The first JFK myth

[whitehall]

JFK's Navy record indicated a rich careless kid who had a relationship with a Nazi spy and lost his job in Intelligence. His PT Boat was the only Boat to be run over in WW2 without firing a shot. Indications were that the dumb ass skipper was sleeping in the middle of a heavily traveled Japanese supply route. The Japanese destroyer never saw the little PT Boat and obviously the PT boat never saw the destroyer.While the Navy was getting a Court Martial together old Joe Kennedy immediately sent a family friend and novelist to re-write young John's adventures before the Navy had a chance to get a Court martial court together. The result was the myth of PT109.

 

[dilloduck]

Joe did a hell of a job getting the movie made too.

 

[whitehall]

Old Joe had ties to Hollywood. It was s cinch to produce the movie and reinforce the legacy with the liberal media cooperation.

 

[Bfgrn]

JFK's Navy record indicated a rich careless kid who had a relationship with a Nazi spy and lost his job in Intelligence. His PT Boat was the only Boat to be run over in WW2 without firing a shot. Indications were that the dumb ass skipper was sleeping in the middle of a heavily traveled Japanese supply route. The Japanese destroyer never saw the little PT Boat and obviously the PT boat never saw the destroyer.While the Navy was getting a Court Martial together old Joe Kennedy immediately sent a family friend and novelist to re-write young John's adventures before the Navy had a chance to get a Court martial court together. The result was the myth of PT109.

Do you have a source for this crap?

 

[editec]

Assuming the OFFICAL RECORD is true?

Kennedy was not responsible for the boat being sunk, and his actions to save his crew were heroic.

If you have any real information, let's hear it.

Out of 531 PTs placed in US Navy service, 69 were lost: 5 - destroyed by enemy surface ship gunfire; 1 - rammed by enemy ship; 1 - rammed enemy ship; 1 - enemy aircraft strafing; 4 - enemy bombings; 2 - kamikaze attacks; 5 - enemy shore batteries; 4 - enemy mines; 1 - damaged by enemy fire then destroyed; 2 - lost in transit, tanker torpedoed by enemy. Total: 26 lost by enemy action.

Additional losses: 18 - grounded in enemy waters and destroyed to prevent capture; 3 - destroyed to prevent capture; 3 - destroyed by US aircraft; 2 - destroyed by Australian aircraft; 2 - destroyed by US ships; 1 - destroyed by enemy shore fire or wild shot from US warship; 5 - grounded/destroyed outside enemy waters or in storms; 6 - fire or explosion in port; 3 - collisions. Total: 43 lost by accidents, friendly fire or sea conditions.

http://www.ptboats.org/20-12-05-trivia-001.html

 

[Sallow]

JFK's Navy record indicated a rich careless kid who had a relationship with a Nazi spy and lost his job in Intelligence. His PT Boat was the only Boat to be run over in WW2 without firing a shot. Indications were that the dumb ass skipper was sleeping in the middle of a heavily traveled Japanese supply route. The Japanese destroyer never saw the little PT Boat and obviously the PT boat never saw the destroyer.While the Navy was getting a Court Martial together old Joe Kennedy immediately sent a family friend and novelist to re-write young John's adventures before the Navy had a chance to get a Court martial court together. The result was the myth of PT109.

Another fine example of a conservative smearing the honor of an American soldier because he was liberal.

Have they no shame?

 

[jaybags]

JFK's Navy record indicated a rich careless kid who had a relationship with a Nazi spy and lost his job in Intelligence. His PT Boat was the only Boat to be run over in WW2 without firing a shot. Indications were that the dumb ass skipper was sleeping in the middle of a heavily traveled Japanese supply route. The Japanese destroyer never saw the little PT Boat and obviously the PT boat never saw the destroyer.While the Navy was getting a Court Martial together old Joe Kennedy immediately sent a family friend and novelist to re-write young John's adventures before the Navy had a chance to get a Court martial court together. The result was the myth of PT109.

Another fine example of a conservative smearing the honor of an American soldier because he was liberal.

Have they no shame?

read the report. the pt boat was run over which leads you to believe there was some lax procedures on the part of the skipper.

 

[rightwinger]

70 year old Swiftboating

 

[Bfgrn]

JFK's Navy record indicated a rich careless kid who had a relationship with a Nazi spy and lost his job in Intelligence. His PT Boat was the only Boat to be run over in WW2 without firing a shot. Indications were that the dumb ass skipper was sleeping in the middle of a heavily traveled Japanese supply route. The Japanese destroyer never saw the little PT Boat and obviously the PT boat never saw the destroyer.While the Navy was getting a Court Martial together old Joe Kennedy immediately sent a family friend and novelist to re-write young John's adventures before the Navy had a chance to get a Court martial court together. The result was the myth of PT109.

