The Daily Freakout: Solar Energy

[Zona]

I just purchased a 5kw windmill with grid tied 10kw battery backup & 5kw solar connection from a guy who could not get the city he lived in to allow him to install it. I paid half the going rate. I am spending my 4th of July weekend installing this so I can celebrate my Independence from the grid. The property I am installing this on has an average annual wind speed of 7m/s or 15 mph & sun power of 4.75KWh/M2/day. I am going to put a meter on the output of the system to see if it is going to be profitable. It will take me a while but I will let you guys know how it works out when I get some real world numbers. This may not be practical for most people due to ordinance, space & location. I am doing this DIY but I think average installation cost will be very expensive.

Here in Arizona, a place that should lead the country on solar energy...i have a guy down the street who did the whole solar powered thing for his home.

He said its 18k up front money but with all the rebates, its really 5k total. This will pay for itself in no time here energy bill wise. I would love to do this and give the fucking electric company my middle finger (by the way, they just sent a notice in the mail informing me they are raising the prices again..).

Its hard to put up 18k though. Its a long talk with the wife, but who knows, i t may happen. Between this, the new roof that got installed last weekend and the insulation I am getting next month, I should start really saving money in about two years.

 

[Stephanie]

No matter what he does, he will be criticized by the righty's in here and all over the country. If he somehow made it so there was world peace, those idiots would bitch about it. If he went into a room and came up with a cure for cancer, these idiots would bitch about it.

fucking crazy.

waaaaa, leave Barry alone.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

I just purchased a 5kw windmill with grid tied 10kw battery backup & 5kw solar connection from a guy who could not get the city he lived in to allow him to install it. I paid half the going rate. I am spending my 4th of July weekend installing this so I can celebrate my Independence from the grid. The property I am installing this on has an average annual wind speed of 7m/s or 15 mph & sun power of 4.75KWh/M2/day. I am going to put a meter on the output of the system to see if it is going to be profitable. It will take me a while but I will let you guys know how it works out when I get some real world numbers. This may not be practical for most people due to ordinance, space & location. I am doing this DIY but I think average installation cost will be very expensive.

Here in Arizona, a place that should lead the country on solar energy...i have a guy down the street who did the whole solar powered thing for his home.

He said its 18k up front money but with all the rebates, its really 5k total. This will pay for itself in no time here energy bill wise. I would love to do this and give the fucking electric company my middle finger (by the way, they just sent a notice in the mail informing me they are raising the prices again..).

Its hard to put up 18k though. Its a long talk with the wife, but who knows, i t may happen. Between this, the new roof that got installed last weekend and the insulation I am getting next month, I should start really saving money in about two years.

If solar energy is so wonderful why do they need to give up $13,000 worth of rebates?

 

[Big Fitz]

No matter what he does, he will be criticized by the righty's in here and all over the country. If he somehow made it so there was world peace, those idiots would bitch about it. If he went into a room and came up with a cure for cancer, these idiots would bitch about it.

fucking crazy.

Much like BOOOOOOOOOOOOSH was, huh?

I gave P-BO credit for snuffing the Somali Pirates with the Maersk Alabama incident... till I found out he didn't give permission, but instead dragged his feet till the ops commander there had to make the call for his ass.

He does something right, I'll be more than happy to give him credit. 1.5 years and still no joy.

 

[KissMy]

Let me see.

$2,000,000,000.oo to create about 1,600 jobs.



Carry the 4



That is about $125,000.oo per job.

You left out a zero. That is about $1,250,000.oo per job. Obama & democrats ares not doing this stimulus right. Handing out vouchers is the best way to make this work. Government jobs always lose money but in a depression when they have to find ways to spend money I vote vouchers over extending unemployment. If everyone got a Energy Voucher that could be used for many different energy saving or efficient generating investment. Citizens could use this to buy a V2G Hybrid, solar panels, wind generator, train or buss passes, insulation, doors & windows, HVAC, lighting, energy star appliances or other items with proven energy savings & even buy shares in a green energy company. They could create more jobs for half the money.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Let me see.

