Taxes

[beretta304]

What exactly do you think is going to be found?

The inequities of the tax system. Romney is, fortuitously, the embodiment of much of what's wrong with the tax code in an election season defined in large part by tax policy proposals. If this numbnuts proposes to raise the tax burden on the middle class to pay for a new round of millionaires' tax cuts, he might as well as show us how much he's been paying all these years. But I doubt he wants to do that.

Anything ethically dubious in there would just be icing on the cake.

Romney has not proposed raising taxes on the middle class and you are dishonest for saying that he has. You can sit here and digress about revenue neutral and such, but it's recognized that it's just another way to try to distract people from the wreck that is Obama.
Are you aware that IF taxes were left EXACTLY as they are today, that is we grow our economy, then revenues to the government will automatically go up?
For more on the budget, see the interview linked below.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lpwVFdQL_s]Paul Ryan Interview with Brit Hume - Special Report w/Bret Baier - 8-14-12 - YouTube[/ame]

It's all Liberal spin that he's going to raise taxes and a manipulation of the numbers. Two different Statisticians can do remarkable things given the same data.

 

[Liberal]

This whole "Romney needs to release more tax returns" is just smoke and mirrors and being done to distract from talking about Obama's lack of a record and no vision for the future or how to get us out of the mess he exacerbated.

Perhaps you are looking at the issue the wrong way?

< ref= Assuming that he did not pay taxes>

Given the situation that is happening in this country, it is obvious that simply cutting spending is not going to solve our problems.. Even republicans are realizing this (proven by the fact that many are dropping the Norquist pledge).

How can a man who potentially went out of his way to not pay taxes be taken seriously when it comes to fixing the deficit? />

No matter what way you shake it, him not releasing them either gives the illusion or proves that he has something to hide.

Potentially? How about actually like Obama putting $48,000 dollars of income in his children's names rather than pay taxes on it? Especially after him telling the rest of us that SHOULD be paying more.

Trust me, many on my side of the argument are guilty of tax evasion via loop-hole. If we break out the measuring stick, I am sure it goes way further on Mitt's side. Even if he did pay taxes, I am sure he shuffled quite a bit. Overall, it just outlines the problem.. Everyone need to pay their share.

Obama is also not building a campaign around deficit reduction.

 

[emptystep]

The fact that Romney plays the loopholes on his taxes is one thing but the fact that he gamed the system so damn hard that the IRS wrote him a check for $1,609,441 is ethically questionable. Best part is that is income Romney doesn't have to pay taxes on.

 

[Wry Catcher]

This whole "Romney needs to release more tax returns" is just smoke and mirrors and being done to distract from talking about Obama's lack of a record and no vision for the future or how to get us out of the mess he exacerbated.

Totally a partisan opinion, one for which no probative evidence can is offered

What exactly do you think is going to be found? He paid a low rate due to taking advantage of legal loopholes? Big deal. As if any one of you wouldn't have done the same. And save the, "I'm not running for President" nonsense. Neither was Romney when he filed them.

The returns are likely so complicated most of you wouldn't know what the hell you are reading. So what are you lefties going to do? Wait for the lamestream media or some left wing website to interpert and spin them into something they are not? Get over it. If I were Romney I would refuse as well. In my case, moreso since it pisses off the far left. It's not his base or his supporters whining about it.

It is all about transparency; I've heard Romney 'earned' $21 million dollars in interest one year. Is that true? If so the details are important. Did his investments which genereated so much income benefit American's or the people of other nations, such as China?


I love the argument that wihout seeing them how can we expect serious tax reform.

Hello! BREAKING NEWS: Every President is wealthy in his own right long before he is elected. It's all about the definition of wealth. Do you think Obama isn't wealthy? He was before he ran and he had the Chicago political machine's wealth backing him as well From that perspective one can say he was comprised before he ran. It's ridiculous. I see wealth as being defined by each individual relative to his own wealth. Most would say that anyone better off financially than themselves is "wealthy" by comparison.

This paragraph comes under the banner of a Loney Tune Cartoon.

If one applied that reasoning nothing would get done on any issue. Look at it dfferently. Romney is already rich so there is no reason for him be corrupt. Al Capone was rich too He doesn't need the money. His wealth is sealed. The lobbyists are the problem not the candidate's wealth. Closing loopholes isn't going to help the average Joe since most of us don't use those loopholes. We can argue the ins and outs of it all day long. Yaeh tax the rich, that's going to solve everything...NOT!

