The Catholic Church and HealthCare.... What if the Bishops Aren't Bluffing?

[California Girl]

Most posters will know, I'm not a big fan of starting threads on media articles, but I'm making an exception for this one. Because the article is a really good one, and has a lot of very significant information contained within it.

So, Obama takes on the Catholic Church... what exactly does that mean? What if the Catholic Church was forced to close its doors? I know that many, particularly on the left, would like to see the Church (and other faith based providers) forced out in order to achieve their 'Nanny State' agenda.... but just take a few minutes to consider the impact of your goal.

• 12.6 percent of hospitals are run by the Catholic Church
• 15.6 percent of all admissions - Catholic Hospitals
• 14.5 percent of all hospital expenses
• a total for Catholic hospitals in 2010 of $98.6 billion

Catholic hospitals handle more than their share of Medicare (16.6 percent) and Medicaid (13.65) discharges, meaning that more than one in six seniors and disabled patients get attention from these hospitals, and more than one in every eight low-income patients as well. Almost a third (32 percent) of these hospitals are located in rural areas, where patients usually have few other options for care.

Catholic hospitals take a leading role in providing less-profitable services to patients. They lead the sector in breast cancer screenings, nutrition programs, trauma, geriatric services, and social work. In most of these areas, other non-profits come close, but hospitals run by state and local governments fall significantly off the pace. Where patients have trouble paying for care, Catholic hospitals cover more of the costs. For instance, Catholic Health Services in Florida provides free care to families below 200 percent of federal poverty line, accepting Medicaid reimbursements as payment in full, and caps costs at 20 percent of household income for families that fall between 200 percent and 400 percent of the federal poverty line.

What if Catholic bishops aren’t bluffing? « Hot Air

Read the article. Then tell me it's a good thing to force the Churches out of providing services. We do it better, cheaper, and for those who are most vulnerable.

As long as hospitals remain open the communities, it won't matter. Systems will come in and buy out the faith based hospitals if they wish to get out of the healthcare game. These takeovers happen everyday in the USA.

Yea, at higher costs..... and less efficiency.... but no doubt that is fine.... as long as it doesn't effect you - it's just the poor and vulnerable that will be most impacted.... who cares about them, right?

 

[Kiki Cannoli]

Most posters will know, I'm not a big fan of starting threads on media articles, but I'm making an exception for this one. Because the article is a really good one, and has a lot of very significant information contained within it.

So, Obama takes on the Catholic Church... what exactly does that mean? What if the Catholic Church was forced to close its doors? I know that many, particularly on the left, would like to see the Church (and other faith based providers) forced out in order to achieve their 'Nanny State' agenda.... but just take a few minutes to consider the impact of your goal.

• 12.6 percent of hospitals are run by the Catholic Church
• 15.6 percent of all admissions - Catholic Hospitals
• 14.5 percent of all hospital expenses
• a total for Catholic hospitals in 2010 of $98.6 billion

Catholic hospitals handle more than their share of Medicare (16.6 percent) and Medicaid (13.65) discharges, meaning that more than one in six seniors and disabled patients get attention from these hospitals, and more than one in every eight low-income patients as well. Almost a third (32 percent) of these hospitals are located in rural areas, where patients usually have few other options for care.

Catholic hospitals take a leading role in providing less-profitable services to patients. They lead the sector in breast cancer screenings, nutrition programs, trauma, geriatric services, and social work. In most of these areas, other non-profits come close, but hospitals run by state and local governments fall significantly off the pace. Where patients have trouble paying for care, Catholic hospitals cover more of the costs. For instance, Catholic Health Services in Florida provides free care to families below 200 percent of federal poverty line, accepting Medicaid reimbursements as payment in full, and caps costs at 20 percent of household income for families that fall between 200 percent and 400 percent of the federal poverty line.

What if Catholic bishops aren’t bluffing? « Hot Air

Read the article. Then tell me it's a good thing to force the Churches out of providing services. We do it better, cheaper, and for those who are most vulnerable.

As long as hospitals remain open the communities, it won't matter. Systems will come in and buy out the faith based hospitals if they wish to get out of the healthcare game. These takeovers happen everyday in the USA.

Yea, at higher costs..... and less efficiency.... but no doubt that is fine.... as long as it doesn't effect you - it's just the poor and vulnerable that will be most impacted.... who cares about them, right?

Higher costs and less efficient are false presumptions. I care for those who do not have access to quality care which is why I support a national system. Healthcare will remain in the community whether the bishop wants it to or not - seems to me you should be angry with church leadership threatening the well being of the poor and vulnerable.

 

[California Girl]

As long as hospitals remain open the communities, it won't matter. Systems will come in and buy out the faith based hospitals if they wish to get out of the healthcare game. These takeovers happen everyday in the USA.

Yea, at higher costs..... and less efficiency.... but no doubt that is fine.... as long as it doesn't effect you - it's just the poor and vulnerable that will be most impacted.... who cares about them, right?