$2,000,000,000.oo to create about 1,600 jobs.



Carry the 4



That is about $125,000.oo per job.

You left out a zero. That is about $1,250,000.oo per job. Obama & democrats ares not doing this stimulus right. Handing out vouchers is the best way to make this work. Government jobs always lose money but in a depression when they have to find ways to spend money I vote vouchers over extending unemployment. If everyone got a Energy Voucher that could be used for many different energy saving or efficient generating investment. Citizens could use this to buy a V2G Hybrid, solar panels, wind generator, train or buss passes, insulation, doors & windows, HVAC, lighting, energy star appliances or other items with proven energy savings & even buy shares in a green energy company. They could create more jobs for half the money.

Damn, I shouldn't do math when I am tired.

Thanks for the catch.

 

[Zona]

I just purchased a 5kw windmill with grid tied 10kw battery backup & 5kw solar connection from a guy who could not get the city he lived in to allow him to install it. I paid half the going rate. I am spending my 4th of July weekend installing this so I can celebrate my Independence from the grid. The property I am installing this on has an average annual wind speed of 7m/s or 15 mph & sun power of 4.75KWh/M2/day. I am going to put a meter on the output of the system to see if it is going to be profitable. It will take me a while but I will let you guys know how it works out when I get some real world numbers. This may not be practical for most people due to ordinance, space & location. I am doing this DIY but I think average installation cost will be very expensive.

Here in Arizona, a place that should lead the country on solar energy...i have a guy down the street who did the whole solar powered thing for his home.

He said its 18k up front money but with all the rebates, its really 5k total. This will pay for itself in no time here energy bill wise. I would love to do this and give the fucking electric company my middle finger (by the way, they just sent a notice in the mail informing me they are raising the prices again..).

Its hard to put up 18k though. Its a long talk with the wife, but who knows, i t may happen. Between this, the new roof that got installed last weekend and the insulation I am getting next month, I should start really saving money in about two years.

If solar energy is so wonderful why do they need to give up $13,000 worth of rebates?

Damn good question. Why is it not cheaper? It is a wonder technology but it seems to be stuck in its infancy mass production wise. Its too damn expensive right now!

No matter what he does, he will be criticized by the righty's in here and all over the country. If he somehow made it so there was world peace, those idiots would bitch about it. If he went into a room and came up with a cure for cancer, these idiots would bitch about it.

fucking crazy.

Much like BOOOOOOOOOOOOSH was, huh?

I gave P-BO credit for snuffing the Somali Pirates with the Maersk Alabama incident... till I found out he didn't give permission, but instead dragged his feet till the ops commander there had to make the call for his ass.

He does something right, I'll be more than happy to give him credit. 1.5 years and still no joy.

Link to him not being responsible for that somli thing? I bet you one damn thing, if things didnt work out as perfectly as it did, it would have been 100% OBAMA THEN...righty?

 

[Old Rocks]

What a current leader in solar is doing right now.

First Solar Continues to Raise the Performance Bar:Greentech Media

Garabedian explained that First Solar sees the solar industry currently in a "transition market" where we are dependent on subsidies and compete against peak power plants. They believe that if they achieve their roadmap numbers -- we can move from the "transition market" to a "sustainable market" and compete directly with baseload power.

Other numbers from First Solar

It takes only 2.5 hours for the factory to go from glass to module
2012 production capacity will be 2 gigawatts
Energy Payback Time (EPBT) is .65 .8 years (EPBT includes manufacturing and installation). Garabedian challenged the silicon guys to lower their silicon consumption to keep up with the First Solar EPBT.
Q1 conversion efficiency was 11.1 percent, Q1 manufacturing cost was 81 cents per watt, Q1 revenue was $568 million
Garabedian said, "What looks disruptive to a VC might not look disruptive to us."

 

[Old Rocks]

Eleven differant solar panels that you can buy right now for under $2 a watt. In fact, the Dupont 100 is only $1.20 a watt.

