The Lies, and spin about what happened in NY 26 Dist Election.

[Greenbeard]

The Ryan plan wasn't perfect, but it was a plan- with details.

Well, no, it wasn't. It actually was just a white paper with a lot of hand-waving (e.g. assumptions that the tax code would be tweaked in some way--without providing any details that could actually be analyzed by JCT--to get the revenue levels Ryan stipulated). He laid out broad concepts, there was no legislative language or policy detail to fill in the substance (read the actual budget resolution these guys voted for on April 15). His problem is that the high-level concepts he wrote down weren't very impressive.

The Dem plan is what?

Plan for what? Medicare? They've already taken the hard steps of laying down their foundation (with actual detail and legislative language--in fact, as I recall, the common complaint was that their proposals took up too many pages) and passing it into law. It essentially revolves around payment reform, delivery system innovations, data-driven quality improvement, and focusing on a transition toward a value-based health system. All proposals from here on will build on that framework, which is already U.S. law, not just a high-level concept paper whipped up by interns who like making graphs in Excel.

 

[Zander]

The Ryan plan wasn't perfect, but it was a plan- with details.

Well, no, it wasn't. It actually was just a white paper with a lot of hand-waving (e.g. assumptions that the tax code would be tweaked in some way--without providing any details that could actually be analyzed by JCT--to get the revenue levels Ryan stipulated). He laid out broad concepts, there was no legislative language or policy detail to fill in the substance (read the actual budget resolution these guys voted for on April 15). His problem is that the high-level concepts he wrote down weren't very impressive.

The Dem plan is what?

Plan for what? Medicare? They've already taken the hard steps of laying down their foundation (with actual detail and legislative language--in fact, as I recall, the common complaint was that their proposals took up too many pages) and passing it into law. It essentially revolves around payment reform, delivery system innovations, data-driven quality improvement, and focusing on a transition toward a value-based health system. All proposals from here on will build on that framework, which is already U.S. law, not just a high-level concept paper whipped up by interns who like making graphs in Excel.

We have an absolutely humungous budget crisis and your solution is another insanely expensive and unconstitutional entitlement program?? Talk about a disconnect.

The Democrats plan - Obama's budget - proffered by Obama's own excel spreadshet generating interns and stooges - garnered a whopping "ZERO" votes in the Senate. ZERO. He is President of the United States and the head of the party that controls the Senate, yet his bullshit budget couldn't get a single vote in favor of it.

 

[Greenbeard]

We have an absolutely humungous budget crisis and your solution is another insanely expensive and unconstitutional entitlement program?? Talk about a disconnect.

I can't tell if this is a non sequitur or you're just in your own world somewhere. I'm talking about reforms made to Medicare. Medicare is not "another...program," it already exists.

The Democrats plan - Obama's budget - proffered by Obama's own excel spreadshet generating interns and stooges - garnered a whopping "ZERO" votes in the Senate. ZERO. He is President of the United States and the head of the party that controls the Senate, yet his bullshit budget couldn't get a single vote in favor of it.

Are you having a separate conversation with someone else in this thread or is this--for some reason--directed at me?

 

[Zander]

We have an absolutely humungous budget crisis and your solution is another insanely expensive and unconstitutional entitlement program?? Talk about a disconnect.

I can't tell if this is a non sequitur or you're just in your own world somewhere. I'm talking about reforms made to Medicare. Medicare is not "another...program," it already exists.

The Democrats plan - Obama's budget - proffered by Obama's own excel spreadshet generating interns and stooges - garnered a whopping "ZERO" votes in the Senate. ZERO. He is President of the United States and the head of the party that controls the Senate, yet his bullshit budget couldn't get a single vote in favor of it.

Are you having a separate conversation with someone else in this thread or is this--for some reason--directed at me?

Medicare is going bankrupt- even with the "reforms" that you mentioned. I assumed, incorrectly, that you were touting Obamacare as a solution to Medicare. My mistake. To your credit I didn't think you were delusional enough to believe that Medicare can be saved with a few administrative tweaks.

As for the rest of my post - it was not specifically directed to you, but we are discussing how the Ryan "BUDGET" proposal impacted the NY election in this thread.....

 

[babosam]

NY 26th lost due to anti medicare. PERIOD. Spin it as you like. Yes the Dem did not get 50% and only won by 5% but the last election of mister bare chest diviate won by 76% in a Rep area of a century.
Reps have gone over the edge with taking away from the poor and giving to the ultra rich. How can any working class, fireman, policeman, teacher, etc. vote for a republican in any office,local or national. If you do, don't cry when you cannot bargain for a livable wage or not be able to live above poverty in retirement and pay out rageous medical prices with run amuck insurance costs. I served 4years military and 36 years firefighting and retired with a little nest egg ate up by medical. wake up doo-doos and vote out any republican

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Yes this is just like NY-23. Dems took away the same lesson there.

