Teachers caught cheating on student test scores

[Care4all]

Thanks Tank:

God bless that woman for calling it "black on black crime". Certainly I can second the crime part..

Caring parents like her don't have years to fix the system. Their problem is a TODAY problem. And they don't want to hear about Bush or dead Kennedys or political excuses. They need a REFUND for the fraudulent actions of the school system. They need CHOICE today..

are private schools (or home schoolers) required to take the same tests that public schools are required to take/give in order to get tax payer's money?

No, they aren't. They use the Iowa tests, I believe. At least here. They are not required to participate in the No Child Left Behind boloney.

so we force the no child left behind testing on public schools, but pay via choice/vouchers for students to go to private schools that are NOT forced to follow no child left behind testing?

doesn't make sense to me?

 

[AllieBaba]

I don't think that's correct.

I thought home schooled kids took the same tests.

This calls for google!

 

[random3434]

Here Care, read these links:

NCLB Guide for Operators and Developers

Homeschooling in an NCLB Society

Non-Public Education School Choice Fact Sheet -- Non-Public Education: A Vital Part of U.S. K-12 Education

Homeschool Testing - Order CAT5, ITBS and More: Where to Find Standardized Tests for Homeschoolers | Suite101.com

 

[random3434]

America's biggest teacher and principal cheating scandal unfolds in Atlanta - Yahoo! News

What ever happened to the day when teachers actually cared about their students? Please tell me we still have some left.

Ignorant statement and inaccurate assumption.

Teachers overwhelmingly care for their students and their success, much more than many parents, I suspect.

Fire the teachers, and if criminal offenses were committed, prosecute.

Agree 100%

 

[manifold]

The key takeaway here is that 178 people is waaaay too many to include in a conspiracy to cheat and/or commit a crime. Whenever possible, stick with me, myself and I. But if expansion is necessary, at least make sure you can trust the additional conspirators you're bringing in.

Anyone that thought they could get away with this is clinically retarded.

 

[Ravi]

are private schools (or home schoolers) required to take the same tests that public schools are required to take/give in order to get tax payer's money?

No, they aren't. They use the Iowa tests, I believe. At least here. They are not required to participate in the No Child Left Behind boloney.

so we force the no child left behind testing on public schools, but pay via choice/vouchers for students to go to private schools that are NOT forced to follow no child left behind testing?

doesn't make sense to me?

Yeah, it is pretty stupid when you put it that way.

My kids were in private school until 9th grade and they didn't have to take those stupid tests until high school. The entire school year for public schools was reformatted to accommodate the testing as was the curriculum.

I have yet to meet a teacher or a student that thinks the tests are a good idea.

 

[Ravi]

I don't think that's correct.

I thought home schooled kids took the same tests.

This calls for google!

My niece was homeschooled. She didn't have to take the NCLB tests.

It is possible that it varies from state to state.

 

[AllieBaba]

Ok, so the feeling I'm getting from internet stuff and what I've picked up at budget meetings (like once or twice a year) is that homeschooled kids work with the school district, and ... it seems that the educators (parents) have to submit certain forms or narratives that contain particular wording and which affirm that the child has made adequate academic progress...and this has to be co-signed, essentially, by the school admin from the district in which the child is schooled.

Does that sound about right?

 

[AllieBaba]

No, they aren't. They use the Iowa tests, I believe. At least here. They are not required to participate in the No Child Left Behind boloney.

so we force the no child left behind testing on public schools, but pay via choice/vouchers for students to go to private schools that are NOT forced to follow no child left behind testing?

doesn't make sense to me?

Yeah, it is pretty stupid when you put it that way.

My kids were in private school until 9th grade and they didn't have to take those stupid tests until high school. The entire school year for public schools was reformatted to accommodate the testing as was the curriculum.

I have yet to meet a teacher or a student that thinks the tests are a good idea.

Of course the students don't think they are, Ravi. That is a given.

Teachers, they don't like them because it provides an overview of the job they're doing.

As the teachers in Atlanta figured out. Hence the cheating. It's that old relativism cropping up again...lying is bad for YOU but okay for ME.

 

[Ravi]

so we force the no child left behind testing on public schools, but pay via choice/vouchers for students to go to private schools that are NOT forced to follow no child left behind testing?

doesn't make sense to me?

Yeah, it is pretty stupid when you put it that way.

My kids were in private school until 9th grade and they didn't have to take those stupid tests until high school. The entire school year for public schools was reformatted to accommodate the testing as was the curriculum.

I have yet to meet a teacher or a student that thinks the tests are a good idea.

Of course the students don't think they are, Ravi. That is a given.

Teachers, they don't like them because it provides an overview of the job they're doing.

As the teachers in Atlanta figured out. Hence the cheating. It's that old relativism cropping up again...lying is bad for YOU but okay for ME.

