The excrement intersects the ventilator...

Discussion in 'Law and Justice System' started by Bullypulpit, Apr 25, 2009.

  1. Bullypulpit
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    Bullypulpit Senior Member

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    It would seem that, despite its claims to the contrary, they Bush administration had information and advice that the use of torture was counter productive. But history has borne that out repeatedly. The memo cited by the Levin report is the Joint Personnel Recovery Agency, which is responsible for SERE training for US forces.

    The JPRA memo states it thus:

    BUt, of course there are those syncophants, cronies, apologists and former members of the Bush administration who continue to forward the notion that in a "ticking time bomb" scenario, torture would provide the needed intel in the most expeditious manner. The JPRA memo contradicts this notion...

    This memo did not see the light of day until it was released yesterday.

    And then there was Phillip Zelikow, a counselor at the Department of State, and a deputy to Secretary Rice, from 2005-2007. Upon gaining access to the Bybee/Yoo memos in 2005, he wrote a brief declaring the positions in those memos to be gravely flawed. He went on to say,

    This active suppression of dissenting opinion was nothing new to the Bush administration. Knowing as they did, however, that the use of torture in interrogations produces unreliable information leave one to wonder at the true motives of the Bush administration in pursuing this policy of deliberate policy of torture. One of the key uses of torture throughout history has been to elicit confessions...false confessions...which is why any evidence obtained through such coercive measures is inadmissible in courts of law. How much of this activity by the Bush administration was aimed at securing just such false confessions? Confessions aimed at establishing a link between 9/11 and Iraq that did not exist...A link to further justify the US invasion of Iraq.

    This is why Dick Cheney is opening his foetid pie-hole in an attempt to head off any investigation into the matter. This is why Cheney is asking for the very narrow declassification and release of information about the supposed efficacy of torture, even as his timeline on the matter doesn't coincide with the actual progression of events. Cheney, being the fear driven little bastard that he is, is scared shitless that he and/or his undelings will be hed accountable for their actions.
     
  2. Skull Pilot
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    Skull Pilot Gold Member

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    except none of the interrogation techniques now banned by obama caused extreme pain did they?
     
  3. Bullypulpit
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    Bullypulpit Senior Member

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    Would you care to provide documentation supporting the baseless right wing talking points you keep mindlessly repeating Skull Merkin?
     
  4. Skull Pilot
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    Skull Pilot Gold Member

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    you're the one implying that extreme pain was caused, not me. You prove that there was pain caused by the ten techniques that were used at Gitmo.

    And may I ask what your obsession is with pubic wigs? Or shall I just call you Bully Pulls It?
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2009
  5. PoliticalChic
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    PoliticalChic Platinum Member

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    WASHINGTON - President Obama’s national intelligence director told colleagues in a private memo last week that the harsh interrogation techniques banned by the White House did produce significant information that helped the nation in its struggle with terrorists.
    NYT: Harsh techniques worked, intel chief says - White House- msnbc.com
     
  6. Truthmatters
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    William Krystle thought that too until he was waterboarded by people who he knew would not let him be harmed (unlike detainees) and after 20 seconds he changed his mind about it not being torture.
     
  7. Skull Pilot
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    Skull Pilot Gold Member

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    Not the point. The point is that Bully pulls It is implying that extreme pain is ineefective yet the ten aggressive interrogation techniques outlined in the NYT did not cause extreme pain.
     
  8. Truthmatters
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    WASHINGTON - President Obama’s national intelligence director told colleagues in a private memo last week that the harsh interrogation techniques banned by the White House did produce significant information that helped the nation in its struggle with terrorists.
    NYT: Harsh techniques worked, intel chief says - White House- msnbc.com[/QUOTE]


    Every expert on interigations will tell you that the effect of torturing people for intel is intell which a mixture of lies, say anything to make it stop and a smatterihng of truth.

    Then you can NO LONGER go back and get the MOST reliable intell that standard interogations provide.

    The subject then will never be won over by the Most efficient type of gathering which involves outsmarting them with various types of pshycological methods.

    If waterboarding works so well why the hell did they have to do in 186 times it one guy?
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2009
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    Torture doesnt work, is an international war crime, its a crime we have prosicuted our own soldiers for, official government memos have caterogised it as torture and the only ones saying its not are the people who will likely go to prison (or support for political reasons the people who will go to prison) when the trials are done.
     
  10. RetiredGySgt
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    Bully, you have made a claim. You have claimed that the procedures used by the Bush Team, as you put it, involved EXTREME PAIN. It is now incumbent on YOU to prove your claim. It is NOT our job to disprove it.

    And for the KICKER? PROVE the techniques were against the law when used. And no sorry, AFTER the fact does not count, you see in this Country you can not make retroactive Laws.

    THEN explain why every member of the Democratic caucus that was on the Intel committee at the House AND the Senate had ZERO problems with the 10 listed techniques. For several YEARS.
     

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