The Latest Socialist Excuse...

[bripat9643]

Right. That's what I assumed you were talking about. But again, doesn't that just put us back the same boat? How do we choose this group of "public stakeholders", and how do we ensure they work for the benefit of society?

Right. That's what I assumed you were talking about. But again, doesn't that just put us back the same boat? How do we choose this group of "public stakeholders", and how do we ensure they work for the benefit of society?

Public stakeholders might start with expanding the board of directors of large corporations to include hourly workers and local community leaders. German corporations have functioned under similar conditions for decades, and many of them did not move to China when major US corporations chose to shutter their homeland facilities and learn Mandarin.

How are workers and local community leaders "steak holders?" What part of the money to build the factory did the provide?

How are workers and local community leaders "steak holders?" What part of the money to build the factory did the provide?

Workers and the local community's tax base have a much bigger stake in Walmart than the useless eaters ol' Sam Walton left behind:

Walmart On Welfare -- The National Memo

"American taxpayer money explains almost a third of Walmart’s worldwide pretax profits last year. But that understates the scale of taxpayer assistance to the retailer, which made 29 percent of its sales overseas last year.

"Figure about 44 percent of Walmart’s domestic pretax profits were contributed by local, state and federal taxpayers directly and indirectly, based on company disclosure statements."

Communist propaganda. The article is based on the theory that Walmart is obligated to pay some arbitrary wage determined by commies like you. Of course, this theory isn't supported by any accepted principles of ethics, morality, government or economics.

Communist propaganda. The article is based on the theory that Walmart is obligated to pay some arbitrary wage determined by commies like you. Of course, this theory isn't supported by any accepted principles of ethics, morality, government or economics.

You're offering the Waltons as examples of ethics and morality?

https://www.nationalmemo.com/walmart-welfare/

"The best-known heir of the retailing innovator Sam Walton, his daughter Alice, 64, has a long history of drunk-driving accidents, including killing a woman hit by her vehicle.

"While repeat drunk drivers are routinely prosecuted in most jurisdictions, often as a matter of policy, and upon conviction get the time behind bars their conduct deserves, to date no law enforcement agency has seen fit to prosecute Alice Walton.

"Instead she basks in the glow of encomiums for the philanthropy enabled by the fortune her father built and boosted by the steady flow of money taxpayers are forced to give her, her relatives and other Walmart investors."

Rich people are imperfect, just like poor people. However, Alice Walton did not create the retail Empire. Sam Walton did, and the world is a better place as a result. Walmart has done more for the poor than all the welfare programs put together.

 

[bripat9643]

Perhaps Economic Democracy is a more useful concept?

Economic democracy - Wikipedia

"Economic democracy is a socioeconomic philosophy that proposes to shift decision-making power from corporate managers and corporate shareholders to a larger group of public stakeholders that includes workers, customers, suppliers, neighbours and the broader public."

Right. That's what I assumed you were talking about. But again, doesn't that just put us back the same boat? How do we choose this group of "public stakeholders", and how do we ensure they work for the benefit of society?

Right. That's what I assumed you were talking about. But again, doesn't that just put us back the same boat? How do we choose this group of "public stakeholders", and how do we ensure they work for the benefit of society?

Public stakeholders might start with expanding the board of directors of large corporations to include hourly workers and local community leaders. German corporations have functioned under similar conditions for decades, and many of them did not move to China when major US corporations chose to shutter their homeland facilities and learn Mandarin.

So how do we decide how to expand the board of directors? And how do we ensure they work for the benefit of society? You seem to be assuming that anything done "democratically" will produce better results. Trump much?

So how do we decide how to expand the board of directors? And how do we ensure they work for the benefit of society? You seem to be assuming that anything done "democratically" will produce better results. Trump much?

As I recall, Trump lost the popular vote by more than 8 million votes? Expanding a large corporation's board would start with recognizing how a handful of directors with vested interests in the status quo aren't likely to make the fundamental changes to the economic system that's made them rich.

Start With Worker Self-Directed Enterprises

"Zooming In to the Micro Level

"That is to change the who and why of key economic decision making at the basic enterprise level. For the economic system to serve the people, the people need to be in charge.

"Historical efforts to do that at the macro level through government either failed when confronted by determined private capitalist opposition, as in the U.S., or failed by giving too much power to too few in the government, as in the USSR.

"We therefore propose reorganizing enterprises such that workers become their own bosses.

"Specifically, that means placing the workers in the position of their own collective board of directors, rather than having directors be non-workers selected by major shareholders.

