Spanish ultimatum - European hypocrisy at its best

rylah

Gold Member
Jun 10, 2015
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Spanish Foreign Minister: Recognition of a Palestinian state is on the table
Spain will allocate a timetable to the EU to reach a consensus on recognition of a Palestinian state and then take a decision.

Spanish Foreign Minister Gozsef Borel confirmed on Tuesday that recognition of a Palestinian state is "on the table" of the government. The minister announced his intention to launch an "intensive process" of consultations with his European counterparts, while setting a timetable for reaching a common position.

If at the end of the timetable there is no consensus formula, he added, each EU member will have to adopt an independent decision. Although the minister did not determine what the Sephardi position would be in such a case, he hinted at a tendency to recognize a Palestinian state when he mentioned that Sweden had already taken this step in 2014. Other EU members also recognize a Palestinian state (Poland, the Czech Republic, Hungary, Romania, Malta and Cyprus), although most did so before entering the EU.
Borrell: “El reconocimiento del Estado palestino está sobre la mesa”

Now if we compared Spain's position on it's own contested territories we stumble upon something quiet revealing - it repeats Israels' arguments to the letter when dealing with the same dangers to it's security and self determination. But with a BIG difference - Spain also lays claims to own lands of a different continent.


What's With Those Spanish Enclaves in North Africa?
Why does Spain have cities in Africa?
It's had them for hundreds of years and won't give them up. The two enclaves—Ceuta and Melilla—have been under Spanish control for more than 400 years. Located on the African side of the Strait of Gibraltar, the cities offered protection for Spanish ships and provided posts for trading between Europe and Africa. In the 1930s, Franco launched his civil war campaign from the Spanish North African cities. When Morocco gained independence in 1956, Spain refused to give them up.

The Moroccans have long contested the ownership of Ceuta and Melilla (and a number of nearby Spanish islands). To make matters more complicated, Spain has argued that it should also own the British colony at Gibraltar—which is just across the strait from Ceuta. This apparent double standard has led to some criticism of the Spanish position: Spain responds by saying that Ceuta and Melilla aren't "colonies" since Spaniards have been living there since before Morocco even existed. (emphasis mine)



Muslims Demand Right to Return to Spain
Following the recent approval of a law that would grant Spanish citizenship to descendants of Sephardic Jews expelled from Spain in 1492, a number of Muslim groups are now demanding similar grace for potentially millions of descendants of Muslims who were expelled from Spain during the Middle Ages.

In the interest of equality, the Muslim supporters say that they are entitled to the same rights and privileges as Jews because both groups were expelled from Spain under similar historical circumstances.


However, historians state that the Jews were in Spain before the Christians, and so their expulsion was on the grounds of bigotry, whereas the Muslims in Spain were colonial occupiers who called the territory Al-Andalus and imposed Arabic as the official language, and so their expulsion was a matter of decolonization.
(emphasis mine)

Spain-IslamicReturn.jpg


I think Israel has an opportunity to make this self defeating tactic run its' course and make counter resolutions to the UN demanding:


1. "Right of Return" for all expelled Muslims, as well as separate resolutions for;
2. "Decolonization and Removal of all Spaniards from Arab lands".
3. "Ultimatum on recognition of Catalonian and Morrocan independence".


Just to see how this hamster runs against itself...

hamster-wheel-treadmill-01.jpg
 
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It is interesting to note that all of the new recognition of Palestine is on the '67 borders. They are trying to give CPR to the long dead two state solution.

Why would they want to do that? Two state solution is not coming back.
 
It is interesting to note that all of the new recognition of Palestine is on the '67 borders. They are trying to give CPR to the long dead two state solution.

Why would they want to do that? Two state solution is not coming back.

Probably because they really want a 2-state solution with Catalonia...
and another 2-3 Arab states for fairness sake.
It's not because they're hypocrites of course... :laugh:

But they did use the correct terms,
they just prefer to apply a different standard when dealing with the Arab colonization of Israel.
 
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Spanish Foreign Minister: Recognition of a Palestinian state is on the table
Spain will allocate a timetable to the EU to reach a consensus on recognition of a Palestinian state and then take a decision.

