Socialism equals less freedom. How?

[KittenKoder]

The extreme righturds are screaming. Beck continues losing major advertisers, disrupters continuing to be told to behave or go to jail, millions of good-thinking Americans telling the Palinistas "enough is enough!".

A heath care reform bill, whether singer-payer or two-term, will go through, period. With the growing political power of minorities and women and young people and with only 1 out of 3 voters a white male, the tide has turned against post-Reagan Republicanism.

Either the modern GOP changes, or it dies.

Nice to know you are a neocon.

 

[Meister]

Lets just get back to basics...here is the 2 cow theory, any second grader can understand.

Communism: The government takes two cows away from your neighbor and sends them into orbit to prove the communist system is better. Your neighbor is sent to Siberia for being a landowner. You are sent to Siberia for being a troublemaker. The capitalists, shocked about the orbiting cows, are spurred into action and land cows on the moon a few years later. Your economy cannot compete and dissolves into chaos.

Fascism: Your neighbor is shot for not having the proper papers for his cows. All four cows are taken away and forced to work in a slave labor camp making missiles. You are then shot for not having any cows.

Socialism: The government takes one cow from your neighbor and gives it to you. Then it takes one cow from each of you in taxes. The two cows are given to poor people, who require continuous government handouts to keep their cows from starving. The government continually raises taxes. Eventually both you and your neighbor are forced to sell your remaining cows to pay the taxes.

American capitalism: The person with 3 cows becomes rich by renting one of his cows to you. Then he takes his cow back and uses the profit to buy your cow from you, leaving him with 4 cows and you with none.

European capitalism: The government discovers that cows cause global warming and you are forced sell your cow to pay for expensive emission control devices. There is no market for cows. It is considered gauche to eat beef, and killing a cow is considered a form of genocide. Your neighbor is tried in the International Criminal Court for running a cow slavery ring. The government sets limits on the number of cows it can have, then exceeds them.

Keynesianism: The government buys your cow and hires five workers to take care of it to ensure full employment. The cows get bigger and bigger, while the currency loses its value. Soon a cow costs $1,000,000 which is only about 3 days wages. But supply and demand has made owning a cow unprofitable. The economy collapses.

Marxism: The cows revolt against exploitation and form a commune where they are all equal. Since everyone is equal, they are all managers and no one does any work. They stand in long lines to buy grass. One cow escapes to Mexico, but the other cows send an assassin after him.

Feminism: You are forced to have an equal number of cows and bulls. Instead of giving milk, your cow runs for the US Senate while your bull refuses to mate. Cows become extinct.

Agribusiness: Cows are genetically modified to produce their own corn. The cows are designed to be cube-shaped to increase stacking efficiency. Other countries pass laws prohibiting the import of self-fed beef.

Political correctness: Bovine servitude is prohibited by the 28th Amendment. It is illegal to say anything unflattering about bovinely-abled individuals or to use the word "cowed". Anyone who says the word "coward" is fired from their job. The word "cowboy" becomes synonymous with "Nazi".

Military: The military builds a secret underground facility, protected by 35-ton blast doors, to house the cows in the event of a national cow emergency. It has its own underground power station, TV station, and hospital. No cows are actually stored there. Anyone who finds out about the facility mysteriously disappears. There are rumors that it stores cows from outer space.

Does this 'splain it for you?

 

[goldcatt]

The extreme righturds are screaming. Beck continues losing major advertisers, disrupters continuing to be told to behave or go to jail, millions of good-thinking Americans telling the Palinistas "enough is enough!".

A heath care reform bill, whether singer-payer or two-term, will go through, period. With the growing political power of minorities and women and young people and with only 1 out of 3 voters a white male, the tide has turned against post-Reagan Republicanism.

Either the modern GOP changes, or it dies.

The OP refers to the concept of socialism, not individual issues in the US. That is how most of us have addressed it. Aren't there enough threads on health care reform and town hall protests already?

