The Difference Between Liberals and Conservatives

[Mr.Nick]

One is on welfare while the other is productive...

 

[rdean]

This is ridiculous. Go to a Tea Party rally and just about every one is on Social Security, Medicare or Medicaid. The number one and number two things that unifies Conservatives is race and religion. Believe it.

 

[hortysir]

From an experiment performed by some social scientists in 2001.

They had subjects identify themselves as either liberals or conservatives... The groups filled out questionnaires about their own beliefs and how they interpreted the beliefs of their opposition. They then rated how much insight their opponents possessed. The results showed liberals believed they knew more about conservatives than conservatives knew about liberals. The conservatives believed they knew more about liberals than liberals knew about conservatives. Both groups thought they knew more about their opponents than their opponents knew about themselves.

I believe I do know more about conservatives than they know about liberals. Here are three elemental principles, or fundamental beliefs, of conservatives:

• Our economic system is fundamentally fair. It rewards hard work and initiative, and punishes laziness and ineptitude. Rich people deserve to be rich, and poor people deserve to be poor.
• The government is fundamentally bad. First because it disrupts the natural outcomes of the free market, and second because it lacks free market discipline, and is therefore inefficient and corrupt.
• When the government disrupts the natural outcomes of the market, it disincentivizes hard work and initiative, and creates a "free ride" mentality among the people.

There are more, of course, but these are three that more or less unite conservatives. (Others divide them.)

My predictions are these: 1.) That the majority-conservatives on this board may nit-pick, but they'll agree that these are three fundamental beliefs of the conservative movement; and 2.) that few, if any, of the conservatives on this board will be able to articulate liberal principles in a way that liberals themselves will agree to.

How I've survived all these years, without your diagnosis, is extraordinary.

 

[mudwhistle]

From an experiment performed by some social scientists in 2001.

They had subjects identify themselves as either liberals or conservatives... The groups filled out questionnaires about their own beliefs and how they interpreted the beliefs of their opposition. They then rated how much insight their opponents possessed. The results showed liberals believed they knew more about conservatives than conservatives knew about liberals. The conservatives believed they knew more about liberals than liberals knew about conservatives. Both groups thought they knew more about their opponents than their opponents knew about themselves.

I believe I do know more about conservatives than they know about liberals. Here are three elemental principles, or fundamental beliefs, of conservatives:

• Our economic system is fundamentally fair. It rewards hard work and initiative, and punishes laziness and ineptitude. Rich people deserve to be rich, and poor people deserve to be poor.
  
• The government is fundamentally bad. First because it disrupts the natural outcomes of the free market, and second because it lacks free market discipline, and is therefore inefficient and corrupt.
  
• When the government disrupts the natural outcomes of the market, it disincentivizes hard work and initiative, and creates a "free ride" mentality among the people.

There are more, of course, but these are three that more or less unite conservatives. (Others divide them.)

My predictions are these: 1.) That the majority-conservatives on this board may nit-pick, but they'll agree that these are three fundamental beliefs of the conservative movement; and 2.) that few, if any, of the conservatives on this board will be able to articulate liberal principles in a way that liberals themselves will agree to.

You're oversimplifying conservatives.

One thing we all are is individuals with our own beliefs. The above is what most of us agree on, but not the only thing.

Most of us think the quickest path between two points is a straight line, that if you're not part of the solution you're part of the problem, and that not all wealth comes from stealing from the poor.

And I think 99% of us agree that some won't work but there are some that can't. It shouldn't be up to the feds to take care of both.

 

[Ernie S.]

This is ridiculous. Go to a Tea Party rally and just about every one is on Social Security, Medicare or Medicaid. The number one and number two things that unifies Conservatives is race and religion. Believe it.

