The Lessons of History

[westwall]

Truth hurts?

When you want to be educated on how to live out on your own without using the government teet, hit me up, wry. It really can be life changing....but first I think you need to move from frisco. Too many nanny state nuts live around there.

Ah, so the bigot in you is asserted for all to see. Thanks for that, as well as expressing your ignorance of San Francisco and the absurd libertarian beliefs you hold.

Which government services do you live without, Meister? Piss and shit in your yard to avoid the sewer system? Ignore red lights as a government interference in your life? Who would you call if someone broke into your home, your banker? Maybe you'd simply shoot the person first, ask questions later. Who would you call if your child went missing? Who would you call if your house caught fire? Who would you call if a neighbor was having a heart attack?

When you live in a rural part of Idaho where there is no sewer and you have to shit and piss in an outhouse in your backyard, where you have no traffic lights or the nearest fire department or police department is an hour away, then Meister and his ilk have no choice but to believe anarchy is the answer to all life's issues because they essentially live like anarchists to begin with.

Wow, to think that people actually lived with none of the trppings of civilised society a mere hundred years ago. How did they do it? As far as life in the country goes, I drove myself to the hospital when I was on the verge of having a heart attack just a little over a year ago, had i not i would have died.

If someone trys to break into my home he'll have a rather hard time about it. It is well fortified to make it bear proof, but in the highly unlikely event that a bad guy get's in he will either surrender or be in a world of hurt.

But, please, feel free to point out how many crimes the police actually halt. I can think of a few over the years but to actually stop crime before or as it is happening requires a CITIZEN who is armed and capable of handling themselves and the weapon they use.

You see dear person, we out in the sticks are a self reliant bunch. We don't need you or your civilised society. We are civilised (in fact most i know out here are far better educated than you city folks) because we choose to be. We help others in need far more often than you city folks who blissfully drive by or ignore pleas for help all the time.

When the next earthquake hits SF, you'd better pray that there is a self reliant type near you to bail your ass out when civilisation grinds to halt otherwise you'll starve real quick!

 

[The Rabbi]

Ah, so the bigot in you is asserted for all to see. Thanks for that, as well as expressing your ignorance of San Francisco and the absurd libertarian beliefs you hold.

Which government services do you live without, Meister? Piss and shit in your yard to avoid the sewer system? Ignore red lights as a government interference in your life? Who would you call if someone broke into your home, your banker? Maybe you'd simply shoot the person first, ask questions later. Who would you call if your child went missing? Who would you call if your house caught fire? Who would you call if a neighbor was having a heart attack?

When you live in a rural part of Idaho where there is no sewer and you have to shit and piss in an outhouse in your backyard, where you have no traffic lights or the nearest fire department or police department is an hour away, then Meister and his ilk have no choice but to believe anarchy is the answer to all life's issues because they essentially live like anarchists to begin with.

Wow, to think that people actually lived with none of the trppings of civilised society a mere hundred years ago. How did they do it? As far as life in the country goes, I drove myself to the hospital when I was on the verge of having a heart attack just a little over a year ago, had i not i would have died.

If someone trys to break into my home he'll have a rather hard time about it. It is well fortified to make it bear proof, but in the highly unlikely event that a bad guy get's in he will either surrender or be in a world of hurt.

But, please, feel free to point out how many crimes the police actually halt. I can think of a few over the years but to actually stop crime before or as it is happening requires a CITIZEN who is armed and capable of handling themselves and the weapon they use.

You see dear person, we out in the sticks are a self reliant bunch. We don't need you or your civilised society. We are civilised (in fact most i know out here are far better educated than you city folks) because we choose to be. We help others in need far more often than you city folks who blissfully drive by or ignore pleas for help all the time.

When the next earthquake hits SF, you'd better pray that there is a self reliant type near you to bail your ass out when civilisation grinds to halt otherwise you'll starve real quick!

Wry and his ilk believe in the old "to protect and serve", which means no one needs anything but police for protection. ANything you need, gov't can get it for you. No sense relying on yourself. Government has many more resources than you can afford. And they're EXPERTS!

