Some fixes that might help to control medical costs

[Cecilie1200]

... the end user is not intellegent enough to prescribe thier own drugs

Can I quote you on that? Heh, I guess I just did.

Actually, I appreciate your candor. I don't often hear it put that way, but you're right: this kind of regulation distributes rights based on intelligence, or at least the current government's estimation of such. Interesting.

\Actually it seems the drug companies are doing an end around by advertizing to the end user so they demand the doctor prescribe this drug to them. Since the end user never went to med school, they have no idea what they need. In fact some may not even know what exactly they are suffering from

Exactly. People aren't smart enough to take care of themselves. I hear ya.

Well, most people don't have medical degrees, so yeah. Also, it's a very good idea to have an objective third party monitoring your use of a lot of medications.

I'd agree with you that it's a good idea. But I'm not willing force my notion of a 'good' idea on other people with the law. At the end of the day, whether something is a good idea is a subjective decision - the answer will be different for every person. The "we-know-better" mentality of meddling statists is wearing thing.

Whether or not a good idea needs to be enforced by law depends entirely on the idea and the subject it addresses. I don't actually have a problem with restricting access to certain dangerous items and substances, depending on what they are and the nature of the restriction. And I don't consider it automatically "statism" to believe that governments have legitimate purposes, or that anarchy is not the perfect natural state.

 

[dblack]

Can I quote you on that? Heh, I guess I just did.

Actually, I appreciate your candor. I don't often hear it put that way, but you're right: this kind of regulation distributes rights based on intelligence, or at least the current government's estimation of such. Interesting.

\Actually it seems the drug companies are doing an end around by advertizing to the end user so they demand the doctor prescribe this drug to them. Since the end user never went to med school, they have no idea what they need. In fact some may not even know what exactly they are suffering from

Exactly. People aren't smart enough to take care of themselves. I hear ya.

Well, most people don't have medical degrees, so yeah. Also, it's a very good idea to have an objective third party monitoring your use of a lot of medications.

I'd agree with you that it's a good idea. But I'm not willing force my notion of a 'good' idea on other people with the law. At the end of the day, whether something is a good idea is a subjective decision - the answer will be different for every person. The "we-know-better" mentality of meddling statists is wearing thing.

Whether or not a good idea needs to be enforced by law depends entirely on the idea and the subject it addresses. I don't actually have a problem with restricting access to certain dangerous items and substances, depending on what they are and the nature of the restriction. And I don't consider it automatically "statism" to believe that governments have legitimate purposes, or that anarchy is not the perfect natural state.

*sigh* again, (and again, and again), I'm not advocating anarchy. I'm saying that it's unnecessary, and an abuse of government, to force something on other people simply because we think it's a good idea.

 

[Cecilie1200]

\Actually it seems the drug companies are doing an end around by advertizing to the end user so they demand the doctor prescribe this drug to them. Since the end user never went to med school, they have no idea what they need. In fact some may not even know what exactly they are suffering from

Exactly. People aren't smart enough to take care of themselves. I hear ya.

Well, most people don't have medical degrees, so yeah. Also, it's a very good idea to have an objective third party monitoring your use of a lot of medications.

I'd agree with you that it's a good idea. But I'm not willing force my notion of a 'good' idea on other people with the law. At the end of the day, whether something is a good idea is a subjective decision - the answer will be different for every person. The "we-know-better" mentality of meddling statists is wearing thing.

Whether or not a good idea needs to be enforced by law depends entirely on the idea and the subject it addresses. I don't actually have a problem with restricting access to certain dangerous items and substances, depending on what they are and the nature of the restriction. And I don't consider it automatically "statism" to believe that governments have legitimate purposes, or that anarchy is not the perfect natural state.

*sigh* again, (and again, and again), I'm not advocating anarchy. I'm saying that it's unnecessary, and an abuse of government, to force something on other people simply because we think it's a good idea.

I get that you don't think you're advocating anarchy, but you kneejerk to "government = bad" so reliably that it's hard for anyone NOT to think you don't want to have one.

I'm all in favor of being suspicious of government and keeping it on a strong chain, like a junkyard dog, but I am still willing to admit that it has a few useful purposes. And I'm at a loss to figure out what you think a GOOD purpose for the use of government is, under these circumstances.

Let's keep in mind, btw, that I'm NOT justifying ALL uses of governments that people think are good ideas, but that IS the basic reasoning behind pretty much any law.

 

[dblack]

I get that you don't think you're advocating anarchy, but you kneejerk to "government = bad" so reliably that it's hard for anyone NOT to think you don't want to have one.

I'm all in favor of being suspicious of government and keeping it on a strong chain, like a junkyard dog

Pardon the post splitting, but this is the sort of thing that's always left me feeling that conservatives really don't get libertarians. I don't hate government. There are bad people in government, to be sure, but the institution itself isn't a bad thing. When it's attending to its primary purpose (protecting individual rights) it's a great thing.

I'm at a loss to figure out what you think a GOOD purpose for the use of government is, under these circumstances.