Taxing the rich is not the panacea, it is one of the first steps to be taken toward fiscal sanity.

Bottom line is there are most serious issues facing the nation than what one may or may not find in Romney's returns...which is likely to be absolutely nothing. It's his perogative to release them or not and he will be the one on the receiving end of his decision.

Correct, it is his choice. Legally he is correct, time will tell if the decision was smart politically. IMO most people are not envious of the rich, most people go along to get along. It is only when the rich expect special treatment or use there wealth to extract special treatment do the rich suffer the rancor of the people.

 

[DiamondDave]

Perhaps you are looking at the issue the wrong way?

< ref= Assuming that he did not pay taxes>

Given the situation that is happening in this country, it is obvious that simply cutting spending is not going to solve our problems.. Even republicans are realizing this (proven by the fact that many are dropping the Norquist pledge).

How can a man who potentially went out of his way to not pay taxes be taken seriously when it comes to fixing the deficit? />

No matter what way you shake it, him not releasing them either gives the illusion or proves that he has something to hide.

Potentially? How about actually like Obama putting $48,000 dollars of income in his children's names rather than pay taxes on it? Especially after him telling the rest of us that SHOULD be paying more.

Trust me, many on my side of the argument are guilty of tax evasion via loop-hole. If we break out the measuring stick, I am sure it goes way further on Mitt's side. Even if he did pay taxes, I am sure he shuffled quite a bit. Overall, it just outlines the problem.. Everyone need to pay their share.

Obama is also not building a campaign around deficit reduction.

But yet you champion a system and approach that has close to 47% NOT paying a share in federal income taxes...

 

[Vel]

Perhaps you are looking at the issue the wrong way?

< ref= Assuming that he did not pay taxes>

Given the situation that is happening in this country, it is obvious that simply cutting spending is not going to solve our problems.. Even republicans are realizing this (proven by the fact that many are dropping the Norquist pledge).

How can a man who potentially went out of his way to not pay taxes be taken seriously when it comes to fixing the deficit? />

No matter what way you shake it, him not releasing them either gives the illusion or proves that he has something to hide.

Potentially? How about actually like Obama putting $48,000 dollars of income in his children's names rather than pay taxes on it? Especially after him telling the rest of us that SHOULD be paying more.

Trust me, many on my side of the argument are guilty of tax evasion via loop-hole. If we break out the measuring stick, I am sure it goes way further on Mitt's side. Even if he did pay taxes, I am sure he shuffled quite a bit. Overall, it just outlines the problem.. Everyone need to pay their share.

Obama is also not building a campaign around deficit reduction.

No. Obama is building his campaign on a moral issue about how rich guys like him should be paying more, while at the same time availing himself of all loopholes in order not to pay more. That makes Obama a huge hypocrite. His motto seems to be , "Do as I say, not as I do".

 

[Vel]

The fact that Romney plays the loopholes on his taxes is one thing but the fact that he gamed the system so damn hard that the IRS wrote him a check for $1,609,441 is ethically questionable. Best part is that is income Romney doesn't have to pay taxes on.

Bless your heart, you've never paid your own taxes have you and don't understand how it works. If you "pay" ( that means send the government money ) more to the government than you "owe" ( that means the actual amount of money you are assessed on your income ), then you are due a refund of the difference. You can elect for the government to apply it to your next years tax or you can have then return the money to you.
***********************************************************
Tax Payments
The voluntary quarterly tax payments one makes can shed light on the detail and accuracy of the CPA. In April 2011, Mr. Romney filed forms that would extend his filing deadline to October 15th. The extension, however, does not extend the deadline to pay taxes that are due. To cover his 2011 tax bill, Mr. Romney included a payment to the United States Treasury of $3,250,000 with his filing extension for April 15th. His actual tax liability turned out to be significantly less than the liability his advisors projected, resulting in a refund of $1,609,441. With his final return showing income of $21,646,507, this means that his advisors thought it possible that Mr. Romney could have upwards of $31,000,000 of total income. It is common to build a cushion into tax payments until final tax documents (ie. K-1s) are supplied because the exact liability cannot be calculated. This cushion, however, is typically closer to 10% of projected liability, not 50%. While it is possible Mr. Romney’s advisors overpaid his extension with the intention of applying it to taxes due for first quarter 2012, the overpayment was almost double the necessary amount based on the “110% of prior year” test. By overpaying such a large amount Mr. Romney was without the use of those funds from the payment date in April, to the refund date close to the end of the year. Even in a low interest rate environment, losing the use of such a large dollar amount for potentially over a year cost Mr. Romney a significant sum.
How We Are Different

 

[RDD_1210]

And we should highlight the problem that you liberals want to tax some more and more, while you fully support not taxing others... wealth redistribution and forcing others to pay for your services... because you feel it is right to treat someone unequally when you benefit from it

So only liberals want a progressive tax system? Which conservatives want a totally flat tax system with no exceptions at all that you advocate?