"This is not primarily a matter of workers as owners of these enterprises (fine, but not required), nor primarily as managers (likewise fine, but not required)."

Your post is total bullshit, and demonstrates your fundamental misunderstanding of capitalism.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

I agree that the primary struggle in American politics is between socialism and capitalism and that Bernie and at least 1/3 of Americans are dim enough to prefer the former. In fact, pretending what they promote is anything but the end of American freedom and prosperity is naive at best.

so·cial·ism
/ˈsōSHəˌlizəm/
noun

1. a political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.
   • (in Marxist theory) a transitional social state between the overthrow of capitalism and the realization of Communism.

a political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole

What problem do you have with businesses being run by a majority of workers instead of the richest one percent of shareholders/stakeholders?

It has never worked, and it never will. How can you give workers control over corporations without expropriating trillions in private property?

t has never worked, and it never will. How can you give workers control over corporations without expropriating trillions in private property?

I would begin the same way FDR did when he forced high levels of taxation on wealth and business in order to fund Social Security, unemployment compensation and a massive federal jobs program.

Today, WSDEs often become practical when the founders/owners of a small business retire and opt to sell their enterprise to their employees instead of rival capitalists. Legal services designed to implement such radical economic procedures already exist.

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

Are you as ignorant as Trump?

https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/fdr-creates-the-wpa

Yep, you’re fucking retarded. Everything FDR did was a failure until the war saved his ass. Cost a lot of lives but his move away from capitalism cost us damn near everything as a country.

 

[Rustic]

Trump is the poster child for why capitalism needs to be modulated

Trump is the poster child for government "modulating" capitalism - and a shining example of why it's such a bad idea.

Trump's the second generation poster child for socialism for the rich and rugged, "free" market individualism for the poor.

Lol
Redistribution is for pussies

 

[jasonnfree]

What problem do you have with businesses being run by a majority of workers instead of the richest one percent of shareholders/stakeholders?

It has never worked, and it never will. How can you give workers control over corporations without expropriating trillions in private property?

t has never worked, and it never will. How can you give workers control over corporations without expropriating trillions in private property?

I would begin the same way FDR did when he forced high levels of taxation on wealth and business in order to fund Social Security, unemployment compensation and a massive federal jobs program.

Today, WSDEs often become practical when the founders/owners of a small business retire and opt to sell their enterprise to their employees instead of rival capitalists. Legal services designed to implement such radical economic procedures already exist.

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

Are you as ignorant as Trump?

https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/fdr-creates-the-w

What problem do you have with businesses being run by a majority of workers instead of the richest one percent of shareholders/stakeholders?

It has never worked, and it never will. How can you give workers control over corporations without expropriating trillions in private property?

t has never worked, and it never will. How can you give workers control over corporations without expropriating trillions in private property?

I would begin the same way FDR did when he forced high levels of taxation on wealth and business in order to fund Social Security, unemployment compensation and a massive federal jobs program.

Today, WSDEs often become practical when the founders/owners of a small business retire and opt to sell their enterprise to their employees instead of rival capitalists. Legal services designed to implement such radical economic procedures already exist.

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

Are you as ignorant as Trump?

https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/fdr-creates-the-wpa

Yep, you’re fucking retarded. Everything FDR did was a failure until the war saved his ass. Cost a lot of lives but his move away from capitalism cost us damn near everything as a country.

pa

Yep, you’re fucking retarded. Everything FDR did was a failure until the war saved his ass. Cost a lot of lives but his move away from capitalism cost us damn near everything as a country.

My thought is ... just don't see how there's much difference between putting people to work on government projects being much different than putting them to work by going to war. Actually, war would be worse considering that so much military equipment produced is blown up. Total loss, whereas putting people to work on projects like FDR did allows them to get a paycheck for producing usable projects like dams, bridges, etc. while they use that government money to buy consumer goods, thereby putting others to work, kinda like trickle down.

 

[SmokeALib]

It has never worked, and it never will. How can you give workers control over corporations without expropriating trillions in private property?

t has never worked, and it never will. How can you give workers control over corporations without expropriating trillions in private property?

I would begin the same way FDR did when he forced high levels of taxation on wealth and business in order to fund Social Security, unemployment compensation and a massive federal jobs program.

Today, WSDEs often become practical when the founders/owners of a small business retire and opt to sell their enterprise to their employees instead of rival capitalists. Legal services designed to implement such radical economic procedures already exist.