 

[edthecynic]

So, the left and dems and Liberal Media are in full spin mode. Trying to say the Result of the Election in NY means Americans have turned away from Republicans already.

Lets examine the Facts. The Democrat did win, by a margin on 5%, She got less than 50% of the Vote. She had help in the form of a former Democratic Candidate who ran under the Tea Party, despite not having any Tea Party support, or Endorsement. This split the Conservative vote, and the Dem won an Election she could not have won in a 2 Candidate race.

Only the Delusional Democrats could think having to pull a fast one, and slip a Democrat Plant in as a tea Party Candidate to win an Election, Means the American Voters are back on their side.

Only the Delusional Democrats would characterize winning an Election with less than 50% of the vote as some kind of overwhelming statement in their favor.

The Simple truth is that with out the Former Democratic Candidate pretending to be a tea Party candidate. The Republican would have won by 4%.

You guys are just completely off your rockers.

So much for the crap that the Teabaggers are not just Republican extremists!!!
Remember how the CON$ used to say there were a lot of Dems in the Tea Party? Were they lying then or are they lying now?

 

[edthecynic]

I doubt this was intentional by the OP, and the rest who agree with him,

but the spin here is that conservatives in this district who favor the Tea Party voted for Davis because they're too stupid to know a real Tea Party candidate from a fake one.

Actually, it's quite intentional! CON$ have to admit the Teabaggers are stupid because the alternative is to admit that CON$ervatism lost, and they will never under any circumstances admit that.

So even though Davis ran 3 times as a Democrat, the stupid Teabaggers were so "confused" they thought he was a real Republican CON$ervative Teabagger.

So it's much better to call the Teabaggers stupid than to ever admit CON$ervatism lost, since CON$ also believe the Teabaggers are too stupid to know they've been mocked and thrown under the bus to save CON$ervatism.

May 25, 2011
RUSH: Yeah, this is a district in New York, the Tea Party guy was a Democrat National Committee stooge. He has run for office three times before as a Democrat. In fact he spent all of his time in this campaign attacking the Republican candidate. He Peroted the Republican candidate. What happened here is the Republican Tea Party voters got confused. Nine percent of them got confused and bought the notion that this was a genuine Tea Party candidate running in New York.

RUSH: We had this election in New York most of the nation wasn't even paying attention to. The Democrats throw in a phony Tea Party candidate, and somehow we've got a referendum on Paul Ryan? Somehow we have a referendum on Medicare reform? Somehow we have a referendum on conservatism?

 

[Sallow]

So, the left and dems and Liberal Media are in full spin mode. Trying to say the Result of the Election in NY means Americans have turned away from Republicans already.

Lets examine the Facts. The Democrat did win, by a margin on 5%, She got less than 50% of the Vote. She had help in the form of a former Democratic Candidate who ran under the Tea Party, despite not having any Tea Party support, or Endorsement. This split the Conservative vote, and the Dem won an Election she could not have won in a 2 Candidate race.

Only the Delusional Democrats could think having to pull a fast one, and slip a Democrat Plant in as a tea Party Candidate to win an Election, Means the American Voters are back on their side.

Only the Delusional Democrats would characterize winning an Election with less than 50% of the vote as some kind of overwhelming statement in their favor.

The Simple truth is that with out the Former Democratic Candidate pretending to be a tea Party candidate. The Republican would have won by 4%.

You guys are just completely off your rockers.

Few problems here..

If the third party candidate was a Democrat with no Tea Party or Conservative support...wouldn't that split the Democratic vote?

But heck..I do hope this same sort of sloppy analysis is going on at the RNC.

 

[Luissa]

Let me guess without reading ... the Dems lost. Wah.

No... the Dems won. Wah.

which is why charlie is having a melt-down.

Ah- HAH! SO , you cheated, huh? Oh wait ... I sound like YOU, don't I?

Wah. Some of y'all need to grow up. Learning to read English instead of into it would be a good start.

You need to argue with someone else. You have never been able to and it's not looking good that you will be able to keep up with me. You're too delusional partisan.

Or would you care to explain how an American Jew who supports Israel can support a President who has a bleeding heart for Palestine?

This is funny.

Gunny charges into a thread and makes a silly post based on his own partisan assumptions of an OP he admits he never read and then when told he's wrong (as usual ... this is a guy who could fuck up a cup of coffee) and has it all backwards he busts out the Cardinals t-shirt and Grow a brain morAns Go USA sign, doubles down on his own partisan stupidy while deserately trying to project on to someone else, and then ties it all up with a non sequitor.