Another fine example of a conservative smearing the honor of an American soldier because he was liberal.

Have they no shame?

read the report. the pt boat was run over which leads you to believe there was some lax procedures on the part of the skipper.

What report? The OP provides none.

 

[jaybags]

Another fine example of a conservative smearing the honor of an American soldier because he was liberal.

Have they no shame?

read the report. the pt boat was run over which leads you to believe there was some lax procedures on the part of the skipper.

What report? The OP provides none.

Motor Torpedo Boat PT-109 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

i am not saying his actions afterwards were not heroic, but the boat was run over

 

[Bfgrn]

read the report. the pt boat was run over which leads you to believe there was some lax procedures on the part of the skipper.

What report? The OP provides none.

Motor Torpedo Boat PT-109 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

i am not saying his actions afterwards were not heroic, but the boat was run over

PT-109, with PT-162 and PT-169, were ordered to continue patrolling the area in case the enemy ships returned. Around 02:00, on a moonless night, Kennedy's boat was idling on one engine to avoid detection of her wake by Japanese aircraft when the crew realized they were in the path of the Japanese destroyer Amagiri, which was returning to Rabaul from Vila, Kolombangara after offloading supplies and 900 soldiers. Amagiri was traveling at a relatively high speed of between 23 knots (43 km/h) and 40 kt (75 km/h) in order to reach harbor by dawn, when Allied air patrols were likely to appear.

The crew had less than 10 seconds to get the engines up to speed, and were run down by the destroyer on 2 August 1943 in the Blackett Strait between Kolombangara and Arundel in the Solomon Islands near 8°06′44″S 156°54′20″E.

Conflicting statements have been made as to whether the destroyer captain had spotted and steered towards the boat; author Donovan, who interviewed members of the destroyer crew, believed the collision was not an accident, though other reports suggest the Amagiri's captain never realized what happened until after the fact. Damage to a propeller slowed the destroyer's trip to its home base.

PT-109 was cut in two. Seamen Andrew Jackson Kirksey and Harold W. Marney were killed, and two other members of the crew were badly injured. For such a catastrophic collision, explosion, and fire, it was a low loss rate compared to other boats that were hit by shell fire. PT-109 was gravely damaged, with watertight compartments keeping only the forward hull afloat in a sea of flames.

PT-169 launched two torpedoes that missed the destroyer and PT-162's torpedoes failed to fire at all. Both boats then turned away from the scene of the action and returned to base without checking for survivors.

Motor Torpedo Boat PT-109 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[FuelRod]

Who was the last President with legitimate military service? George H.W?

 

[rightwinger]

In the almost 70 years since the Sinking of the PT 109, I have heard nothing but admiration from the crew who served with JFK

I have never known enlisted to cover up for an inept officer, especially when he almost kills them. If JFK had bungled the piloting of the PT boat and it had led to the sinking, the crew would have made it loud and clear

Nighttime operation in dense fog can hide even an enemy destroyer. If his crew saw the destroyer and JFK steered into it, we would have heard about it

 

[rightwinger]

Who was the last President with legitimate military service? George H.W?

Bush was a war hero.
Jimmy Carter also served admirably

Of course, Ike did OK for himself

 

[OldUSAFSniper]

JFK's Navy record indicated a rich careless kid who had a relationship with a Nazi spy and lost his job in Intelligence. His PT Boat was the only Boat to be run over in WW2 without firing a shot. Indications were that the dumb ass skipper was sleeping in the middle of a heavily traveled Japanese supply route. The Japanese destroyer never saw the little PT Boat and obviously the PT boat never saw the destroyer.While the Navy was getting a Court Martial together old Joe Kennedy immediately sent a family friend and novelist to re-write young John's adventures before the Navy had a chance to get a Court martial court together. The result was the myth of PT109.

Another fine example of a conservative smearing the honor of an American soldier because he was liberal.

Have they no shame?

Go easy with that broad brush their Captain. I have read the accounts of JFK's actions and this is the very first time I have heard some of these accusations. I tend to give them the same weight as I give John Kerry's testimony to Congress about Vietnam Vets.

I was around when JFK was President, although I was in the 4th grade when he was assasinated. He did some very good things... and he did some really dumb things.

If you'd read the accounts of the Cuban Missle Crisis and just how close we really came, you'd realize that he was a pretty good President over all.

 

[Bfgrn]

JFK's Navy record indicated a rich careless kid who had a relationship with a Nazi spy and lost his job in Intelligence. His PT Boat was the only Boat to be run over in WW2 without firing a shot. Indications were that the dumb ass skipper was sleeping in the middle of a heavily traveled Japanese supply route. The Japanese destroyer never saw the little PT Boat and obviously the PT boat never saw the destroyer.While the Navy was getting a Court Martial together old Joe Kennedy immediately sent a family friend and novelist to re-write young John's adventures before the Navy had a chance to get a Court martial court together. The result was the myth of PT109.