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

Are you as ignorant as Trump?

https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/fdr-creates-the-w

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

Are you as ignorant as Trump?

https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/fdr-creates-the-wpa

Yep, you’re fucking retarded. Everything FDR did was a failure until the war saved his ass. Cost a lot of lives but his move away from capitalism cost us damn near everything as a country.

pa

Yep, you’re fucking retarded. Everything FDR did was a failure until the war saved his ass. Cost a lot of lives but his move away from capitalism cost us damn near everything as a country.

My thought is ... just don't see how there's much difference between putting people to work on government projects being much different than putting them to work by going to war. Actually, war would be worse considering that so much military equipment produced is blown up. Total loss, whereas putting people to work on projects like FDR did allows them to get a paycheck for producing usable projects like dams, bridges, etc. while they use that government money to buy consumer goods, thereby putting others to work, kinda like trickle down.

Why maintain roads under Sharia law? You won't be allowed to go anywhere anyway.

 

[dblack]

So how do we decide how to expand the board of directors? And how do we ensure they work for the benefit of society? You seem to be assuming that anything done "democratically" will produce better results. Trump much?

As I recall, Trump lost the popular vote by more than 8 million votes?

The point went whizzing by you, which is: democracy often produces bad results. Making everything in society a matter of democracy binds everything to those bad results.

This is the key aspect of 'democracy' that liberals can't seem to acknowledge. Democracy is good for making decisions where everyone must agree - where conformity is required. Where it's not required, democracy is a sledge hammer that kills diversity unnecessarily restricts freedom. With most social problems it isn't necessary to take a vote and force everyone into one course of action - yet this is the solution liberals reach for at every opportunity.

Expanding a large corporation's board would start with recognizing how a handful of directors with vested interests in the status quo aren't likely to make the fundamental changes to the economic system that's made them rich.

You seem to be assuming they should. Why?

Start With Worker Self-Directed Enterprises

Yep. That sort of thing is doable right now - no laws required. Seems unlikely to work, in my view - but as long as no one is getting violent, or passing laws forcing others to play along, it seems like a worthwhile experiment.

It gets shaky, in my view, when you look at the goals: "Our core goal is the development of a major—and, if possible, prevailing—sector of the economy that is comprised of enterprises (offices, factories, farms, and stores) in which the employees democratically perform the following key enterprise activities: (a) divide all the labors to be performed, (b) determine what is to be produced, how it is to be produced, and where it is to be produced, and (c) decide on the use and distribution of the output or revenues (if output is monetized) therefrom."

These kinds of decisions simply aren't well-suited to democracy. Rank-and-file employees don't have the skills or experience to make these decisions effectively.

 

[georgephillip]

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

How did Venezuela become a socialist economy without nationalizing its banks?

Economist Jeffrey Sachs: U.S. Sanctions Have Devastated Venezuela & Killed Over 40,000 Since 2017 | Democracy Now!

So your point is you and Jeffrey know better than Venezuela's El Presidente what was the cause - their socialist economic model - of Venezuela's economic meltdown?

Yanno, you think and say a lot of very Silly Socialist Shit (SSS) but the history of socialism-in-action is as replete with failure as it is with true believers who try to deny it.

And no Comrade George ... you can't have what others have built and earned just because you are one of life's bitter losers.
Just buy a box of tissues and have another good cry.

Yanno, you think and say a lot of very Silly Socialist Shit (SSS) but the history of socialism-in-action is as replete with failure as it is with true believers who try to deny it.

Do you think it's credible to blame socialism's "failures" (with the exception of Cuba) on the actions of the greatest military empire of all time's eternal antipathy? I only ask because capitalists claim to worship competition.

They claim no such thing and blaming others for socialism's failures is only "credible" if one is a socialist crybaby unable to face the fact that as an economic model, confiscating the hard-earned wealth of those who produce it and giving it to life's losers (like you) is not a recipe for economic success and prosperity.

No Comrade George ... you can't have what is mine.

No Comrade George ... you can't have what is mine.

What's yours?

 

[SAYIT]

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

How did Venezuela become a socialist economy without nationalizing its banks?

Economist Jeffrey Sachs: U.S. Sanctions Have Devastated Venezuela & Killed Over 40,000 Since 2017 | Democracy Now!

So your point is you and Jeffrey know better than Venezuela's El Presidente what was the cause - their socialist economic model - of Venezuela's economic meltdown?

Yanno, you think and say a lot of very Silly Socialist Shit (SSS) but the history of socialism-in-action is as replete with failure as it is with true believers who try to deny it.

