The Lessons of History

[sfcalifornia]

And yet the surveys of voters say their minds were made up back in March. So all that money was for nothing, including the union money on failed candidate Falk.

Walker was going to be retained the instant the petition passed.

If Falk has 30 million and Walker had just 3 million I think the election would have turn out differently.

But that's just me.

No. It wouldn't.

Why? Most Wisconsinites had their mind made up MONTHS before the Primary. The only questions were who was going to LOSE to the Incumbents. Everyone I knew turned off the political commercials before they got 5 seconds in regardless of party. They threw out all the mailers. They hung up on the robocalls.

That money did NOTHING to change the minds of Wisconsinites save for the totally ignorant.

What made up their mind?

How pissed off they were for the Madison Protests and the psychotics pushing the recall petitions in their face and acting like assholes if you didn't sign. We were/ARE fed up with lefties political bullying and want things back to normal.

So when the left pushes for a recall, it's political bullying. When the right pushes for a recall, like what happened in CA, it's political process.

I think the reason why the recall failed was because the Dems did not really have an established opponent against Walker before the recall process started.

Then, after it became clear the recall was going to happen, the Dems dusted off Barrett and he ran again. Bad move. I think you're right... the voters of WI had their minds made up during the first election between Walker and Barrett. Had they chosen someone different and maybe more charismatic (like an actor from Hollywood).........

 

[Big Fitz]

If Falk has 30 million and Walker had just 3 million I think the election would have turn out differently.

But that's just me.

No. It wouldn't.

Why? Most Wisconsinites had their mind made up MONTHS before the Primary. The only questions were who was going to LOSE to the Incumbents. Everyone I knew turned off the political commercials before they got 5 seconds in regardless of party. They threw out all the mailers. They hung up on the robocalls.

That money did NOTHING to change the minds of Wisconsinites save for the totally ignorant.

What made up their mind?

How pissed off they were for the Madison Protests and the psychotics pushing the recall petitions in their face and acting like assholes if you didn't sign. We were/ARE fed up with lefties political bullying and want things back to normal.

So when the left pushes for a recall, it's political bullying. When the right pushes for a recall, like what happened in CA, it's political process.

I think the reason why the recall failed was because the Dems did not really have an established opponent against Walker before the recall process started.

Then, after it became clear the recall was going to happen, the Dems dusted off Barrett and he ran again. Bad move. I think you're right... the voters of WI had their minds made up during the first election between Walker and Barrett. Had they chosen someone different and maybe more charismatic (like an actor from Hollywood).........

Why was Gray Davis recalled versus why Walker suffered an attempted recall?

The Out of State Unions who forced the recall in WI picked Falk. Falk lost to Barrett because NOBODY in the state liked her. She even lost Dane County (her home state and center of all things Public Union) by a landslide versus Barrett. She was established long since. Barrett was also long established as the previous election's loser.

The Dems were desperate to keep Barrett out at first. The petitioners did not want a repeat of 2010. There was nobody more charismatic. There was no plan outside of "Repeal Act 10" and return to Doyle era policies which had wrecked this state.

Your perspective is massively skewed on the libbies chances. WI did not want the recall. Outside special interests, and internal crybabies did.

 

[Unkotare]

LOL!!!

Liberals' sour grapes are quite sweet!

 

[g5000]

The Majority is deciding liberty issues, the rights of workers to freely associate and collectively bargain for salary, benefits and working conditions have been curtailed by majority vote

Incorrect.

The ability of PUBLIC EMPLOYEES PAID BY THE TAXPAYER to collectively bargain for their FRINGE BENEFITS is gone. Private sector workers have had NONE OF THEIR COLLECTIVE BARGAINING RIGHTS AFFECTED.

And the public employees still have the ability to collectively bargain their wages, dumbass.

Stop making shit up, you whiny little drama queen. How dare you lecture about history when you are fabricating it as you go?

 

[Wry Catcher]

The Majority is deciding liberty issues, the rights of workers to freely associate and collectively bargain for salary, benefits and working conditions have been curtailed by majority vote

Incorrect.

The ability of PUBLIC EMPLOYEES PAID BY THE TAXPAYER to collectively bargain for their FRINGE BENEFITS is gone. Private sector workers have had NONE OF THEIR COLLECTIVE BARGAINING RIGHTS AFFECTED.

And the public employees still have the ability to collectively bargain their wages, dumbass.

