The EPA

[Old Rocks]

Do you have the run of the mill?

Got a question- a local foundry recently switched from firing smelters with coal to using electricity.
The locals say their emissions are worse. How's that possible?

First, do you mean, "Do I have run of the mill", or "Do I run the mill"? Of course I have little to say over how the mill is ran. However, yes, as a senior millwright, I do have the run of the mill. I can go anywhere in the installations without my presence being questioned.

We are a rolling mill, at present we do no smelting. We buy slabs of various alloy from all over the world, and roll the steel, Heat Treat it to make armor, and make pipe and tubular products.

Smelting with electricity produces huge amounts of particulate matter, especially when using scrap. Without a good vacuum system and adaquete bag houses, it is a very dirty operation. Since both the vacuum system and the baghouses are seen as overhead, most operators tend to scrimp on both. So, without adaquete regulations, and enforcement of those regulations, steel mills that smelt, are very dirty and undesirable neighbors.

 

[Moonglow]

Looks like this agency has become much to powerful. A dictatorship in fact.
We really do need to dress them down to get manufacturing back into the US.
Any thoughts one way or the other?

How is it a dictatorship?

 

[Old Rocks]

Ol' Cops and most 'Conservatives' believe that any rule that prevents you from harming your neighbor while pursueing the almighty dollar is dictatorship.

 

[NLT]

The steel mill I work at has some of the most advanced pollution controls of any mill in the world. Both for water and air. And the controls are constantly being improved on. Much of this is the result of the EPA rules, some is voluntary to keep ahead of the EPA rules. American owned mills could take lessons from what has been done at 'my' mill.

EVRAZ? Russian owned.

 

[skookerasbil]

The EPA is all we have to protect us against the big corperations poisoning us and our children. The actions by US Steel are typical of all corperations. We saw the decades long coverup concerning asbestos with Monsanto and others.

Any politician that starts yapping about eliminating the EPA needs to be targeted by all sane voters, and removed from office by whatever means possible.

Those standards were met more than 30 years ago Ray.........and every environmentalist knows it too.

Anyway........after November, the EPA is going to have to take some giant steps backwards so the boot can be taken off the throats of small business in America. And I will be cheering.

 

[Old Rocks]

The steel mill I work at has some of the most advanced pollution controls of any mill in the world. Both for water and air. And the controls are constantly being improved on. Much of this is the result of the EPA rules, some is voluntary to keep ahead of the EPA rules. American owned mills could take lessons from what has been done at 'my' mill.

EVRAZ? Russian owned.

That's right. And little you know how ironic I find it to be working for a Russian company. On base and in uniform when we stopped those Soviet ships off of Cuba. But time moves on, and things change in so many ways.

I work in an American Steel mill, owned by a Russian company, and we sell great amounts of Armor Plate to the Government of Isreal. Something totally unimaginable in 1962.

 

[Old Rocks]

The EPA is all we have to protect us against the big corperations poisoning us and our children. The actions by US Steel are typical of all corperations. We saw the decades long coverup concerning asbestos with Monsanto and others.

Any politician that starts yapping about eliminating the EPA needs to be targeted by all sane voters, and removed from office by whatever means possible.

Those standards were met more than 30 years ago Ray.........and every environmentalist knows it too.

Anyway........after November, the EPA is going to have to take some giant steps backwards so the boot can be taken off the throats of small business in America. And I will be cheering.

No, they were not. Even today, there are numerous instances of companies evading air pollution standards by locating huge generation plants on Indian Reservations. And the plants in construction prior the 1975 have their pollution grandfathered in.

Any loosening of standards will result in huge pollution. Corperations are like adolescents, give an inch, and they take a mile.

 

[mudwhistle]

Looks like this agency has become much to powerful. A dictatorship in fact.
We really do need to dress them down to get manufacturing back into the US.
Any thoughts one way or the other?

Get rid of it.

It's purely political.

 

[mudwhistle]

Ol' Cops and most 'Conservatives' believe that any rule that prevents you from harming your neighbor while pursueing the almighty dollar is dictatorship.

Actually that's against the law.

The EPA intentionally destroys industries based on fake science.

The EPA can't tell China or any other country not to poison the planet, so they're worthless.