Never said. that.. there are plenty on the REP side who want a progressive system chock full of exemptions, differing tax levels for differing types of income, deductions, loopholes, etc... because the more complex you have it, the more you are able to manipulate the system...

A flat tax would probably have many 'rich' that would pay more, because of the elimination of loopholes and because of including capital gains in with all other income... but you will not even accept that because you fully support every growing numbers paying zero in income tax, in this class warfare game

And before you say it, yes we know Bush II also increased the # of people not paying income tax... and nobody is defending Bush's policies on this

Oh so it's not just liberals then? Weird that's who you pointed out. Wonder why that is. Everything you stand for is laughable.

 

[RDD_1210]

Then you turn this right around on Obamalama... as I have stated SO many times... Offer to release every tax form from every year he has been working, along with every report card, complete driving record, complete health record, every employment evaluation, and every other fucking thing you can think of... the minute Obamalama agrees to do the same.... bust the myth that Obama wants this all about transparency and expose that Obamalama only wants it about selective transparency on this one narrow thing to advance his class warfare rhetoric

Fine, let him make the offer. But he won't. Obama providing those documents doesn't change anything. Romney showing how little he paid in taxes, does.

What the hell do you mean... how little he paid.......He paid more then you........just following the law........You bastards are so damn greedy it makes those around you guys ill. All Americans should be treated equally, Something a democrat has never once in the party history believed in..........

How do you know? Based upon the returns he's released so far, he hasn't paid more than me. I suspect the other returns will only show that he's paid even less than that.

 

[RDD_1210]

Then you turn this right around on Obamalama... as I have stated SO many times... Offer to release every tax form from every year he has been working, along with every report card, complete driving record, complete health record, every employment evaluation, and every other fucking thing you can think of... the minute Obamalama agrees to do the same.... bust the myth that Obama wants this all about transparency and expose that Obamalama only wants it about selective transparency on this one narrow thing to advance his class warfare rhetoric

Fine, let him make the offer. But he won't. Obama providing those documents doesn't change anything. Romney showing how little he paid in taxes, does.

Who knows if he will or won't.. if I were his campaign manager, I would advise it... it would destroy Obamalama...

It is not about how little he paid in taxes (13% or whatever)... it is simply about your side's insistence on class warfare... Oooooo the 'evil rich', boogey boogey boogey

No one said rich are evil. Why is it impossible for you to debate the actual things that are being said. Oh I know, because your corporate masters at Fox News tell you what to say. Sheep.

 

[RDD_1210]

What exactly do you think is going to be found?

The inequities of the tax system. Romney is, fortuitously, the embodiment of much of what's wrong with the tax code in an election season defined in large part by tax policy proposals. If this numbnuts proposes to raise the tax burden on the middle class to pay for a new round of millionaires' tax cuts, he might as well as show us how much he's been paying all these years. But I doubt he wants to do that.

Anything ethically dubious in there would just be icing on the cake.

Romney has not proposed raising taxes on the middle class and you are dishonest for saying that he has. You can sit here and digress about revenue neutral and such, but it's recognized that it's just another way to try to distract people from the wreck that is Obama.
Are you aware that IF taxes were left EXACTLY as they are today, that is we grow our economy, then revenues to the government will automatically go up?
For more on the budget, see the interview linked below.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lpwVFdQL_s]Paul Ryan Interview with Brit Hume - Special Report w/Bret Baier - 8-14-12 - YouTube[/ame]

Sure he has. You just choose not to believe it.

 

[DiamondDave]

So only liberals want a progressive tax system? Which conservatives want a totally flat tax system with no exceptions at all that you advocate?

Never said. that.. there are plenty on the REP side who want a progressive system chock full of exemptions, differing tax levels for differing types of income, deductions, loopholes, etc... because the more complex you have it, the more you are able to manipulate the system...