Have you ever actually been to a TEA Party rally? I've been to dozens and most I've seen there are working people, 30 to 60. Most white, yes but maybe 10% each black and Hispanic. Yes, I'd bet that most are Christian, but so are most blacks and Hispanics.
Of course you take as the source of your opinions, anecdotes and photos used to support this contention you choose to believe in.
I normally do not give free advice to idiots, but you are so bereft of common sense I feel just a hint of compassion for you.
Please try to form an opinion on your own.
Your opinion of the TEA Party is based on hearsay, as is your opinion of right wing talk radio, Conservative ideology, party affiliation of scientists and practically every bit of garbage that flows into your vacant mind through left wing blogs and out through your key board.
Go to a TEA Party rally. Listen to people while keeping your mouth shut. Form your own opinion. Learn critical thinking.

 

[bripat9643]

From an experiment performed by some social scientists in 2001..

An experiment by a bunch of libs sucking on the government tit?

You've already lost whatever credibility you were hoping for.

They had subjects identify themselves as either liberals or conservatives... The groups filled out questionnaires about their own beliefs and how they interpreted the beliefs of their opposition. They then rated how much insight their opponents possessed. The results showed liberals believed they knew more about conservatives than conservatives knew about liberals. The conservatives believed they knew more about liberals than liberals knew about conservatives. Both groups thought they knew more about their opponents than their opponents knew about themselves.

I believe I do know more about conservatives than they know about liberals. Here are three elemental principles, or fundamental beliefs, of conservatives:

• Our economic system is fundamentally fair. It rewards hard work and initiative, and punishes laziness and ineptitude. Rich people deserve to be rich, and poor people deserve to be poor.
  
• The government is fundamentally bad. First because it disrupts the natural outcomes of the free market, and second because it lacks free market discipline, and is therefore inefficient and corrupt.
  
• When the government disrupts the natural outcomes of the market, it disincentivizes hard work and initiative, and creates a "free ride" mentality among the people.

There are more, of course, but these are three that more or less unite conservatives. (Others divide them.)

My predictions are these: 1.) That the majority-conservatives on this board may nit-pick, but they'll agree that these are three fundamental beliefs of the conservative movement; and 2.) that few, if any, of the conservatives on this board will be able to articulate liberal principles in a way that liberals themselves will agree to.

The last claim is true because liberals are in denial. They constantly deny that they are socialists or that they want to control people. Yet, all we see from them is more socialism and incessant attempts to control people.

Liberalism is a pack of lies, so it stretches credibility to expect honesty from them.

 

[bripat9643]

What's strikes me about conservatives on this board - not all, but many of them - is how angry they are, how quick they are to resort to personal attacks, and how often what they have to say seems to be little more than regurgitation from Rush/Beck/Drudge, etc.

They simply dish out what they have been subjected to your years. I've been posting on political bulletin boards for at least 15 years, and I have been the target of incessant bile and ad hominems. When I first started this hobby, I thought liberals could be reasoned with. I've learned otherwise.

 

[Mr.Nick]

What's strikes me about conservatives on this board - not all, but many of them - is how angry they are, how quick they are to resort to personal attacks, and how often what they have to say seems to be little more than regurgitation from Rush/Beck/Drudge, etc.

They simply dish out what they have been subjected to your years. I've been posting on political bulletin boards for at least 15 years, and I have been the target of incessant bile and ad hominems. When I first started this hobby, I thought liberals could be reasoned with. I've learned otherwise.

That's because progressiveism is a mental disorder..........

They're not "liberal" either calling them such would be a lie to the English language.

 

[dcbl]

Here's a reality check, it all boils down to this:

Today's conservatives believe that it boils down to self sufficiency & hard work

Today's liberals believe it is our obligation to create opportunities for everyone

 

[DontBeStupid]

Here's a reality check, it all boils down to this:

Today's conservatives believe that it boils down to self sufficiency & hard work

Today's liberals believe it is our obligation to create opportunities for everyone

Close. I think. It's phrased to sound like liberals don't value hard work and sufficiency. We do. Very much. But we also know that that is pointless without an opportunity to use it.