 

[Harry Dresden]

The lessons we learn from WI is that corporate money matters. With a war chest nearly 10 times larger than his opponent it is no supprise the Walker won.

so i guess when a candidate has a Billion dollars to spend, you know he/she is going to win...

 

[Harry Dresden]

If Falk has 30 million and Walker had just 3 million I think the election would have turn out differently.

But that's just me.

No. It wouldn't.

Why? Most Wisconsinites had their mind made up MONTHS before the Primary. The only questions were who was going to LOSE to the Incumbents. Everyone I knew turned off the political commercials before they got 5 seconds in regardless of party. They threw out all the mailers. They hung up on the robocalls.

That money did NOTHING to change the minds of Wisconsinites save for the totally ignorant.

What made up their mind?

How pissed off they were for the Madison Protests and the psychotics pushing the recall petitions in their face and acting like assholes if you didn't sign. We were/ARE fed up with lefties political bullying and want things back to normal.

So when the left pushes for a recall, it's political bullying. When the right pushes for a recall, like what happened in CA, it's political process.

I think the reason why the recall failed was because the Dems did not really have an established opponent against Walker before the recall process started.

Then, after it became clear the recall was going to happen, the Dems dusted off Barrett and he ran again. Bad move. I think you're right... the voters of WI had their minds made up during the first election between Walker and Barrett. Had they chosen someone different and maybe more charismatic (like an actor from Hollywood).........

the difference in our recall was that many Democrats wanted Davis out of there too....

 

[Wry Catcher]

48 years ago. We got it then. What the hell happened and how'd we forget that goverment isn't the solution, it's the problem.

"A Time for Choosing" by Ronald Reagan - YouTube

Wrong. On so many levels wrong. The government as operated under George W. Bush was a problem; government in general is not.

Yeah, that's it. Did you even WATCH the speech and listen to the examples of government failure in 1964? Doubt it. If you had, maybe you'd have had something more intelligible to say.

I did. I also 'watched' President Reagan for eight years. President Reagan was a great speaker, well trained and well prepared when speaking to the base. What I suggest you and others who so worship President Reagan do, is to measure his words by his actions as POTUS.

Did he shrink government?

Did he reduce thea national debt?

Did he raise taxes as well as cut taxes?

President Reagan did accomplish a number of importatant things, but the question to be asked is, "does man make history, or does history make the man"?

 

[The Rabbi]

In Reagan's case he made history. The USSR would still be a force if not for Reagan's policies. The air traffic controllers would still be calling the shots if not for Reagan. The Iranians would still be holding US hostages if not for Reagan. We would be a third rate defeated power if not for Reagan.
The best testament is that the leftists here still try to tear down Reagan 30 years after he left office. I dont see anyone on the right expending that much effort on Carter.

 

[Wry Catcher]

When you live in a rural part of Idaho where there is no sewer and you have to shit and piss in an outhouse in your backyard, where you have no traffic lights or the nearest fire department or police department is an hour away, then Meister and his ilk have no choice but to believe anarchy is the answer to all life's issues because they essentially live like anarchists to begin with.

Wow, to think that people actually lived with none of the trppings of civilised society a mere hundred years ago. How did they do it? As far as life in the country goes, I drove myself to the hospital when I was on the verge of having a heart attack just a little over a year ago, had i not i would have died.

If someone trys to break into my home he'll have a rather hard time about it. It is well fortified to make it bear proof, but in the highly unlikely event that a bad guy get's in he will either surrender or be in a world of hurt.

But, please, feel free to point out how many crimes the police actually halt. I can think of a few over the years but to actually stop crime before or as it is happening requires a CITIZEN who is armed and capable of handling themselves and the weapon they use.

You see dear person, we out in the sticks are a self reliant bunch. We don't need you or your civilised society. We are civilised (in fact most i know out here are far better educated than you city folks) because we choose to be. We help others in need far more often than you city folks who blissfully drive by or ignore pleas for help all the time.

When the next earthquake hits SF, you'd better pray that there is a self reliant type near you to bail your ass out when civilisation grinds to halt otherwise you'll starve real quick!