 

[Oddball]

The extreme righturds are screaming. Beck continues losing major advertisers, disrupters continuing to be told to behave or go to jail, millions of good-thinking Americans telling the Palinistas "enough is enough!".

A heath care reform bill, whether singer-payer or two-term, will go through, period. With the growing political power of minorities and women and young people and with only 1 out of 3 voters a white male, the tide has turned against post-Reagan Republicanism.

Either the modern GOP changes, or it dies.

Change the subject much, neoconturd?

 

[Meister]

The extreme righturds are screaming. Beck continues losing major advertisers, disrupters continuing to be told to behave or go to jail, millions of good-thinking Americans telling the Palinistas "enough is enough!".

A heath care reform bill, whether singer-payer or two-term, will go through, period. With the growing political power of minorities and women and young people and with only 1 out of 3 voters a white male, the tide has turned against post-Reagan Republicanism.

Either the modern GOP changes, or it dies.

The OP refers to the concept of socialism, not individual issues in the US. That is how most of us have addressed it. Aren't there enough threads on health care reform and town hall protests already?

I keep telling everyone, he's a troll.....every thread he's on it's the same. No facts just his talking points.

 

[goldcatt]

Lets just get back to basics...here is the 2 cow theory, any second grader can understand.

Communism: The government takes two cows away from your neighbor and sends them into orbit to prove the communist system is better. Your neighbor is sent to Siberia for being a landowner. You are sent to Siberia for being a troublemaker. The capitalists, shocked about the orbiting cows, are spurred into action and land cows on the moon a few years later. Your economy cannot compete and dissolves into chaos.

Fascism: Your neighbor is shot for not having the proper papers for his cows. All four cows are taken away and forced to work in a slave labor camp making missiles. You are then shot for not having any cows.

Socialism: The government takes one cow from your neighbor and gives it to you. Then it takes one cow from each of you in taxes. The two cows are given to poor people, who require continuous government handouts to keep their cows from starving. The government continually raises taxes. Eventually both you and your neighbor are forced to sell your remaining cows to pay the taxes.

American capitalism: The person with 3 cows becomes rich by renting one of his cows to you. Then he takes his cow back and uses the profit to buy your cow from you, leaving him with 4 cows and you with none.

European capitalism: The government discovers that cows cause global warming and you are forced sell your cow to pay for expensive emission control devices. There is no market for cows. It is considered gauche to eat beef, and killing a cow is considered a form of genocide. Your neighbor is tried in the International Criminal Court for running a cow slavery ring. The government sets limits on the number of cows it can have, then exceeds them.

Keynesianism: The government buys your cow and hires five workers to take care of it to ensure full employment. The cows get bigger and bigger, while the currency loses its value. Soon a cow costs $1,000,000 which is only about 3 days wages. But supply and demand has made owning a cow unprofitable. The economy collapses.

Marxism: The cows revolt against exploitation and form a commune where they are all equal. Since everyone is equal, they are all managers and no one does any work. They stand in long lines to buy grass. One cow escapes to Mexico, but the other cows send an assassin after him.

Feminism: You are forced to have an equal number of cows and bulls. Instead of giving milk, your cow runs for the US Senate while your bull refuses to mate. Cows become extinct.

Agribusiness: Cows are genetically modified to produce their own corn. The cows are designed to be cube-shaped to increase stacking efficiency. Other countries pass laws prohibiting the import of self-fed beef.

Political correctness: Bovine servitude is prohibited by the 28th Amendment. It is illegal to say anything unflattering about bovinely-abled individuals or to use the word "cowed". Anyone who says the word "coward" is fired from their job. The word "cowboy" becomes synonymous with "Nazi".

Military: The military builds a secret underground facility, protected by 35-ton blast doors, to house the cows in the event of a national cow emergency. It has its own underground power station, TV station, and hospital. No cows are actually stored there. Anyone who finds out about the facility mysteriously disappears. There are rumors that it stores cows from outer space.

