Supreme court rules signatures initiative signatures are not protected

What expectation of privacy does someone really have when they put their name on a petition?

A real name would be needed to validate the petition. Wouldn't the petition have to be verifiable?
Otherwise it'd be a petition signed by the 7 dwarfs, Mickey, Minnie, and Donald.
 
But do we really want to know?

Yes.

And if we did, what would we do about it? Publish their names in the newspaper.

Quite simple really. Since many ballots are electronic it could simple be immediately posted online as it happens.

If we don't like the way others vote, then we need to educate and persuade them to vote differently.

People may fear backlash which is exactly what they need to have. I'm not going to persuade anyone to vote differently. I don't vote and I don't persuade anyone else to either.
 
What expectation of privacy does someone really have when they put their name on a petition?

A real name would be needed to validate the petition. Wouldn't the petition have to be verifiable?
Otherwise it'd be a petition signed by the 7 dwarfs, Mickey, Minnie, and Donald.
None.
 
What expectation of privacy does someone really have when they put their name on a petition?

A real name would be needed to validate the petition. Wouldn't the petition have to be verifiable?
Otherwise it'd be a petition signed by the 7 dwarfs, Mickey, Minnie, and Donald.

its clear by the courtcase that many who put their name on a petition believe the expectation of privacy is that their names will not be published on an internet site etc....

like i said, the official in charge can verify without publishing the names
 
If 10,000 sign a paper putting a measure on the ballot for a 4 million dollar public park you could be damn sure I want to know who signed it and who voted for it. It has nothing to do with privacy. When they are forcefully taking money from people who would not voluntarily give their privacy needs to be thrown out the window.
Well, you may be able to see the petition, but you won't see the ballot for good reason. The secret ballot is the only way to insure the voter will not be intimidated and will vote according to their beliefs.

the signature on the petition is part of the same electoral process....the signature merely gets the petition on the ballot....why shouldn't signatures also enjoy the same level of privacy?

can't answer this flopper?
 
Well, you may be able to see the petition, but you won't see the ballot for good reason. The secret ballot is the only way to insure the voter will not be intimidated and will vote according to their beliefs.

the signature on the petition is part of the same electoral process....the signature merely gets the petition on the ballot....why shouldn't signatures also enjoy the same level of privacy?

can't answer this flopper?
Petitioning for a resolution to be placed on as ballot isn't the same as voting for it.
Just because I believe that the people should be able to vote and decide on an issue doesn't mean that I support the issue in question.
 
the signature on the petition is part of the same electoral process....the signature merely gets the petition on the ballot....why shouldn't signatures also enjoy the same level of privacy?

can't answer this flopper?
Petitioning for a resolution to be placed on as ballot isn't the same as voting for it.
Just because I believe that the people should be able to vote and decide on an issue doesn't mean that I support the issue in question.

other than stating the obvious, that the signature is not identical to a vote...you failed to answer the question

why is it the 4% of registered voters who signed the petition needs to be public, given, that during the referendum process, those in favor or opposed to the petition, come out in the public square and try and convince the voters to vote on the petition?

there is no need for the names to be published. scotus got it wrong.
 
the signature on the petition is part of the same electoral process....the signature merely gets the petition on the ballot....why shouldn't signatures also enjoy the same level of privacy?

can't answer this flopper?
Petitioning for a resolution to be placed on as ballot isn't the same as voting for it.
Just because I believe that the people should be able to vote and decide on an issue doesn't mean that I support the issue in question.

oh, come On. If you sign a petition, you support the motion.
 
But do we really want to know?

Yes.

And if we did, what would we do about it? Publish their names in the newspaper.

Quite simple really. Since many ballots are electronic it could simple be immediately posted online as it happens.

If we don't like the way others vote, then we need to educate and persuade them to vote differently.

People may fear backlash which is exactly what they need to have. I'm not going to persuade anyone to vote differently. I don't vote and I don't persuade anyone else to either.
The foundation of fair elections is based on the secret ballot. With the secret ballot voters can vote their conscience without fear of intimidation and reprisal.
 