 

[dcbl]

Here's a reality check, it all boils down to this:

Today's conservatives believe that it boils down to self sufficiency & hard work

Today's liberals believe it is our obligation to create opportunities for everyone

Close. I think. It's phrased to sound like liberals don't value hard work and sufficiency. We do. Very much. But we also know that that is pointless without an opportunity to use it.

There is an outside chance that it was phrased to sound that way, as my political leanings are just slightly to the right of Attila the Hun...

Conservatives get real excited when we read about the Pilgrims & how they followed the advice that was givin by the Apostle Paul in 2 Thessalonians 3

For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.

It may sound harsh to many, but I'm all good with that. Do we have a moral obligation to support those that CANNOT work? Sure! But it should not be legislated & enforced at the point of a sword...

 

[Wacky Quacky]

Here's a reality check, it all boils down to this:

Today's conservatives believe that it boils down to self sufficiency & hard work

Today's liberals believe it is our obligation to create opportunities for everyone

Close. I think. It's phrased to sound like liberals don't value hard work and sufficiency. We do. Very much. But we also know that that is pointless without an opportunity to use it.

That's where another disconnect occurs. Liberals believe that most people don't have any opportunities unless government steps in to essentially give them that opportunity, conservatives believe that every opportunity is out there for the taking without government help.

Also, liberals may value hard work, but they sure don't promote it. 2 years worth of unemployment checks, unions that ensure you do as little work as possible, making laziness as comfortable as possible. How does that promote hard work ethics?

 

[percysunshine]

This is ridiculous. Go to a Tea Party rally and just about every one is on Social Security, Medicare or Medicaid. The number one and number two things that unifies Conservatives is race and religion. Believe it.

Holy Shit!

rdean is a Tea Party member.

Which one of you approved his application? ...come on....fess up.

 

[DontBeStupid]

It may sound harsh to many, but I'm all good with that. Do we have a moral obligation to support those that CANNOT work? Sure! But it should not be legislated & enforced at the point of a sword...

It does sound harsh. It also sounds like a recipe for a weak economy. Much of what I think in relation to helping the downtrodden is based on economics. People without money and without opportunities don't benefit the economy. In fact, they tend to turn to desperate measures to support themselves, like drugs and robbery. Not good. We could spend money on cops and jails, or we could spend money on giving those people opportunities. I vote for opportunities.

But also, those who cannot work should be taken care of. We all agree on this. However, virtually no conservative thinks that should be the responsibility of the government. They almost all want the family or the church to do the supporting. That's all fine and good, but in a modern America, it's just not realistic. More and more people don't belong to churches, not that churches these days could support that many people, and, again, economically, many families simply can't support someone like they could in the 1950s. It would bankrupt them and that's not good for the economy or the country.

 

[Kuros]

few, if any, of the conservatives on this board will be able to articulate liberal principles in a way that liberals themselves will agree to.

(1) Fairness

(2) Harm-reduction

John Haidt

The rest are details.

I think you need more elaboration than that. Are conservatives against "fairness" and "harm-reduction"?

The link elaborates. Conservatives also support fairness and harm-reduction, but also support a host of other values and priorities that mitigate their pursuit of fairness and harm-reduction.

 

[DontBeStupid]

Liberals believe that most people don't have any opportunities unless government steps in to essentially give them that opportunity, conservatives believe that every opportunity is out there for the taking without government help.

No. We believe everyone has at least a few, but some have way more than others, and that the more opportunities everyone has, the better we are as a country. I think some conservatives believe everyone in this country has the exact same opportunities as everyone else, and that's simply not true.

Also, liberals may value hard work, but they sure don't promote it. 2 years worth of unemployment checks, unions that ensure you do as little work as possible, making laziness as comfortable as possible. How does that promote hard work ethics?

