The Future of Transportation - Part 1

The average household uses about 1 kw per hour. That is 168 kw hrs. in a week. The P85D Tesla has a 85 kw hr battery. About 1/2 of what a household uses in one week. 1/6 of what you state. Want to do a hypothesis test on that, and see what kind of P-value you get on it? Surely someone working on their Phd in atmospheric physics can do that in their head. LOL
 
The average household uses about 1 kw per hour. That is 168 kw hrs. in a week. The P85D Tesla has a 85 kw hr battery. About 1/2 of what a household uses in one week. 1/6 of what you state. Want to do a hypothesis test on that, and see what kind of P-value you get on it? Surely someone working on their Phd in atmospheric physics can do that in their head. LOL

Tell me again how much energy is needed to overcome the charge resistance during charging........

It is not one watt in, one watt stored...

Moron!!
 
The average household uses about 1 kw per hour. That is 168 kw hrs. in a week. The P85D Tesla has a 85 kw hr battery. About 1/2 of what a household uses in one week. 1/6 of what you state. Want to do a hypothesis test on that, and see what kind of P-value you get on it? Surely someone working on their Phd in atmospheric physics can do that in their head. LOL
Tell me again how much energy is needed to overcome the charge resistance during charging........ It is not one watt in, one watt stored... Moron!!

LOLOLOLOLOL.....hilarious how denier cult trolls like BoobyBobNutJob will make some idiotic claim (post #40) that is easily debunked (post #41) and then will immediately abandon it to make another idiotic claim (of course, denier cult trolls always will keep repeating the same debunked claims over and over again later, no matter how many times they get debunked with solid evidence).

The reality of EV charging, which has been happening for years now, has nothing to do with ol' NutJob's retarded objections.

How Much Does It Cost To Charge An Electric Car?
Thu, 04/17/2014
There are many reasons for considering making an electric car the next car you buy or lease. Besides the many environmental benefits, the promise of energy security, the silky-smooth driving experience with instant torque available without delay and low maintenance, one of the best characteristics of electric vehicles is how little they cost to operate.


Nissan LEAF charging

Just as with gasoline cars, some are more efficient than others, but the average EV needs about 30 kWh’s of electricity to power the vehicle for 100 miles. For example, the EPA rating for the Nissan LEAF is exactly 30 kWh’s per 100 miles. A Tesla Model S 60 is rated at a combined 35 kWh’s per 100 miles and uses a little more energy since it’s heavier and more powerful than a LEAF, while the Chevy Spark EV has a combined consumption rating of 28 kWh’s per 100 miles. The consumption for all electric vehicles can be viewed at the US Department of Energy’s website: www.fueleconomy.gov

According to Researchers at the University of Michigan Transportation Research Institute, the sales-weighted average fuel economy of all new vehicles sold in the United States in 2013 was 24.8 mpg. The average cost for a gallon of regular gasoline in the US over the past three years was $3.53/gallon. By using 15,000 miles as the average amount of miles a person will drive in a year, the annual cost of gasoline for the average car will be $2,135 per year, using the average cost of gasoline from 2011 through 2013.


Tesla Model S charging

Electricity rates vary much more than gasoline across the country, but the cost is much more stable. Unlike with gasoline, there aren’t huge spikes in electricity rates if a refinery has a problem, and neither does the price skyrocket when there is political instability in one of the large oil producing countries as we have seen lately, since all of the electricity we use in America is domestically produced. The average cost of electricity in the US is 12 cents per kWh. Therefore the average person driving an average EV 15,000 miles per year pay about $540.00 per year to charge it. As mentioned, the cost of electricity can vary greatly depending on where you live, but in order to equal the price of the average gasoline car’s fuel costs, the price of electricity would have to be four times the national average, and cost 48 cents per kWh. Nowhere in the US does electricity cost even close to that much. So the average person would save roughly $1,600 per year in fuel alone, and that's if gasoline prices remain around $3.53 per gallon. Gasoline prices do frequently spike up and down, but in the long run it always goes up. Electricity costs do eventually increase also, but not nearly at the pace of gasoline. Plus with fewer moving parts, EV's cost much less to maintain. If you combine the fuel savings with the reduced maintenence costs, it's clear to see an EV will cost you much less in the long run, even if it costs a little more up front.

Another great thing about electric cars is that you can easily reduce your electric bill by $40 to $50 per month just by being more efficient, and therefore completely eliminate your transportation fuel cost! You really can't use less gasoline unless you drive less or buy a more efficient car, but you can reduce your electricity usage at home and still drive as much as you always have. Simple measures like a programmable thermostat and the use of compact florescent or LED light bulbs can make a big difference. In fact, five 100 watt light bulbs left on continuously for a year use nearly the same amount of energy as it takes to power an electric car 15,000 miles! Here's how: five 100 watt light bulbs use 500 watts per hour. In 24 hours they use 12,000 watts or 12kWh. In 365 days they use 4,380kWh. A typical EV that uses 30 kWH’s for every 100 miles will use 4,500 kWh’s to drive 15,000 miles. Simply by turning unnecessary lighting off at your home, you can drastically reduce or completely eliminate your annual transportation fuel cost. Try doing that with a gasser!
 
