The 'Deep State:' Fact Or Fable

Discussion in 'Politics' started by PoliticalChic, Nov 27, 2019.

  1. bodecea
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    bodecea Diamond Member

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    #Itsacult
     
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  2. BlindBoo
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    BlindBoo Platinum Member

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    Well I'm certainly proud of not having your values.

    "Today, those who subscribe to the principles of the American Revolution — individual liberty, limited government, the free market, and the rule of law — call themselves by a variety of terms, including conservative, libertarian, classical liberal, and liberal. We see problems with all of those terms. "Conservative" smacks of an unwillingness to change, of a desire to preserve the status quo. Only in America do people seem to refer to free-market capitalism — the most progressive, dynamic, and ever-changing system the world has ever known — as conservative. Additionally, many contemporary American conservatives favor state intervention in some areas, most notably in trade and into our private lives.

    "Classical liberal" is a bit closer to the mark, but the word "classical" fails to capture the contemporary vibrancy of the ideas of freedom.

    "Liberal" may well be the perfect word in most of the world — the liberals in societies from China to Iran to South Africa to Argentina tend to be supporters of human rights and free markets — but its meaning has clearly been altered in the contemporary United States.

    The Jeffersonian philosophy that animates Cato's work has increasingly come to be called "libertarianism" or "market liberalism." It combines an appreciation for entrepreneurship, the market process, and lower taxes with strict respect for civil liberties and skepticism about the benefits of both the welfare state and foreign military adventurism.

    This vision brings the wisdom of the American Founders to bear on the problems of today. As did the Founders, it looks to the future with optimism and excitement, eager to discover what great things women and men will do in the coming century. Market liberals appreciate the complexity of a great society, recognizing that socialism and government planning are just too clumsy for the modern world. It is — or used to be — the conventional wisdom that a more complex society needs more government, but the truth is just the opposite. The simpler the society, the less damage government planning does. Planning is cumbersome in an agricultural society, costly in an industrial economy, and impossible in the information age. Today collectivism and planning are outmoded and backward, a drag on social progress.

    Libertarians have a cosmopolitan, inclusive vision for society. We applaud the progressive extension of the promises of the Declaration of Independence to more people, especially to women, African-Americans, religious minorities, and gay and lesbian people. Our greatest challenge today is to continue to extend the promise of political freedom and economic opportunity to those who are still denied it, in our own country and around the world."

    Cato's Mission
     
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  3. IM2
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    IM2 Platinum Member

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    I have learned to always...ALWAYS....expect a dumb thread from you posting bunch of words that say nothing. Comey was a republican and that's a fact. Maybe one day when you graduate college and leave your parents house, you'll learn how wrong and misinformed you currently are.
     
  4. OldLady
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    OldLady Diamond Member

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    No. I get it. When I worked for the state, there were usually major conflicting policy statements and regs that we had to try and interpret, choose which to follow. If we asked Augusta they gave us a nonanswer like "both."
    Rules are meant to be broken, which has always led me to live by the dictum, make as few rules as possible. Bureaucrats go NUTSO developing new policies every time there is a fuckup or a mistake, as if they're going to prevent any such thing ever happening in the future.

    It doesn't mean, though, that they are some evil cabal put in place to make politicians rich. That's the silly part, this Deep State theory. These people, at highest levels, ARE political animals and they play political games and spend their time pointing fingers and holding on to their positions. There is no coordinated, planned effort to tangle up the government in great balls of string. It just happens because bureaucracies are like that.
     
  5. PoliticalChic
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    PoliticalChic Diamond Member

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    The Founders, classical liberals, conservatives
    a. individualism, free markets, and limited constitutional government.


    Fascists, Nazis, Liberals, Progressives, Socialists, Communists
    b. the collective, command and control regulation of private industry, and overarching government that can order every aspect of the private citizen's life....right down to control of his thoughts and speech.


    " Franklin Roosevelt had pictured a place where citizens were joined in a collective enterprise ... Reagan pictured a more individualistic America where everyone would flourish once freed from the shackles of the state, and so the watchwords became self-reliance and small government."
    The Liberal Crackup

    Get it now????
     
  6. PoliticalChic
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    PoliticalChic Diamond Member

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    Charging Trump with "Quid Pro Quo"???

    Really?



    6. The most basic question is whether the President sets foreign policy, or the Deep State of career experts does.


    While Quid Pro Quo is the charge against the President, the fact is that all of foreign policy is predicated on quid pro quo. In fact, the only time it wasn’t was when Hussein Obama gave the Castro brothers everything they wished, and got noting…..except for a slap in the face….in return.

    Obama removes restrictions on Cuba, gets nothing in return. And....he visits, but Raul Castro couldn't be bothered to be at the airport:

    " As the plane landed at a rainy Jose Marti International Airport, Mr Obama tweeted: "What's up Cuba? Just touched down here, looking forward to meeting and hearing directly from the Cuban people." The president was greeted by foreign minister Bruno Rodriguez - not president Raul Castro. Instead he will hold talks with his Cuban counterpart on Monday." Obama Arrives In Cuba For Historic Visit

    "Both Donald Trump and Sen. Ted Cruz slammed the greeting President Obama and his wife received during their historic touch-down at a Cuban airport, saying the failure of Raul Castro to personally greet them as they exited Air Force One was a slap in the face to America."
    www.wnd.com/2016/03/obama-snubbed-castro-fails-to-welcome-air-force-one/#P4htmI3yufsIQ4zM.99






    No…wait: Hussein gave lots to Iran without anything in return, unless one counts his pride in providing Iran with nuclear weapons.
     
  7. alang1216
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    alang1216 Pragmatist

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    No true Scotsman would ever be against Trump. :auiqs.jpg:
     
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  8. BlindBoo
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    BlindBoo Platinum Member

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    Yes, I absolutely get you and understand your constant messaging.
     
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  9. alang1216
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    alang1216 Pragmatist

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    In the real world, as opposed to the ideological utopia you dream about, every country and every society is a mix of liberal and conservative ideals, libertarian and authoritarian politics, communist and free market economics. The mix is always different and evolving but never purely one or the other extreme and for good reason, in the real world the extremes are dangerous, unstable, and ineffective.
     
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  10. alang1216
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    alang1216 Pragmatist

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    I have to admit, Trump go no quid pro quo when he moved the US embassy to Jerusalem. In fact he got nothing but a thank you.
     
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