Gunny Fail.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

So, the left and dems and Liberal Media are in full spin mode. Trying to say the Result of the Election in NY means Americans have turned away from Republicans already.

Lets examine the Facts.

The Simple truth is that with out the Former Democratic Candidate pretending to be a tea Party candidate. The Republican would have won by 4%.

You guys are just completely off your rockers.

....And, you FAUX Noise fans will believe ANYTHING!!!

The Mo$t Profitable Propaganda Machine
In History

 

[Charles_Main]

So, the left and dems and Liberal Media are in full spin mode. Trying to say the Result of the Election in NY means Americans have turned away from Republicans already.

Lets examine the Facts. The Democrat did win, by a margin on 5%, She got less than 50% of the Vote. She had help in the form of a former Democratic Candidate who ran under the Tea Party, despite not having any Tea Party support, or Endorsement. This split the Conservative vote, and the Dem won an Election she could not have won in a 2 Candidate race.

Only the Delusional Democrats could think having to pull a fast one, and slip a Democrat Plant in as a tea Party Candidate to win an Election, Means the American Voters are back on their side.

Only the Delusional Democrats would characterize winning an Election with less than 50% of the vote as some kind of overwhelming statement in their favor.

The Simple truth is that with out the Former Democratic Candidate pretending to be a tea Party candidate. The Republican would have won by 4%.

You guys are just completely off your rockers.

First, you assume that all the Tea Party vote would have gone to the Republicans. That may or may not be true.

But even if it were true and the Republican won, that's so totally not the point. The Republicans won that district with 74% of the vote in 2010. The Democrat candidate won the same percentage of votes as they won in 2006 when the Dems swept the country.

I do think one should not read too much into a special election, but if the Republicans stick their head in the sand and ignore this, they risk getting hammered next year.

The Tea Party is NOT popular right now. Here in Florida, Tea Party governor Rick Scott has an approval rating of 29%, the lowest in recorded history, whereas his negatives are 57%. Poll after poll has shown that even though people like the idea of reducing the deficit, they are decidedly against cutting specific programs that affect them.

Horse shit. The Democrat that won this time got just over 1% more of the vote, than Barack Obama got back when he ran for it and LOST!!

This is no mandate. If not for the 3rd Party split the Republicans would have held.

but keep telling yourself ny26 means you are going to be swept back into power in 2012, and Obama is a sure thing if you want.

 

[Toro]

Horse shit. The Democrat that won this time got just over 1% more of the vote, than Barack Obama got back when he ran for it and LOST!!

This is no mandate. If not for the 3rd Party split the Republicans would have held.

but keep telling yourself ny26 means you are going to be swept back into power in 2012, and Obama is a sure thing if you want.

And you keep telling yourself this was meaningless.

Its not about whether or not the Democrat won. Its about how low the vote was for the Republicans. The Republicans won 42% of the vote after winning 74% just two years ago. The Democrat won as many votes in the district as they did in the 2006 sweep.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Horse shit. The Democrat that won this time got just over 1% more of the vote, than Barack Obama got back when he ran for it and LOST!!

This is no mandate. If not for the 3rd Party split the Republicans would have held.

but keep telling yourself ny26 means you are going to be swept back into power in 2012, and Obama is a sure thing if you want.

And you keep telling yourself this was meaningless.

Its not about whether or not the Democrat won. Its about how low the vote was for the Republicans. The Republicans won 42% of the vote after winning 74% just two years ago. The Democrat won as many votes in the district as they did in the 2006 sweep.

^ This guy is smart

Dems need to run on a platform of $1Trillion plus deficits. Learn the lesson of NY-26.

Deficits, high taxes, high gas prices, high unemployment, really sell!

 

[Toro]

Horse shit. The Democrat that won this time got just over 1% more of the vote, than Barack Obama got back when he ran for it and LOST!!

This is no mandate. If not for the 3rd Party split the Republicans would have held.

but keep telling yourself ny26 means you are going to be swept back into power in 2012, and Obama is a sure thing if you want.

And you keep telling yourself this was meaningless.

Its not about whether or not the Democrat won. Its about how low the vote was for the Republicans. The Republicans won 42% of the vote after winning 74% just two years ago. The Democrat won as many votes in the district as they did in the 2006 sweep.

^ This guy is smart

Dems need to run on a platform of $1Trillion plus deficits. Learn the lesson of NY-26.

Deficits, high taxes, high gas prices, high unemployment, really sell!

"Ryan will save Medicare."

Just run on that, Frank. Y'all will do fine.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

And you keep telling yourself this was meaningless.

Its not about whether or not the Democrat won. Its about how low the vote was for the Republicans. The Republicans won 42% of the vote after winning 74% just two years ago. The Democrat won as many votes in the district as they did in the 2006 sweep.