And no Comrade George ... you can't have what others have built and earned just because you are one of life's bitter losers.
Just buy a box of tissues and have another good cry.

Yanno, you think and say a lot of very Silly Socialist Shit (SSS) but the history of socialism-in-action is as replete with failure as it is with true believers who try to deny it.

Do you think it's credible to blame socialism's "failures" (with the exception of Cuba) on the actions of the greatest military empire of all time's eternal antipathy? I only ask because capitalists claim to worship competition.

They claim no such thing and blaming others for socialism's failures is only "credible" if one is a socialist crybaby unable to face the fact that as an economic model, confiscating the hard-earned wealth of those who produce it and giving it to life's losers (like you) is not a recipe for economic success and prosperity.

No Comrade George ... you can't have what is mine.

No Comrade George ... you can't have what is mine.

What's yours?

What is mine is mine (yeah, I built it), Comrade George, what is yours is yours, and whiny socialist politicians like Warren will promise life's weak-minded losers anything in exchange for your votes. She will not get the opportunity to deliver.

 

[dblack]

What is mine is mine, Comrade George, what is yours is yours, and whiny socialist politicians like Warren will promise you anything in exchange for your vote. She will not get the opportunity to deliver.

She might. More and more people are ready to toss freedom aside in exchange for promises of "free shit".

 

[Missouri_Mike]

It has never worked, and it never will. How can you give workers control over corporations without expropriating trillions in private property?

t has never worked, and it never will. How can you give workers control over corporations without expropriating trillions in private property?

I would begin the same way FDR did when he forced high levels of taxation on wealth and business in order to fund Social Security, unemployment compensation and a massive federal jobs program.

Today, WSDEs often become practical when the founders/owners of a small business retire and opt to sell their enterprise to their employees instead of rival capitalists. Legal services designed to implement such radical economic procedures already exist.

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

Are you as ignorant as Trump?

https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/fdr-creates-the-w

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

You’re a brainwashed idiot. You actually think you’re going to tax your way to 10 million new jobs?

Are you as ignorant as Trump?

https://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/fdr-creates-the-wpa

Yep, you’re fucking retarded. Everything FDR did was a failure until the war saved his ass. Cost a lot of lives but his move away from capitalism cost us damn near everything as a country.

pa

Yep, you’re fucking retarded. Everything FDR did was a failure until the war saved his ass. Cost a lot of lives but his move away from capitalism cost us damn near everything as a country.

My thought is ... just don't see how there's much difference between putting people to work on government projects being much different than putting them to work by going to war. Actually, war would be worse considering that so much military equipment produced is blown up. Total loss, whereas putting people to work on projects like FDR did allows them to get a paycheck for producing usable projects like dams, bridges, etc. while they use that government money to buy consumer goods, thereby putting others to work, kinda like trickle down.

Trickle down doesn’t work when it relies on a massive fire house quantity of cash to the government before it can begin trickling down.

 

[georgephillip]

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

How did Venezuela become a socialist economy without nationalizing its banks?

Economist Jeffrey Sachs: U.S. Sanctions Have Devastated Venezuela & Killed Over 40,000 Since 2017 | Democracy Now!

So your point is you and Jeffrey know better than Venezuela's El Presidente what was the cause - their socialist economic model - of Venezuela's economic meltdown?

Yanno, you think and say a lot of very Silly Socialist Shit (SSS) but the history of socialism-in-action is as replete with failure as it is with true believers who try to deny it.

And no Comrade George ... you can't have what others have built and earned just because you are one of life's bitter losers.
Just buy a box of tissues and have another good cry.

So your point is you and Jeffrey know better than Venezuela's El Presidente what was the cause - their socialist economic model - of Venezuela's economic meltdown?

Venezuela is the latest in a long list of countries who economies were destroyed by illegal US economic sanctions:

Financial Imperialism-The Case of Venezuela

"Venezuela today is a classic case how US imperialism in the 21st century employs financial measures to crush a state and country that dares to break away from the US global economic empire and pursue an independent course outside the US empire’s web of entangling economic and financial relations.

"Here’s how US ‘financial imperialism’ has worked, and continues to work, with the intent of assisting regime change in the case of Venezuela.

"In a world where US Capitalism is the dominant hegemon the US currency—the dollar—is the centerpiece of the US global economic empire. The dollar serves as the global trading currency as well as the global banking reserves currency.

"More than 85% of all global trade (export and import) is done in dollars.

"Certain commodities, like global oil and oil futures contracts, are traded virtually only in dollars.