The average household uses about 1 kw per hour. That is 168 kw hrs. in a week. The P85D Tesla has a 85 kw hr battery. About 1/2 of what a household uses in one week. 1/6 of what you state. Want to do a hypothesis test on that, and see what kind of P-value you get on it? Surely someone working on their Phd in atmospheric physics can do that in their head. LOL
Tell me again how much energy is needed to overcome the charge resistance during charging........ It is not one watt in, one watt stored... Moron!!

LOLOLOLOLOL.....hilarious how denier cult trolls like BoobyBobNutJob will make some idiotic claim (post #40) that is easily debunked (post #41) and then will immediately abandon it to make another idiotic claim (of course, denier cult trolls always will keep repeating the same debunked claims over and over again later, no matter how many times they get debunked with solid evidence).

The reality of EV charging, which has been happening for years now, has nothing to do with ol' NutJob's retarded objections.

How Much Does It Cost To Charge An Electric Car?
Thu, 04/17/2014
There are many reasons for considering making an electric car the next car you buy or lease. Besides the many environmental benefits, the promise of energy security, the silky-smooth driving experience with instant torque available without delay and low maintenance, one of the best characteristics of electric vehicles is how little they cost to operate.


Nissan LEAF charging

Just as with gasoline cars, some are more efficient than others, but the average EV needs about 30 kWh’s of electricity to power the vehicle for 100 miles. For example, the EPA rating for the Nissan LEAF is exactly 30 kWh’s per 100 miles. A Tesla Model S 60 is rated at a combined 35 kWh’s per 100 miles and uses a little more energy since it’s heavier and more powerful than a LEAF, while the Chevy Spark EV has a combined consumption rating of 28 kWh’s per 100 miles. The consumption for all electric vehicles can be viewed at the US Department of Energy’s website: www.fueleconomy.gov

According to Researchers at the University of Michigan Transportation Research Institute, the sales-weighted average fuel economy of all new vehicles sold in the United States in 2013 was 24.8 mpg. The average cost for a gallon of regular gasoline in the US over the past three years was $3.53/gallon. By using 15,000 miles as the average amount of miles a person will drive in a year, the annual cost of gasoline for the average car will be $2,135 per year, using the average cost of gasoline from 2011 through 2013.


Tesla Model S charging

Electricity rates vary much more than gasoline across the country, but the cost is much more stable. Unlike with gasoline, there aren’t huge spikes in electricity rates if a refinery has a problem, and neither does the price skyrocket when there is political instability in one of the large oil producing countries as we have seen lately, since all of the electricity we use in America is domestically produced. The average cost of electricity in the US is 12 cents per kWh. Therefore the average person driving an average EV 15,000 miles per year pay about $540.00 per year to charge it. As mentioned, the cost of electricity can vary greatly depending on where you live, but in order to equal the price of the average gasoline car’s fuel costs, the price of electricity would have to be four times the national average, and cost 48 cents per kWh. Nowhere in the US does electricity cost even close to that much. So the average person would save roughly $1,600 per year in fuel alone, and that's if gasoline prices remain around $3.53 per gallon. Gasoline prices do frequently spike up and down, but in the long run it always goes up. Electricity costs do eventually increase also, but not nearly at the pace of gasoline. Plus with fewer moving parts, EV's cost much less to maintain. If you combine the fuel savings with the reduced maintenence costs, it's clear to see an EV will cost you much less in the long run, even if it costs a little more up front.

Another great thing about electric cars is that you can easily reduce your electric bill by $40 to $50 per month just by being more efficient, and therefore completely eliminate your transportation fuel cost! You really can't use less gasoline unless you drive less or buy a more efficient car, but you can reduce your electricity usage at home and still drive as much as you always have. Simple measures like a programmable thermostat and the use of compact florescent or LED light bulbs can make a big difference. In fact, five 100 watt light bulbs left on continuously for a year use nearly the same amount of energy as it takes to power an electric car 15,000 miles! Here's how: five 100 watt light bulbs use 500 watts per hour. In 24 hours they use 12,000 watts or 12kWh. In 365 days they use 4,380kWh. A typical EV that uses 30 kWH’s for every 100 miles will use 4,500 kWh’s to drive 15,000 miles. Simply by turning unnecessary lighting off at your home, you can drastically reduce or completely eliminate your annual transportation fuel cost. Try doing that with a gasser!