Higher costs and less efficient are false presumptions. I care for those who do not have access to quality care which is why I support a national system. Healthcare will remain in the community whether the bishop wants it to or not - seems to me you should be angry with church leadership threatening the well being of the poor and vulnerable.

I support the Church being a provider because they care more about the poor and vulnerable than any government or private sector company.

A national system won't fucking work... it doesn't work anywhere else so we should learn that lesson instead of pretending that it will be different for us.

 

[auditor0007]

I don't see why Catholic institutions would be forced to close. The requirements are the same for Catholic, Jewish, and Protestant institutions as well as government and privately owned institutions. I admit I haven't followed this issue very closely but it seems rather unlikely these church institutions are going to close their doors. Contraception coverage is part of health care plans in Italy and nearly all other European countries yet I haven't heard of any church institutions closing in these countries in protest.

The only difference is that the health care plans that cover contraception in Italy are covered by the government, not the Church. This really is a complicated issue. I understand the Church's position. What I find interesting here is that it seems to me that if the Church, as an employer, is going to offer health insurance that does not cover contraception, then the premiums should be lower, allowing the employee to purchase her own contraception with the difference. In the end, someone is paying for birth control pills or whatever the woman may use, so is there a real difference if it is included in the plan at a higher premium or if it is paid for out of pocket with a lower insurance premium?

Outside of that, I do wonder what will happen if this planet hits 10 billion people and we can no longer support everyone with our resources. Will the Catholic Church still insist everyone should have 18 kids? I won't be around that long, but it is something to wonder about.

 

[Ravi]

So Catholics are major recipients of tax dollars?

Yep. From what I understand, they get over 60% of their funding from tax dollars.

I know the Seventh Day Adventists will happily step in and take over "charity" hospitals. After all, medicare or medicaid pays for the "charity" cases.

 

[Ravi]

As long as hospitals remain open the communities, it won't matter. Systems will come in and buy out the faith based hospitals if they wish to get out of the healthcare game. These takeovers happen everyday in the USA.

Yea, at higher costs..... and less efficiency.... but no doubt that is fine.... as long as it doesn't effect you - it's just the poor and vulnerable that will be most impacted.... who cares about them, right?

Higher costs and less efficient are false presumptions. I care for those who do not have access to quality care which is why I support a national system. Healthcare will remain in the community whether the bishop wants it to or not - seems to me you should be angry with church leadership threatening the well being of the poor and vulnerable.

Exactly. The hypocrisy on this subject is beyond belief.

 

[California Girl]

Yea, at higher costs..... and less efficiency.... but no doubt that is fine.... as long as it doesn't effect you - it's just the poor and vulnerable that will be most impacted.... who cares about them, right?

Higher costs and less efficient are false presumptions. I care for those who do not have access to quality care which is why I support a national system. Healthcare will remain in the community whether the bishop wants it to or not - seems to me you should be angry with church leadership threatening the well being of the poor and vulnerable.

Exactly. The hypocrisy on this subject is beyond belief.

No hypocrisy from the Church... exactly the opposite. It will not compromise its doctrine for any Administration - regardless of political ideology.

 

[California Girl]

So Catholics are major recipients of tax dollars?

Yep. From what I understand, they get over 60% of their funding from tax dollars.

I know the Seventh Day Adventists will happily step in and take over "charity" hospitals. After all, medicare or medicaid pays for the "charity" cases.

Actually, the Seventh Dad Adventists are one of the 2,500 faiths that are supporting the Catholic Church on this. So, I wouldn't be so certain of their 'happily' if I were you.

 

[chanel]

Remember the cries from the left when Planned Parenthood funding was to be cut? Back alley abortions. Women dying of cancer.

Catholic hospitals? No biggie.

Oh the hypocrisy and downright stupidity.

 

[California Girl]

Remember the cries from the left when Planned Parenthood funding was to be cut? Back alley abortions. Women dying of cancer.

Catholic hospitals? No biggie.

Oh the hypocrisy and downright stupidity.

Good point.

 

[Ravi]

So Catholics are major recipients of tax dollars?

Yep. From what I understand, they get over 60% of their funding from tax dollars.

I know the Seventh Day Adventists will happily step in and take over "charity" hospitals. After all, medicare or medicaid pays for the "charity" cases.

Actually, the Seventh Dad Adventists are one of the 2,500 faiths that are supporting the Catholic Church on this. So, I wouldn't be so certain of their 'happily' if I were you.

I don't know if that is true or not. But it doesn't change the fact that they would happily step in and take over Catholic "charity" hospitals.

 

[California Girl]

Yep. From what I understand, they get over 60% of their funding from tax dollars.

I know the Seventh Day Adventists will happily step in and take over "charity" hospitals. After all, medicare or medicaid pays for the "charity" cases.

Actually, the Seventh Dad Adventists are one of the 2,500 faiths that are supporting the Catholic Church on this. So, I wouldn't be so certain of their 'happily' if I were you.

I don't know if that is true or not. But it doesn't change the fact that they would happily step in and take over Catholic "charity" hospitals.