A flat tax would probably have many 'rich' that would pay more, because of the elimination of loopholes and because of including capital gains in with all other income... but you will not even accept that because you fully support every growing numbers paying zero in income tax, in this class warfare game

And before you say it, yes we know Bush II also increased the # of people not paying income tax... and nobody is defending Bush's policies on this

Oh so it's not just liberals then? Weird that's who you pointed out. Wonder why that is. Everything you stand for is laughable.

Yep... there are ones on both side who want to cheat the system... it is why conservatives and many on the libertarian right have become disappointed in the GOP

But you liberals certainly want it, albeit for a different approach and reason, for your class warfare games... so that others may pay for you, or at least more than you, for the things you want... and as you vilify the 'evil rich' who abuse the overly complex system, you praise those who are not rich who abuse the system.... I, on the other hand, am against both

And funny how you say that what I stand for is laughable... when I stand for equality in treatment, blind to situation, person, position, or whatever else... shows a lot about you

 

[DiamondDave]

Fine, let him make the offer. But he won't. Obama providing those documents doesn't change anything. Romney showing how little he paid in taxes, does.

Who knows if he will or won't.. if I were his campaign manager, I would advise it... it would destroy Obamalama...

It is not about how little he paid in taxes (13% or whatever)... it is simply about your side's insistence on class warfare... Oooooo the 'evil rich', boogey boogey boogey

No one said rich are evil. Why is it impossible for you to debate the actual things that are being said. Oh I know, because your corporate masters at Fox News tell you what to say. Sheep.

You wish to 'punish' those making more with unequal treatment so that they may pay for things you want, either personally or for government... you don't generally 'punish' those you think are 'good'

And, idiot, it is also why I used the single quotations and not the double quotations.. I did not attribute you SAYING DIRECTLY the words evil rich.... I insinuate it is what you portray them to be

 

[RDD_1210]

Never said. that.. there are plenty on the REP side who want a progressive system chock full of exemptions, differing tax levels for differing types of income, deductions, loopholes, etc... because the more complex you have it, the more you are able to manipulate the system...

A flat tax would probably have many 'rich' that would pay more, because of the elimination of loopholes and because of including capital gains in with all other income... but you will not even accept that because you fully support every growing numbers paying zero in income tax, in this class warfare game

And before you say it, yes we know Bush II also increased the # of people not paying income tax... and nobody is defending Bush's policies on this

Oh so it's not just liberals then? Weird that's who you pointed out. Wonder why that is. Everything you stand for is laughable.

Yep... there are ones on both side who want to cheat the system... it is why conservatives and many on the libertarian right have become disappointed in the GOP

But you liberals certainly want it, albeit for a different approach and reason, for your class warfare games... so that others may pay for you, or at least more than you, for the things you want... and as you vilify the 'evil rich' who abuse the overly complex system, you praise those who are not rich who abuse the system.... I, on the other hand, am against both

And funny how you say that what I stand for is laughable... when I stand for equality in treatment, blind to situation, person, position, or whatever else... shows a lot about you

You don't stand for equality, you stand for your version of equality, big difference.

 

[RDD_1210]

Who knows if he will or won't.. if I were his campaign manager, I would advise it... it would destroy Obamalama...

It is not about how little he paid in taxes (13% or whatever)... it is simply about your side's insistence on class warfare... Oooooo the 'evil rich', boogey boogey boogey

No one said rich are evil. Why is it impossible for you to debate the actual things that are being said. Oh I know, because your corporate masters at Fox News tell you what to say. Sheep.

You wish to 'punish' those making more with unequal treatment so that they may pay for things you want, either personally or for government... you don't generally 'punish' those you think are 'good'

And, idiot, it is also why I used the single quotations and not the double quotations.. I did not attribute you SAYING DIRECTLY the words evil rich.... I insinuate it is what you portray them to be

So it's a punishment to be able to live in a society that cares about one another and come together to form a more perfect union? Your views are very telling.

 

[emptystep]

The fact that Romney plays the loopholes on his taxes is one thing but the fact that he gamed the system so damn hard that the IRS wrote him a check for $1,609,441 is ethically questionable. Best part is that is income Romney doesn't have to pay taxes on.