And in that wall-o-text Old Crock never once does the math..
 
Tell me again how much energy is needed to overcome the charge resistance during charging........

Not much. Lithium batteries have a charge/discharge efficiency of around 90%. They are a huge improvement in that category over previous battery types.

It is not one watt in, one watt stored...

"Watts" are not stored. "Watt-hrs" are. A Ph.D student should know the difference between power and energy.
 
Tell me again how much energy is needed to overcome the charge resistance during charging........

Not much. Lithium batteries have a charge/discharge efficiency of around 90%. They are a huge improvement in that category over previous battery types.

It is not one watt in, one watt stored...

"Watts" are not stored. "Watt-hrs" are. A Ph.D student should know the difference between power and energy.

Watts = Amps x Volts

It is a unit of measure needed to determine how much power is consumed over coming the resistance of the cell you morons are attempting to charge. I wouldn't expect a moron like you to understand Ohms law or its application.

And by the way you indeed store watts of energy. IE; your car battery is 12 volts with 650 Cold Cranking Amps. Using Ohms law 12*650=7,800 watts of STORED ENERGY... Fucking moron.
 
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Toyota just placed on the market its FIRST hydrogen fuel cell vehicle for public purchase. While it needs to be recharged with the two component gases needed, the folks at Toyota are currently testing a fuel cell which is self replicating of the gases during operation and will only need to be charged for a few hours each week to offset the power loss in recharging from the tap water in your home.

The EPA and public safety hoops have been cleared to see these on the road next year here in the US.. Between this and the Thorium units being made/tested in Japan for vehicle and big truck powering I believe the use of wind mills and PV arrays days are numbered as well. there will be no need for long term storage units and batteries covering acres.. personalized units for powering of your home will be next up.

Toyota Mirai The Turning Point
 
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And simply because the Hair ball and Old Crock wont do the math on how much it takes to charge these batteries lets show people the REAL COST of charging these cars.

If we use an old lead acid type battery, depending on charge of the 6 cells its internal resistance can vary from 20,000 ohms to as little as 1 ohm. Self regulating chargers use this to regulate the amperage/voltage it applies to the battery.

A battery at 50% discharge will have about 10,000 ohms resistance and require 16 volts at 10 amps to over come it. (this is just one battery that stores 650 cold cranking amps-7,800 watts) It will take three hours to charge it fully. 16*10=160 watts * 3 hours =480 watts.

Now we include the Inductance loss of the transformer which steps down the voltage to usable levels. This loss is about 47% of the output or roughly another 240 watts. 240+480=720 watts. Basically running one 100 watt light bulb for 7.2 hours

The average EV has 12,700-28,500watts of stored energy in massive cells which are a hybrid deep cycle battery. The internal resistance of these cells is 1 ohm to 20,000 ohms depending on number of cells and voltage at which they operate the amperage necessary to charge it can be massive.

Lets use a Lithium Deep cycle battery that has 28,000 watts @ 48 volts.
We have 24 cells in each series and 20,0000 ohms, there are 8 series of batteries to obtain this storage. This requires a voltage of 230 volts as the amperage necessary is over 30 amps. This battery will require 60 volts at 30 amps. (each series needs 4 amps at 60 volts).

Again 60*30=1,800 watts, Add 600 watts for inductive loss in the transformer and we have 2,400 watts @ 230 volts (or 10.4 amps draw on each leg of the drop) Assume 12 hours of charge time to full charge each night 12*2,400=28,800 watts or 28kw.

Turning off a few light bulbs isn't going to offset it, tuning off your house maybe (if you have a very big house like Al Gore). And you thought paying for the car was sticker shock, wait till they get their first power bill.. (those who have all electric heat in January understand the shock)
 
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Toyota just placed on the market its FIRST hydrogen fuel cell vehicle for public purchase. While it needs to be recharged with the two component gases needed, the folks at Toyota are currently testing a fuel cell which is self replicating of the gases during operation and will only need to be charged for a few hours each week to offset the power loss in recharging from the tap water in your home.

The EPA and public safety hoops have been cleared to see these on the road next year here in the US.. Between this and the Thorium units being made/tested in Japan for vehicle and big truck powering I believe the use of wind mills and PV arrays days are numbered as well. there will be no need for long term storage units and batteries covering acres.. personalized units for powering of your home will be next up.

Toyota Mirai The Turning Point
The mirai costs a lot more than the Leaf. And it is still an electric vehicle. We have a grid already, but not a system for hydrogen storage and tranportation on the scale such vehicles would require. Very easy to install solar panels at home, and provide your own power. Much more difficult to do that for hydrogen.

Mini-Thorium units? Pie in the sky.
 

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