"Recently more countries have begun to peg their own currency to the dollar, allowing it to move in tandem with the dollar.

"Some have even eliminated their currency altogether and now use only the US dollar as their domestic currency. Increasingly as well, more countries are issuing their domestic bonds in dollars (i.e. dollar denominated bonds).

"And their central banks follow the US central bank, the Federal Reserve’s, policy as it raises or lowers US interest rates that in turn cause the US dollar to rise and fall.

"They do so even if rising US interest rates mean rising rates in their own economies that precipitate recessions and mass unemployment. These are all examples of the growing financial integration with the US Imperial State and economy."

 

[georgephillip]

What problem do you have with businesses being run by a majority of workers instead of the richest one percent of shareholders/stakeholders?

American biz is not run by the richest one percent of shareholders, Comrade George, and if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao you will end up in Venezuela.

American biz is not run by the richest one percent of shareholders, Comrade George, and if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao you will end up in Venezuela.

American capitalists like the Koch brothers acting through their useful political idiots inflict economic sanctions on private banks in Venezuela to crash the economy and you blame "socialism"?...

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

Socialist Venezuela Falling Apart As President Maduro Shockingly Blames Party
News flash! Socialism in poor, closed-door economies is a failure. So says Nicolas Maduro, who happens to be the president of one: the biggest failed state in the Americas, poor ol’ Venezuela.

In a surprising twist on Monday, Maduro went against the Socialists United (PSUV) playbook of blaming Washington (especially the CIA) for Venezuela’s troubles.

“The production models we’ve tried so far have failed, and the responsibility is ours—mine and yours,” Maduro told the PSUV party congress.

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

How did Venezuela become a socialist economy without nationalizing its banks?

Economist Jeffrey Sachs: U.S. Sanctions Have Devastated Venezuela & Killed Over 40,000 Since 2017 | Democracy Now!

"More than 40,000 people have died in Venezuela since 2017 as a result of U.S. sanctions, according to a new report by the Center for Economic and Policy Research co-authored by economists Jeffrey Sachs and Mark Weisbrot.

"The report examines how U.S. sanctions have reduced the availability of food and medicine in Venezuela and increased disease and mortality.

"We speak with Jeffrey Sachs in our New York studio. In the report, he writes, 'American sanctions are deliberately aiming to wreck Venezuela’s economy and thereby lead to regime change. It’s a fruitless, heartless, illegal, and failed policy, causing grave harm to the Venezuelan people.'"

Socialism is what has devastated Venezuela and killed 40,000 people, moron.

What problem do you have with businesses being run by a majority of workers instead of the richest one percent of shareholders/stakeholders?

American biz is not run by the richest one percent of shareholders, Comrade George, and if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao you will end up in Venezuela.

American biz is not run by the richest one percent of shareholders, Comrade George, and if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao you will end up in Venezuela.

American capitalists like the Koch brothers acting through their useful political idiots inflict economic sanctions on private banks in Venezuela to crash the economy and you blame "socialism"?...

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

Socialist Venezuela Falling Apart As President Maduro Shockingly Blames Party
News flash! Socialism in poor, closed-door economies is a failure. So says Nicolas Maduro, who happens to be the president of one: the biggest failed state in the Americas, poor ol’ Venezuela.

In a surprising twist on Monday, Maduro went against the Socialists United (PSUV) playbook of blaming Washington (especially the CIA) for Venezuela’s troubles.

“The production models we’ve tried so far have failed, and the responsibility is ours—mine and yours,” Maduro told the PSUV party congress.

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

How did Venezuela become a socialist economy without nationalizing its banks?

Economist Jeffrey Sachs: U.S. Sanctions Have Devastated Venezuela & Killed Over 40,000 Since 2017 | Democracy Now!

"More than 40,000 people have died in Venezuela since 2017 as a result of U.S. sanctions, according to a new report by the Center for Economic and Policy Research co-authored by economists Jeffrey Sachs and Mark Weisbrot.

"The report examines how U.S. sanctions have reduced the availability of food and medicine in Venezuela and increased disease and mortality.

"We speak with Jeffrey Sachs in our New York studio. In the report, he writes, 'American sanctions are deliberately aiming to wreck Venezuela’s economy and thereby lead to regime change. It’s a fruitless, heartless, illegal, and failed policy, causing grave harm to the Venezuelan people.'"

Socialism is what has devastated Venezuela and killed 40,000 people, moron.

Illegal sanctions imposed by lawless capitalists have destroyed Venezuela and murdered millions of innocent people from Korea to Kandahar over the past 75 years.

