The Great Abortion Compromise!

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Shogun, Oct 11, 2006.

  1. Shogun
    Online

    Shogun Guest

    Ratings:
    +0
    Greetings!

    None of you are familiar with me since I lurk on this board more than I post so forgive me for coming out of left field. I wanted to run an idea past a group of people with mixed political identity rather than my usual left leaning stomping grounds. I hope that a similar thread has not already been posted; i've read the rules and am not trying to step on toes... Here goes..

    If voting Americans can agree on nothing else I am confident that we all can all feel what kind of polarized society we are. Pro this, Con that. 49%-51%. I will admit that I have enjoyed many, MANY rounds of debate (or arguement rather) and understant what it means to pick a team and go down with the ship so to speak. My question today is What can we do to develop a compromise on starkly polarized issues? You know what they say about opinions and, uh, elbows, right? Can we respect the opinon of someone else even if it is not our own? Can we agree to disagree knowing that, even if we win the election, we are ALL on the same boat? These are questions that I ask myself while trying to find common ground. Often it is easier to wrap ourselves up in a team jersey than it is to reach out and find common ground. I want to find common ground on theissue of abortion.

    here is my compromise:


    Is it a human when the sperm touches the egg or when the fetus is delivered from the vagina? While I don't believe that a fertalized egg is a human it is a human I think it is rediculous to hand out a blank abortion check that a late term baby must pay for. We can argue about souls on another thread. It seems to me that the brain cannot function without circulating bloodflow. THUS, I am willing to allow the criminalization for all abortion procedures performed on a fetus that has developed a heartbeat unless, of course, there is an issue of death for the mother. going further, I am willing to require that any doctor that allows an abortion past this stage not only loses their medical license but also serves the same jail time that manslaughter on a pregnant woman will deliver (no pun intended). IF there is a health concern for the mother then two second opinions are necessary in order to validate the claim.

    In return, we pass a constitutionl amendment that clarifies the right of individual privacy to ensure that personal choice is not litigated by public morals, frank and honest sex education programs in public school (which can be opted out of course), access to every form of birth control available including the morning after pill. children under the age of 18 must still notify their legal guardian or parent since they are not autonomous legal enteties.

    The point IS to minimize aborted children and not decide whose sexual behavior is acceptable, right? I guess what im looking for in feedback is not so much "ra ra abortion sucks" or "ug ug limitless abortion" as "Ill agree with this if we adjust that". Mutual respect under mutual democracy. The Golden rule...

    UNITED WE STAND....
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 4
  2. CrimsonWhite
    Offline

    CrimsonWhite *****istrator Emeritus Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2006
    Messages:
    7,978
    Thanks Received:
    1,755
    Trophy Points:
    123
    Location:
    Guntucky
    Ratings:
    +1,757
    :clap:

    I agree completely. Welcome to the board. The only problem is legislating and enforcing such a complex policy. Those that wish to get an abortion, but are resticted, would still seek out the alley way hobbyist of the 50's and 60's. Making the morning after pill readily available would of course help, but I don't see much compromise coming from the religious right.
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  3. 5stringJeff
    Offline

    5stringJeff Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2003
    Messages:
    9,990
    Thanks Received:
    536
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Puyallup, WA
    Ratings:
    +540
    Weclome Shogun. :thup: I appreciated your argument, except for this part:

    The existence (or non-existence) of a soul is of paramount importance in the abortion matter. If a baby gets a soul at conception, then aborting a baby between conception and heart formation (as you advocated) means that you've killed a human with a soul. Therefore, I don't think you can separate physical growth or organ formation from the existence of a soul.
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  4. Shogun
    Online

    Shogun Guest

    Ratings:
    +0
    thank you for the welcome....


    prehaps the religious right thinks the same thing about those who seem to want unfettered abortion. sure.. no one wants back alley coathanger abortions.. but can you agree that givin up late term abortions and gaining open access to clear education and the full range of birth control is better than having neither?

    think of it as haggling with the intention of finding an acceptable common deal. What i'm trying to discover is if we are all past the point of honest consideration and stuck in vitriolic polarization. this is a two way street. if you can respect then you can be respected. if you can take then you can give.


    again. golded rule.. walk a mile.. that sort of thiing.

    We can all generalize that the left and the right yadda yadda yadda. we all have our reasons to think what we do. my question to you is what part of YOUR position are you willing to soften up on if you can trust that your opposite will do the same?



    again, thanks for the welcome.
     
  5. Shogun
    Online

    Shogun Guest

    Ratings:
    +0

    I respect that you have your position on the necessity to consider the soul. Many people do not believe the same thing as you do. We are all capable of forming a valid opinion. MY question to you is would you rather attempt to force people to believe your opinion regarding a soul or minimize the act of abortion and walk away knowing that a common compromise wont be challenged as soon as the political pendelum swings away from you?
     
  6. dmp
    Offline

    dmp Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2004
    Messages:
    13,088
    Thanks Received:
    741
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Enterprise, Alabama
    Ratings:
    +741


    You mean 'CHristians'? Not everyone who is against (or for, I suppose) something is an extremist. :)
     
  7. 5stringJeff
    Offline

    5stringJeff Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2003
    Messages:
    9,990
    Thanks Received:
    536
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Puyallup, WA
    Ratings:
    +540
    Would I take your compromise? As a starting point. I still believe the existence of the soul is essential to the issue of abortion.
     
  8. Nienna
    Offline

    Nienna Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2005
    Messages:
    4,515
    Thanks Received:
    333
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Ohio
    Ratings:
    +333
    I was just about to post something similar. :)

    I believe that human life begins at conception, or at least that there is no other rational line to be drawn about the point at which life begins... life including the soul of the human.

    However, any move toward oulawing abortion (except to save the life of the mother) is a move I would consider supporting.
     
  9. Shogun
    Online

    Shogun Guest

    Ratings:
    +0
    EXACTLY! Sometimes we can demonize what we dont agree easier than trying to understand and respect (or at least consider) a position other than our own.. Sure sure.. there ARE the fred phelps types who are stuck in their opinion. Thats fine. Im not talking to them. Im looking for people who are willing to hold on to their opinions while considering the opinions of others in order to form a commonly acceptable solution. Some people are simply not interested in anything but unbending application of their perspective. While their freedom put up a brick wall is one that ill protect, i'm looking for the common middle grounders who understand the value of mutual consideration. Blocking opposition into one giant bundle to ignore is the greatest diservice to a compromise. Again, if you can expect consideration then expect to be considerate. Our range of opinions alone don't hurt us.. our polarized willingness to demonize and ignore each other will.
     
  10. CrimsonWhite
    Offline

    CrimsonWhite *****istrator Emeritus Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2006
    Messages:
    7,978
    Thanks Received:
    1,755
    Trophy Points:
    123
    Location:
    Guntucky
    Ratings:
    +1,757
    "Because the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you, that you may make atonement with it upon the altar for your souls, and the blood may be for an expiation of the soul."
    Leviticus 17:11

    The Bible states in many more verses that the blood is life and that life is in the blood. Blood does not form in the body of a baby until several days after conception. I believe this when the "soul" "takes shape" as well. I'm not contradicting you, just backing you up with verse. :thup:
     

Share This Page