 

[Old Rocks]

Ol' Cops and most 'Conservatives' believe that any rule that prevents you from harming your neighbor while pursueing the almighty dollar is dictatorship.

Actually that's against the law.

The EPA intentionally destroys industries based on fake science.

The EPA can't tell China or any other country not to poison the planet, so they're worthless.

LOL. More yap-yap without the slightest backup. And another 'Conservative' that thinks poisoning our children as China is doing is the way to go.

 

[Stephanie]

We need to get rid of their Leader(Obama) this November first..


Then we need to put the brakes on this agency and many others..

 

[Old Rocks]

Hey Staph, good luck with that with the present field. Obama by more than he recieved in 2008.

 

[skookerasbil]

The EPA bases alot of its conclusions based not upon science but upon political science as any reasonable perosn can see in its reports. In a recent report related to fracking in Wyoming, it used the terms "may" and "possible" 14 times...........

Blog: EPA Fracking Report and Energy Politics


Lets face it........the only way that Obama can defend his energy policies is to scare the shit out of people using the EPA......and there are alot of dolts out there who never consider governmental reports to be political.


More on the EPA and bogus science.................

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/on-energy/2012/01/19/lisa-jacksons-epa-throws-out-science-for-politics

 

[skookerasbil]

An absolute MUST read for people who really want to know what the EPA is all about.................

http://www.ucsusa.org/assets/documents/scientific_integrity/interference-at-the-epa.pdf


If you are stupid enough to think that the EPA is all about the environment, then you are among the hoplessly duped of our society...........dont bother reading it.

 

[skookerasbil]

What people have to realize is that there are tradeoffs that are ENORMOUS for state budgets due to the meddling of the green nutters. In New York alone, energy projects which are held up cost New York over 30 billion and over 50,000 jobs. Meanwhile, the state budget is 15 billlion in the red.........and in my field of work..........running group homes for developmentally disabled adults, we are having to cut 3 million dollars from our budget this year. Think that doesnt have an impact on the lives of these disabled adults? And we are just one of dozens of similar organizations in the state who provide the same services to over 25,000 people. Our budgets are getting slammed!!!


But the the environmentalist radicals its.........."FUCK THEM.........we have to make sure our environment is 100% pure!!!"


The modern liberal doesnt give a crap abut the necessary tradeoffs.

 

[midcan5]

I suggest those who dislike the EPA live downwind of a chemical plant, eat un-inspected foods in restaurants un-inspected, move near a dumping ground of chemicals, buy their drugs on the internet, live next to a busy highway, buy cheap home products from China, and after doing so, tell us how it is. Oh and those interested make sure your beneficiary does the opposite. For those of us who have lived a bit longer, we hope it is you and not us who have to go back to the good old days.

"It's hard to argue the positive impact that the EPA has had on our environment. Anyone who was alive in the 60's and 70's and remembers what it was like to live in an industrial area can certainly attest to that.

I remember the smokestacks that spewed tons of smoke into the air, causing a brown layer of smog that hovered over our city. I remember how, one by one, the community beaches and swimming areas were shut down because of the industrial waste being dumped into the bay and rivers. It was so bad that the Chesapeake is still struggling to recover to this day. I remember seeing car after car out on the highway, spitting out filthy exhaust fumes. The EPA helped change all that." Out Of The Fog: Defunding The EPA: Bad Policy or Good Idea?

 

[skookerasbil]

I suggest those who dislike the EPA live downwind of a chemical plant, eat un-inspected foods in restaurants un-inspected, move near a dumping ground of chemicals, buy their drugs on the internet, live next to a busy highway, buy cheap home products from China, and after doing so, tell us how it is. Oh and those interested make sure your beneficiary does the opposite. For those of us who have lived a bit longer, we hope it is you and not us who have to go back to the good old days.

"It's hard to argue the positive impact that the EPA has had on our environment. Anyone who was alive in the 60's and 70's and remembers what it was like to live in an industrial area can certainly attest to that.

I remember the smokestacks that spewed tons of smoke into the air, causing a brown layer of smog that hovered over our city. I remember how, one by one, the community beaches and swimming areas were shut down because of the industrial waste being dumped into the bay and rivers. It was so bad that the Chesapeake is still struggling to recover to this day. I remember seeing car after car out on the highway, spitting out filthy exhaust fumes. The EPA helped change all that." Out Of The Fog: Defunding The EPA: Bad Policy or Good Idea?

another progressive who doesnt have the ability to think on the margin. If the air was 99.99999% pure, the k00ks would still be bitching that the conservatives were trying to poison the world!!!