Trump’s Economic Sanctions Have Cost Venezuela About $6bn Since August 2017

 

[Theowl32]

the United States has been an economic and innovation marvel and our national wealth has been good for our citizens and enabled us to be a force of good throughout the world

Are you pretty much always in troll mode?

when i'm drunk, yes

Let me guess - you're usually drunk?

yes

Basque sucks Spain's dick.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

How did Venezuela become a socialist economy without nationalizing its banks?

Economist Jeffrey Sachs: U.S. Sanctions Have Devastated Venezuela & Killed Over 40,000 Since 2017 | Democracy Now!

So your point is you and Jeffrey know better than Venezuela's El Presidente what was the cause - their socialist economic model - of Venezuela's economic meltdown?

Yanno, you think and say a lot of very Silly Socialist Shit (SSS) but the history of socialism-in-action is as replete with failure as it is with true believers who try to deny it.

And no Comrade George ... you can't have what others have built and earned just because you are one of life's bitter losers.
Just buy a box of tissues and have another good cry.

So your point is you and Jeffrey know better than Venezuela's El Presidente what was the cause - their socialist economic model - of Venezuela's economic meltdown?

Venezuela is the latest in a long list of countries who economies were destroyed by illegal US economic sanctions:

Financial Imperialism-The Case of Venezuela

"Venezuela today is a classic case how US imperialism in the 21st century employs financial measures to crush a state and country that dares to break away from the US global economic empire and pursue an independent course outside the US empire’s web of entangling economic and financial relations.

"Here’s how US ‘financial imperialism’ has worked, and continues to work, with the intent of assisting regime change in the case of Venezuela.

"In a world where US Capitalism is the dominant hegemon the US currency—the dollar—is the centerpiece of the US global economic empire. The dollar serves as the global trading currency as well as the global banking reserves currency.

"More than 85% of all global trade (export and import) is done in dollars.

"Certain commodities, like global oil and oil futures contracts, are traded virtually only in dollars.

"Recently more countries have begun to peg their own currency to the dollar, allowing it to move in tandem with the dollar.

"Some have even eliminated their currency altogether and now use only the US dollar as their domestic currency. Increasingly as well, more countries are issuing their domestic bonds in dollars (i.e. dollar denominated bonds).

"And their central banks follow the US central bank, the Federal Reserve’s, policy as it raises or lowers US interest rates that in turn cause the US dollar to rise and fall.

"They do so even if rising US interest rates mean rising rates in their own economies that precipitate recessions and mass unemployment. These are all examples of the growing financial integration with the US Imperial State and economy."

LMAO! More socialist excuses for their self inflicted failures. You do realize socialism has a long track record of failure before the US dollar was the currency for trade right? What’s your excuse for that?

 

[bripat9643]

American biz is not run by the richest one percent of shareholders, Comrade George, and if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao you will end up in Venezuela.

American biz is not run by the richest one percent of shareholders, Comrade George, and if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao you will end up in Venezuela.

American capitalists like the Koch brothers acting through their useful political idiots inflict economic sanctions on private banks in Venezuela to crash the economy and you blame "socialism"?...

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

Socialist Venezuela Falling Apart As President Maduro Shockingly Blames Party
News flash! Socialism in poor, closed-door economies is a failure. So says Nicolas Maduro, who happens to be the president of one: the biggest failed state in the Americas, poor ol’ Venezuela.

In a surprising twist on Monday, Maduro went against the Socialists United (PSUV) playbook of blaming Washington (especially the CIA) for Venezuela’s troubles.

“The production models we’ve tried so far have failed, and the responsibility is ours—mine and yours,” Maduro told the PSUV party congress.

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

How did Venezuela become a socialist economy without nationalizing its banks?

Economist Jeffrey Sachs: U.S. Sanctions Have Devastated Venezuela & Killed Over 40,000 Since 2017 | Democracy Now!

"More than 40,000 people have died in Venezuela since 2017 as a result of U.S. sanctions, according to a new report by the Center for Economic and Policy Research co-authored by economists Jeffrey Sachs and Mark Weisbrot.

"The report examines how U.S. sanctions have reduced the availability of food and medicine in Venezuela and increased disease and mortality.

"We speak with Jeffrey Sachs in our New York studio. In the report, he writes, 'American sanctions are deliberately aiming to wreck Venezuela’s economy and thereby lead to regime change. It’s a fruitless, heartless, illegal, and failed policy, causing grave harm to the Venezuelan people.'"

