Something Is Wrong, and It’s Not the Universe

[ding]

No, it doesn't. T

Yes it does, clearly and completely. Your statement:

"Of course it is expanding into space"

...is utterly incorrect, and the article is an attempt to explain why it is incorrect.

This misconception on your part is the source of your errors and of your nonsensical queries, such as to ask how matter moves "perpendicularly to the direction of the explosion".

That query is nonsensical. You think it isn't. And this is due to the fundamental error I have described.

I think i have exhausted all resources at my disposal that would help you understand why you are making a fundamental error. I encourage to to keep reading up on the topic and to ask others. Prehaps you will come to understand your error.

What is clear is you are not capable of thinking in complex enough ways to carry on a conversation about a subject that is far beyond your comprehension.

That dude is a legend in his own mind.

Is it fair enough for me to assume that you have a science or engineering background?

 

[ding]

You can use a 1D model to help explain the expansion of space as well.

Imagine you and a friend are holding the ends of a rope, pulled tight. The rope is 1 meter long. Every minute, 1 meter of this rope expands to 2 meters in length. After 1 minute, you and your friend are 2 meters apart. After 2 minutes, you are 4 meters apart. After 3 minutes, you are 8 meters apart.

This helps us understand why the farther something is from us, the faster it is moving away from us.

Actually it doesn’t explain why the farther something is from us the faster it is moving away from us.

If you explained why every meter of rope expands to two meters of rope every minute, that would explain why the farther something is from us the faster it is moving away from us.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Actually it doesn’t explain why the farther something is from us the faster it is moving away from us.

Of course it does. It clearly demonstrates that your friend is moving away faster, the longer the rope. Maybe read it again, see if you can figure it out.

 

[ding]

Actually it doesn’t explain why the farther something is from us the faster it is moving away from us.

Of course it does. It clearly demonstrates that your friend is moving away faster, the longer the rope. Maybe read it again, see if you can figure it out.

Dude, I don’t need to read it again.

Why is the rope expanding 2 meters every minute for every 1 meter of rope?

Because whatever the answer is to that question is the reason for why everything is accelerating away from everything else.

 

[ding]

Actually it doesn’t explain why the farther something is from us the faster it is moving away from us.

Of course it does. It clearly demonstrates that your friend is moving away faster, the longer the rope. Maybe read it again, see if you can figure it out.

I’m not arguing it doesn’t demonstrate. I am arguing it doesn’t explain why every object in the universe is accelerating away from every other object in the universe.

You said it explains it. It doesn’t.

 

[westwall]

No, it doesn't. T

Yes it does, clearly and completely. Your statement:

"Of course it is expanding into space"

...is utterly incorrect, and the article is an attempt to explain why it is incorrect.

This misconception on your part is the source of your errors and of your nonsensical queries, such as to ask how matter moves "perpendicularly to the direction of the explosion".

That query is nonsensical. You think it isn't. And this is due to the fundamental error I have described.

I think i have exhausted all resources at my disposal that would help you understand why you are making a fundamental error. I encourage to to keep reading up on the topic and to ask others. Prehaps you will come to understand your error.

What is clear is you are not capable of thinking in complex enough ways to carry on a conversation about a subject that is far beyond your comprehension.

That dude is a legend in his own mind.

Is it fair enough for me to assume that you have a science or engineering background?

PhD in geology from Caltech

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Why is the rope expanding 2 meters every minute for every 1 meter of rope?

It isn't. It's expanding by 1 meter per minute per meter of rope. So maybe you do need to read it again...?

And I chose those numbers because they are easy to work with.

So yes, please read it again. All the informationyou need to understand why expanding space causes objects farther from us to move away from us faster is there.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

I am arguing it doesn’t explain why every object in the universe is accelerating away from every other object in the universe.

The expansion of space explains that. The illustration just helps to understand the explanation.

 

[ding]

No, it doesn't. T

Yes it does, clearly and completely. Your statement:

"Of course it is expanding into space"

...is utterly incorrect, and the article is an attempt to explain why it is incorrect.

This misconception on your part is the source of your errors and of your nonsensical queries, such as to ask how matter moves "perpendicularly to the direction of the explosion".

That query is nonsensical. You think it isn't. And this is due to the fundamental error I have described.

I think i have exhausted all resources at my disposal that would help you understand why you are making a fundamental error. I encourage to to keep reading up on the topic and to ask others. Prehaps you will come to understand your error.

What is clear is you are not capable of thinking in complex enough ways to carry on a conversation about a subject that is far beyond your comprehension.

That dude is a legend in his own mind.

Is it fair enough for me to assume that you have a science or engineering background?

PhD in geology from Caltech

I can tell.

 

[ding]

I am arguing it doesn’t explain why every object in the universe is accelerating away from every other object in the universe.

The expansion of space explains that. The illustration just helps to understand the explanation.

You are talking in circles.

You said you can use a 1D model to help explain the expansion of space. Then you provided your example of a 1 meter rope being pulled by two people and that every minute 1meter of this rope expands to 2 meters. After 1 minute you are 2 meters apart from your friend. After two minutes you are 4?meters after three minutes you are 8 meters apart.