Spanish Foreign Minister Gozsef Borel confirmed on Tuesday that recognition of a Palestinian state is "on the table" of the government. The minister announced his intention to launch an "intensive process" of consultations with his European counterparts, while setting a timetable for reaching a common position.

If at the end of the timetable there is no consensus formula, he added, each EU member will have to adopt an independent decision. Although the minister did not determine what the Sephardi position would be in such a case, he hinted at a tendency to recognize a Palestinian state when he mentioned that Sweden had already taken this step in 2014. Other EU members also recognize a Palestinian state (Poland, the Czech Republic, Hungary, Romania, Malta and Cyprus), although most did so before entering the EU.
Borrell: “El reconocimiento del Estado palestino está sobre la mesa”

Now if we compared Spain's position on it's own contested territories we stumble upon something quiet revealing - it repeats Israels' arguments to the letter when dealing with the same dangers to it's security and self determination. But with a BIG difference - Spain also lays claims to own lands of a different continent.


What's With Those Spanish Enclaves in North Africa?
Why does Spain have cities in Africa?
It's had them for hundreds of years and won't give them up. The two enclaves—Ceuta and Melilla—have been under Spanish control for more than 400 years. Located on the African side of the Strait of Gibraltar, the cities offered protection for Spanish ships and provided posts for trading between Europe and Africa. In the 1930s, Franco launched his civil war campaign from the Spanish North African cities. When Morocco gained independence in 1956, Spain refused to give them up.

The Moroccans have long contested the ownership of Ceuta and Melilla (and a number of nearby Spanish islands). To make matters more complicated, Spain has argued that it should also own the British colony at Gibraltar—which is just across the strait from Ceuta. This apparent double standard has led to some criticism of the Spanish position: Spain responds by saying that Ceuta and Melilla aren't "colonies" since Spaniards have been living there since before Morocco even existed. (emphasis mine)



Muslims Demand Right to Return to Spain
Following the recent approval of a law that would grant Spanish citizenship to descendants of Sephardic Jews expelled from Spain in 1492, a number of Muslim groups are now demanding similar grace for potentially millions of descendants of Muslims who were expelled from Spain during the Middle Ages.

In the interest of equality, the Muslim supporters say that they are entitled to the same rights and privileges as Jews because both groups were expelled from Spain under similar historical circumstances.


However, historians state that the Jews were in Spain before the Christians, and so their expulsion was on the grounds of bigotry, whereas the Muslims in Spain were colonial occupiers who called the territory Al-Andalus and imposed Arabic as the official language, and so their expulsion was a matter of decolonization.
(emphasis mine)

Spain-IslamicReturn.jpg


I think Israel has an opportunity to make this self defeating tactic run its' course and make counter resolutions to the UN demanding:


1. "Right of Return" for all expelled Muslims, as well as separate resolutions for;
2. "Decolonization and Removal of all Spaniards from Arab lands".
3. "Ultimatum on recognition of Catalonian and Morrocan independence".


Just to see how this hamster runs against itself...

hamster-wheel-treadmill-01.jpg
There will never be peace in the “holy” land. Don’t know what Spain’s trying to do here.
 
Spanish Foreign Minister: Recognition of a Palestinian state is on the table
Spain will allocate a timetable to the EU to reach a consensus on recognition of a Palestinian state and then take a decision.

Spanish Foreign Minister Gozsef Borel confirmed on Tuesday that recognition of a Palestinian state is "on the table" of the government. The minister announced his intention to launch an "intensive process" of consultations with his European counterparts, while setting a timetable for reaching a common position.

If at the end of the timetable there is no consensus formula, he added, each EU member will have to adopt an independent decision. Although the minister did not determine what the Sephardi position would be in such a case, he hinted at a tendency to recognize a Palestinian state when he mentioned that Sweden had already taken this step in 2014. Other EU members also recognize a Palestinian state (Poland, the Czech Republic, Hungary, Romania, Malta and Cyprus), although most did so before entering the EU.
Borrell: “El reconocimiento del Estado palestino está sobre la mesa”

Now if we compared Spain's position on it's own contested territories we stumble upon something quiet revealing - it repeats Israels' arguments to the letter when dealing with the same dangers to it's security and self determination. But with a BIG difference - Spain also lays claims to own lands of a different continent.