Stop making shit up, you whiny little drama queen. How dare you lecture about history when you are fabricating it as you go?

Nice rant. I suggest a mirror first (to see a Drama Queen) followed up with a reading comprehension program.

To wit: " The Majority is deciding liberty issues, the rights of workers to freely associate and collectively bargain for salary, benefits and working conditions have been curtailed by majority vote".


cur·tail: verb (used with object)
to cut short; cut off a part of; abridge; reduce; diminish.

 

[g5000]

Need some cheese with that whine, Drama Queen?



The taxpayers won. Of course you see that as a bad thing.

 

[WillowTree]

A people get the government they deserve. If the voters in WI or throughout the several states decide to elect those who define liberty as the will of the majority we will have turned our backs on the principles upon which the founding fathers risked everything.

The liberty of free association and the freedom to petition the government died in WI yesterday when the majority of voters decided to change the course of history. The fringe on the right wing of American politics is crowing in celebration not knowing - as none of us can know - what the consequences of such a vote will eventually mean; it seems President Jefferson had an idea of the meaning:

"All, too, will bear in mind this sacred principle, that though the will of the majority is in all cases to prevail, that will to be rightful must be reasonable; that the minority possess their equal rights, which equal law must protect, and to violate would be oppression"

 

[WillowTree]

To the left, when they win, the people have spoken.
To the left, when they lose, the majority is oppressing the minority.

Hammmer,, meet nail.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Need some cheese with that whine, Drama Queen?



The taxpayers won. Of course you see that as a bad thing.

Government employees who belong to unions are taxpayers too, genius
Since I helped you with your language skills maybe you could find it in your heart to stop with the personal attacks and attempting to curtail my efforts to debate.

Channeling Willow Tree is not the best way to prove you have anything intelligent to post, BTW.

 

[Big Fitz]

Need some cheese with that whine, Drama Queen?



The taxpayers won. Of course you see that as a bad thing.

Government employees who belong to unions are taxpayers too, genius
Since I helped you with your language skills maybe you could find it in your heart to stop with the personal attacks and attempting to curtail my efforts to debate.

Channeling Willow Tree is not the best way to prove you have anything intelligent to post, BTW.

yes, but they are receiving taxpayer money to pay their saleries. Its like a paper plant. You run a huge band of paper, and trim the sides. That trimmed edge goes down shoots and back into the slurry and reused. So although they add a small part back to the whole of taxpayer money to sustain themselves, it is just that. A small, rather insignificant part compared to the whole which comes from the rest of the state.

Right now, government in most state is the largest employer when before public sector unions, this was not the case. We need to return to that way where government was not a large portion of the job base in the state. WI started that process.

 

[WillowTree]

The lessons we learn from WI is that corporate money matters. With a war chest nearly 10 times larger than his opponent it is no supprise the Walker won.

The lessons we learn from WI is that corporate money matters. With a war chest nearly 10 times larger than his opponent it is no supprise the Walker won.

That is true. Citizens United v. Federal Elecitons Commission is the real story here. That said, the people of WI spoke and will live with the consequences yet unseen of their vote.

But I'm certain the two of you were A okay with the unions buying democrats.. cry us a fucking river whydonchya?

 

[Wry Catcher]

The lessons we learn from WI is that corporate money matters. With a war chest nearly 10 times larger than his opponent it is no supprise the Walker won.

That is true. Citizens United v. Federal Elecitons Commission is the real story here. That said, the people of WI spoke and will live with the consequences yet unseen of their vote.

So we're to talking point #3: "It's Citizens United fault."

That leaves us with:

1. They outspent us. (Despite the fact most voters had made their mind up months before)
2. He won, now he must compromise with us. (Regardless that the left's issues failed)
3. It's Citizens United Fault (because issues, only corporate and NOT UNION money worked)

As noted above, you have every right to your opinion. We have every right to dismiss your opinion as one based on ignorance. To deny money has any impact on elections is either mendacious or abject ignorance.

 

[Wry Catcher]

The lessons we learn from WI is that corporate money matters. With a war chest nearly 10 times larger than his opponent it is no supprise the Walker won.

The lessons we learn from WI is that corporate money matters. With a war chest nearly 10 times larger than his opponent it is no supprise the Walker won.

That is true. Citizens United v. Federal Elecitons Commission is the real story here. That said, the people of WI spoke and will live with the consequences yet unseen of their vote.