Does this 'splain it for you?

Never saw it put quite that way.

 

[Oddball]

In another thread the statement was made that Socialism makes us less free. Canada, England, and Europe are all countries and regions much more socialized then we are yet all provide equal or greater quality of life, longer life, and equal or more civil liberties. So exactly how has socialization in those countries made them less free than ourselves?

And if you could I would like the explanation in the form of a logical argument-that is, your predicate should be supported by premises and conclusion congruent to all premises and predicate. "I'm a dumb fuck, go to Canada dick-wad, etc" are fallacies and only shows your ignorance. Many of you have already established that so now I am giving you the opportunity to show some intelligence. How exactly are we more free while others with comparable or better quality of lives and liberty aren't?

Socialism = authoritarian central control (no matter how superficially benign) = less individualism and freedom of choice.

That intelligent enough for you?

 

[garyd]

In a nut shell the more money the government strips from any one individual the less economic freedom that individual has and the larger the bureaucracy will become. At some point the Welfare state will invariably over reach and you will get an economic collapse. And then everyone will have the freedom to starve.

 

[PeterS]

Yet ... all of those countries are behind in every advance, they are even behind the US.

How so? Give a specific example.

Actually, this only works the other way around, show more major advancements that were not just a change but actual improvements that came from those countries, the US has more.

More what? You do understand what specific means don't you? And you should be careful here because the majority of medical advances have come thru academics which are largely funded by government and if you are going to go into computer science and telecommunications we would be no where close to where we are without government investment.

So specifically, what 'more' are you talking about?

 

[007]

The extreme righturds are screaming. Beck continues losing major advertisers, disrupters continuing to be told to behave or go to jail, millions of good-thinking Americans telling the Palinistas "enough is enough!".

A heath care reform bill, whether singer-payer or two-term, will go through, period. With the growing political power of minorities and women and young people and with only 1 out of 3 voters a white male, the tide has turned against post-Reagan Republicanism.

Either the modern GOP changes, or it dies.

The OP refers to the concept of socialism, not individual issues in the US. That is how most of us have addressed it. Aren't there enough threads on health care reform and town hall protests already?

I keep telling everyone, he's a troll.....every thread he's on it's the same. No facts just his talking points.

Yup... and most of his talking points and opinion are bull shit.

 

[HUGGY]

In another thread the statement was made that Socialism makes us less free. Canada, England, and Europe are all countries and regions much more socialized then we are yet all provide equal or greater quality of life, longer life, and equal or more civil liberties. So exactly how has socialization in those countries made them less free than ourselves?

And if you could I would like the explanation in the form of a logical argument-that is, your predicate should be supported by premises and conclusion congruent to all premises and predicate. "I'm a dumb fuck, go to Canada dick-wad, etc" are fallacies and only shows your ignorance. Many of you have already established that so now I am giving you the opportunity to show some intelligence. How exactly are we more free while others with comparable or better quality of lives and liberty aren't?

Socialism equals less freedom. How?


Just the thought of a social endeavor stupifies and enrages a segment of the population leaving them non functional and therefore less free.

 

[garyd]

As anything having to do with intelligent commentary leaves huggy completely ineffectual.

 

[Meister]

In another thread the statement was made that Socialism makes us less free. Canada, England, and Europe are all countries and regions much more socialized then we are yet all provide equal or greater quality of life, longer life, and equal or more civil liberties. So exactly how has socialization in those countries made them less free than ourselves?

And if you could I would like the explanation in the form of a logical argument-that is, your predicate should be supported by premises and conclusion congruent to all premises and predicate. "I'm a dumb fuck, go to Canada dick-wad, etc" are fallacies and only shows your ignorance. Many of you have already established that so now I am giving you the opportunity to show some intelligence. How exactly are we more free while others with comparable or better quality of lives and liberty aren't?

Socialism equals less freedom. How?