Another fine example of a conservative smearing the honor of an American soldier because he was liberal.

Have they no shame?

Go easy with that broad brush their Captain. I have read the accounts of JFK's actions and this is the very first time I have heard some of these accusations. I tend to give them the same weight as I give John Kerry's testimony to Congress about Vietnam Vets.

I was around when JFK was President, although I was in the 4th grade when he was assasinated. He did some very good things... and he did some really dumb things.

If you'd read the accounts of the Cuban Missle Crisis and just how close we really came, you'd realize that he was a pretty good President over all.

J.F.K. was less afraid of Soviet leader Nikita Khrushchev's ordering a surprise attack than he was "that something would go wrong in a Dr. Strangelove kind of way"—with a politically unstable U.S. general snapping and launching World War III.

Kennedy was particularly alarmed by his trigger-happy Air Force chief, cigar-chomping General Curtis LeMay, who firmly believed the U.S. should unleash a pre-emptive nuclear broadside against Russia while America still enjoyed massive arms superiority. Throughout the 13-day Cuban missile crisis, Kennedy was under relentless pressure from LeMay and nearly his entire national-security circle to "fry" Cuba, in the Air Force chief's memorable language. But J.F.K., whose only key support in the increasingly tense Cabinet Room meetings came from his brother Bobby and Defense Secretary Robert McNamara, kept searching for a nonmilitary solution. When Kennedy, assiduously working the back channels to the Kremlin, finally succeeded in cutting a deal with Khrushchev, the world survived "the most dangerous moment in human history," in Schlesinger's words. But no one at the time knew just how dangerous. Years later, attending the 40th anniversary of the crisis at a conference in Havana, Schlesinger, Sorensen and McNamara were stunned to learn that if U.S. forces had attacked Cuba, Russian commanders on the island were authorized to respond with tactical and strategic nuclear missiles. The Joint Chiefs had assured Kennedy during the crisis that "no nuclear warheads were in Cuba at the time," Sorensen grimly noted. "They were wrong." If Kennedy had bowed to his military advisers' pressure, a vast swath of the urban U.S. within missile range of the Soviet installations in Cuba could have been reduced to radioactive rubble.

Read more: Warrior For Peace - The Lessons of J.F.K. - TIME

"War will exist until that distant day when the conscientious objector enjoys the same reputation and prestige that the warrior does today."
Jack Kennedy

 

[rightwinger]

JFK ran for President against Nixon

If Nixon could have produced crew members from PT-109 who could testify that JFK screwed the pooch in losing his ship.......he would have

 

[Bfgrn]

If you ever get a chance to see The Kennedy Detail, it is fascinating.

Here is a clip on the Cuban Missile Crisis

Secret Service Agent Gerald S. Blaine
Secret Service Agent Paul Landis
Secret Service Agent In Charge Clinton J Hill

The Kennedy Detail: Cuban Missle Crisis : Video : Discovery Channel

 

[whitehall]

We can discuss US Grant, Robert E. Lee, George Patton and most other American heroes but pop-culture has determined that there are certain icons that cannot be questioned and if you do you risk emotional outbursts. Everything we know or think we know about PT 109 is based on a puff piece called "Survivor" written by family friend John Hersey and published in the New Yorker magazine in 1944. The notion that JFK is a hero because he swam out to a coral reef and forlornly waved a lantern at passing ships hoping to hitch a ride is ludicrous. Maybe it indicates his lack of leadership but it isn't an example of clear thinking. JFK confessed that he was worried about the fallout over PT 109 and rightfully so but the article turned things around.

 

[Bfgrn]

We can discuss US Grant, Robert E. Lee, George Patton and most other American heroes but pop-culture has determined that there are certain icons that cannot be questioned and if you do you risk emotional outbursts. Everything we know or think we know about PT 109 is based on a puff piece called "Survivor" written by family friend John Hersey and published in the New Yorker magazine in 1944. The notion that JFK is a hero because he swam out to a coral reef and forlornly waved a lantern at passing ships hoping to hitch a ride is ludicrous. Maybe it indicates his lack of leadership but it isn't an example of clear thinking. JFK confessed that he was worried about the fallout over PT 109 and rightfully so but the article turned things around.

Like rightwinger said, the Kennedys have been fully vetted. Just like old man Kennedy's bootlegging smear is BS. The man passed two senate confirmation hearings. FDR and Joe Kennedy had plenty of enemies. They would have slaughtered him if there was even a shred of evidence.

Maybe you should take a harder look at Patton and the Biscari massacre.