But I'm certain the two of you were A okay with the unions buying democrats.. cry us a fucking river whydonchya?

Still channeling the Strawman huh willow. Why not find Dorthy, she may help you in your quest.

 

[WillowTree]

The lessons we learn from WI is that corporate money matters. With a war chest nearly 10 times larger than his opponent it is no supprise the Walker won.

That is true. Citizens United v. Federal Elecitons Commission is the real story here. That said, the people of WI spoke and will live with the consequences yet unseen of their vote.

But I'm certain the two of you were A okay with the unions buying democrats.. cry us a fucking river whydonchya?

Still channeling the Scarecrow huh willow. Why not find Dorthy she may help you in your quest.

whatever the hell that means.. but, tell us,, can you say Govenor Walker? say it real sweet,, it just kinda rolls off the tongue.. Govenor Walker..

 

[Big Fitz]

That is true. Citizens United v. Federal Elecitons Commission is the real story here. That said, the people of WI spoke and will live with the consequences yet unseen of their vote.

So we're to talking point #3: "It's Citizens United fault."

That leaves us with:

1. They outspent us. (Despite the fact most voters had made their mind up months before)
2. He won, now he must compromise with us. (Regardless that the left's issues failed)
3. It's Citizens United Fault (because issues, only corporate and NOT UNION money worked)

As noted above, you have every right to your opinion. We have every right to dismiss your opinion as one based on ignorance. To deny money has any impact on elections is either mendacious or abject ignorance.

And your opinion is fact now, eh?

I'll remember to duck that beam in your eye the next time you look my way, hypocrite.

 

[Wry Catcher]

But I'm certain the two of you were A okay with the unions buying democrats.. cry us a fucking river whydonchya?

Still channeling the Scarecrow huh willow. Why not find Dorthy she may help you in your quest.

whatever the hell that means.. but, tell us,, can you say Govenor Walker? say it real sweet,, it just kinda rolls off the tongue.. Govenor Walker..

LOL, thanks I will (Wry says, "GOVERNOR Walker"). What it meant WT was pretty clear to anyone with a brain.

Was reading the Wonderful Wizard of Oz introduced after you dropped out of the second grade?

 

[Wry Catcher]

So we're to talking point #3: "It's Citizens United fault."

That leaves us with:

1. They outspent us. (Despite the fact most voters had made their mind up months before)
2. He won, now he must compromise with us. (Regardless that the left's issues failed)
3. It's Citizens United Fault (because issues, only corporate and NOT UNION money worked)

As noted above, you have every right to your opinion. We have every right to dismiss your opinion as one based on ignorance. To deny money has any impact on elections is either mendacious or abject ignorance.

And your opinion is fact now, eh?

I'll remember to duck that beam in your eye the next time you look my way, hypocrite.

Nice spin. It is a fact, proven by how much money is spent in electons and how they impact the results. Only a fool or a partisan hack would deny such a claim. Is it universally true? Not always, but the CU v. FEC ruling did change the rules so time will tell. IMO if it stands our transition from a representative democracy will be replaced by a pure plutocracy.

 

[Katzndogz]

OP hates "Tyranny of the Majority" and rightly so, but seems to support a "Tyranny of the Minority".

"You can't oppress me! Cause then I can't oppress you!"

Democrats support tyranny of the minority as long as they are in the minority. When they are in the majority, it's the Will of the People.

 

[Wry Catcher]

OP hates "Tyranny of the Majority" and rightly so, but seems to support a "Tyranny of the Minority".

"You can't oppress me! Cause then I can't oppress you!"

Democrats support tyranny of the minority as long as they are in the minority. When they are in the majority, it's the Will of the People.

Thanks for sharing. It's always nice to read such a comprehensive and well thought out opinion (sarcasm).

 

[Big Fitz]

As noted above, you have every right to your opinion. We have every right to dismiss your opinion as one based on ignorance. To deny money has any impact on elections is either mendacious or abject ignorance.

And your opinion is fact now, eh?

I'll remember to duck that beam in your eye the next time you look my way, hypocrite.

Nice spin. It is a fact, proven by how much money is spent in electons and how they impact the results. Only a fool or a partisan hack would deny such a claim. Is it universally true? Not always, but the CU v. FEC ruling did change the rules so time will tell. IMO if it stands our transition from a representative democracy will be replaced by a pure plutocracy.

:ducks:

Complaining about spin now?