What's With Those Spanish Enclaves in North Africa?
Why does Spain have cities in Africa?
It's had them for hundreds of years and won't give them up. The two enclaves—Ceuta and Melilla—have been under Spanish control for more than 400 years. Located on the African side of the Strait of Gibraltar, the cities offered protection for Spanish ships and provided posts for trading between Europe and Africa. In the 1930s, Franco launched his civil war campaign from the Spanish North African cities. When Morocco gained independence in 1956, Spain refused to give them up.

The Moroccans have long contested the ownership of Ceuta and Melilla (and a number of nearby Spanish islands). To make matters more complicated, Spain has argued that it should also own the British colony at Gibraltar—which is just across the strait from Ceuta. This apparent double standard has led to some criticism of the Spanish position: Spain responds by saying that Ceuta and Melilla aren't "colonies" since Spaniards have been living there since before Morocco even existed. (emphasis mine)



Muslims Demand Right to Return to Spain
Following the recent approval of a law that would grant Spanish citizenship to descendants of Sephardic Jews expelled from Spain in 1492, a number of Muslim groups are now demanding similar grace for potentially millions of descendants of Muslims who were expelled from Spain during the Middle Ages.

In the interest of equality, the Muslim supporters say that they are entitled to the same rights and privileges as Jews because both groups were expelled from Spain under similar historical circumstances.


However, historians state that the Jews were in Spain before the Christians, and so their expulsion was on the grounds of bigotry, whereas the Muslims in Spain were colonial occupiers who called the territory Al-Andalus and imposed Arabic as the official language, and so their expulsion was a matter of decolonization.
(emphasis mine)

Spain-IslamicReturn.jpg


I think Israel has an opportunity to make this self defeating tactic run its' course and make counter resolutions to the UN demanding:


1. "Right of Return" for all expelled Muslims, as well as separate resolutions for;
2. "Decolonization and Removal of all Spaniards from Arab lands".
3. "Ultimatum on recognition of Catalonian and Morrocan independence".


Just to see how this hamster runs against itself...

hamster-wheel-treadmill-01.jpg
There will never be peace in the “holy” land. Don’t know what Spain’s trying to do here.
Because there’s peace everywhere else!
 
Spanish Foreign Minister: Recognition of a Palestinian state is on the table
Spain will allocate a timetable to the EU to reach a consensus on recognition of a Palestinian state and then take a decision.

Spanish Foreign Minister Gozsef Borel confirmed on Tuesday that recognition of a Palestinian state is "on the table" of the government. The minister announced his intention to launch an "intensive process" of consultations with his European counterparts, while setting a timetable for reaching a common position.

If at the end of the timetable there is no consensus formula, he added, each EU member will have to adopt an independent decision. Although the minister did not determine what the Sephardi position would be in such a case, he hinted at a tendency to recognize a Palestinian state when he mentioned that Sweden had already taken this step in 2014. Other EU members also recognize a Palestinian state (Poland, the Czech Republic, Hungary, Romania, Malta and Cyprus), although most did so before entering the EU.
Borrell: “El reconocimiento del Estado palestino está sobre la mesa”

Now if we compared Spain's position on it's own contested territories we stumble upon something quiet revealing - it repeats Israels' arguments to the letter when dealing with the same dangers to it's security and self determination. But with a BIG difference - Spain also lays claims to own lands of a different continent.


What's With Those Spanish Enclaves in North Africa?
Why does Spain have cities in Africa?
It's had them for hundreds of years and won't give them up. The two enclaves—Ceuta and Melilla—have been under Spanish control for more than 400 years. Located on the African side of the Strait of Gibraltar, the cities offered protection for Spanish ships and provided posts for trading between Europe and Africa. In the 1930s, Franco launched his civil war campaign from the Spanish North African cities. When Morocco gained independence in 1956, Spain refused to give them up.

The Moroccans have long contested the ownership of Ceuta and Melilla (and a number of nearby Spanish islands). To make matters more complicated, Spain has argued that it should also own the British colony at Gibraltar—which is just across the strait from Ceuta. This apparent double standard has led to some criticism of the Spanish position: Spain responds by saying that Ceuta and Melilla aren't "colonies" since Spaniards have been living there since before Morocco even existed. (emphasis mine)



Muslims Demand Right to Return to Spain
Following the recent approval of a law that would grant Spanish citizenship to descendants of Sephardic Jews expelled from Spain in 1492, a number of Muslim groups are now demanding similar grace for potentially millions of descendants of Muslims who were expelled from Spain during the Middle Ages.