The goals of the EPA are far, far, far diffrerent than they were in the 1970's. The founding fathers would shut this fraudulent agency down so fast, the k00ks heads would be swimming.



Here is a photo of what imo is the most beautiful car ever built. A 1955 Mercedes Gull Wing 300sl.

Minimum you can buy one for in 2012 in pristine shape? 250K. Now imagine the EPA as a car judge at a classic car show. Theyd take a walk around and tell the owner, "Fuck you......I see a litte hideous smudge right here. Take 100K off the price of the car!!". The EPA manufacture "environmental dangers" on a daily basis..........only the hopelessly duped dont get it.


The EPA is a fascist agency with a fucked up agenda........an agenda that kills the middle class in America.

Check out all the shit they have been doing in just the past year and will do through election day..........

Next up from the EPA:

• In the remaining weeks of 2011, the agency will finalize rules regulating emissions for boilers and solid waste incinerators and to curb mercury and toxic emissions from power plants. The EPA also will move forward with automakers and the Department of Transportation to set new miles-per-gallon standards for automobiles and lower the amount of sulfur in gasoline.

• On Jan. 1, the agency’s rule governing air pollution that blows across state lines will take effect, amid a flurry of paperwork in a massive lawsuit driven by 45 petitioners. The lawsuit was brought by states beholden to more stringent requirements and utilities that will have to implement them. The EPA is joined in the case by downwind cities and states that will benefit from the new air pollution limits, along with environmentalists and some other utilities.

• April 3, the EPA will finalize air standards for wells that use hydraulic fracturing to access natural gas and for oil and natural gas processing plants.

• The EPA will set greenhouse gas emission standards for fossil-fueled power plants and petroleum refineries.

• Under review at the White House Office of Management and Budget are rules to reconsider air emission standards at chemical manufacturing plants, and a review of risk and technology for emission standards for shipbuilding and ship repair.

• The EPA plans to decide during the summer how to regulate coal ash — the byproduct that is often reused in housing products but has been the subject of national attention after some dangerous spills from huge retention ponds.

• In July, the agency also will finalize a rule for water discharge permits for cooling towers that keep power plants and manufacturing facilities from overheating. Such towers pull water from rivers and streams, posing dangers to fish and fish eggs that become caught in intake screens. The issue prompted a Supreme Court ruling that says the EPA may consider costs and benefits in its regulations because the Clean Water Act does not explicitly forbid it.

• The EPA has agreed to judicially mandated deadlines for acting on plans to cut haze-causing pollution from coal-fired power plants in 45 states. The deadlines run from this December to November 2012.

• Meanwhile, several rules are caught up in an ongoing lawsuit over EPA’s climate “endangerment finding” in which the agency determined that carbon dioxide emissions threaten public health and the environment. The finding became an underpinning of EPA climate regulations. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit will hear oral arguments for that case Feb. 28-29, and many expect that the case will be decided in the summer.
Read more: EPA poised to roll out 2012 agenda - Erica Martinson - POLITICO.com


EPA poised to roll out 2012 agenda - Erica Martinson - POLITICO.com




The environmental nutters think this is about the environment

 

[newpolitics]

Ah yes, more of the people that think that the air quality of China is fine, that rivers poisoned for hundreds of miles is a cheap price to pay for the wealth of the 1%. That children's health is far less important than the wealth of the already rich.

What a bunch of knownothing asses you are.

First Libtard defender of the EPA

Let me be the second. Industry is not the end-all of human existence, and all efforts and concerns should not go to serve its end, solely. What is it with the conservative deification of the economy? Granted, it is a part of life, and a very important part, but there are other equally important things, but just because they don't play an active or as active role in the lives of the majority of humans, doesn't make it less important. I am referring to the physical environment, including non-human animals.

 

[Old Rocks]

I suggest those who dislike the EPA live downwind of a chemical plant, eat un-inspected foods in restaurants un-inspected, move near a dumping ground of chemicals, buy their drugs on the internet, live next to a busy highway, buy cheap home products from China, and after doing so, tell us how it is. Oh and those interested make sure your beneficiary does the opposite. For those of us who have lived a bit longer, we hope it is you and not us who have to go back to the good old days.

