The Lying A-Holes have stuck it to us again

[Care4all]

He is not wrong. All profits from our subchapter S corp are taxed as personal income - even though we do not touch them. It's the fact that we CAN take the money; not that we DO.

oh, no question about you paying yourself from the business in that manner....NEVER said he was wrong on that Chanel....

He implied that you take the money you've been paid and is being taxed and then use it to reinvest in your company and I believe he is WRONG on that....I believe your reinvestment in the business is done BEFORE you pay yourself an individual income from the business.

also, I believe he is wrong implying tons more in taxes will have to be paid by these individual small business owners, because the tax does NOT go up at all for the first $250k of taxable income, but ONLY for the money you decide to take as income ABOVE that amount....above the $250k will have a tax increase of 3.6%....but the first 250k is exempt from a tax hike.

 

[chanel]

You are right on that point, and it may only add up to a couple hundred dollars. I really have no idea. But my question is 3% here; 5% there, etc. What is the total increase? It's very easy to say "Let the tax cuts expire" but what else is on top of that? That is why small businesses are hoarding cash now. Too much uncertainty.

And the cost of living in NJ is far greater than other parts of the country. Couples earning $200K are not "rich" here in the Garden State. They may not deserve any sympathy; but they do not deserve to be punished for their success either. Federal rules should account for regional differences in my opinion.

Estimated median house or condo value in 2008:
New Jersey: $364,100


Read more: Cape May County, New Jersey detailed profile - houses, real estate, cost of living, wages, work, agriculture, ancestries, and more

 

[Care4all]

You are right on that point, and it may only add up to a couple hundred dollars. I really have no idea. But my question is 3% here; 5% there, etc. What is the total increase? It's very easy to say "Let the tax cuts expire" but what else is on top of that? That is why small businesses are hoarding cash now. Too much uncertainty.

And the cost of living in NJ is far greater than other parts of the country. Couples earning $200K are not "rich" here in the Garden State. They may not deserve any sympathy; but they do not deserve to be punished for their success either. Federal rules should account for regional differences in my opinion.

Estimated median house or condo value in 2008:
New Jersey: $364,100


Read more: Cape May County, New Jersey detailed profile - houses, real estate, cost of living, wages, work, agriculture, ancestries, and more

yes, very true the cost of living in new jersey is high!

I do think the thresh hold of above $250k could be higher to cover the high cost of living in some states....like begin it at a million instead....but that would take writing new law, i believe?

this is just letting the tax cuts expire, bringing the tax rate to what you were paying when clinton was in office and the first couple of years under Bush.... was it PUNISHMENT then?

Most of those making $250k on up to hundreds of millions did quite well under this tax structure during the clinton years???

 

[chanel]

But that's not even what this thread is about. Hidden taxes on the "rich" AKA $250K in the HEALTH CARE BILL! That's what's eating me.

 

[rightwinger]

But that's not even what this thread is about. Hidden taxes on the "rich" AKA $250K in the HEALTH CARE BILL! That's what's eating me.

Well, you can't have it both ways...

When the Healthcare bill was being written, the rightwing screamed "We can't afford it, we can't afford, it, we can't afford it" So they put things into the bill to make it budget neutral. They delayed implementation for some parts, added some revenue enhancements....all so the bill would pay for itself over 10 years

Then the rightwing complained that all the bill didn't take3 effect immediately, that there were taxes in the bill.

 

[Trajan]

But that's not even what this thread is about. Hidden taxes on the "rich" AKA $250K in the HEALTH CARE BILL! That's what's eating me.

Well, you can't have it both ways...

When the Health care bill was being written, the rightwing screamed "We can't afford it, we can't afford, it, we can't afford it" So they put things into the bill to make it budget neutral. They delayed implementation for some parts, added some revenue enhancements....all so the bill would pay for itself over 10 years

Then the rightwing complained that all the bill didn't take3 effect immediately, that there were taxes in the bill.

there were complaints it does't take effect right way because the taxes they will collect to pay for it will be spent on other things and then when 2014 comes around there won't be a lock box with that money sitting in it, how many times do you have to be bamboozled before you catch on, ala SS.

This was dishonest, adding a tax in to make the numbers fit is a end run if you are going to declare hey its budget neutral, every dollar you take from us, and put into gov. hands does not as we have seen painfully over the last 20 months especially, generate 1.50, that mantra is as dead as Kelsey nuts.