In the interest of equality, the Muslim supporters say that they are entitled to the same rights and privileges as Jews because both groups were expelled from Spain under similar historical circumstances.


However, historians state that the Jews were in Spain before the Christians, and so their expulsion was on the grounds of bigotry, whereas the Muslims in Spain were colonial occupiers who called the territory Al-Andalus and imposed Arabic as the official language, and so their expulsion was a matter of decolonization.
(emphasis mine)

Spain-IslamicReturn.jpg


I think Israel has an opportunity to make this self defeating tactic run its' course and make counter resolutions to the UN demanding:


1. "Right of Return" for all expelled Muslims, as well as separate resolutions for;
2. "Decolonization and Removal of all Spaniards from Arab lands".
3. "Ultimatum on recognition of Catalonian and Morrocan independence".


Just to see how this hamster runs against itself...

hamster-wheel-treadmill-01.jpg
There will never be peace in the “holy” land. Don’t know what Spain’s trying to do here.
Because there’s peace everywhere else!
In lots of places, yes.
 
Spanish Foreign Minister: Recognition of a Palestinian state is on the table
Spain will allocate a timetable to the EU to reach a consensus on recognition of a Palestinian state and then take a decision.

Spanish Foreign Minister Gozsef Borel confirmed on Tuesday that recognition of a Palestinian state is "on the table" of the government. The minister announced his intention to launch an "intensive process" of consultations with his European counterparts, while setting a timetable for reaching a common position.

If at the end of the timetable there is no consensus formula, he added, each EU member will have to adopt an independent decision. Although the minister did not determine what the Sephardi position would be in such a case, he hinted at a tendency to recognize a Palestinian state when he mentioned that Sweden had already taken this step in 2014. Other EU members also recognize a Palestinian state (Poland, the Czech Republic, Hungary, Romania, Malta and Cyprus), although most did so before entering the EU.
Borrell: “El reconocimiento del Estado palestino está sobre la mesa”

Now if we compared Spain's position on it's own contested territories we stumble upon something quiet revealing - it repeats Israels' arguments to the letter when dealing with the same dangers to it's security and self determination. But with a BIG difference - Spain also lays claims to own lands of a different continent.


What's With Those Spanish Enclaves in North Africa?
Why does Spain have cities in Africa?
It's had them for hundreds of years and won't give them up. The two enclaves—Ceuta and Melilla—have been under Spanish control for more than 400 years. Located on the African side of the Strait of Gibraltar, the cities offered protection for Spanish ships and provided posts for trading between Europe and Africa. In the 1930s, Franco launched his civil war campaign from the Spanish North African cities. When Morocco gained independence in 1956, Spain refused to give them up.

The Moroccans have long contested the ownership of Ceuta and Melilla (and a number of nearby Spanish islands). To make matters more complicated, Spain has argued that it should also own the British colony at Gibraltar—which is just across the strait from Ceuta. This apparent double standard has led to some criticism of the Spanish position: Spain responds by saying that Ceuta and Melilla aren't "colonies" since Spaniards have been living there since before Morocco even existed. (emphasis mine)



Muslims Demand Right to Return to Spain
Following the recent approval of a law that would grant Spanish citizenship to descendants of Sephardic Jews expelled from Spain in 1492, a number of Muslim groups are now demanding similar grace for potentially millions of descendants of Muslims who were expelled from Spain during the Middle Ages.

In the interest of equality, the Muslim supporters say that they are entitled to the same rights and privileges as Jews because both groups were expelled from Spain under similar historical circumstances.


However, historians state that the Jews were in Spain before the Christians, and so their expulsion was on the grounds of bigotry, whereas the Muslims in Spain were colonial occupiers who called the territory Al-Andalus and imposed Arabic as the official language, and so their expulsion was a matter of decolonization.
(emphasis mine)

Spain-IslamicReturn.jpg


I think Israel has an opportunity to make this self defeating tactic run its' course and make counter resolutions to the UN demanding:


1. "Right of Return" for all expelled Muslims, as well as separate resolutions for;
2. "Decolonization and Removal of all Spaniards from Arab lands".
3. "Ultimatum on recognition of Catalonian and Morrocan independence".


