that's why Greece and Italy are junk and Germany couldn't find buyers for their bonds; the USA is still the safest place to park money. That's why our rates are so low.
 
No sidetracks. I want you folks to explain what you want the US government's role in the economy to be.

Depends on the state... But in all to make sure the laws are being upheld. Stimulus and Bail-outs are not laws, they are unfair and massivly destructive.

Bailouts are massively destructive?

So somehow letting AIG, goldman sachs, GE, JP morgan, BoA, CitiGroup, american express, GM, chrysler, and discover card all fail would have been constructive? because without TARP thats what would have happened. With Federal Reserve lending, that list grows to include companies like mcdonalds.

If the government hadnt bailed out those companies the entire world would be in a depression right now.

As for stimulus, your just wrong. Government should always pursue countercyclical fiscal policy in a depression, that is econ 101. Look at what we see now. Governments that practice austerity (ours included) harm the economy, basic fact. Greeces debt to GDP ratio has actually gotten worse since they cut spending.


If the government hadnt bailed out those companies the entire world would be out a depression right now.

There, fixed.
 
But of course the markets want stimulus, and dont care about our debt atm.

If the markets were concerned about debt you would see the following:
Interest rates climb as our borrowers became less willing to lend, and stocks would fall as interest rates constrain growth.

But what we see is that interest rates and stocks are low. Suggesting interest rates are being driven down by people that would rather invest in low yielding bonds than in risky equities.

In short we should spend to full employment, or until we become constrained by the bond market.

BTW, nice krugman copy-pasta. Half of the people here will crucify you for citing him, the other half think hes a brilliant economist. Count me in with the latter.

Krugman is dumber than you are.

The Markets are huge flight to safety right now. They care about debt that's why Greece and Italy are junk and Germany couldn't find buyers for their bonds; the USA is still the safest place to park money. That's why our rates are so low.

Oh dont even get me started on europe....

Germany has a surplus. It had to pay extra because the market is preparing for a break up of the euro in which germany returns to its own currency and then repays bonds issued in euros with less valuable deutschmarks. not because it was worried about debt

Italy is a solvent nation. The problem is that it doesnt have control over its own currency so it may become illiquid. Illiquidy scares investors, they demand higher interest rates, higher interest rates maybe lead to insolvency. Its a victim of a self fulfilling cycle because the ECB wont act as a lender of last resort.

But back to US debt...

You partially made my point. If people thought the US had a debt problem like those countries, they wouldnt finance our debt. Of course creditors worry about their delinquent debtors like greece (altough the problem is more complex than you understand). But we arent one of those delinquent debtors, thats why their buying our debt.

And your missing a fundamental point about the bond market. The flight into treasuries show that the market is concerned about GROWTH. When a country has low interest rates the market has little incentive to buy those bonds. Why invest in US treasuries that yield 1.8% over ten years when you could invest in equities that might yield 10% in a year? The fact that the treasury can still find buyers for 10 year notes at 1.86% is because investors dont believe equities or other investments will have higher yields, and may even think theyll have a negative yield.

The markets arent worried about our debt. thats a simple fact.
 
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