The Jesus Story

[The Illusion]

I should note that hell is now freezing over. I actually agree with Chris....

However, my reasons for believing rest in my own witness from God and not from the eye witness accounts of others. I would presume that many have had the Spirit speak to them and not realized the real source of their faith.

I understand the lack of belief, but what I will never understand is the decision that you cant learn any more than you already know. As if there is no possibility. You dont even try to look at things from a believers perspective and yet you wonder why you cant concieve of God or Christ. You dont try to accurately learn what He allegedly taught. you just dismiss it as fantastic.

Maybe it's just me, but I dont like discounting any knowledge from anyones perspective. But than I love understanding things. It's just part of my nature.

What faith are you, if I might ask so?

Jamie

 

[AllieBaba]

Yeah, there's so much more validity to the "Mary was raped by a roman soldier" story than the story, documented by a variety of people and never contested by ANYONE living at the time or in the centuries after, put forth in the bible.

But carry on with your fantasy if it makes you happy. Suicides shouldn't be treated, either. Because according to you, they aren't sick.

 

[The Illusion]

Yeah, there's so much more validity to the "Mary was raped by a roman soldier" story than the story, documented by a variety of people and never contested by ANYONE living at the time or in the centuries after, put forth in the bible.

But carry on with your fantasy if it makes you happy. Suicides shouldn't be treated, either. Because according to you, they aren't sick.

lol the validity of the biblical account has been refuted for many many years even recently afterword.

Jamie

 

[AllieBaba]

Of course, one wonders why no major historians noticed Jesus or all the dead people who allegedly rose from the graves,,,

No one except Josephus. And a variety of other scholars who commented on it.

Educate yourself before you flap your cocksuckers.

 

[AllieBaba]

Yeah, there's so much more validity to the "Mary was raped by a roman soldier" story than the story, documented by a variety of people and never contested by ANYONE living at the time or in the centuries after, put forth in the bible.

But carry on with your fantasy if it makes you happy. Suicides shouldn't be treated, either. Because according to you, they aren't sick.

lol the validity of the biblical account has been refuted for many many years even recently afterword.

Jamie

Really? Link to proof it was refuted recently afterward.

The one thing about the bible is NOBODY came forth to declare the disciples were were lying. They didn't like what they said, but they never called them liars. Because multitudes witnessed the miracles and the life of Christ.

 

[Shannon]

No one except Josephus. And a variety of other scholars who commented on it.

Educate yourself before you flap your cocksuckers.

Josephus barely mentioned christianity in passing, really. And noone reported a bunch of the dead walking the earth. Only one person recorded that- even only one of the gospels thought it worth mentioning

 

[The Illusion]

Yeah, there's so much more validity to the "Mary was raped by a roman soldier" story than the story, documented by a variety of people and never contested by ANYONE living at the time or in the centuries after, put forth in the bible.

But carry on with your fantasy if it makes you happy. Suicides shouldn't be treated, either. Because according to you, they aren't sick.

lol the validity of the biblical account has been refuted for many many years even recently afterword.

Jamie

Really? Link to proof it was refuted recently afterward.

The one thing about the bible is NOBODY came forth to declare the disciples were were lying. They didn't like what they said, but they never called them liars. Because multitudes witnessed the miracles and the life of Christ.

Id like to see those eye witness reports. .

Jamie

 

[Care4all]

everyone knew it....this was the Word that passed through the area, then on to the entire world.

it was, ''the GOOD NEWS'' at the time....the good news that HE is RISEN, was what began the entire movement of Christianity! There were no New Testimate Bibles right after his death? It was passed on by those who witnessed it...HE IS risen!!! He spent 40 days i believe, Risen from the dead, but walking here on Earth after his Crucifixion.... (some groups didm't witness nor believe it, but STILL viewed Him as a great Prophet)

To seriously believe that Jesus was simply the son of a girl that was raped by a roman soldier which was common at the time, and nothing more, that went on to change the ENTIRE WORLD, from his death onward, from our calendar to billions of followers still 2000 years later, is simply.... purposefully being disingenuously ignorant for anyone with a braincell or two imho....