Just to see how this hamster runs against itself...

hamster-wheel-treadmill-01.jpg
There will never be peace in the “holy” land. Don’t know what Spain’s trying to do here.
Because there’s peace everywhere else!
In lots of places, yes.
Canada?
 


It's the SAME rethoric to the letter,
Al Jazeerah is already setting the stage to blame terrorism on "Spain's racist discrimination".
I can already see the big headlines and UN permanent resolution items...
oh wait I forgot ... it's the UNholly alliance we're speaking of "No Jews to blame, No Israel to blame - No interest"
 
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What's your point?

First of all, Spain is Spain, EU is EU.

Second of all, what is the problem?
 
What's your point?

First of all, Spain is Spain, EU is EU.

Second of all, what is the problem?

My point is that Spain is right in its' arguments regarding the Right of Return, and liberation of their country from a foreign Arab occupier. Spain is using virtually the same arguments as Israel, but tries to pressure the later to accept what they refuse themselves.

No one claims Spain has no right to exist, no-one calls for boycott (Spain remains an occupying force holding colonies on a different continent!), no-one sets permanent agenda items in the UN against the Spanish people, no-one is demanding they flood the country with potentially hostile population.

This is most vivid example of European double standard - applied only to the Jewish nation.

Q. Shall Europeans be given a pass on their apparent BS?
Q.Shall we all FORGET about Europe's war against the Jewish nation in the recent past,
should we FORGIVE Europe for feeding the same irrational obsession today?

 
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What's your point?

First of all, Spain is Spain, EU is EU.

Second of all, what is the problem?

My point is that Spain is right in its' arguments regarding the Right of Return, and liberation of their country from a foreign Arab occupier. Spain is using virtually the same arguments as Israel, but tries to pressure the later to accept what they refuse themselves.

No one claims Spain has no right to exist, no-one calls for boycott (Spain remains and occupying force holding colonies on a different continent!), no-one sets permanent agenda items in the UN against the Spanish people, no-one is demanding they flood the country with potentially hostile population.

This is most vivid example of European double standard - applied only to the Jewish nation.
Let's pretend we don't know what it is about Europe that has special obsession with the Jewish nation.
:woohoo:


Brilliant riposte.

What's your view of the Assyrian diaspora?
 
What's your point?

First of all, Spain is Spain, EU is EU.

Second of all, what is the problem?

My point is that Spain is right in its' arguments regarding the Right of Return, and liberation of their country from a foreign Arab occupier. Spain is using virtually the same arguments as Israel, but tries to pressure the later to accept what they refuse themselves.

No one claims Spain has no right to exist, no-one calls for boycott (Spain remains and occupying force holding colonies on a different continent!), no-one sets permanent agenda items in the UN against the Spanish people, no-one is demanding they flood the country with potentially hostile population.

This is most vivid example of European double standard - applied only to the Jewish nation.
Let's pretend we don't know what it is about Europe that has special obsession with the Jewish nation.
:woohoo:

Just so You know,
everything bad You wish for Israel is already in Your backyard,
for every European nation that was ever colonized by the Muslims is "Palestine".






 
Last edited:
What's your point?

First of all, Spain is Spain, EU is EU.

Second of all, what is the problem?

My point is that Spain is right in its' arguments regarding the Right of Return, and liberation of their country from a foreign Arab occupier. Spain is using virtually the same arguments as Israel, but tries to pressure the later to accept what they refuse themselves.

No one claims Spain has no right to exist, no-one calls for boycott (Spain remains and occupying force holding colonies on a different continent!), no-one sets permanent agenda items in the UN against the Spanish people, no-one is demanding they flood the country with potentially hostile population.

This is most vivid example of European double standard - applied only to the Jewish nation.
Let's pretend we don't know what it is about Europe that has special obsession with the Jewish nation.
:woohoo:


Brilliant riposte.

What's your view of the Assyrian diaspora?
You can all burn in hell.
 
Spanish Foreign Minister: Recognition of a Palestinian state is on the table
Spain will allocate a timetable to the EU to reach a consensus on recognition of a Palestinian state and then take a decision.