But do we really want to know?

Yes.



Quite simple really. Since many ballots are electronic it could simple be immediately posted online as it happens.

If we don't like the way others vote, then we need to educate and persuade them to vote differently.

People may fear backlash which is exactly what they need to have. I'm not going to persuade anyone to vote differently. I don't vote and I don't persuade anyone else to either.
The foundation of fair elections is based on the secret ballot. With the secret ballot voters can vote their conscience without fear of intimidation and reprisal.
And yet that same principal does not apply to the people that signed a petition? It is the same concept.
 
can't answer this flopper?
Petitioning for a resolution to be placed on as ballot isn't the same as voting for it.
Just because I believe that the people should be able to vote and decide on an issue doesn't mean that I support the issue in question.

oh, come On. If you sign a petition, you support the motion.

Not necessarily.
Here in Florida, a few years ago, we passed a measure that puts any constitutional amendment on the ballot.
Running a restaurant, I'm approached by all sorts of groups trying to get their measure on the ballot.
I'm a firm believer in letting the people decide.
I've signed several petitions, just to get them on the ballot, only to vote against them in November.
 
Yes.



Quite simple really. Since many ballots are electronic it could simple be immediately posted online as it happens.



People may fear backlash which is exactly what they need to have. I'm not going to persuade anyone to vote differently. I don't vote and I don't persuade anyone else to either.
The foundation of fair elections is based on the secret ballot. With the secret ballot voters can vote their conscience without fear of intimidation and reprisal.
And yet that same principal does not apply to the people that signed a petition? It is the same concept.
The petition signers are only asking that the question be put on the ballot. Signing a petition does not say how you will vote, only that you want the issue voted on. You could be either for or against.

From a practical standpoint, petitions are not private. I signed one last week. It had hundreds of signatures. Anyone looking at the petition can see who the signers are. With or without a court ruling petitions aren't private.
 
Supreme Court: Names on ballot petitions can be disclosed - latimes.com

I am taken aback by this ruling. I dont see why peoples names should be public as, to me at least, it is the same as casting a vote. The ruling somewhat angered me but I have to be missing something. 8-1 is a pretty strong ruling and makes me think twice. What am I missing?

Any petition that is circulated for signatures, is by it's very nature a public document. I have as much right to know who signed a petition against clean water as you do regarding banning handguns.
 
The fact that you can glance at a page of signatures has nothing to do with the impact of this ruling. I still cannot see how making those names public has ANY positive impact where there is a very good impact in voter AND signer privacy: you are not influenced by fear that your name will be released. No one has addressed that.
 
Supreme Court: Names on ballot petitions can be disclosed - latimes.com

I am taken aback by this ruling. I dont see why peoples names should be public as, to me at least, it is the same as casting a vote. The ruling somewhat angered me but I have to be missing something. 8-1 is a pretty strong ruling and makes me think twice. What am I missing?

Any petition that is circulated for signatures, is by it's very nature a public document. I have as much right to know who signed a petition against clean water as you do regarding banning handguns.

And I could make that EXACT statement about voting. I have a right to know who voted to limit my second amendment rights! That however is bullshit and I have no such right. Where do you see the right to view my VOTE to have an issue brought to a public vote.
 
Supreme Court: Names on ballot petitions can be disclosed - latimes.com

I am taken aback by this ruling. I dont see why peoples names should be public as, to me at least, it is the same as casting a vote. The ruling somewhat angered me but I have to be missing something. 8-1 is a pretty strong ruling and makes me think twice. What am I missing?

Any petition that is circulated for signatures, is by it's very nature a public document. I have as much right to know who signed a petition against clean water as you do regarding banning handguns.

And I could make that EXACT statement about voting. I have a right to know who voted to limit my second amendment rights! That however is bullshit and I have no such right. Where do you see the right to view my VOTE to have an issue brought to a public vote.

What type of "rights" does one have where they can hide behind "privacy" and forcefully take from their neighbor and make laws to exploit them?

It's absurd. A "right" to private voting is like a "right" to free health care.
 

New Topics

Forum List

Back
Top