Socialism is what has devastated Venezuela and killed 40,000 people, moron.

American biz is not run by the richest one percent of shareholders, Comrade George, and if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao you will end up in Venezuela.

American biz is not run by the richest one percent of shareholders, Comrade George, and if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao you will end up in Venezuela.

American capitalists like the Koch brothers acting through their useful political idiots inflict economic sanctions on private banks in Venezuela to crash the economy and you blame "socialism"?...

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

Socialist Venezuela Falling Apart As President Maduro Shockingly Blames Party
News flash! Socialism in poor, closed-door economies is a failure. So says Nicolas Maduro, who happens to be the president of one: the biggest failed state in the Americas, poor ol’ Venezuela.

In a surprising twist on Monday, Maduro went against the Socialists United (PSUV) playbook of blaming Washington (especially the CIA) for Venezuela’s troubles.

“The production models we’ve tried so far have failed, and the responsibility is ours—mine and yours,” Maduro told the PSUV party congress.

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

How did Venezuela become a socialist economy without nationalizing its banks?

Economist Jeffrey Sachs: U.S. Sanctions Have Devastated Venezuela & Killed Over 40,000 Since 2017 | Democracy Now!

"More than 40,000 people have died in Venezuela since 2017 as a result of U.S. sanctions, according to a new report by the Center for Economic and Policy Research co-authored by economists Jeffrey Sachs and Mark Weisbrot.

"The report examines how U.S. sanctions have reduced the availability of food and medicine in Venezuela and increased disease and mortality.

"We speak with Jeffrey Sachs in our New York studio. In the report, he writes, 'American sanctions are deliberately aiming to wreck Venezuela’s economy and thereby lead to regime change. It’s a fruitless, heartless, illegal, and failed policy, causing grave harm to the Venezuelan people.'"

Socialism is what has devastated Venezuela and killed 40,000 people, moron.

Illegal sanctions imposed by lawless capitalists have destroyed Venezuela and murdered millions of innocent people from Korea to Kandahar over the past 75 years.

Trump’s Economic Sanctions Have Cost Venezuela About $6bn Since August 2017

Have you commie morons figured out that no one is buying your shopworn excuse that the United States is responsible for the failure of your latest Utopia?

 

[georgephillip]

The Democratic Socialists of America say that "both the economy and society should be run democratically" and find that very disturbing. I don't think either should be run democratically.

Democracy is a terrible way to "run" things. It's fine for choosing representatives in government, but it's no way to run a society, nor an economy. It essentially injects politics into everything we do, makes everything potentially a political issue. No thanks.

Democracy is a terrible way to "run" things. It's fine for choosing representatives in government, but it's no way to run a society, nor an economy. It essentially injects politics into everything we do, makes everything potentially a political issue. No thanks.

Shifting economic decision making from a relative handful of rich corporate managers/shareholders to a much larger, middle-class contingent of public stakeholders would likely decrease the level of economic inequality we currently see in the US.

Such radical reform would eliminate the need for government to redistribute wealth/income through taxation.

Elizabeth Warren’s Rise Is a Plus for Issue Politics — And a Bad Sign for Billionaires

"While working people almost all live off highly-taxed 'income,' high net worth individuals mostly live off other revenue streams: carried interest, capital gains, inheritance, etc.

"Warren’s plan would create a net worth calculation that would hit households worth between $50 million and $1 billion with a 2% annual 'ultra-millionaires tax.'"

 

[dblack]

The Democratic Socialists of America say that "both the economy and society should be run democratically" and find that very disturbing. I don't think either should be run democratically.

Democracy is a terrible way to "run" things. It's fine for choosing representatives in government, but it's no way to run a society, nor an economy. It essentially injects politics into everything we do, makes everything potentially a political issue. No thanks.

Democracy is a terrible way to "run" things. It's fine for choosing representatives in government, but it's no way to run a society, nor an economy. It essentially injects politics into everything we do, makes everything potentially a political issue. No thanks.

Shifting economic decision making from a relative handful of rich corporate managers/shareholders to a much larger, middle-class contingent of public stakeholders would likely decrease the level of economic inequality we currently see in the US.

Did you even read my post? Sometimes it just seems like you hit 'reply' so you can paste in another brochure.

I don't see how public stakeholders would do anything other than run a business into the ground.

 

[bripat9643]

The Democratic Socialists of America say that "both the economy and society should be run democratically" and find that very disturbing. I don't think either should be run democratically.