There is MORE than enough proof that Jesus wasn't merely a common bastard of a roman soldier rapist...

I am not saying it is proof of His Deity, but it CERTAINLY is NOT proof that He wasn't.... and was merely a frequently common bastard of a roman soldier....don't ya think?

care

 

[The Illusion]

everyone knew it....this was the Word that passed through the area, then on to the entire world.

it was, ''the GOOD NEWS'' at the time....the good news that HE is RISEN, was what began the entire movement of Christianity! There were no New Testimate Bibles right after his death? It was passed on by those who witnessed it...HE IS risen!!! He spent 40 days i believe, Risen from the dead, but walking here on Earth after his Crucifixion.... (some groups didm't witness nor believe it, but STILL viewed Him as a great Prophet)

To seriously believe that Jesus was simply the son of a girl that was raped by a roman soldier which was common at the time, and nothing more, that went on to change the ENTIRE WORLD, from his death onward, from our calendar to billions of followers still 2000 years later, is simply.... purposefully being disingenuously ignorant for anyone with a braincell or two imho....

There is MORE than enough proof that Jesus wasn't merely a common bastard of a roman soldier rapist...

I am not saying it is proof of His Deity, but it CERTAINLY is NOT proof that He wasn't.... and was merely a frequently common bastard of a roman soldier....don't ya think?

care

changed the whole world? oh? buddha, who existed before your jesus did, also changed the whole world. oh wait. only his part, just as your jesus changed the western part. note the similarities between the words of your jesus and those of buddha. did i mention buddha came before your jesus? i wouild imagine that someone so powerful as buddha would also be a son of your god then. no?

lets get back to the changed the whole world thingy. i am glad that greed, murder, corruption, and other such negative behaviours are now eradicated because yoru jesus changed the world. oh, wait. they are still around us

 

[JW Frogen]

Jesus turned water into wine.

OK, probably did not happen, but still I can turn anything into booze, sooner or latter, so maybe it did?

Metaphorically and "AA Hello Jesus" speaking.

 

[The Illusion]

Of course, one wonders why no major historians noticed Jesus or all the dead people who allegedly rose from the graves,,,

No one except Josephus. And a variety of other scholars who commented on it.

Educate yourself before you flap your cocksuckers.

josephus never met your jesus. he only heard second hand accounts. the other "scholars" you failed to mention (there were about six others) mention "the christ" which translated means "the messiah". there were over seven messianic figures that preceded your jesus. which of these were these unmentioned scholars referring to? thats right, you have no idea.

what was it you said? educate yourself before you flap your cocsuckers. btw, this is jamies husband posting. you will see me soon as vincubus. i am the originator of the story in her OP.

vinny

 

[The Illusion]

I believe the story from Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John.

On what evidence?

Eye witness testimony.

these "eyewitnesses" were deposed? their character vouched for? where are their depositions? and what are their names?

ALL of the first four gospels were written by men who never met your jesus. there ARE no eyewitnesses.

 

[Avatar4321]

josephus never met your jesus. he only heard second hand accounts. the other "scholars" you failed to mention (there were about six others) mention "the christ" which translated means "the messiah". there were over seven messianic figures that preceded your jesus. which of these were these unmentioned scholars referring to? thats right, you have no idea.

what was it you said? educate yourself before you flap your cocsuckers. btw, this is jamies husband posting. you will see me soon as vincubus. i am the originator of the story in her OP.

vinny

So let me see if i understand you correctly.

You call the place Christ came from to be backwards and highly superstitious region. You complain constantly of their stupidity and lack of intellectual prowess. Yet you expect intellectual scholars to have recorded everything and reject what the people who were actually there recorded... Exactly how many scholars do you think existed in a backward superstitious region?