Wry and his ilk believe in the old "to protect and serve", which means no one needs anything but police for protection. ANything you need, gov't can get it for you. No sense relying on yourself. Government has many more resources than you can afford. And they're EXPERTS!

Wry believes an untrained and emotion charged individual can do more harm than good in tense situtations. Wry has no problem with a sober, trained person never convicted of a crime of violence defending his/her home with a firearm. Wry does not believe that firearm or its ammunition should pose a risk to innocent persons living within their home or walking on a public street.

 

[Big Fitz]

Wrong. On so many levels wrong. The government as operated under George W. Bush was a problem; government in general is not.

Yeah, that's it. Did you even WATCH the speech and listen to the examples of government failure in 1964? Doubt it. If you had, maybe you'd have had something more intelligible to say.

I did. I also 'watched' President Reagan for eight years. President Reagan was a great speaker, well trained and well prepared when speaking to the base. What I suggest you and others who so worship President Reagan do, is to measure his words by his actions as POTUS.

Did he shrink government?

Did he reduce thea national debt?

Did he raise taxes as well as cut taxes?

President Reagan did accomplish a number of importatant things, but the question to be asked is, "does man make history, or does history make the man"?

Huh.... that's actually good advice.

Maybe you should apply your same standard to Obama. Yes?

 

[Wry Catcher]

In Reagan's case he made history. The USSR would still be a force if not for Reagan's policies. The air traffic controllers would still be calling the shots if not for Reagan. The Iranians would still be holding US hostages if not for Reagan. We would be a third rate defeated power if not for Reagan.
The best testament is that the leftists here still try to tear down Reagan 30 years after he left office. I dont see anyone on the right expending that much effort on Carter.

I think everything you post is framed in concrete by your biases. Truth, introspection and honesty can never penetrate that famwork.

 

[Big Fitz]

In Reagan's case he made history. The USSR would still be a force if not for Reagan's policies. The air traffic controllers would still be calling the shots if not for Reagan. The Iranians would still be holding US hostages if not for Reagan. We would be a third rate defeated power if not for Reagan.
The best testament is that the leftists here still try to tear down Reagan 30 years after he left office. I dont see anyone on the right expending that much effort on Carter.

I think everything you post is framed in concrete by your biases. Truth, introspection and honesty can never penetrate that famwork.

You're looking in a mirror when typing that, aren't you?

 

[BlindBoo]

The lessons we learn from WI is that corporate money matters. With a war chest nearly 10 times larger than his opponent it is no supprise the Walker won.

so i guess when a candidate has a Billion dollars to spend, you know he/she is going to win...

You can't know anything until the fat lady sings but if their oponent had say 10 billion to spend......maybe not.

Can I have one of them smokes?

 

[Wry Catcher]

Yeah, that's it. Did you even WATCH the speech and listen to the examples of government failure in 1964? Doubt it. If you had, maybe you'd have had something more intelligible to say.

I did. I also 'watched' President Reagan for eight years. President Reagan was a great speaker, well trained and well prepared when speaking to the base. What I suggest you and others who so worship President Reagan do, is to measure his words by his actions as POTUS.

Did he shrink government?

Did he reduce the national debt?

Did he raise taxes as well as cut taxes?

President Reagan did accomplish a number of important things, but the question to be asked is, "does man make history, or does history make the man"?

Huh.... that's actually good advice.

Maybe you should apply your same standard to Obama. Yes?

I have. Have you?

1. The world in which the President inherited was in (understatement) disarray. Not only did President Obama not have time, he did not have a road map on how to respond to the second greatest economic crisis in our nation's history.

Agree or disagree?

2. The political climate into which the President operated was poisoned even before he took the oath of office. The conservative media and conservatives in general dogged his every move and openly proclaimed they hoped he failed.

Agree or disagree?

3. The economic conditions in Europe continue to worry financial markets negatively impacting our economy. The President has little or no influence to fix Europe

Agree or disagree?