Spanish Foreign Minister Gozsef Borel confirmed on Tuesday that recognition of a Palestinian state is "on the table" of the government. The minister announced his intention to launch an "intensive process" of consultations with his European counterparts, while setting a timetable for reaching a common position.

If at the end of the timetable there is no consensus formula, he added, each EU member will have to adopt an independent decision. Although the minister did not determine what the Sephardi position would be in such a case, he hinted at a tendency to recognize a Palestinian state when he mentioned that Sweden had already taken this step in 2014. Other EU members also recognize a Palestinian state (Poland, the Czech Republic, Hungary, Romania, Malta and Cyprus), although most did so before entering the EU.
Borrell: “El reconocimiento del Estado palestino está sobre la mesa”

Now if we compared Spain's position on it's own contested territories we stumble upon something quiet revealing - it repeats Israels' arguments to the letter when dealing with the same dangers to it's security and self determination. But with a BIG difference - Spain also lays claims to own lands of a different continent.


What's With Those Spanish Enclaves in North Africa?
Why does Spain have cities in Africa?
It's had them for hundreds of years and won't give them up. The two enclaves—Ceuta and Melilla—have been under Spanish control for more than 400 years. Located on the African side of the Strait of Gibraltar, the cities offered protection for Spanish ships and provided posts for trading between Europe and Africa. In the 1930s, Franco launched his civil war campaign from the Spanish North African cities. When Morocco gained independence in 1956, Spain refused to give them up.

The Moroccans have long contested the ownership of Ceuta and Melilla (and a number of nearby Spanish islands). To make matters more complicated, Spain has argued that it should also own the British colony at Gibraltar—which is just across the strait from Ceuta. This apparent double standard has led to some criticism of the Spanish position: Spain responds by saying that Ceuta and Melilla aren't "colonies" since Spaniards have been living there since before Morocco even existed. (emphasis mine)



Muslims Demand Right to Return to Spain
Following the recent approval of a law that would grant Spanish citizenship to descendants of Sephardic Jews expelled from Spain in 1492, a number of Muslim groups are now demanding similar grace for potentially millions of descendants of Muslims who were expelled from Spain during the Middle Ages.

In the interest of equality, the Muslim supporters say that they are entitled to the same rights and privileges as Jews because both groups were expelled from Spain under similar historical circumstances.


However, historians state that the Jews were in Spain before the Christians, and so their expulsion was on the grounds of bigotry, whereas the Muslims in Spain were colonial occupiers who called the territory Al-Andalus and imposed Arabic as the official language, and so their expulsion was a matter of decolonization.
(emphasis mine)

Spain-IslamicReturn.jpg


I think Israel has an opportunity to make this self defeating tactic run its' course and make counter resolutions to the UN demanding:


1. "Right of Return" for all expelled Muslims, as well as separate resolutions for;
2. "Decolonization and Removal of all Spaniards from Arab lands".
3. "Ultimatum on recognition of Catalonian and Morrocan independence".


Just to see how this hamster runs against itself...

hamster-wheel-treadmill-01.jpg

Actually the problem with your argument is that the new government of Spain are the left wing PSOE. The PP, the right wingers, are the ones who are anti-independence, anti-anything other than them having power.

The PSOE are different. No, they've never granted independence to any part of Spain, however they're more likely to accept talks with those parts that do want independence.
 
"From the Ocean to the Sea - Al-Andalus will be Free" ?

 
.

The PSOE are different. No, they've never granted independence to any part of Spain, however they're more likely to accept talks with those parts that do want independence.

Negotiate this: "From the Ocean to the Sea - Al-Andalus will be free".


Q.Bargaining chips...how about dividing Madrid?
 
.

The PSOE are different. No, they've never granted independence to any part of Spain, however they're more likely to accept talks with those parts that do want independence.

Negotiate this: "From the Ocean to the Sea - Al-Andalus will be free".


Bargaining chips? How about dividing Madrid?

What?

I lived in Andalucia and their "independence movement" isn't really an independence movement, it's more just "we're from Andalucia and we want our identity". Nothing more.

Catalonia and the Basque country are the ones who really want independence. Mainly because they're rich enough to know they can go it alone.

Why would you divide Madrid? This makes no sense.
 

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