Stone to rehablitate Hilter Stalin and Mao.

[Sodafin]

Do you have a link to your blog?

I don't have a blog - I am a journalist.

I worked for several years specialising in Fascist Theory and in Post-Soviet Republics, work which took me to every country in Eastern Europe and often involved months working in cities like Cracow, Minsk and Kyev researching political history.

Hence, I do actually know what I am talking about here - I'm not just farting in the wind.

 

[MaggieMae]

There is no de facto right wing party in Germany. Neo Nazis not being rightwingers in the sense of small government types. The right prefers smaller governments. Neo Nazis prefer larger governments the only real difference between them and anyother big government social engineers is in what they want big government to engineer.


Soda I have over 179 hours concentrated in history and education and a life time of reading history ever read Mein Kampf? Obviously not or you'd know better.

Goldberg cites dozens of newspaper editorials by well know leftist and other works by the same pre Spanish Civil War in Praise of both Hitler and Moussolini. The items are fully foot noted. Political science isn't history and the way it is currently taught in most major univeristies it is not infrequently bilge.

The conclusive history of the rise and fall of the Nazi party and Soviet Communism contains many elements of politics. To use only one of those elements to re-politicize the subject to sell a book with an obvious current-day agenda is highly suspect. While I'm sure it contains accuracy, what was Goldberg's intent? To make people uninterested in seriously researching history believe that liberal Democrats, even today, are sympathetic to Communism.

 

[Baruch Menachem]

You seem to have spent your career in the woods unable to see the forest because of all the trees that were in the way.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

You can label anything right wing, the policies reflect liberal progressivism that we see here now.

 

[MaggieMae]

Then making hitler out to be a rightwinger is purely ludicorus. He was all in favor of central planning of everything and in fact German capitalists - the Krupps the Rheinmetals et al retained there holdings exactly to the extent they were subservient to HItlers demands. Even to the extent that certain weapons which could have changed the outcome of the war. Were killed because the Hitler government killed them not because the soldiers or the weapons makers wanted it to be so. hence the insistence by hitler that the ME 262 should be made into a dive bomber delayed it's entrance into the war by almost a year.

Hitler's insistance that Barbarossa be made without upgunning the PZKF III to the long barreled 5cm gun and perhaps most importantly the failure to begin production of the the Sturmgewere 43 the worlds first assault rifle - in sufficient numbers to equip the entire German army until to late to matter.

Ever Read Albert Speer?

The Nazi 25 Point Program of 1920 called for the nationalization of all corporations, profit sharing by large industries, a communalization of department stores and, where necessary, the seizure of land without compensation for the good of the community. But much of that proved unnecessary because of the extreme nationalism that Hitler conveyed, and whatever he wanted was just willingly handed over. Of course he also solved Germany's unemployment situation following the depression by recruiting them into the German Army, and put others to work in factories building weapons.

 

[MaggieMae]

Hitler was in Control in 1933... and Moussolini before that. Stalin had people hauled off from literally day one even having their pictures erased form old photos. So was Stalin a right winger? Again Policy wise the only difference Between Hitler and Stalin was copuntry of Origin.

My point was that too many people think that Hitler was a "Socialist," which is bullshit. I'm also making the point that Jonah Goldberg attempts to fool readers into thinking the left-wing of TODAY are Stalinites. Just as YOU are not a Nazi, I'M not a Communist. Enough already. You cannot compare those two regimes to today's realm of social and political ideologies as being identical.

 

[garyd]

Maggie neither Goldberg or myself believe that every democrat is a socialist. In fact they can't be. Registered Democrats are almost forty percent of voters but only 21% claim to be liberal or left. Hitler was a statist, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Lenin were all statists. Statist is a left wing not a right wing position.

Whether Soda likes it or ot the poilitical line runs from anarchy on the extreme right to totalitarianism on the extreme left. You can't be a totalitarian and not be on the political left. Doing it Soda's way puts Anarchy in the middle and totaltarianism at both ends which is logically absurd.

 

[Sunni Man]

Do you have a link to your blog?

I don't have a blog - I am a journalist.

I worked for several years specialising in Fascist Theory and in Post-Soviet Republics, work which took me to every country in Eastern Europe and often involved months working in cities like Cracow, Minsk and Kyev researching political history.

I believe you once stated that you are a jew.

That means you have an agenda to champion.

So and anything you write will be far from objective.

 

[Xenophon]

What context excatly do mass murderers need?

That they made the trains run on time?

That was Mussolini.

 

[Sunni Man]

Whether Soda likes it or ot the poilitical line runs from anarchy on the extreme right to totalitarianism on the extreme left. You can't be a totalitarian and not be on the political left. Doing it Soda's way puts Anarchy in the middle and totaltarianism at both ends which is logically absurd.

Anarchy is on the extreme left not the right.

