Students in college for more than 6 years to potentially lose Pell grant

[Truthmatters]

there was a time in our history that school was about learning.

when in college I took courses just because I wanted to know about the subject.

I wasnt jsut getting a piece of paper to wave at an employeer.

I WANTED TO LEARN,

The attitude here in this thread aobut what education is is cold hard proof of what is wrong with education in this country.

who cares about learning its all about appearances and the piece of paper to wave at prospective employees.

 

[RadiomanATL]

there was a time in our history that school was about learning.

when in college I took courses just because I wanted to know about the subject.

I wasnt jsut getting a piece of paper to wave at an employeer.

I WANTED TO LEARN,

The attitude here in this thread aobut what education is is cold hard proof of what is wrong with education in this country.

who cares about learning its all about appearances and the piece of paper to wave at prospective employees.

Except no one here has said that this is all an education is about.

More lies from you.

 

[Unkotare]

Don't even get me started on athletic scholarships.

Why not?

Because many athletes (not all) do not meet the minimum standards for entrance. .

Oh, "not all"? How generous of you to concede so much! How many then? You sound bitter and clusmy.

 

[Unkotare]

There are many bright talented students who get no money, because in this country, throwing a ball is valued much more than playing an instrument or some other skill.

In college, as in the rest of life, certain skills are more valuable (not more valued - more valuable) than others. If coming to terms with that is an early part of the higher education experience then so be it - kids should learn it well. If a school brings in a great deal of money (and attracts top applicants in all fields, in addition to other benefits) through its football program then it only makes sense to recruit the best football players it feels appropriate for the school. If that makes a very good football player more attractive to the school than a very good harmonica player - then so be it. Welcome to life, kids. A very good violin player is also more valuable to the school than that very good harmonica player, and that very good football player is more valuable than a very good fencer, and a female student who excells in the sciences is more valuable than a male student who is really good at history. Real world 101.

 

[Unkotare]

there was a time in our history that school was about learning.

when in college I took courses just because I wanted to know about the subject.

I wasnt jsut getting a piece of paper to wave at an employeer.

I WANTED TO LEARN,

The attitude here in this thread aobut what education is is cold hard proof of what is wrong with education in this country.

who cares about learning its all about appearances and the piece of paper to wave at prospective employees.

If only everyone were like you, the world would be such a better place! Right?

 

[BillyV]

there was a time in our history that school was about learning.

when in college I took courses just because I wanted to know about the subject.

I wasnt jsut getting a piece of paper to wave at an employeer.

I WANTED TO LEARN,

The attitude here in this thread aobut what education is is cold hard proof of what is wrong with education in this country.

who cares about learning its all about appearances and the piece of paper to wave at prospective employees.

My favorite scene from the movie "Good Will Hunting":
Chuckie: All right, are we gonna have a problem?
Clark: There's no problem. I was just hoping you could give me some insight into the evolution of the market economy in the southern colonies. My contention is that prior to the Revolutionary War the economic modalities, especially of the southern colonies could most aptly be characterized as agrarian pre-capitalist and...
Will: [interrupting] Of course that's your contention. You're a first year grad student. You just got finished some Marxian historian, Pete Garrison prob’ly, you’re gonna be convinced of that until next month when you get to James Lemon, then you’re gonna be talkin’ about how the economies of Virginia and Pennsylvania were entrepreneurial and capitalist way back in 1740. That's gonna last until next year, you’re gonna be in here regurgitating Gordon Wood, talkin’ about you know, the Pre-revolutionary utopia and the capital-forming effects of military mobilization.
Clark: [taken aback] Well, as a matter of fact, I won't, because Wood drastically underestimates the impact of--
Will: ..."Wood drastically underestimates the impact of social distinctions predicated upon wealth, especially inherited wealth..." You got that from Vickers. "Work in Essex County," Page 98, right? Yeah I read that too. Were you gonna plagiarize the whole thing for us- you have any thoughts of- of your own on this matter? Or do- is that your thing, you come into a bar, you read some obscure passage and then you pretend- you pawn it off as your own- your own idea just to impress some girls? Embarrass my friend?
[Clark is stunned]
Will: See the sad thing about a guy like you, is in about 50 years you’re gonna start doin' some thinkin' on your own and you’re gonna come up with the fact that there are two certainties in life. One, don't do that. And two, you dropped a hundred and fifty grand on a f**kin’ education you coulda' got for a dollar fifty in late charges at the Public Library.
Clark: Yeah, but I will have a degree, and you'll be serving my kids fries at a drive-thru on our way to a skiing trip.
Will: [smiles] Yeah, maybe. But at least I won't be unoriginal.

Good Will Hunting - Wikiquote

The point being, if you just want to learn something, the library is free, and you can learn whatever you want. If you're spending thousands of dollars of taxpayer money, you have a higher purpose to learn something that will make you employable. A degree is evidence of that, nothing more; all of these programs could be learned without college. We should not be supporting "feel good" degree programs with public money. If you want to pay your own way through college, feel free to pursue whatever education suits you.

 

[uscitizen]

Ahh the reality of the media...

 

[Truthmatters]

You dont get everything from a book.

You cant ask a book questions.


A real professor is part of the education.

the people who wrote the books were people.

There is nothing wrong with the full range of knowledge a proff has to impart to you.

If you dont think for yourself while being educated why the hell would you not think for yourself while reading.

Lecture does NOT prevent you from thinking.

 

[chanel]

Why not?

Because many athletes (not all) do not meet the minimum standards for entrance. .