Then you said this helps us understand why the farther something is away from us the faster it is moving away from us.

Your 1D model - which isn’t a 1D model - doesn’t explain why space is expanding at all.

You saying the expansion of space explains why every object is accelerating away from every other object explains why every object is accelerating away from every other object is the definition of circular reasoning.

Why is every object accelerating away from every other object? And please don’t say because the expansion of space explains it.

 

[james bond]

Actually that too is inaccurate. Everything is moving away from everything else. Which is how the apparent velocity between objects can exceed the speed of light without the objects themselves exceeding the speed of light.

The universe is expanding faster than the speed of light. We know this because of the measurements Hubble first took between us and galaxies farther out from us. Now we have better technology for better measurements. Fort Fun Indiana is an idiot, but he's right on this. No need to rehash.

You are right that it does not mean that the galaxies are moving FTL through our universe. Einstein's special relativity is not violated. Einstein's special theory says that nothing in our universe can move FTL, but it doesn't say the expansion of the universe itself cannot move FTL. Hubble measured the the recession velocity of the galaxies over time and it showed it was FTL. It does not mean that the galaxies were moving under their own power to get from point A to point B, the expansion of the universe was. That said, this expansion is not really speed as we know it. It's FTL expansion.

 

[ding]

Nothing is traveling faster than the speed of light. If an object is moving at 75% the speed of light and another object is moving away from the first object at 75% of the speed of light then then they are moving away from each other at 150% of the speed of light but neither object is traveling faster than the speed of light.

 

[ding]

It isn't. It's expanding by 1 meter per minute per meter of rope. So maybe you do need to read it again...?

What isn’t? Your lame 1D model which isn’t a 1D model at all or space itself?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Then you said this helps us understand why the farther something is away from us the faster it is moving away from us.

And it does exactly that. If it doesn't help you understand, that just means you need more help than most people.

Why is every object accelerating away from every other object?

Because space is expanding. Just as in the rope example, you and your friend are speeding away from each other at an accelerated rate. Your misunderstanding of the illustration is your fault.

Your 1D model - which isn’t a 1D model - doesn’t explain why space is expanding at all.

It is not meant to do that. It is meant to help you understand the expansion of space, and what results. As was already pointed out to you.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

1D model which isn’t a 1D model at all

It, of course, is. The rope is merely a line. 1D.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Nothing is traveling faster than the speed of light.

Relative to the Earth? False. Regions of the universe are, indeed, receding from us faster than the speed of light.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

So, to review:

The rope analogy is a 1D analogy (the rope is a line segment) meant to help us understand why, the farther form us something is, the farther it is moving away from us.

The longer the rope, the faster the rope is expanding. A 2 meter rope expands to 4 meters in one minute, while a 4 meter rope expands to 8 meters in one minute. As you can see, the longer rope is expanding faster: 4 meters in one minute, as opposed to 2 meters in one minute for the shorter rope.

If the rope is long enough, you and your friend will be speeding away from each other at a relative speed greater than the speed of light.

The expanaion of space is expressed in similar units (distance/time/distance): kilometers per second per megaparsec.

 

[james bond]

Nothing is traveling faster than the speed of light. If an object is moving at 75% the speed of light and another object is moving away from the first object at 75% of the speed of light then then they are moving away from each other at 150% of the speed of light but neither object is traveling faster than the speed of light.

That's what I just said. It means the expansion is traveling FTL. No need to rehash stuff that was covered already. Don't take up 20 pages arguing about stupid shit with FFI. This is a good thread and does not need to be ruined.

 

[ding]

Then you said this helps us understand why the farther something is away from us the faster it is moving away from us.

And it does exactly that. If it doesn't help you understand, that just means you need more help than most people.

Why is every object accelerating away from every other object?

Because space is expanding. Just as in the rope example, you and your friend are speeding away from each other at an accelerated rate. Your misunderstanding of the illustration is your fault.

Your 1D model - which isn’t a 1D model - doesn’t explain why space is expanding at all.

It is not meant to do that. It is meant to help you understand the expansion of space, and what results. As was already pointed out to you.

Why is space expanding?

I am fully expecting you to say the answer is because objects are moving away from each other to complete your circular logic loop.

 

[ding]

Then you said this helps us understand why the farther something is away from us the faster it is moving away from us.

And it does exactly that. If it doesn't help you understand, that just means you need more help than most people.

Why is every object accelerating away from every other object?

Because space is expanding. Just as in the rope example, you and your friend are speeding away from each other at an accelerated rate. Your misunderstanding of the illustration is your fault.

Your 1D model - which isn’t a 1D model - doesn’t explain why space is expanding at all.

It is not meant to do that. It is meant to help you understand the expansion of space, and what results. As was already pointed out to you.

You shouldn’t use intentionally misleading expressions like explains and understands.

You haven’t explained why space and time is expanding. You don’t even know that saying space and time is expanding is saying the same thing as all objects are moving away from themselves.

You literally believe the reason that all objects moving away from all other objects is because space is expanding. Like you believe that is a physical phenomenon. That the boundary is getting bigger which causes all objects to move away from all other objects.