Some thoughts on Iraq!!

Discussion in 'Iraq' started by Navy1960, Jun 23, 2009.

  1. Navy1960
    Offline

    Navy1960 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2008
    Messages:
    5,821
    Thanks Received:
    1,188
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Arizona
    Ratings:
    +1,189
    We've already discovered just so far the remains of 400,000 people in mass graves," said British Prime Minister Tony Blair on November 20 in London. The United Nations, the U.S. State Department, Amnesty International, and Human Rights Watch (HRW) all estimate that Saddam Hussein's regime murdered hundreds of thousands of innocent people. "Human Rights Watch estimates that as many as 290,000 Iraqis have been 'disappeared' by the Iraqi government over the past two decades," said the group in a statement in May. "Many of these 'disappeared' are those whose remains are now being unearthed in mass graves all over Iraq."

    USAID: Assistance for Iraq - Iraq's Legacy of Terror: Mass Graves

    [​IMG]

    The Halabja poison gas attack (Kurdish: Kîmyabarana Helebce) occurred in the period 16–17 March 1988, during the Iran-Iraq War. Chemical weapons (CW) were used by the Iraqi government forces in the Iraqi Kurdish town of Halabja, killing thousands of people, most of them civilians (3,200-5,000 dead on the spot and 7,000-10,000 injured[1]). Thousands more died of horrific complications, diseases, and birth defects in the years after the attack[2].

    The incident, which Human Rights Watch (HRW) defined as an act of genocide, was as of 2009 the largest-scale chemical weapons attack directed against a civilian-populated area in history[citation needed].
    Halabja poison gas attack - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    It never ceases to amaze me the number of people who would simply dismiss these acts based on political ideals that don't fit in with the current thinking of their candidate. Never the less these things did happen under Saddam Hussein if just bringing him to justice for these crimes against humanity is the only legacy of Iraq. Then the soldiers, sailor, airman, and marines who gave their lives in Iraq gave the people of Iraq a chance to live without tyranny and opression. I see many people on here justify actions this nation has taken in the Balkens for things such as ethnic cleansing. However, when it comes to Iraq because it was "George Bush's" war it's somehow okay to kill innocent people and leave them to the devices of people who would continue the same tatics that were condemned in the Balkens. If this nation went into Iraq on the pretext of planting tree's in the end, the fact that the Iraqi people have a chance to decide their own path is the ultimate victory, regardless of how fast, or how soon or President may want to leave them to their own devices once again...
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 1
  2. Sweet Willy
    Offline

    Sweet Willy BANNED

    Joined:
    May 20, 2009
    Messages:
    2,637
    Thanks Received:
    180
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Ratings:
    +180
    And to think, Bush the first sent thousands of these people to their deaths. Encouraged an uprising of people with sticks and rocks against the worlds 4th largest army, leading them to beleive we would have their backs. And they were mecilessly slaughtered while we stood and watched from striking distance.

    It takes a naive fool to think the US gives a damn about this. If we did, we could have stopped it when it mattered.
     
  3. sealybobo
    Offline

    sealybobo Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    50,773
    Thanks Received:
    3,200
    Trophy Points:
    1,845
    Location:
    Michigan
    Ratings:
    +10,224
    For one, was he really that bad or are they exxaggerating? Since Bush/Cheney have lied several times, I tend to believe this information is bullshit too.

    And there are evil dictators all over the world. What do you want to do about them?

    And since Bush invaded, 1 million Iraqi's have died and millions more displaced.

    I don't even want to get into this debate. I just want to suggest that maybe it is you that is swallowing bullshit. Let Iran deal with it. Let Saudi Arabia deal with it. We can't afford to get involved. Lets be Australia. They don't seem to get their panties in a bunch over dead Iraqi's. And how do you know who's in those graves? And it isn't like the Shiites are going to be any better.

    And you think they live without without tyranny and opression? We don't even live without those things.

    And so now we need to go start a war with Iran?

    Ok, so lets say you are right about everything. Lets say I conceed all these things you said and I believe all that you posted. You're missing something. You're missing the sloppy job that GW did that COST US Soldiers their lives.

    On purpose or were Bush/Rumsfeld/Cheney just fuck ups?

    I say they did it on purpose. They had our troops sitting in the middle of a civil war and they were STALLING so Hunt Oil could make money and so Haloburton/KBR could make money.

    Do you think Haloburton/KBR want the wars to end? Fuck no!

    So Bush used "Saddam's a bad man" in order to invade? Is that the new reason for the invasion?