4. President Obama supported the Auto Bailout which commenced under the former President Bush. It prevented a much higher unemployment rate in the U.S.

Agree or disagree?

5. The Right Wing in American politics has continued to label President Obama as a Socialist or Marxist and that includes the Republican Leadership in the Congress: Boehner and McConnell.

In addition to a world-wide economic slowdown nations which look to American's leadership are dismayed by our nation divided and this has perpetuated the economic malaise of the recovery.

Agree or disagree?

I think the reform of health care in America is necessary but that putting that issue on the front burner was a mistake.

I think supporting the Lilly Ledbetter and signing it into law was politically heroic given the past and current examples of misogyny in our country.

I think the President has done a fine job of beginning to correct the mess he inherited under difficult conditions, that the efforts by the GOP in general and the far right fringe in particular has created "house divided" maybe as great as the President Lincoln inherited in 1861 (and I think that was done intentionally)

Agree or disagree?

 

[BlindBoo]

In Reagan's case he made history. The USSR would still be a force if not for Reagan's policies. The air traffic controllers would still be calling the shots if not for Reagan. The Iranians would still be holding US hostages if not for Reagan. We would be a third rate defeated power if not for Reagan.
The best testament is that the leftists here still try to tear down Reagan 30 years after he left office. I dont see anyone on the right expending that much effort on Carter.

You denegrate all other president by claiming it was only Raygun who brough down the USSR! Carter negociated the release of all hostages from Iran. Raygun had nothing to do with it unless you count the extra time they had to spend in captivity becuase of Raygun. Rayguns policies are the reason he will alway be considered the first pseudo-conservative. Instead of helping to get us off foriegn oil Raygun plunged the needle in deeper. Vast amounts of time and effort are still channeled by the Rupublicans to destroy Carter.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

In Reagan's case he made history. The USSR would still be a force if not for Reagan's policies. The air traffic controllers would still be calling the shots if not for Reagan. The Iranians would still be holding US hostages if not for Reagan. We would be a third rate defeated power if not for Reagan.
The best testament is that the leftists here still try to tear down Reagan 30 years after he left office. I dont see anyone on the right expending that much effort on Carter.

Amen Brother

Reagan's naming the USSR as an Evil Empire, dedicating his administration to their defeat, then making good on his promise is why the American Left will always hate him.

It says a lot about the "American" Left

 

[The T]

In Reagan's case he made history. The USSR would still be a force if not for Reagan's policies. The air traffic controllers would still be calling the shots if not for Reagan. The Iranians would still be holding US hostages if not for Reagan. We would be a third rate defeated power if not for Reagan.
The best testament is that the leftists here still try to tear down Reagan 30 years after he left office. I dont see anyone on the right expending that much effort on Carter.

Amen Brother

Reagan's naming the USSR as an Evil Empire, dedicating his administration to their defeat, then making good on his promise is why the American Left will always hate him.

It says a lot about the "American" Left

Indeed...Reagan made the leftists sweat profusely.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

1. The world in which the President inherited was in (understatement) disarray. Not only did President Obama not have time, he did not have a road map on how to respond to the second greatest economic crisis in our nation's history.

He asked to be in charge of it, that's what a President does. Whining about what he "Inherited" makes him look not up to the job.

If he needed a road map he could have done some reading

Depression of 1920

 

[Wry Catcher]

In Reagan's case he made history. The USSR would still be a force if not for Reagan's policies. The air traffic controllers would still be calling the shots if not for Reagan. The Iranians would still be holding US hostages if not for Reagan. We would be a third rate defeated power if not for Reagan.
The best testament is that the leftists here still try to tear down Reagan 30 years after he left office. I dont see anyone on the right expending that much effort on Carter.

I think everything you post is framed in concrete by your biases. Truth, introspection and honesty can never penetrate that famwork.

You're looking in a mirror when typing that, aren't you?

No, you're looking in the mirror when you say that, aren't YOU!
[see, I can default to the second grade too, I simply feel silly doing it. Why don't you?]

 

[The T]

1. The world in which the President inherited was in (understatement) disarray. Not only did President Obama not have time, he did not have a road map on how to respond to the second greatest economic crisis in our nation's history.

