Socialism Really!

Discussion in 'Congress' started by Navy1960, Oct 29, 2008.

  1. Navy1960
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    Navy1960 Senior Member

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    America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: its patriotism, its morality, and its spiritual life. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within. Joseph Stalin

    I have noticed lately this label of socialism being tossed around and like many in this years election cycle I am guilty of being caught in that fervor myself. When you look at the words of Stalin or Marx about our country or Socialism, let's really look long and hard at them, in what is likely to be one of the biggest turn outs in election history we as a nation will sing out to the world in a loud voice the true meaning of patriotism, what it means to be an American. When power is peacefully transferred will will again show the world the meaning of the word American patriotism , so in that respect Stalins socialistic words ring hallow. Now lets look at the morality issue. While this is one is hard to address, it can be said with todays society and all that is out there that offers a corrupting influence to young people, movies, drugs, gangs. etc. the morals of this nation have been in decline for sometime. However IMHO this boils down to a choice and a rather simple one at that. Morality begins at home and we as Americans choose to make those socialistic words ring hallow by the choices we make in teaching our young people what is morally right and wrong and the difference between good and bad. A strong belief in spiritual values is the cornerstone of this country and still is to this day, many spiritual beliefs are celebrated in the United States and I will submit even if you are an athiest, that is a belief system and is celebrated in this nation. So in total the social values that Stalin had hoped for all ring hallow and the only way to make them come to life is by the choices that we as Americans make.

    Barack Obama by Stalins definition would come no where close to Americans decline. Is he a patriot? well if you judge simply by the inspiration that has brought millions of new voters to the polls, then the answer would be yes. Is he moral , I have seen no evidence that would lead me to believe that Barack Obama does not love his family and is not a caring loving father so again the answer is yes, As for spiritual , once can see that Barack Obama is and has been for many years a very spiritual man, so once more the answer is yes.

    So what then does the word socialism apply too? IMHO it comes down to policy , if that policy is socialistic then call it what it is socialistic . If the evidence is there in the policy to point to an overall change in government call it socialism.

    The Decree on Land ratified the actions of the peasants who throughout Russia seized private land and redistributed it among themselves. The Bolsheviks viewed themselves as representing an alliance of workers and peasants and memorialized that understanding with the Hammer and Sickle on the flag and coat of arms of the Soviet Union.

    Other decrees:

    The Russian banks were all nationalized.
    Control of the factories was given to the soviets.
    Private bank accounts were confiscated.
    The Church's properties (including bank accounts) were seized.
    Wages were fixed at higher rates than during the war and a shorter, eight-hour working day was introduced.
    All foreign debts were repudiated.
    http://www.usmessageboard.com/newthread.php?do=newthread&f=89

    so⋅cial⋅ism   /ˈsoʊʃəˌlɪzəm/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [soh-shuh-liz-uhm] Show IPA Pronunciation

    –noun 1. a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.
    2. procedure or practice in accordance with this theory.
    3. (in Marxist theory) the stage following capitalism in the transition of a society to communism, characterized by the imperfect implementation of collectivist principles


    so·cial·is·tic (ssh-lstk)
    adj.
    Of, advocating, or tending toward socialism.


    In conclusion there is evidence both ways to point to policies advocated by Barack Obama that his policies are socialistic. However in our nations history we have had many presidents advocate socialistic policies before from FDR to Eisenhower all the way to Bush 43. It remains to be seen though if Barack Obama's definition of "change" is as the current label thats been attached to him is in the classic sense a shift to socialism.
     
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  2. Wade
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    Wade Member

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    I agree Navy, we don't know anything about Obama yet. Seems like there's no documentation to be found anywhere. :razz:

    Oh, there are many differences between a socialist country and Obama's vision for this country.

    In a truly socialist country, people stand in line for food. Bribes are the way things get done. Old people run everything. If you want the good meat, you better know someone behind the counter. Car ownership, is pretty much limited to those that can justify them to the government (ie. who you know). When it's time to pick potatoes, the bus shows up, and you have to go pick potatoes, no choice. There's never two brands of anything, just the state brand. There's only one political party, and membership is earned or typically inherited. Everyone must work, or they send you to a prison where you will work. Advancement, is only encouraged by the technical capabilities of your enemies. A socialist R&D program generally involves stealing the technology from someone else. Health care is outstanding, if 40 year old pharmaceutical technology is good enough for you. And, don't ask for Viagra or hair formula or Prozac or old age medicines, those are not deemed a necessity by the state. And best of all, there's no rich people to blame everything on.
     
  3. Silence
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    Silence wanna lick?

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    :clap2: once again Navy you awe me with your intellect and well thought out posts.

    Wade, if you know nothing about Obama it's simply because you are not looking or aren't interested to know. That is your loss.
     
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  4. Modbert
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    Modbert Daydream Believer Supporting Member

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    I have to agree with Silence and Navy here.

    Great job as always Navy.
     
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  5. Navy1960
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    Navy1960 Senior Member

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    Thank you, you know what I thought about on this one is it really boils down to a policy issue does it not? While a policy may be socialistic in nature and even someone who is a staunch Republican has been known to support such policies, it is a far cry from socialism as a form of government in the true sense. Now I disagree with Barack Obama and many here especially on the tax issue and the energy issue very much but as I stated above, in my mind it remains to be seen if the sum total of all the policies equal socialism and so far I don't see the federal government stepping in to pay my property taxes. lol
     
  6. Red Dawn
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    Red Dawn Senior Member

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    Navy,

    McCain, Palin, and their sychophants know they're lying.

    The whole communist/socialist nonsense is just a dog whistle to drive the base to the polls.

    Screaming "communist!" at someone doesn't resonate with anyone under the age of 45. It's totally outdated and ineffective. And it only works for a base that tends to be old and white.
     
  7. Wade
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    Wade Member

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    Oh I'm looking. Actually, I'm researching the legal ramifications of a what has to happen if a President was found to have not been eligible for office. Does all instruments with his signature affixed recant back to the Legislative level? Or, do they simply have to be signed by the new President. And, would that be the Vice-President, or the Presidential runner up?

    Nope, Obama will not deliver this country unto pure socialism. He is simply providing a map, and it is merely but another foot fall towards the inevitable slippery slope. I vote we pull back, before it's too late.

    My research indicates that there isn't really much to know about Obama. He was idealistic, and wanted to raise those that are less fortunate than others, all reasons aside. He sees the Presidency as the quickest path to "making a difference". He will do everything he can, and blame his failures to accomplish his goals on his detractors. But, along the way, he will discover that LAZY has a super power all of it's own. It can not be damaged with words, or punishment, it will outlast the greatest attempts to stir it. It is "the unmovable object". And, for all his effort to raise those that care not of themselves, he will resort to inventing accomplishment. For he is not the unstoppable object.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2008
  8. Wade
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    Wade Member

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    Or a base that values honor and personal property, over emotional based logic.
     
  9. Missourian
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    Missourian Gold Member

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    That's because they lived thru the Cold War when it was sub zero. We saw how evil communism and socialism really were.

    Don't get me wrong, IMO true socialist might not be a bad thing, but human nature precludes the possibility of true socialism. Someone must be in charge and that person becomes prey to the axiom 'power corrupts'.
     

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