Now you're just being partisan. Unions do not promote laziness. A lazy union worker can be replace with a productive union worker and I guarantee it happens. I've seen it. And unemployment checks are economically better than no money at all. See my response above about what people with no money and no opportunities would do to the country.

 

[dcbl]

It may sound harsh to many, but I'm all good with that. Do we have a moral obligation to support those that CANNOT work? Sure! But it should not be legislated & enforced at the point of a sword...

It does sound harsh. It also sounds like a recipe for a weak economy. Much of what I think in relation to helping the downtrodden is based on economics. People without money and without opportunities don't benefit the economy. In fact, they tend to turn to desperate measures to support themselves, like drugs and robbery. Not good. We could spend money on cops and jails, or we could spend money on giving those people opportunities. I vote for opportunities.

But also, those who cannot work should be taken care of. We all agree on this. However, virtually no conservative thinks that should be the responsibility of the government. They almost all want the family or the church to do the supporting. That's all fine and good, but in a modern America, it's just not realistic. More and more people don't belong to churches, not that churches these days could support that many people, and, again, economically, many families simply can't support someone like they could in the 1950s. It would bankrupt them and that's not good for the economy or the country.

Minimally, we should set it up so that the MOST financial benefit that ANYONE can hope for through welfare or GOVERNMENT MANDATED charity (welfare, or whatever you want to call it) is equal to no more than 70% of what one could make with a full 40 hour week at minimum wage...

 

[Sundial]

Liberals view govt as good. They see govt as a force that could bring good to the world. Ease the suffering of those that suffer. They feel that those who are wealthy have an obligation to those without. They dont trust that peoples self intrest can direct the economy in a good way. They distrust human desire and despise greed.

Am I getting close to a liberal mindset in a non judgemental way.

Close. Government can be a force for good, or not, depending on who's in charge. If you have bad leaders the government will be bad as a result. If you have a good government, it will be a force for good.

A lot of liberals distrust human desire if you mean desire for material things. Many would say that the accumulation of stuff for the sake of accumulating stuff is unhealthy, and that if you're rich, you have an obligation to give something back.

 

[Mr.Nick]

It may sound harsh to many, but I'm all good with that. Do we have a moral obligation to support those that CANNOT work? Sure! But it should not be legislated & enforced at the point of a sword...

It does sound harsh. It also sounds like a recipe for a weak economy. Much of what I think in relation to helping the downtrodden is based on economics. People without money and without opportunities don't benefit the economy. In fact, they tend to turn to desperate measures to support themselves, like drugs and robbery. Not good. We could spend money on cops and jails, or we could spend money on giving those people opportunities. I vote for opportunities.

But also, those who cannot work should be taken care of. We all agree on this. However, virtually no conservative thinks that should be the responsibility of the government. They almost all want the family or the church to do the supporting. That's all fine and good, but in a modern America, it's just not realistic. More and more people don't belong to churches, not that churches these days could support that many people, and, again, economically, many families simply can't support someone like they could in the 1950s. It would bankrupt them and that's not good for the economy or the country.

Are you insane or just stupid?

Sure, lets pay criminals to stop committing crimes?

Yes you suggest paying criminals so they don't gank your ass.

Lets just employ robbers because they rob...

Awesome ideas.

 

[Mr.Nick]

Liberals view govt as good. They see govt as a force that could bring good to the world. Ease the suffering of those that suffer. They feel that those who are wealthy have an obligation to those without. They dont trust that peoples self intrest can direct the economy in a good way. They distrust human desire and despise greed.

Am I getting close to a liberal mindset in a non judgemental way.

Close. Government can be a force for good, or not, depending on who's in charge. If you have bad leaders the government will be bad as a result. If you have a good government, it will be a force for good.

A lot of liberals distrust human desire if you mean desire for material things. Many would say that the accumulation of stuff for the sake of accumulating stuff is unhealthy, and that if you're rich, you have an obligation to give something back.

Oh I have a "desire" to bring Stalin to progressives.

They can meet their daddy...................