Solar Panels - $1.20/W solar panels! Free Solar Panel Survey

 

[HUGGY]

Everyone with any sense knows that solar will be a major component to energy in the future. What that industry needs is a good kick start. As more investment is made and the markets start growing the private sector will take over and grow rapidly much in the mold of the benefits of space technology. The problem is that private industry does not want to take the first big step. Obama is forward thinking. He knows that to get more energy independant we have to take the lead. It's the same with wind technology. It could be huge for us if we focus on U S jobs as we build the windmills with our own workers. Geo Thermal could also be big. No one system is going to do the trick but the best bet for now is to at least start with free energy and transform it into electricity. If we can get a half or a third of the vehicles on the road electric we will be way ahead of the curve.

 

[GWV5903]

How do we forget or delete these products we obtain from oil?

Clothing Ink
Heart Valves
Crayons
Parachutes
Telephones
Enamel
Transparent tape
Antiseptics
Vacuum bottles
Deodorant
Pantyhose
Rubbing Alcohol
Carpets
Epoxy paint
Oil filters
Upholstery
Hearing Aids
Car sound insulation
Cassettes
Motorcycle helmets
Pillows
Shower doors
Shoes
Refrigerator linings
Electrical tape
Safety glass
Awnings
Salad bowl
Rubber cement
Nylon rope
Ice buckets
Fertilizers
Hair coloring
Toilet seats
Denture adhesive
Loudspeakers
Movie film
Fishing boots
Candles
Water pipes
Car enamel
Shower curtains
Credit cards
Aspirin
Golf balls
Detergents
Sunglasses
Glue
Fishing rods
Linoleum
Plastic wood
Soft contact lenses
Trash bags
Hand lotion
Shampoo
Shaving cream
Footballs
Paint brushes
Balloons
Fan belts
Umbrellas
Paint Rollers
Luggage
Antifreeze
Model cars
Floor wax
Sports car bodies
Tires
Dish washing liquids
Unbreakable dishes
Toothbrushes
Toothpaste
Combs
Tents
Hair curlers
Lipstick
Ice cube trays
Electric blankets
Tennis rackets
Drinking cups
House paint
Roller skates wheels
Guitar strings
Ammonia
Eyeglasses
Ice chests
Life jackets
TV cabinets
Car battery cases
Insect repellent
Refrigerants
Typewriter ribbons
Cold cream
Glycerin
Plywood adhesive
Cameras
Anesthetics
Artificial turf
Artificial Limbs
Bandages
Dentures
Mops
Beach Umbrellas
Ballpoint pens
Boats
Nail polish
Golf bags
Caulking
Tape recorders
Curtains
Vitamin capsules
Dashboards
Putty
Percolators
Skis
Insecticides
Fishing lures
Perfumes
Shoe polish
Petroleum jelly
Faucet washers
Food preservatives
Antihistamines
Cortisone
Dyes
LP records
Solvents
Roofing

The evils of oil, WOW how did we allow the Sex Poodle to sell us against oil, how many of these products are you willing to give up or better yet pay more for them ?!?!?!?!

 

[Zona]

How do we forget or delete these products we obtain from oil?