Just the thought of a social endeavor stupifies and enrages a segment of the population leaving them non functional and therefore less free.

Your still looking for that moment of clarity, huh Huggy.

 

[KittenKoder]

How so? Give a specific example.

Actually, this only works the other way around, show more major advancements that were not just a change but actual improvements that came from those countries, the US has more.

More what? You do understand what specific means don't you? And you should be careful here because the majority of medical advances have come thru academics which are largely funded by government and if you are going to go into computer science and telecommunications we would be no where close to where we are without government investment.

So specifically, what 'more' are you talking about?

You enjoy avoiding the subject. There is only one meaning to the word 'more'.

 

[Oddball]

Just the thought of a social endeavor stupifies and enrages a segment of the population leaving them non functional and therefore less free.

Your still looking for that moment of clarity, huh Huggy.

More like still looking for his Paxil and Valium.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The extreme righturds are screaming. Beck continues losing major advertisers, disrupters continuing to be told to behave or go to jail, millions of good-thinking Americans telling the Palinistas "enough is enough!".

A heath care reform bill, whether singer-payer or two-term, will go through, period. With the growing political power of minorities and women and young people and with only 1 out of 3 voters a white male, the tide has turned against post-Reagan Republicanism.

Either the modern GOP changes, or it dies.

Nice to know you are a neocon.

 

[Meister]

This was from another poster on this forum, from another thread.

A short story in applied socialism; a big learning experience.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

someone posted this interesting story at my blog. How true! Read and weep libs!

A short story in applied socialism; a big learning experience.

Last semester Texas Tech had an economics professor who said he had never failed a single student before, but had, on one occasion, failed an entire class. That class had insisted socialism could be successful wherein no one would be poor and no one would be rich, socialism was the great equalizer. The professor then said ok, we will have an experiment in this class on socialism.

All grades would be averaged and everyone would receive the same grade; no one would fail and no one would receive an A. After the first test the grades were averaged and everyone got a B. The students who studied hard were upset and the students who studied little were happy. But, as the mid-term test rolled around, the students who studied little had studied even less and the ones who studied hard decided they wanted a free ride too; so they studied little. The second Test average was a D! No one was happy. When finals rolled around the average was an F.

The scores NEVER increased and the bickering, blame, name calling all resulted in hard feelings and NO ONE would study for anyone else. To the students’ great surprise, ALL failed and the professor told them that socialism ultimately ALWAYS fails. It is the natural human condition for those who work harder to be the ones expecting to receive the greater reward, but when a socialist government takes that reward away; NO ONE will endeavor to succeed.
http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...lied-socialism-a-big-learning-experience.html

 

[KittenKoder]

The extreme righturds are screaming. Beck continues losing major advertisers, disrupters continuing to be told to behave or go to jail, millions of good-thinking Americans telling the Palinistas "enough is enough!".

A heath care reform bill, whether singer-payer or two-term, will go through, period. With the growing political power of minorities and women and young people and with only 1 out of 3 voters a white male, the tide has turned against post-Reagan Republicanism.

Either the modern GOP changes, or it dies.

Nice to know you are a neocon.

You are parroting their behavior. Conservatives, luckily, do not ascribe to neocon ideology as you are.

 

[Sweet Willy]

This was from another poster on this forum, from another thread.

A short story in applied socialism; a big learning experience.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

someone posted this interesting story at my blog. How true! Read and weep libs!

A short story in applied socialism; a big learning experience.

Last semester Texas Tech had an economics professor who said he had never failed a single student before, but had, on one occasion, failed an entire class. That class had insisted socialism could be successful wherein no one would be poor and no one would be rich, socialism was the great equalizer. The professor then said ok, we will have an experiment in this class on socialism.

All grades would be averaged and everyone would receive the same grade; no one would fail and no one would receive an A. After the first test the grades were averaged and everyone got a B. The students who studied hard were upset and the students who studied little were happy. But, as the mid-term test rolled around, the students who studied little had studied even less and the ones who studied hard decided they wanted a free ride too; so they studied little. The second Test average was a D! No one was happy. When finals rolled around the average was an F.