Actually, it does no such thing.

It may or may not prove that teachers can teach kids to take tests. Which, IMO, is one skill they learn anyway.

It may also show that the teachers the kids had up until that year may or may not have been good teachers. It says nothing really about the current teacher.

 

[Care4all]

i don't think home schooled children should be required to take NCLB tests....i don't think they are getting tax voucher money to school their kids....are they?

 

[Flopper]

The test evaluate the foundations of each subject. If the teachers weren't teaching that before, they weren't teaching. If the scores became better the longer the tests were given, that means the teachers finally got serious about teaching.

If scores improve, that can mean teachers are doing a better job of teaching the subject but it also can mean that teachers are teaching to the test which is quite different.

Not really. Since the test evaluates the foundation of skills, the teachers are now teaching what they are supposed to be teaching and publishers are offering more practice.

I think standardize tests are pretty good job at evaluating student progress, as long as the students are not overly coached. If a teacher is very familiar with the types of questions that will on a test and spends the time to coach the students, it will make a significant difference in test scores. That doesn't mean the student really understands the underlying principals. It just means they can supply the answers to the test questions.

Bureaucrats’ love standardized tests for determining student, teacher, and school performance, but there is a lot more to performance evaluation than just test scores. Just a few problem kids in a class can make the class average look really bad. I know of one case where a middle school principal actively tried to get problem kids to drop out just to improve school test scores. They’re also a lot of smart kids that know the material but choke up when taking test. Standardize tests don’t tell the whole story. There're just a tool.

 

[KissMy]

This pisses me off! They were forced to cheat or lose their jobs. Why not pressure them to actually teach or lose their jobs?

Atlanta Cheating Teachers

Fells told ABC News that teachers who refused to cheat were punished and pushed out. She resigned voluntarily in 2008 partly due to the pressure to cheat. The school district said it is now firing all teachers and administrators implicated in the report.

 

[chanel]

Many of the students don't take the test seriously. They are told they will be promoted no matter what. How about a little accountability there as well?

 

[Ravi]

Many of the students don't take the test seriously. They are told they will be promoted no matter what. How about a little accountability there as well?

Why should they take it seriously when it is a test to score the school itself?

 

[Tank]

The white and Asian kids take it seriously.

 

[AllieBaba]

Yeah, it is pretty stupid when you put it that way.

My kids were in private school until 9th grade and they didn't have to take those stupid tests until high school. The entire school year for public schools was reformatted to accommodate the testing as was the curriculum.

I have yet to meet a teacher or a student that thinks the tests are a good idea.

Of course the students don't think they are, Ravi. That is a given.

Teachers, they don't like them because it provides an overview of the job they're doing.

As the teachers in Atlanta figured out. Hence the cheating. It's that old relativism cropping up again...lying is bad for YOU but okay for ME.

Actually, it does no such thing.

It may or may not prove that teachers can teach kids to take tests. Which, IMO, is one skill they learn anyway.

It may also show that the teachers the kids had up until that year may or may not have been good teachers. It says nothing really about the current teacher.

Yeah, more relativism.

In this specific case, it shows the teachers are liars and cheaters.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Of course the students don't think they are, Ravi. That is a given.

Teachers, they don't like them because it provides an overview of the job they're doing.

As the teachers in Atlanta figured out. Hence the cheating. It's that old relativism cropping up again...lying is bad for YOU but okay for ME.

Actually, it does no such thing.

It may or may not prove that teachers can teach kids to take tests. Which, IMO, is one skill they learn anyway.

It may also show that the teachers the kids had up until that year may or may not have been good teachers. It says nothing really about the current teacher.

Yeah, more relativism.

In this specific case, it shows the teachers are liars and cheaters.

Out of the mouth of babes she condemns herself. Yes, oh yes, AllieBaba, oh my yes, you are perhaps the biggest liar and cheater of the board.

 

[AllieBaba]

Actually, it does no such thing.

It may or may not prove that teachers can teach kids to take tests. Which, IMO, is one skill they learn anyway.

It may also show that the teachers the kids had up until that year may or may not have been good teachers. It says nothing really about the current teacher.

Yeah, more relativism.

In this specific case, it shows the teachers are liars and cheaters.

Out of the mouth of babes she condemns herself. Yes, oh yes, AllieBaba, oh my yes, you are perhaps the biggest liar and cheater of the board.

 

[Care4all]

This pisses me off! They were forced to cheat or lose their jobs. Why not pressure them to actually teach or lose their jobs?

Atlanta Cheating Teachers

Fells told ABC News that teachers who

refused to cheat were punished and pushed out. She resigned voluntarily in 2008 partly due to the pressure to cheat. The school district said it is now firing all teachers and administrators implicated in the report.

B I N G O! it pisses me off too!