We own them. You want 'em, you pay for 'em. Or is seizing property another acceptable price now?

Also, they'll need to make sure they can afford it. Our Hospitals don't 'make money', quite the opposite.... they cost the Church serious amounts of cash.... as you would know if you read the damned article.

Seems to me, the left just hates the fact that religions do so much good for society.

 

[peach174]

I don't see why Catholic institutions would be forced to close. The requirements are the same for Catholic, Jewish, and Protestant institutions as well as government and privately owned institutions. I admit I haven't followed this issue very closely but it seems rather unlikely these church institutions are going to close their doors. Contraception coverage is part of health care plans in Italy and nearly all other European countries yet I haven't heard of any church institutions closing in these countries in protest.

Guess what? Catholic, Jewish and Protestant's' are against this.
All three were represented at the committee meeting held by Darrell Issa.
That's because no European countries have a 1st amendment that protects freedom of religion like we do.

 

[Ravi]

Actually, the Seventh Dad Adventists are one of the 2,500 faiths that are supporting the Catholic Church on this. So, I wouldn't be so certain of their 'happily' if I were you.

I don't know if that is true or not. But it doesn't change the fact that they would happily step in and take over Catholic "charity" hospitals.

We own them. You want 'em, you pay for 'em. Or is seizing property another acceptable price now?

Also, they'll need to make sure they can afford it. Our Hospitals don't 'make money', quite the opposite.... they cost the Church serious amounts of cash.... as you would know if you read the damned article.

Seems to me, the left just hates the fact that religions do so much good for society.

Your question: what if the bishops aren't bluffing?

My answer: the sda would fill the void.

Not take them or seize them. Happily fill the void.

You are obviously unhinged on the subject.

 

[koshergrl]

Most posters will know...

Why would we know that?

 

[koshergrl]

I don't know if that is true or not. But it doesn't change the fact that they would happily step in and take over Catholic "charity" hospitals.

We own them. You want 'em, you pay for 'em. Or is seizing property another acceptable price now?

Also, they'll need to make sure they can afford it. Our Hospitals don't 'make money', quite the opposite.... they cost the Church serious amounts of cash.... as you would know if you read the damned article.

Seems to me, the left just hates the fact that religions do so much good for society.

Your question: what if the bishops aren't bluffing?

My answer: the sda would fill the void.

Not take them or seize them. Happily fill the void.

You are obviously unhinged on the subject.

I don't see the adventists ever taking the place of the Catholic church, lol. They are their own animal but that's just not happening. I don't see the Catholic church going away.....

 

[koshergrl]

And if it ever does, we are in for some horrific shit.

 

[Greenbeard]

Remember the cries from the left when Planned Parenthood funding was to be cut? Back alley abortions. Women dying of cancer.

Catholic hospitals? No biggie.

Probably because this is a non-issue.

1. Plenty of Catholics are just fine with the compromise rule, which preserves access to contraception to employees without requiring the employer to contribute financially. The freedom of religion issue was settled weeks ago, the question now is who was just along for the ride to go after contraception. Those folks do indeed continue their war on contraception.
2. The worst case scenario for a Catholic-run hospital that doesn't like the rule, despite it not requiring them to pay for anything they don't want to, would be to simply not offer health insurance coverage as part of its compensation package. Bump up wages and allow employees to seek their own coverage in an exchange. Problem solved, no one is hurt.

This stuff about Catholics razing their hospitals to the ground and pissing on the ashes just to spite society is standard fare for the paranoid style characterizing the American right. It's not, however, a realistic outcome, unless the average Catholic businessman is as unhinged and irrational as the average poster on USMB.

 

[California Girl]

Remember the cries from the left when Planned Parenthood funding was to be cut? Back alley abortions. Women dying of cancer.

Catholic hospitals? No biggie.

Probably because this is a non-issue.

1. Plenty of Catholics are just fine with the compromise rule, which preserves access to contraception to employees without requiring the employer to contribute financially. The freedom of religion issue was settled weeks ago, the question now is who was just along for the ride to go after contraception. Those folks do indeed continue their war on contraception.
2. The worst case scenario for a Catholic-run hospital that doesn't like the rule, despite it not requiring them to pay for anything they don't want to, would be to simply not offer health insurance coverage as part of its compensation package. Bump up wages and allow employees to seek their own coverage in an exchange. Problem solved, no one is hurt.

This stuff about Catholics razing their hospitals to the ground and pissing on the ashes just to spite society is standard fare for the paranoid style characterizing the American right. It's not, however, a realistic outcome, unless the average Catholic businessman is as unhinged and irrational as the average poster on USMB.

Razing our hospitals to the ground? More left wing hysteria. idiot.

Most Catholics.... along with most Christians... and most other faiths.... take religious liberty seriously. The only ones who don't are left wing hacks who don't like America's Constitution.

 

[Si modo]

So Catholics are major recipients of tax dollars?

Yep. From what I understand, they get over 60% of their funding from tax dollars.

....

I don't believe a thing you post without support. Link? Nothing personal.