 

[Xenophon]

Hence, if he is seeking to making a film about a right wing dictator

How is the National Socialist Party (Nazi) party suddenly Right Wing?

Why suddenly?

Nazism is now, and always has been, considered a right wing party.

Check any academic source (i.e. Marris, Kershaw) on this - it isn't a disputed point that I'm aware of.

Garyd-

If you don't know - just ask. What you have posted has no basis at all in reality.

It is simply incorrect.

Germany's right wing of the 20s and 30s were monarchists who dreamed of a return of the Hollenzollerns.
Many of them, including industrialists such as Krupp (Alfried, the son, was a gold party member) saw Hitler as a means to restore German greatness, but fully intended to control him, as they did not understand him.

The Nazi movement is a twisted version of socialism, and Hitler never changed the party's officals goals which remained Socialist until the end in 1945.

If there is a need to put Hitler in context, the people who need it are the sunniumans of this world, that idiot refuses to believe teh Nazis murdered over 6 million Jews and other 'undesirables' as well as managing to kill Millions of ethinic German and maybe as many as 20 million Russians.

 

[garyd]

No sunni it isn't. the right is not totlaitarian it is for smaller government. The smaller the government the closer you get to anarchy and the further you get from totalitarianism. Most of the people on the right in this country want smaller less intrusive government at least at the federal level ergot the further right you go the further you move toward anarchy.

The primary reason Marxism always stops at the so-called dictatorship of the proletariat is that you can't get from the totalitarian state necessary to make even a reasonable approximation of from each according to his means to each according to his needs to an anarchy. Life just doesn't work that way.

There have been only two men in the history of the world that have looked the God power dead in the eye and told him to go to hell. One was George Washington and the other was Nelson Mandela.

 

[Sunni Man]

No sunni it isn't. the right is not totlaitarian it is for smaller government. The smaller the government the closer you get to anarchy and the further you get from totalitarianism. Most of the people on the right in this country want smaller less intrusive government at least at the federal level ergot the further right you go the further you move toward anarchy.

The primary reason Marxism always stops at the so-called dictatorship of the proletariat is that you can't get from the totalitarian state necessary to make even a reasonable approximation of from each according to his means to each according to his needs to an anarchy. Life just doesn't work that way.

There have been only two men in the history of the world that have looked the God power dead in the eye and told him to go to hell. One was George Washington and the other was Nelson Mandela.

People on the right still want a government. Just a smaller government.

Anarchy wants NO government. Thus they are the left.

 

[Liability]

The New York Times will ultimately give a work of this nature made by Mr. Stone a glowing review. The Slimes will pontificate that we are somehow obliged to look at it from the perspective of the "other guy."

I can just see their prose, now: ~~~~~~

"Mr. Stone brings his considerable intellect and talent to bear on this difficult, and oft-times disturbing, topic. In his portrayal of the exigencies which confronted Mr. Hitler, exigencies which few of us ever consider otherwise, we see the late dictatorial ruler of Nazi Germany in a more sympathetic light. Granted, few people today approve of the way the Nazi regime treated the Jewish people or the other victims of its repressive tactics. However, the revulsion, which most people automatically feel whenever the name of Adolf Hitler is invoked, is made to give way in this Stone tour de force to a more reflective contemplation of the man and his Reich."​

I can hardly WAIT to see how The Slimes addresses the "plights" facing "Mr." Mao (or perhaps it's "Mr." Tse-tung?) and "Mr." Stalin. They and their politics, after all, are more familiar to the likes of the Editorial Board of The New York Slimes.

 

[Big Fitz]

How is the National Socialist Party (Nazi) party suddenly Right Wing?

Why suddenly?

Nazism is now, and always has been, considered a right wing party.

Check any academic source (i.e. Marris, Kershaw) on this - it isn't a disputed point that I'm aware of.

.

National socialism is with out question left wing politics, you have been badly mis-educated .

Oh oh... he's gonna neg rep you now because you dissed his "credentials".

 

[Coyote]

I love it when people try to claim the Nazi's were a leftwing party or a rightwing party. They had elements of both and neither. I think the mistake is in assuming that politics falls into a simplistic 2-dimensional left-right axis.

 

[Coyote]

I love it when people try to claim the Nazi's were a leftwing party or a rightwing party. They had elements of both and neither. I think the mistake is in assuming that politics falls into a simplistic 2-dimensional left-right axis.

 

[Liability]

His goal will be blur the distinction between America today and Nazi Germany .

There's nothing to blur in the minds of many many modern American liberals.

From their jaundiced perspective, this is already the Nazi States of the American Reich!

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so.' - Ronald Reagan

Like He could see Soda fizzing before he popped.

 

[garyd]

Sunni is no government closer to small government or big government you sir are an addle pate who makes no sense but we already knew that.