Clothing Ink
Heart Valves
Crayons
Parachutes
Telephones
Enamel
Transparent tape
Antiseptics
Vacuum bottles
Deodorant
Pantyhose
Rubbing Alcohol
Carpets
Epoxy paint
Oil filters
Upholstery
Hearing Aids
Car sound insulation
Cassettes
Motorcycle helmets
Pillows
Shower doors
Shoes
Refrigerator linings
Electrical tape
Safety glass
Awnings
Salad bowl
Rubber cement
Nylon rope
Ice buckets
Fertilizers
Hair coloring
Toilet seats
Denture adhesive
Loudspeakers
Movie film
Fishing boots
Candles
Water pipes
Car enamel
Shower curtains
Credit cards
Aspirin
Golf balls
Detergents
Sunglasses
Glue
Fishing rods
Linoleum
Plastic wood
Soft contact lenses
Trash bags
Hand lotion
Shampoo
Shaving cream
Footballs
Paint brushes
Balloons
Fan belts
Umbrellas
Paint Rollers
Luggage
Antifreeze
Model cars
Floor wax
Sports car bodies
Tires
Dish washing liquids
Unbreakable dishes
Toothbrushes
Toothpaste
Combs
Tents
Hair curlers
Lipstick
Ice cube trays
Electric blankets
Tennis rackets
Drinking cups
House paint
Roller skates wheels
Guitar strings
Ammonia
Eyeglasses
Ice chests
Life jackets
TV cabinets
Car battery cases
Insect repellent
Refrigerants
Typewriter ribbons
Cold cream
Glycerin
Plywood adhesive
Cameras
Anesthetics
Artificial turf
Artificial Limbs
Bandages
Dentures
Mops
Beach Umbrellas
Ballpoint pens
Boats
Nail polish
Golf bags
Caulking
Tape recorders
Curtains
Vitamin capsules
Dashboards
Putty
Percolators
Skis
Insecticides
Fishing lures
Perfumes
Shoe polish
Petroleum jelly
Faucet washers
Food preservatives
Antihistamines
Cortisone
Dyes
LP records
Solvents
Roofing

The evils of oil, WOW how did we allow the Sex Poodle to sell us against oil, how many of these products are you willing to give up or better yet pay more for them ?!?!?!?!

Greatest post ever.

 

[HUGGY]

How do we forget or delete these products we obtain from oil?

Clothing Ink
Heart Valves
Crayons
Parachutes
Telephones
Enamel
Transparent tape
Antiseptics
Vacuum bottles
Deodorant
Pantyhose
Rubbing Alcohol
Carpets
Epoxy paint
Oil filters
Upholstery
Hearing Aids
Car sound insulation
Cassettes
Motorcycle helmets
Pillows
Shower doors
Shoes
Refrigerator linings
Electrical tape
Safety glass
Awnings
Salad bowl
Rubber cement
Nylon rope
Ice buckets
Fertilizers
Hair coloring
Toilet seats
Denture adhesive
Loudspeakers
Movie film
Fishing boots
Candles
Water pipes
Car enamel
Shower curtains
Credit cards
Aspirin
Golf balls
Detergents
Sunglasses
Glue
Fishing rods
Linoleum
Plastic wood
Soft contact lenses
Trash bags
Hand lotion
Shampoo
Shaving cream
Footballs
Paint brushes
Balloons
Fan belts
Umbrellas
Paint Rollers
Luggage
Antifreeze
Model cars
Floor wax
Sports car bodies
Tires
Dish washing liquids
Unbreakable dishes
Toothbrushes
Toothpaste
Combs
Tents
Hair curlers
Lipstick
Ice cube trays
Electric blankets
Tennis rackets
Drinking cups
House paint
Roller skates wheels
Guitar strings
Ammonia
Eyeglasses
Ice chests
Life jackets
TV cabinets
Car battery cases
Insect repellent
Refrigerants
Typewriter ribbons
Cold cream
Glycerin
Plywood adhesive
Cameras
Anesthetics
Artificial turf
Artificial Limbs
Bandages
Dentures
Mops
Beach Umbrellas
Ballpoint pens
Boats
Nail polish
Golf bags
Caulking
Tape recorders
Curtains
Vitamin capsules
Dashboards
Putty
Percolators
Skis
Insecticides
Fishing lures
Perfumes
Shoe polish
Petroleum jelly
Faucet washers
Food preservatives
Antihistamines
Cortisone
Dyes
LP records
Solvents
Roofing

The evils of oil, WOW how did we allow the Sex Poodle to sell us against oil, how many of these products are you willing to give up or better yet pay more for them ?!?!?!?!

Independance from oil is not absolute or all or nothing. We have plenty of oil to last for hundreds of years if we use it wisely and slow down using it for transportation and our electrical needs.