Bless your heart, you've never paid your own taxes have you and don't understand how it works. If you "pay" ( that means send the government money ) more to the government than you "owe" ( that means the actual amount of money you are assessed on your income ), then you are due a refund of the difference. You can elect for the government to apply it to your next years tax or you can have then return the money to you.
***********************************************************
Tax Payments
The voluntary quarterly tax payments one makes can shed light on the detail and accuracy of the CPA. In April 2011, Mr. Romney filed forms that would extend his filing deadline to October 15th. The extension, however, does not extend the deadline to pay taxes that are due. To cover his 2011 tax bill, Mr. Romney included a payment to the United States Treasury of $3,250,000 with his filing extension for April 15th. His actual tax liability turned out to be significantly less than the liability his advisors projected, resulting in a refund of $1,609,441. With his final return showing income of $21,646,507, this means that his advisors thought it possible that Mr. Romney could have upwards of $31,000,000 of total income. It is common to build a cushion into tax payments until final tax documents (ie. K-1s) are supplied because the exact liability cannot be calculated. This cushion, however, is typically closer to 10% of projected liability, not 50%. While it is possible Mr. Romney’s advisors overpaid his extension with the intention of applying it to taxes due for first quarter 2012, the overpayment was almost double the necessary amount based on the “110% of prior year” test. By overpaying such a large amount Mr. Romney was without the use of those funds from the payment date in April, to the refund date close to the end of the year. Even in a low interest rate environment, losing the use of such a large dollar amount for potentially over a year cost Mr. Romney a significant sum.
How We Are Different

He gave the $3.25M on April 15th. At that time he owned $3.009,766 and had paid $1,369,095, so at that time he had underpaid $1,640,671. He gave a check for $3.25M in April and got a check back for $1,609,441 back a few months later. So by your own logic Romney underpaid by more than he overpaid and therefore is the better gamer. grats

 

[DiamondDave]

No one said rich are evil. Why is it impossible for you to debate the actual things that are being said. Oh I know, because your corporate masters at Fox News tell you what to say. Sheep.

You wish to 'punish' those making more with unequal treatment so that they may pay for things you want, either personally or for government... you don't generally 'punish' those you think are 'good'

And, idiot, it is also why I used the single quotations and not the double quotations.. I did not attribute you SAYING DIRECTLY the words evil rich.... I insinuate it is what you portray them to be

So it's a punishment to be able to live in a society that cares about one another and come together to form a more perfect union? Your views are very telling.

It is a punishment to be forced to pay someone else's share... since you like to focus on 'fair share'

It is not a punishment when you voluntarily donate to a cause

You mantra of forcing others to pay for you or those you wish to pander to is very telling

 

[DiamondDave]

Oh so it's not just liberals then? Weird that's who you pointed out. Wonder why that is. Everything you stand for is laughable.

Yep... there are ones on both side who want to cheat the system... it is why conservatives and many on the libertarian right have become disappointed in the GOP

But you liberals certainly want it, albeit for a different approach and reason, for your class warfare games... so that others may pay for you, or at least more than you, for the things you want... and as you vilify the 'evil rich' who abuse the overly complex system, you praise those who are not rich who abuse the system.... I, on the other hand, am against both

And funny how you say that what I stand for is laughable... when I stand for equality in treatment, blind to situation, person, position, or whatever else... shows a lot about you

You don't stand for equality, you stand for your version of equality, big difference.

Your idea of equality in treatment is making others pay more of a % share.... that is not equality in treatment, however...

I stand for complete and blind equality in treatment... not one like you who screams for equality in treatment when it benefits you, and inequality in treatment of others when it benefits you

 

[Liberal]

But yet you champion a system and approach that has close to 47% NOT paying a share in federal income taxes...

Do remind me as to what system that is...

 

[Full-Auto]

This whole "Romney needs to release more tax returns" is just smoke and mirrors and being done to distract from talking about Obama's lack of a record and no vision for the future or how to get us out of the mess he exacerbated.

Perhaps you are looking at the issue the wrong way?

< ref= Assuming that he did not pay taxes>

Given the situation that is happening in this country, it is obvious that simply cutting spending is not going to solve our problems.. Even republicans are realizing this (proven by the fact that many are dropping the Norquist pledge).

How can a man who potentially went out of his way to not pay taxes be taken seriously when it comes to fixing the deficit? />

No matter what way you shake it, him not releasing them either gives the illusion or proves that he has something to hide.

That is a two way street. Hiding your immigration status on college apps is the same thing.

Whats he hiding? Can any of you think past your nose?