In fact, how many scholars have you read from that region and period? List them. I mean you are clearly well read from the time period if you are trying to claim that none of them spoke anything concerning what happened. I assume this is from hours of study of these records. Otherwise, your position makes absolutely no sense.

I doubt a single scholar has recorded your intimate activities with your spouse. Are we to conclude that because no scholar has said anything that you've never made love to your wife? According to your logic, we must conclude that.

Arguments from silence are necessarily weak. And when we continually tell ourselves something cant have happened because there is no evidence for it we already prejudice ourselves against ever finding evidence that it did happen. It's a pointless position that does nothing but close our minds to future knowledge.

And why are you closing your minds to knowledge? Because someone has tod you that no scholar supports something. Why on earth would you put such blind faith in what someone else tells you? I dont expect anyone to put blind faith in what I said, I expect them to actually go to the Lord and learn for themselves. You'd be surprised how few people actually do that. Because theyd rather argue for ignorance or pretend that knowledge cant be obtained then actually put some faith and effort into finding that knowledge.

Every man, woman, and child, can know that God is if they approach Him in humility and willingness to follow Him. If they are sincere seekers of truth, not only to know, but to live as well, God can reveal i to them. But if they pretend as though its impossible to know. If they proceed to do nothing or demand in arrogance what must be sought with lowliness, then why should they be rewarded for such destructive and counter productive behavior.

God is trying to teach us principles in everything He asks of us. Principles that will guide us to happy and long lives if we followed them. And He just asks us to try and be patient. That's all. And if we follow those principles, we will recieve all the Father has.

 

[vincubus]

josephus never met your jesus. he only heard second hand accounts. the other "scholars" you failed to mention (there were about six others) mention "the christ" which translated means "the messiah". there were over seven messianic figures that preceded your jesus. which of these were these unmentioned scholars referring to? thats right, you have no idea.

what was it you said? educate yourself before you flap your cocsuckers. btw, this is jamies husband posting. you will see me soon as vincubus. i am the originator of the story in her OP.

vinny

So let me see if i understand you correctly.

You call the place Christ came from to be backwards and highly superstitious region. You complain constantly of their stupidity and lack of intellectual prowess. Yet you expect intellectual scholars to have recorded everything and reject what the people who were actually there recorded... Exactly how many scholars do you think existed in a backward superstitious region?

In fact, how many scholars have you read from that region and period? List them. I mean you are clearly well read from the time period if you are trying to claim that none of them spoke anything concerning what happened. I assume this is from hours of study of these records. Otherwise, your position makes absolutely no sense.

I doubt a single scholar has recorded your intimate activities with your spouse. Are we to conclude that because no scholar has said anything that you've never made love to your wife? According to your logic, we must conclude that.

Arguments from silence are necessarily weak. And when we continually tell ourselves something cant have happened because there is no evidence for it we already prejudice ourselves against ever finding evidence that it did happen. It's a pointless position that does nothing but close our minds to future knowledge.

And why are you closing your minds to knowledge? Because someone has tod you that no scholar supports something. Why on earth would you put such blind faith in what someone else tells you? I dont expect anyone to put blind faith in what I said, I expect them to actually go to the Lord and learn for themselves. You'd be surprised how few people actually do that. Because theyd rather argue for ignorance or pretend that knowledge cant be obtained then actually put some faith and effort into finding that knowledge.

Every man, woman, and child, can know that God is if they approach Him in humility and willingness to follow Him. If they are sincere seekers of truth, not only to know, but to live as well, God can reveal i to them. But if they pretend as though its impossible to know. If they proceed to do nothing or demand in arrogance what must be sought with lowliness, then why should they be rewarded for such destructive and counter productive behavior.