 

[Old Rocks]

OK, GWV, isn't burning something this valuable pretty damned stupid?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Everyone with any sense knows that solar will be a major component to energy in the future. What that industry needs is a good kick start. As more investment is made and the markets start growing the private sector will take over and grow rapidly much in the mold of the benefits of space technology. The problem is that private industry does not want to take the first big step. Obama is forward thinking. He knows that to get more energy independant we have to take the lead. It's the same with wind technology. It could be huge for us if we focus on U S jobs as we build the windmills with our own workers. Geo Thermal could also be big. No one system is going to do the trick but the best bet for now is to at least start with free energy and transform it into electricity. If we can get a half or a third of the vehicles on the road electric we will be way ahead of the curve.

I have been advocating solar energy for 30+ years, don't talk to me about what everyone knows. The tech has been around for 100 years before that, yet even today it has not reached the point where it is economically viable.

Wind power has been around even longer, and geothermal almost as long. The problem with people today is the exact same problem I had 3
years ago, no one looks back to see that the problem is not that no one wants to use this stuff, it is that it is not efficient. Now environmentalists want to make a big thing about this being green energy, yet solar is probably the least green of the three energy sources you mentioned, even disregarding manufacturing of the panels.
Have you stopped to think about what that means in term of the actual date in the future when solar power is going to be the answer to our energy needs?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

OK, GWV, isn't burning something this valuable pretty damned stupid?

Which is why claiming that big oil is trying to stifle energy research is so stupid, they make more money off other products than they do gasoline and heating oil.

 

[Old Rocks]

Solar energy is not going to be the answer for our energy needs. Geothermal is not going to be the answer to our energy needs. Wind is not going to be the answer to our energy needs. Nuclear is not going to be the answer to all our energy needs.

But all of the above, plus even a few more, can be the answer to our energy needs if we build a distributed grid. Not only that, the homeowner can become a producer as well as a consumer of energy through solar and small wind. There are places in this nation where one could put in PV Solar, Thermal Solar, Wind, and Geothermal, and the royalties from the energy companies would go to public coffers as most of the land is BLM. That is SouthEastern Oregon. There are similiar places in other western states where one grid leg could pick up clean energy from several sources.

 

[Old Rocks]

Except Chevron purposely killed the NiMh batteries that would have began large numbers of electric cars a decade ago.

Consumer Reports ignores NiMH, taken in by GM, Chevron

Your article on GM and the EV1 is completely wrong, from start to finish. CR should be embarrassed.

"GM flashes back to its electric future
"GM says most of the technology used in the Chevrolet Volt--and many
of its engineers--came from the original EV1 program..."

That's just false. The engineers work now for Aerovironment and
ACPropulsion.

"...In fact, the EV1 team has also provided key talent and
technology at the leading independent electric car companies. GM
clearly did not kill the electric car..."

GM did, in fact, kill the Electric car, by selling control of the
Nickel Metal Hydride batteries to Texaco, which passed them off to
Chevron, whose COBASYS unit sued Toyota-Panasonic, and production of
the EV-95 battery used in the RAV4-EV (and all other successful EVs)
was stopped.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Solar energy is not going to be the answer for our energy needs. Geothermal is not going to be the answer to our energy needs. Wind is not going to be the answer to our energy needs. Nuclear is not going to be the answer to all our energy needs.

But all of the above, plus even a few more, can be the answer to our energy needs if we build a distributed grid. Not only that, the homeowner can become a producer as well as a consumer of energy through solar and small wind. There are places in this nation where one could put in PV Solar, Thermal Solar, Wind, and Geothermal, and the royalties from the energy companies would go to public coffers as most of the land is BLM. That is SouthEastern Oregon. There are similiar places in other western states where one grid leg could pick up clean energy from several sources.

We are not there yet, not even close. We are decades away from that unless there is a major breakthrough in technology. Keep on dreaming though.

 

[Ravi]

Who here that is for Solar is against space exploration? Solar is not nearly as friendly as it needs to be, but it solely owes its current State to Space Exploration.

Remind us again how dollars spent in Space are a waste.

By the way Ravi? Where will Obama put his solar farms? His democrats have over turned EVERY previous attempt to locate solar farms in any size ANYWHERE?

lol...I've never been against space exploration, and you don't need a solar farm top harness solar energy.