Same as in any other circumstances. Protecting individual rights.

Let's keep in mind, btw, that I'm NOT justifying ALL uses of governments that people think are good ideas, but that IS the basic reasoning behind pretty much any law.

Sadly, the general consensus supports that view of the law. Most people see the government as a general purpose tool to impose order on society.

 

[Markle]

How is withholding information from the actual healthcare consumers - the patients - helpful?

You can learn all that in a thirty second commercial? Amusing!

How about the doctor informing you?

 

[Markle]

\Actually it seems the drug companies are doing an end around by advertizing to the end user so they demand the doctor prescribe this drug to them. Since the end user never went to med school, they have no idea what they need. In fact some may not even know what exactly they are suffering from

Of course they are. There is no other reason to advertise on TV. They want the customer with, whatever sounds like that drug being advertised, is the answer to their prayers. They NEED to tell their doctor about this because he/she obviously don't know about this miracle drug for their rash.

 

[JBond]

Prohibit Prescription drug commercials, if you can;t buy it without a prescriptin you can't advertise it at all

I agree it is illegal to advertise hard alcohol and cigarettes. Both items are legal over the counter products if you meet the drinking age.

First Amendment issues. Restrictions on advertising is a slippery slope.

 

[Cecilie1200]

How is withholding information from the actual healthcare consumers - the patients - helpful?

You can learn all that in a thirty second commercial? Amusing!

How about the doctor informing you?

All I need to know from a 30-second commercial is "this is a possible treatment for this condition. This is its name. This is where I can go to research it before bringing it up to my doctor." Pretty much the same as I look for from any other commercial for any other product: it exists, go find out more.

Only a damned fool remains ignorant of their health issues and blindly expects the doctor to just handle everything.

 

[Desperado]

Prohibit Prescription drug commercials, if you can;t buy it without a prescriptin you can't advertise it at all

I agree it is illegal to advertise hard alcohol and cigarettes. Both items are legal over the counter products if you meet the drinking age.

First Amendment issues. Restrictions on advertising is a slippery slope.

However they did it with cigarettes which is a product that is legal a requires no prescription to purchase.

 

[Desperado]

How is withholding information from the actual healthcare consumers - the patients - helpful?

You can learn all that in a thirty second commercial? Amusing!

How about the doctor informing you?

All I need to know from a 30-second commercial is "this is a possible treatment for this condition. This is its name. This is where I can go to research it before bringing it up to my doctor." Pretty much the same as I look for from any other commercial for any other product: it exists, go find out more.

Only a damned fool remains ignorant of their health issues and blindly expects the doctor to just handle everything.

Fine, get diagnosed by WEBMD.Com, then find your remedy through TV commercials than find a doctor that will prescribe them for you.
In fact why do you even need doctors that went to expensive med schools Just order your drugs of choice through on-line pharmacies that do not require a prescriptiom

 

[deanrd]

1. Give Medicare the right to negotiate drug prices directly with the manufacturers as the VA does, eliminating the Pharmacy Benefit Managers and other middlemen.
2. Require hospitals, doctor's offices and pharmacies to CLEARLY post the prices (with & without insurance) of the most common medical procedures, prescriptions and insurance copays at their places of business. That way patients can comparison shop and know what their out of pocket costs will be. Also require that patients be able to get a cost estimate from the provider of more complicated services UP FRONT before making a decision on treatment.

Would you sign a contract for remodeling your house without an estimate of the cost up front?

Those aren't the GOP's plan. The GOP's plan is let the fukers die and don't be slow. We haven't time.

 

[deanrd]

I watched Megan McCain, John McCain's daughter on the View says healthcare for everyone is just too expensive. We can't afford it. Thank God they have money to cover her father. It's lucky for the little people they don't have human feelings the way she does. When one of them gets sick, it's not so bad. Cuz they aren't rich.

 

[Cecilie1200]

How is withholding information from the actual healthcare consumers - the patients - helpful?

You can learn all that in a thirty second commercial? Amusing!

How about the doctor informing you?

All I need to know from a 30-second commercial is "this is a possible treatment for this condition. This is its name. This is where I can go to research it before bringing it up to my doctor." Pretty much the same as I look for from any other commercial for any other product: it exists, go find out more.

Only a damned fool remains ignorant of their health issues and blindly expects the doctor to just handle everything.

Fine, get diagnosed by WEBMD.Com, then find your remedy through TV commercials than find a doctor that will prescribe them for you.
In fact why do you even need doctors that went to expensive med schools Just order your drugs of choice through on-line pharmacies that do not require a prescriptiom

Oh, yeah, "be informed about and active in your own health care" ABSOLUTELY is the same as "diagnose yourself online, why do you need a doctor at all?"

And there is no such thing as an online pharmacy that doesn't require a prescription, you medical moron. If it requires a prescription at your corner drug store, it requires one at EVERY pharmacy. And this little display of ignorance is EXACTLY why I want to be educated and informed on my own healthcare needs: because I never want to sound as foolish as you just did.