God is trying to teach us principles in everything He asks of us. Principles that will guide us to happy and long lives if we followed them. And He just asks us to try and be patient. That's all. And if we follow those principles, we will recieve all the Father has.

hmmm....i had been a born again for some 20 years plus. i am very familiar with the bible, having read it through four times, as well as studied it in bible study and on my own, and along with commentary. i have closed my mind to nothing. and please spare me your sermons. i have heard some fantastic ones. i do not need nor do i want your sermons, but i am sure you feel you must justify your beliefs and appease your desert god and tell me of the good news. i know it, and have rejected it.

you claim i complained continually that they (the jews) were stupid and lack intellectual prowess. you will kindly cite that? have a care lest you bear false witness. your words here are your only witness, and they, coupled with your attitude, can drive others from your god or bring them closer. we aren't stupid nor are we sheep. watch your words that they ring true.

lets see. because someone told me. yes, they did. i have read the pliney source. that primary source told me, as well as the tacitus source,(another primary source) and the josephus source, etc. anything else you want to know? and just to digress ( something i am prone to) the bede is the only source that has easter as a pagan holliday, and he learned of that from an old german woman. one source. just threw that in to illustrate my effort to stay balanced. ( i am a pagan, btw, and reject the notion that easter is a pagan holiday, at least by that name "easter"). [edit to clarify. i went LOOKING for the sources that supposedly talked of your jesus. i read them. so what you suppose is totally wrong]

arguments from silence might be weak, but lacking credible proof and making assumptions based on faith are weaker yet. otherwise, your post, while appealing in a humble way, is chock full of argumentative fallacies.

 

[editec]

Lovely fairy tale.

Not quite so interesting as the fairy tale you're seeking to rewrite, but still, pretty nice.

 

[Ceasaro]

So, wasn't mary raped? Did anyone check her hymen before she gave birth to jesus? Who picked that name anyway? jesus, isn't that spanish?

 

[Care4all]

VINCUBUS and ILLUSION are the same poster?

I am getting a little confused here...?

 

[Care4all]

everyone knew it....this was the Word that passed through the area, then on to the entire world.

it was, ''the GOOD NEWS'' at the time....the good news that HE is RISEN, was what began the entire movement of Christianity! There were no New Testimate Bibles right after his death? It was passed on by those who witnessed it...HE IS risen!!! He spent 40 days i believe, Risen from the dead, but walking here on Earth after his Crucifixion.... (some groups didm't witness nor believe it, but STILL viewed Him as a great Prophet)

To seriously believe that Jesus was simply the son of a girl that was raped by a roman soldier which was common at the time, and nothing more, that went on to change the ENTIRE WORLD, from his death onward, from our calendar to billions of followers still 2000 years later, is simply.... purposefully being disingenuously ignorant for anyone with a braincell or two imho....

There is MORE than enough proof that Jesus wasn't merely a common bastard of a roman soldier rapist...

I am not saying it is proof of His Deity, but it CERTAINLY is NOT proof that He wasn't.... and was merely a frequently common bastard of a roman soldier....don't ya think?

care

changed the whole world? oh? buddha, who existed before your jesus did, also changed the whole world. oh wait. only his part, just as your jesus changed the western part. note the similarities between the words of your jesus and those of buddha. did i mention buddha came before your jesus? i wouild imagine that someone so powerful as buddha would also be a son of your god then. no?

lets get back to the changed the whole world thingy. i am glad that greed, murder, corruption, and other such negative behaviours are now eradicated because yoru jesus changed the world. oh, wait. they are still around us

Yes Buddha did change the world, and you didn't find the disrespectful need to make up an entirely DECEITFUL AND FAUX STORY that he was the bastard child of a Roman soldier that raped his mother either....so what gives, ya got something against Jesus vs Buddha?

 

[thu theenker]

So, wasn't mary raped? Did anyone check her hymen before she gave birth to jesus?

Ther wus a book that said sumun did, but the council @ niecine leftit out

 

[The Illusion]

VINCUBUS and ILLUSION are the same poster?

I am getting a little confused here...?

Hes my husband and posted as me until he went and made a forum account for himself.

Jamie