He asked to be in charge of it, that's what a President does. Whining about what he "Inherited" makes him look not up to the job.

If he needed a road map he could have done some reading

Depression of 1920

And thus the charges of his agenda are true despite his denial. Obama has gone opposite direction to mold this republic into an EU-Style Socialistic State.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Notwithstanding the comments posted between this post and post #112, the statements in #112 have been mostly ignored (one was spun into an idiotgram - no surprise there) and that is no surprise.

 

[Oldstyle]

I did. I also 'watched' President Reagan for eight years. President Reagan was a great speaker, well trained and well prepared when speaking to the base. What I suggest you and others who so worship President Reagan do, is to measure his words by his actions as POTUS.

Did he shrink government?

Did he reduce the national debt?

Did he raise taxes as well as cut taxes?

President Reagan did accomplish a number of important things, but the question to be asked is, "does man make history, or does history make the man"?

Huh.... that's actually good advice.

Maybe you should apply your same standard to Obama. Yes?

I have. Have you?

1. The world in which the President inherited was in (understatement) disarray. Not only did President Obama not have time, he did not have a road map on how to respond to the second greatest economic crisis in our nation's history.

Agree or disagree?

2. The political climate into which the President operated was poisoned even before he took the oath of office. The conservative media and conservatives in general dogged his every move and openly proclaimed they hoped he failed.

Agree or disagree?

3. The economic conditions in Europe continue to worry financial markets negatively impacting our economy. The President has little or no influence to fix Europe

Agree or disagree?

4. President Obama supported the Auto Bailout which commenced under the former President Bush. It prevented a much higher unemployment rate in the U.S.

Agree or disagree?

5. The Right Wing in American politics has continued to label President Obama as a Socialist or Marxist and that includes the Republican Leadership in the Congress: Boehner and McConnell.

In addition to a world-wide economic slowdown nations which look to American's leadership are dismayed by our nation divided and this has perpetuated the economic malaise of the recovery.

Agree or disagree?

I think the reform of health care in America is necessary but that putting that issue on the front burner was a mistake.

I think supporting the Lilly Ledbetter and signing it into law was politically heroic given the past and current examples of misogyny in our country.

I think the President has done a fine job of beginning to correct the mess he inherited under difficult conditions, that the efforts by the GOP in general and the far right fringe in particular has created "house divided" maybe as great as the President Lincoln inherited in 1861 (and I think that was done intentionally)

Agree or disagree?

First of all, Obama didn't "inherit" anything...he campaigned for it and told us that he had a plan to fix things and that he would hit the ground running to do so. The fact that he STILL doesn't have a "road map" to fix things 3 1/2 years later says volumes about his abilities or lack thereof.

The political climate was not "poisoned" when he took office. Barack Obama came into office with an amazingly high approval rating and Super Majorities in both the House and Senate to work with. He HAD an incredible opportunity, Wry that he squandered on ObamaCare. What so many of you fail to remember is that when Mitch McConnell made his statement that his number one priority was replacing Obama it was AFTER Barry's first year in office and his "elections have consequences...I won" attitude towards the GOP. Was the political climate "poisoned" by the end of that first year? You bet. When you lock the opposition out in the hall and have Nancy and Harry write legislation that gets rammed through by whatever means necessary then you're going to be disliked by the other side. By the end of Obama's first year in office, Republicans LOATHED him.

President Obama could just as easily pushed GM to reorganize under bankruptcy, Wry. He didn't do so because he wanted to "save" the auto industry...he did so because he owed a debt to the United Auto Workers. He intervened not to save the the auto industry but to save union contracts that would have been tossed in a reorganization.

President Obama is neither a Communist nor a Socialist...he's simply an incompetent.

Other country's are "dismayed" by the fact that we don't have a coherent economic plan going forward. Our credit was downgraded because we are not perceived to have the political backbone to make tough choices in reducing our deficit. Given this Administrations total lack of ANY substantial cuts to spending combined with it's inability to grow the economy, that perception still holds true.