The scores NEVER increased and the bickering, blame, name calling all resulted in hard feelings and NO ONE would study for anyone else. To the students’ great surprise, ALL failed and the professor told them that socialism ultimately ALWAYS fails. It is the natural human condition for those who work harder to be the ones expecting to receive the greater reward, but when a socialist government takes that reward away; NO ONE will endeavor to succeed.
http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...lied-socialism-a-big-learning-experience.html

Let's look at another experiment.

Let's say that a professor has 20 students. He gives 20 grades per semester. There are 400 possible A grades to be given. Starting from all things being equal, the top 5 students get an A on the first two test. In true capitalist form, these 5 students are allowed to invest their A grades towards the remaining 390 A's left. Now, they don't have to work as hard as anyone else. They only have to get a B on the next test and apply their interest from their investment to make it an A. Now they have 3 A's each......more to invest. On the next test, they only have to study hard enough to get a C and the interest from their 3 A investment covers the rest. And so on and so on until the former A students don't have to do anything at all but show up and collect the remaining A grades. Meanwhile, the B students who have worked really hard the whole time get robbed of the possible A grades for them not because the A students worked harder or studied more but because the system was set up to reward A students with more A's, regardless of how hard they studied.

So, when you meet some incredible asshole and wonder "how did this guy get so wealthy?" there is your answer. He got his hands on a couple of A's and we gave him an entitlement to more without having to work for them.

 

[KittenKoder]

This was from another poster on this forum, from another thread.

A short story in applied socialism; a big learning experience.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

someone posted this interesting story at my blog. How true! Read and weep libs!

A short story in applied socialism; a big learning experience.

Last semester Texas Tech had an economics professor who said he had never failed a single student before, but had, on one occasion, failed an entire class. That class had insisted socialism could be successful wherein no one would be poor and no one would be rich, socialism was the great equalizer. The professor then said ok, we will have an experiment in this class on socialism.

All grades would be averaged and everyone would receive the same grade; no one would fail and no one would receive an A. After the first test the grades were averaged and everyone got a B. The students who studied hard were upset and the students who studied little were happy. But, as the mid-term test rolled around, the students who studied little had studied even less and the ones who studied hard decided they wanted a free ride too; so they studied little. The second Test average was a D! No one was happy. When finals rolled around the average was an F.

The scores NEVER increased and the bickering, blame, name calling all resulted in hard feelings and NO ONE would study for anyone else. To the students’ great surprise, ALL failed and the professor told them that socialism ultimately ALWAYS fails. It is the natural human condition for those who work harder to be the ones expecting to receive the greater reward, but when a socialist government takes that reward away; NO ONE will endeavor to succeed.
http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...lied-socialism-a-big-learning-experience.html

Let's look at another experiment.

Let's say that a professor has 20 students. He gives 20 grades per semester. There are 400 possible A grades to be given. Starting from all things being equal, the top 5 students get an A on the first two test. In true capitalist form, these 5 students are allowed to invest their A grades towards the remaining 390 A's left. Now, they don't have to work as hard as anyone else. They only have to get a B on the next test and apply their interest from their investment to make it an A. Now they have 3 A's each......more to invest. On the next test, they only have to study hard enough to get a C and the interest from their 3 A investment covers the rest. And so on and so on until the former A students don't have to do anything at all but show up and collect the remaining A grades. Meanwhile, the B students who have worked really hard the whole time get robbed of the possible A grades for them not because the A students worked harder or studied more but because the system was set up to reward A students with more A's, regardless of how hard they studied.

So, when you meet some incredible asshole and wonder "how did this guy get so wealthy?" there is your answer. He got his hands on a couple of A's and we gave him an entitlement to more without having to work for them.

You really suck at analogies. I mean really suck at it.