Oh, "not all"? How generous of you to concede so much! How many then? You sound bitter and clusmy.

Bitter and clumsy to clarify a generalization? Would you like percentages? If so, you'll have to search yourself. It might be hard to find though because colleges tend not to disclose such embarrassing (and wasteful) information.

Common knowledge. I apologize for stating the obvious, if that was your point.

 

[Sunshine]

College students taking longer than six years to obtain their undergraduate degree would have their Pell grants cut off next school year under a $1 trillion budget bill passed Friday in the House.

Millions of students each year receive Pell grants, which are offered to low-income students and don’t have to be paid back.

The bill keeps the maximum grant award at $5,550, but seeks to save $11 billion over the next decade in Pell dollars, in part, by reducing the maximum number of years the grant can be received from nine to six.

It’s estimated that about 100,000 students would be affected by the change

Students in college for more than 6 years to potentially lose Pell grant - The Washington Post

Nine years to finish college?

This day and age it is hard to finish up a degree of any substance in 4 years. When my daughter went, of course I paid and no one else, I told her 'you have 5 years to get in and get out. After that, you pay your own way.' She got finished in 4 1/2. But she needed every day of it. My Nursing degree also took longer than the 4 years and my advisor told me it would. Some, though, take far longer than that to complete a Nursing degree because they get EVERY course they have to take finished before they take the actuall Nursing courses. I understand why. And that is because if all you are taking are the actual nursing courses, you are in school or clinical almost 8 hours a day 5 days a week. But that isn't really finishing everything else first isn't a requirement, nor is it really needed if you arrange your schedule and classes well. No one should get free taxpayer money to hang out on a school campus for a decade.

 

[Truthmatters]

How will we get more Drs?

 

[Unkotare]

Because many athletes (not all) do not meet the minimum standards for entrance. .

Oh, "not all"? How generous of you to concede so much! How many then? You sound bitter and clusmy.

Bitter and clumsy to clarify a generalization? Would you like percentages? If so, you'll have to search yourself..

Yeah, that's what I thought. Tell me, does it hurt when you talk out your ass like that? Do you get a rash or something?

 

[geauxtohell]

College students taking longer than six years to obtain their undergraduate degree would have their Pell grants cut off next school year under a $1 trillion budget bill passed Friday in the House.

Millions of students each year receive Pell grants, which are offered to low-income students and don’t have to be paid back.

The bill keeps the maximum grant award at $5,550, but seeks to save $11 billion over the next decade in Pell dollars, in part, by reducing the maximum number of years the grant can be received from nine to six.

It’s estimated that about 100,000 students would be affected by the change

Students in college for more than 6 years to potentially lose Pell grant - The Washington Post

Nine years to finish college?

At face value, I don't oppose this. Does graduate work count as well? I know Pell Grants aren't available for Medical School as it stands, but I don't know about other graduate work.

At any rate, if you can't finish a degree in six years, then it's time to let some other student get a crack at it.

 

[BillyV]

You dont get everything from a book.

You cant ask a book questions.

A real professor is part of the education.

the people who wrote the books were people.

There is nothing wrong with the full range of knowledge a proff has to impart to you.

If you dont think for yourself while being educated why the hell would you not think for yourself while reading.

Lecture does NOT prevent you from thinking.

All true, as long as you are footing the bill. I am not anti-education, and while much (if not most) of what you need to know you can glean from a book, a professor can make it easier to understand if they are good at teaching it (although if the professor is SO important, why do they need new editions of textbooks every year?). If the public is footing the bill through a Pell grant, you need to be able to become a productive citizen able to support yourself at graduation as a result of the experience more so than when you enrolled; otherwise you have wasted public funds. And yes, that must be measured by your employability and the value of employment as related to the degree received. If you borrow the money from the government, you have to be able to repay that loan from the money you will earn from that education. Too many complain that they can't get real jobs to pay their $100,000 debt from the six years they spent pursuing "Women's Studies" or "Art History" and want the debt forgiven. Sorry, not our fault; you should have checked the job market for art gallery curators before embarking on your multiyear vacation at school.

 

[geauxtohell]

How will we get more Drs?

Most people who take nine years to finish college probably aren't on the graduate school track.

I obtained my degree in four years and then went pack and paid out of pocket to do the pre-med stuff for two years. As I wasn't a full time student, I wasn't eligible for scholarships.

There are no grants in Medical School, just loans. the closest thing would be the HPSP program where Medical Students enter active duty after completing medical school, but typically only a few students do that every year.

 

[Sunshine]

How will we get more Drs?

Most people who take nine years to finish college probably aren't on the graduate school track.

I obtained my degree in four years and then went pack and paid out of pocket to do the pre-med stuff for two years. As I wasn't a full time student, I wasn't eligible for scholarships.

There are no grants in Medical School, just loans. the closest thing would be the HPSP program where Medical Students enter active duty after completing medical school, but typically only a few students do that every year.

My nephew went to both college and med school on a full academic scholarship.

 

[blu]

a 6 year cap is reasonable. many 4 year programs are actually 5. the mechanical engineering students I took physics and calculus with were all put on 5 year plans by their advisors in order to keep them sane. I saw their requirements and would never envy what they have to go through.

 

[chanel]

My son is in a 5 year 3 co-op engineering program. He had 19.5 credits this semester. Thankfully, he has maintained his sanity - so far.

Six years seems fair enough.

 

[Unkotare]

My favorite scene from the movie "Good Will Hunting":.

Yow, what a horrible, pretentious movie.