 

[Desperado]

How is withholding information from the actual healthcare consumers - the patients - helpful?

You can learn all that in a thirty second commercial? Amusing!

How about the doctor informing you?

All I need to know from a 30-second commercial is "this is a possible treatment for this condition. This is its name. This is where I can go to research it before bringing it up to my doctor." Pretty much the same as I look for from any other commercial for any other product: it exists, go find out more.

Only a damned fool remains ignorant of their health issues and blindly expects the doctor to just handle everything.

Fine, get diagnosed by WEBMD.Com, then find your remedy through TV commercials than find a doctor that will prescribe them for you.
In fact why do you even need doctors that went to expensive med schools Just order your drugs of choice through on-line pharmacies that do not require a prescriptiom

Oh, yeah, "be informed about and active in your own health care" ABSOLUTELY is the same as "diagnose yourself online, why do you need a doctor at all?"

And there is no such thing as an online pharmacy that doesn't require a prescription, you medical moron. If it requires a prescription at your corner drug store, it requires one at EVERY pharmacy. And this little display of ignorance is EXACTLY why I want to be educated and informed on my own healthcare needs: because I never want to sound as foolish as you just did.

Buy drugs online no prescription, low prices.... online pharmacy no prescription needed plenty of these on Google most of them from Canada.

 

[dblack]

How is withholding information from the actual healthcare consumers - the patients - helpful?

You can learn all that in a thirty second commercial? Amusing!

How about the doctor informing you?

All I need to know from a 30-second commercial is "this is a possible treatment for this condition. This is its name. This is where I can go to research it before bringing it up to my doctor." Pretty much the same as I look for from any other commercial for any other product: it exists, go find out more.

Only a damned fool remains ignorant of their health issues and blindly expects the doctor to just handle everything.

Fine, get diagnosed by WEBMD.Com, then find your remedy through TV commercials than find a doctor that will prescribe them for you.
In fact why do you even need doctors that went to expensive med schools Just order your drugs of choice through on-line pharmacies that do not require a prescriptiom

The main thing is that politicians should decide. We should trust them to make our medical decisions for us.

Uh ....

 

[Markle]

Prohibit Prescription drug commercials, if you can;t buy it without a prescriptin you can't advertise it at all

I agree it is illegal to advertise hard alcohol and cigarettes. Both items are legal over the counter products if you meet the drinking age.

First Amendment issues. Restrictions on advertising is a slippery slope.

However they did it with cigarettes which is a product that is legal a requires no prescription to purchase.

And hard liquor.

 

[Markle]

I watched Megan McCain, John McCain's daughter on the View says healthcare for everyone is just too expensive. We can't afford it. Thank God they have money to cover her father. It's lucky for the little people they don't have human feelings the way she does. When one of them gets sick, it's not so bad. Cuz they aren't rich.

Four states have tried "Medicare" for all and all four states have quit because they could not even come close to affording the plan.

 

[Desperado]

How is withholding information from the actual healthcare consumers - the patients - helpful?

You can learn all that in a thirty second commercial? Amusing!

How about the doctor informing you?

All I need to know from a 30-second commercial is "this is a possible treatment for this condition. This is its name. This is where I can go to research it before bringing it up to my doctor." Pretty much the same as I look for from any other commercial for any other product: it exists, go find out more.

Only a damned fool remains ignorant of their health issues and blindly expects the doctor to just handle everything.

Fine, get diagnosed by WEBMD.Com, then find your remedy through TV commercials than find a doctor that will prescribe them for you.
In fact why do you even need doctors that went to expensive med schools Just order your drugs of choice through on-line pharmacies that do not require a prescriptiom

The main thing is that politicians should decide. We should trust them to make our medical decisions for us.

Uh ....

Eliminate all prescription drugs and allow them to be sold over the counter than. Let the viewer of the commercials decide what works for them.

 

[Marion Morrison]

1. Give Medicare the right to negotiate drug prices directly with the manufacturers as the VA does, eliminating the Pharmacy Benefit Managers and other middlemen.
2. Require hospitals, doctor's offices and pharmacies to CLEARLY post the prices (with & without insurance) of the most common medical procedures, prescriptions and insurance copays at their places of business. That way patients can comparison shop and know what their out of pocket costs will be. Also require that patients be able to get a cost estimate from the provider of more complicated services UP FRONT before making a decision on treatment.

Would you sign a contract for remodeling your house without an estimate of the cost up front?

What about stopping medical Insurance companies and Pharmaceutical reps from bribing politicians?

That's why the cost of going to the doctor is so high.

The Medicare angle you're aiming at is correct as well, but there's more.

I was looking at the doctor bills from when I was a kid..

$26

$23.

 

[Markle]

Eliminate all prescription drugs and allow them to be sold over the counter than. Let the viewer of the commercials decide what works for them.

WOW! Great news or the mortuaries!

Eliminate all prescription drugs and let the VIEWER of the commercials decide what works for them? No high school education much less a medical degree.

Are you serious? Hopefully, you're being facetious!