^ This guy is smart

Dems need to run on a platform of $1Trillion plus deficits. Learn the lesson of NY-26.

Deficits, high taxes, high gas prices, high unemployment, really sell!

"Ryan will save Medicare."

Just run on that, Frank. Y'all will do fine.

Dems 2008: "These two entities—Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac—are not facing any kind of financial crisis"

Dems 2012: "These two entities—Medicare and Social Security—are not facing any kind of financial crisis,"

 

[JFK_USA]

So a Democrat won a very red district but that really means America really hates democrats?

 

[thereisnospoon]

So a Democrat won a very red district but that really means America really hates democrats?

Correct. Democrats never run on what they really stand for.
DO you really think a political candidate would stand a snowball's chance if he said A).....If elected ,it would be my intention to increase taxes on all Americans"( lifting of the Bush tax cuts which Obama tried to hide as being for the middle class). B) I will sponsor legislation that would raise the cost of utilities in the hopes that Americans will conserve energy.(Cap and Trade) C) If elected I will join with my fellow democrats in instituting a new set of rules that will control how people express themselves in speech (similar to Canada's anti defamation speech laws) or in their actions especially against those we believe to be victims of the majority( hate crimes laws which do not apply to all)...
Think about it. Not one democrat candidate has ever said he or she would do these ridiculous things but once they got together in a large group protected from the wolves( us) they went ahead and tried all of these things.
The irritating part of this medicare issue is here we have a bunch of retired old farts with nice pensions, two homes one of which is in Florida or some other warm weather paradise who are not in need of one red cent of public assistance sitting there sipping their post 18 hole martini going "those fuckers up there in Washington better not mess with my medicare. I paid into that and i deserve it."
That's a problem. I think all social programs should be based on financial need. For example, if a retired person is living off SS and has a part time job, heck yeah, let them have medicare. If a retired person is yanking down a state pension of over $50k per year and with health insurance paid as part of his retirement, hell no, you don't get more from the taxpayers.
Unfortunately the seniors who vote the most and of course their children are the ones who have the retirement and the two houses.
Whether these people realize it or not or even want to acknowledge. medicare is going to end up broke in less than 15 years if it's not revamped. Obamacare does nothing to insure that will not happen. Obamacare de-funds half the cost of medicare and lands the cost right in the laps of American taxpayers.
Politics has seen to it that this issue is going to get kicked down the road because people that run for office want to win elections. If they are being chased by a bunch of blue haired old biddies carrying pitchforks, they will lose. So medicare goes broke and the producers will get stuck with the bill.

 

[8537]

So, the left and dems and Liberal Media are in full spin mode. Trying to say the Result of the Election in NY means Americans have turned away from Republicans already.

Lets examine the Facts. The Democrat did win, by a margin on 5%, She got less than 50% of the Vote. She had help in the form of a former Democratic Candidate who ran under the Tea Party, despite not having any Tea Party support, or Endorsement. This split the Conservative vote, and the Dem won an Election she could not have won in a 2 Candidate race.

Only the Delusional Democrats could think having to pull a fast one, and slip a Democrat Plant in as a tea Party Candidate to win an Election, Means the American Voters are back on their side.

Only the Delusional Democrats would characterize winning an Election with less than 50% of the vote as some kind of overwhelming statement in their favor.

The Simple truth is that with out the Former Democratic Candidate pretending to be a tea Party candidate. The Republican would have won by 4%.

You guys are just completely off your rockers.

So you're saying that Tea Partiers were so fucking dumb that they voted for a Dem just because that person attached Tea Party to their name?

lol. Sounds about right!

 

[rightwinger]

So, the left and dems and Liberal Media are in full spin mode. Trying to say the Result of the Election in NY means Americans have turned away from Republicans already.

Lets examine the Facts. The Democrat did win, by a margin on 5%, She got less than 50% of the Vote. She had help in the form of a former Democratic Candidate who ran under the Tea Party, despite not having any Tea Party support, or Endorsement. This split the Conservative vote, and the Dem won an Election she could not have won in a 2 Candidate race.

Only the Delusional Democrats could think having to pull a fast one, and slip a Democrat Plant in as a tea Party Candidate to win an Election, Means the American Voters are back on their side.

Only the Delusional Democrats would characterize winning an Election with less than 50% of the vote as some kind of overwhelming statement in their favor.

The Simple truth is that with out the Former Democratic Candidate pretending to be a tea Party candidate. The Republican would have won by 4%.

You guys are just completely off your rockers.

So you're saying that Tea Partiers were so fucking dumb the voted for a Dem just because that person attached Tea Party to their name?

lol. Sounds about right!

You don't expect tea partiers to actually read up on the candidate they are voting for do you?