Democracy is a terrible way to "run" things. It's fine for choosing representatives in government, but it's no way to run a society, nor an economy. It essentially injects politics into everything we do, makes everything potentially a political issue. No thanks.

Democracy is a terrible way to "run" things. It's fine for choosing representatives in government, but it's no way to run a society, nor an economy. It essentially injects politics into everything we do, makes everything potentially a political issue. No thanks.

Shifting economic decision making from a relative handful of rich corporate managers/shareholders to a much larger, middle-class contingent of public stakeholders would likely decrease the level of economic inequality we currently see in the US.

Such radical reform would eliminate the need for government to redistribute wealth/income through taxation.

Elizabeth Warren’s Rise Is a Plus for Issue Politics — And a Bad Sign for Billionaires

"While working people almost all live off highly-taxed 'income,' high net worth individuals mostly live off other revenue streams: carried interest, capital gains, inheritance, etc.

"Warren’s plan would create a net worth calculation that would hit households worth between $50 million and $1 billion with a 2% annual 'ultra-millionaires tax.'"

There is no need to redistribute wealth, moron.

 

[georgephillip]

Venezuela's President-for-Life Maduro not only admitted at a PSUV Party conference (yeah, socialism requires the elimination of other political parties) that their socialist economic model is a failure, he blamed himself and the party. Only desperate children need to blame capitalists. You spew common socialist LIES in defense of what has proven to be a guaranteed socio-economic recipe for disaster.

How did Venezuela become a socialist economy without nationalizing its banks?

Economist Jeffrey Sachs: U.S. Sanctions Have Devastated Venezuela & Killed Over 40,000 Since 2017 | Democracy Now!

So your point is you and Jeffrey know better than Venezuela's El Presidente what was the cause - their socialist economic model - of Venezuela's economic meltdown?

Yanno, you think and say a lot of very Silly Socialist Shit (SSS) but the history of socialism-in-action is as replete with failure as it is with true believers who try to deny it.

And no Comrade George ... you can't have what others have built and earned just because you are one of life's bitter losers.
Just buy a box of tissues and have another good cry.

So your point is you and Jeffrey know better than Venezuela's El Presidente what was the cause - their socialist economic model - of Venezuela's economic meltdown?

Venezuela is the latest in a long list of countries who economies were destroyed by illegal US economic sanctions:

Financial Imperialism-The Case of Venezuela

"Venezuela today is a classic case how US imperialism in the 21st century employs financial measures to crush a state and country that dares to break away from the US global economic empire and pursue an independent course outside the US empire’s web of entangling economic and financial relations.

"Here’s how US ‘financial imperialism’ has worked, and continues to work, with the intent of assisting regime change in the case of Venezuela.

"In a world where US Capitalism is the dominant hegemon the US currency—the dollar—is the centerpiece of the US global economic empire. The dollar serves as the global trading currency as well as the global banking reserves currency.

"More than 85% of all global trade (export and import) is done in dollars.

"Certain commodities, like global oil and oil futures contracts, are traded virtually only in dollars.

"Recently more countries have begun to peg their own currency to the dollar, allowing it to move in tandem with the dollar.

"Some have even eliminated their currency altogether and now use only the US dollar as their domestic currency. Increasingly as well, more countries are issuing their domestic bonds in dollars (i.e. dollar denominated bonds).

"And their central banks follow the US central bank, the Federal Reserve’s, policy as it raises or lowers US interest rates that in turn cause the US dollar to rise and fall.

"They do so even if rising US interest rates mean rising rates in their own economies that precipitate recessions and mass unemployment. These are all examples of the growing financial integration with the US Imperial State and economy."

LMAO! More socialist excuses for their self inflicted failures. You do realize socialism has a long track record of failure before the US dollar was the currency for trade right? What’s your excuse for that?

LMAO! More socialist excuses for their self inflicted failures. You do realize socialism has a long track record of failure before the US dollar was the currency for trade right? What’s your excuse for that?

Just because you are ignorant of something doesn't mean it never happened.

"First plan, 1928–1932[edit]
Main article: first five-year plan

Five-year plans for the national economy of the Soviet Union - Wikipedia

"From 1928 to 1940, the number of Soviet workers in industry, construction, and transport grew from 4.6 million to 12.6 million and factory output soared.[6] Stalin's first five-year plan helped make the USSR a leading industrial nation."

https://artir.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/sovgdp.png?w=640

Stalin's GDP was far inferior to US GDP; however, the Russian tyrant didn't resort to a century of chattel slavery to accomplish his economic goals.