    Well then tell me why we are still there? And if you are able to answer, tell me why we are still paying and Iraq oil is not funding our efforts.

    Remember when we hung Saddam? What were the hangmen chanting? Do you remember? Mook Tada, Mook Tada, as in Mook Tada El Sadr.

    There is the next leader of Iraq. So when he becomes brutal and anti American, we can go spend $10 billion a month for 6 years to overthrow him too.
     
  4. sealybobo
    Offline

    sealybobo Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    50,773
    Thanks Received:
    3,200
    Trophy Points:
    1,845
    Location:
    Michigan
    Ratings:
    +10,224
    :clap2:

    And NAVY is that naive fool.
     
  5. MaggieMae
    Offline

    MaggieMae Reality bits

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2009
    Messages:
    24,043
    Thanks Received:
    1,599
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Ratings:
    +1,601
    Frankly, I had no problem with taking out Saddam Hussein once and for all since it was clear he had no intention of abiding by anything the United Nations imposed. My problem with the Iraq war began when once he was captured, there was an opportunity for the U.S. to at least scale back and not get embroiled in the middle of a coming civil war. We had no business being there and trying to dictate how Iraq's political landscape should be without Saddam Hussein. We should have at least retreated to Kuwait and gone to a Plan B at that time, rather than waiting five years for General Patraeus to finally get it right after thousands dead, maimed, the country destroyed, and costing the US taxpayer $4.8 billion per month.
     
  6. sealybobo
    Offline

    sealybobo Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    50,773
    Thanks Received:
    3,200
    Trophy Points:
    1,845
    Location:
    Michigan
    Ratings:
    +10,224
    :clap2:

    And then you can discuss weather the lack of planning was done on purpose, because KBR, Haloburton, Hunt Oil and Blackwater are all still making billions every month.


    War for profit anyone?
     
  7. Sweet Willy
    Offline

    Sweet Willy BANNED

    Joined:
    May 20, 2009
    Messages:
    2,637
    Thanks Received:
    180
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Ratings:
    +180
    The Kurdish issue was a bunch of BS too. The war cry had become, at one time, "HE GASSED HIS OWN PEOPLE !" This, of course, was news to Iraqis and Kurds alike. The Kurds were never "his people", they had actually been denied citizenship and then refused it when offered. They were in pact with Iran, a state enemy of Iraq. So, let's put the shoe on the other foot. The state of Idaho arms it's militia with tanks, grenades and AK 47s and then announces they have entered a pact with Iran and are now an open enemy of the US, inside of the US.

    We wouldn't be hostile towards our own people would we? That would make us some kind of monsters.
     
  8. Navy1960
    Offline

    Navy1960 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2008
    Messages:
    5,821
    Thanks Received:
    1,188
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Arizona
    Ratings:
    +1,189
    Maggie, my feelings on the war itself was that the war, was entered into without any clear "exit strategy" which led to years of mismanagement of the war and futher led to more violence. IMHO this U.S. as you have had clear goals upon entering Iraq, once there executed those goals with massive force, then exited in a quick and concise manner. However, given the fact that this War was mismanaged from the start and all the factors, that led up to finally getting it right does not mitigate my original post in that, if for one simple reason alone the Iraqis are left with the chance to choose their own destiny whatever that may be, and are free from torture,ethnic violence, then the mission there was worth every sacrifice made to free those people from that. Further, I'd like to take this moment to thank sealy for making my point on partisanship for me here, I could not have made it any better myself.
     
  9. strollingbones
    Offline

    strollingbones Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2008
    Messages:
    65,657
    Thanks Received:
    15,627
    Trophy Points:
    2,190
    Location:
    chicken farm
    Ratings:
    +31,973
    i wonder how many years it will take to reconize the mass graves that are being made now...isnt the time of the killing the time to protest
     
  10. sealybobo
    Offline

    sealybobo Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    50,773
    Thanks Received:
    3,200
    Trophy Points:
    1,845
    Location:
    Michigan
    Ratings:
    +10,224
    You said, "If Iraqis are left with the chance to choose their own destiny whatever that may be, and are free from torture,ethnic violence, then the mission there was worth every sacrifice made to free those people from that."

    So if they choose Death To America as their destiny, will it still be worth it?

    And what if they want muslim law and they oppress women? If thats what they chose.

    Free? Who says they are free? We own them now.

    You gonna police their elections to assure they aren't rigged? You don't even realize you yourself aren't free. Stupid.
     

Share This Page