 

[Trajan]

He is not wrong. All profits from our subchapter S corp are taxed as personal income - even though we do not touch them. It's the fact that we CAN take the money; not that we DO.

oh, no question about you paying yourself from the business in that manner....NEVER said he was wrong on that Chanel....

He implied that you take the money you've been paid and is being taxed and then use it to reinvest in your company and I believe he is WRONG on that....I believe your reinvestment in the business is done BEFORE you pay yourself an individual income from the business.

also, I believe he is wrong implying tons more in taxes will have to be paid by these individual small business owners, because the tax does NOT go up at all for the first $250k of taxable income, but ONLY for the money you decide to take as income ABOVE that amount....above the $250k will have a tax increase of 3.6%....but the first 250k is exempt from a tax hike.

maybe I stated it badly, my point was as Chanel inferred, that in a phase like this were we are looking for people to add to their bus. we would make it advantageous to do so. Right now any cap gains or profit taken a straight income that could normally be deferred are being taken now, because no none knows if the rates will expire there fore, this will have a negative effect, they will take the payout and not reinvest, why should they?

 

[asterism]

NOTE, according to the irs, less than 2% of all couples earn more than $250k in taxable income.

And I seriously doubt all of those couples are small business owners, plus all business expenses are tax deductible or business investments as well are tax deductible so this "over $250k in taxable income" is the money that is going in to the hands of the individual owners and does nothing to the business itself.

All business investments are not tax deductible. It depends on the details, but some business investments are not eligible to be deductible until a loss is realized and then only at a rate of $3000 per year, and even that is still subject to the Alternative Minimum Tax.

 

[asterism]

NOTE, according to the irs, less than 2% of all couples earn more than $250k in taxable income.

And I seriously doubt all of those couples are small business owners, plus all business expenses are tax deductible or business investments as well are tax deductible so this "over $250k in taxable income" is the money that is going in to the hands of the individual owners and does nothing to the business itself.

yes thats true BUT 50% of the bus, in this country is generated by those in that bracket and above it.

If you are an S-corp. any profits are distributed amongst the shareholders according to % ownership and you have to report them on your personal tax return and pay the taxes at your tax rate.

Ergo if you are a business owner making more than 250K, you will take a big hit. These distributions are not taxed at a flat rate like the capital gains tax…they are added onto your income. Most of the time, a business owner doesn’t even see this money. It is put back into the business to be used as working capital or capital expenditures.


A huge majority of LLCs file as individuals also.

i think you are wrong....

if the businesses want to reinvest in their company, that is done PRIOR to taking the business's profit in individual income...not AFTER the owner takes his money, so it does not affect the business operating or investment income.

That is false. Some investments can be made with immediate write-offs, some investments are amortized, and some can only be used to reduce taxable income (again, subject to limits and AMT) after the loss has been realized.

 

[asterism]

He is not wrong. All profits from our subchapter S corp are taxed as personal income - even though we do not touch them. It's the fact that we CAN take the money; not that we DO.

oh, no question about you paying yourself from the business in that manner....NEVER said he was wrong on that Chanel....

He implied that you take the money you've been paid and is being taxed and then use it to reinvest in your company and I believe he is WRONG on that....I believe your reinvestment in the business is done BEFORE you pay yourself an individual income from the business.

also, I believe he is wrong implying tons more in taxes will have to be paid by these individual small business owners, because the tax does NOT go up at all for the first $250k of taxable income, but ONLY for the money you decide to take as income ABOVE that amount....above the $250k will have a tax increase of 3.6%....but the first 250k is exempt from a tax hike.

That's not true either. In order to hire new employees for a new line of business, I have to either have the money for their salaries and equipment first or I have to be able to immediately generate revenue from the activity. In the case of starting a project where there is no immediate revenue, that means I have to invest back into my business after tax. There is no line item on an 1120S for "money we're using next year to start a new project." As with anything, this is subject to many different details.

 

[asterism]

But that's not even what this thread is about. Hidden taxes on the "rich" AKA $250K in the HEALTH CARE BILL! That's what's eating me.

Well, you can't have it both ways...

When the Healthcare bill was being written, the rightwing screamed "We can't afford it, we can't afford, it, we can't afford it" So they put things into the bill to make it budget neutral. They delayed implementation for some parts, added some revenue enhancements....all so the bill would pay for itself over 10 years

Then the rightwing complained that all the bill didn't take3 effect immediately, that there were taxes in the bill.

So you agree that the "budget neutral" line was bullshit in that the healthcare reform doesn't pay for itself by cutting costs, it's does it by raising taxes on unrelated activity.