"It's hard to argue the positive impact that the EPA has had on our environment. Anyone who was alive in the 60's and 70's and remembers what it was like to live in an industrial area can certainly attest to that.

I remember the smokestacks that spewed tons of smoke into the air, causing a brown layer of smog that hovered over our city. I remember how, one by one, the community beaches and swimming areas were shut down because of the industrial waste being dumped into the bay and rivers. It was so bad that the Chesapeake is still struggling to recover to this day. I remember seeing car after car out on the highway, spitting out filthy exhaust fumes. The EPA helped change all that." Out Of The Fog: Defunding The EPA: Bad Policy or Good Idea?

another progressive who doesnt have the ability to think on the margin. If the air was 99.99999% pure, the k00ks would still be bitching that the conservatives were trying to poison the world!!!

The goals of the EPA are far, far, far diffrerent than they were in the 1970's. The founding fathers would shut this fraudulent agency down so fast, the k00ks heads would be swimming.



Here is a photo of what imo is the most beautiful car ever built. A 1955 Mercedes Gull Wing 300sl.

Minimum you can buy one for in 2012 in pristine shape? 250K. Now imagine the EPA as a car judge at a classic car show. Theyd take a walk around and tell the owner, "Fuck you......I see a litte hideous smudge right here. Take 100K off the price of the car!!". The EPA manufacture "environmental dangers" on a daily basis..........only the hopelessly duped dont get it.


The EPA is a fascist agency with a fucked up agenda........an agenda that kills the middle class in America.

Check out all the shit they have been doing in just the past year and will do through election day..........

Next up from the EPA:

• In the remaining weeks of 2011, the agency will finalize rules regulating emissions for boilers and solid waste incinerators and to curb mercury and toxic emissions from power plants. The EPA also will move forward with automakers and the Department of Transportation to set new miles-per-gallon standards for automobiles and lower the amount of sulfur in gasoline.

• On Jan. 1, the agency’s rule governing air pollution that blows across state lines will take effect, amid a flurry of paperwork in a massive lawsuit driven by 45 petitioners. The lawsuit was brought by states beholden to more stringent requirements and utilities that will have to implement them. The EPA is joined in the case by downwind cities and states that will benefit from the new air pollution limits, along with environmentalists and some other utilities.

• April 3, the EPA will finalize air standards for wells that use hydraulic fracturing to access natural gas and for oil and natural gas processing plants.

• The EPA will set greenhouse gas emission standards for fossil-fueled power plants and petroleum refineries.

• Under review at the White House Office of Management and Budget are rules to reconsider air emission standards at chemical manufacturing plants, and a review of risk and technology for emission standards for shipbuilding and ship repair.

• The EPA plans to decide during the summer how to regulate coal ash — the byproduct that is often reused in housing products but has been the subject of national attention after some dangerous spills from huge retention ponds.

• In July, the agency also will finalize a rule for water discharge permits for cooling towers that keep power plants and manufacturing facilities from overheating. Such towers pull water from rivers and streams, posing dangers to fish and fish eggs that become caught in intake screens. The issue prompted a Supreme Court ruling that says the EPA may consider costs and benefits in its regulations because the Clean Water Act does not explicitly forbid it.

• The EPA has agreed to judicially mandated deadlines for acting on plans to cut haze-causing pollution from coal-fired power plants in 45 states. The deadlines run from this December to November 2012.

• Meanwhile, several rules are caught up in an ongoing lawsuit over EPA’s climate “endangerment finding” in which the agency determined that carbon dioxide emissions threaten public health and the environment. The finding became an underpinning of EPA climate regulations. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit will hear oral arguments for that case Feb. 28-29, and many expect that the case will be decided in the summer.
Read more: EPA poised to roll out 2012 agenda - Erica Martinson - POLITICO.com


EPA poised to roll out 2012 agenda - Erica Martinson - POLITICO.com




The environmental nutters think this is about the environment

Excellent. The EPA is doing it's job.

 

[uscitizen]

A little mercury never hurt anyone.


Everyone remember that Nixon signed the EPA into existence.