Amazing how that works.

 

[Care4all]

He is not wrong. All profits from our subchapter S corp are taxed as personal income - even though we do not touch them. It's the fact that we CAN take the money; not that we DO.

oh, no question about you paying yourself from the business in that manner....NEVER said he was wrong on that Chanel....

He implied that you take the money you've been paid and is being taxed and then use it to reinvest in your company and I believe he is WRONG on that....I believe your reinvestment in the business is done BEFORE you pay yourself an individual income from the business.

also, I believe he is wrong implying tons more in taxes will have to be paid by these individual small business owners, because the tax does NOT go up at all for the first $250k of taxable income, but ONLY for the money you decide to take as income ABOVE that amount....above the $250k will have a tax increase of 3.6%....but the first 250k is exempt from a tax hike.

That's not true either. In order to hire new employees for a new line of business, I have to either have the money for their salaries and equipment first or I have to be able to immediately generate revenue from the activity. In the case of starting a project where there is no immediate revenue, that means I have to invest back into my business after tax. There is no line item on an 1120S for "money we're using next year to start a new project." As with anything, this is subject to many different details.

how did all the small businesses clearing more than $250k a year in taxable income do it, before they were given the tax breaks and how'd they make out in the 1990's through 2003?

 

[Charles_Main]

Actually we complained that the taxes took effect before the bill. So they could make IT LOOK like it was budget neutral over 10 years. By collecting 10 Years worth of taxes to pay for 6 Years worth of program.

 

[shintao]

So you agree that the "budget neutral" line was bullshit in that the healthcare reform doesn't pay for itself by cutting costs, it's does it by raising taxes on unrelated activity.

Amazing how that works.

It depends on what costs, and why would anyone think health care was going to be free? Sounds like these pie-in-sky taxcut dreams to pay off the deficit. People need a living wage and benefits to survive. So you aren't going to cut wages & salaries, or the costs of research, or the cost of equipment and buildings, and adding more people to care for a bigger population growth. Get real!

 

[asterism]

oh, no question about you paying yourself from the business in that manner....NEVER said he was wrong on that Chanel....

He implied that you take the money you've been paid and is being taxed and then use it to reinvest in your company and I believe he is WRONG on that....I believe your reinvestment in the business is done BEFORE you pay yourself an individual income from the business.

also, I believe he is wrong implying tons more in taxes will have to be paid by these individual small business owners, because the tax does NOT go up at all for the first $250k of taxable income, but ONLY for the money you decide to take as income ABOVE that amount....above the $250k will have a tax increase of 3.6%....but the first 250k is exempt from a tax hike.

That's not true either. In order to hire new employees for a new line of business, I have to either have the money for their salaries and equipment first or I have to be able to immediately generate revenue from the activity. In the case of starting a project where there is no immediate revenue, that means I have to invest back into my business after tax. There is no line item on an 1120S for "money we're using next year to start a new project." As with anything, this is subject to many different details.

how did all the small businesses clearing more than $250k a year in taxable income do it, before they were given the tax breaks and how'd they make out in the 1990's through 2003?

The same way they do it today only with a better environment. In 2003 there was easier access to capital (business loans, credit cards, home equity lines of credit) and a higher threshold on AMT.

 

[chanel]

Here is the list of 15 new taxes that are in the HC bill. This was composed before the "reconciliation bill". Wow. I didn't see this real estate tax. Could there be more hidden?

15 New Taxes to Pay for the New Health Care Bill | Wall St. Cheat Sheet

 

[Douger]

You have exactly what you voted for.

 

[Micky G. Jagger]

Americans who think Obamacare should have done more outnumber those who think the government should stay out of health care by 2-to-1.

And yet a plurality of voters are ready to vote Obama's party out of office and install an opposition party that will not pursue that goal. Boy, that's a headscratcher, huh.

You lie like a cow pie.

 

[Greenbeard]

Could there be more hidden?

There's nothing "hidden," you just have to actually read something comprehensive on the law. Here's a section-by-section summary of everything in the law, in the order it appears. If you want revenue raisers, skip to page 57 ("Title IX -- Revenue Provisions"). This thread is about part of Section 9015.

 

[Meister]

Could there be more hidden?

There's nothing "hidden," you just have to actually read something comprehensive on the law. Here's a section-by-section summary of everything in the law, in the order it appears. If you want revenue raisers, skip to page 57 ("Title IX -- Revenue Provisions"). This thread is about part of Section 9015.

Dude, your a plant, no doubt about that.