Social Security: It's worse than you think

Social Security still has a $2.7 trillion surplus and is good to around 2033 - even with no changes.

Plus, Social Security doesn't cost the government one penny - other than the interest paid on the government bonds held by Social Security - just like China and other holders of U.S. debt.

Social Security is the largest holder of U.S. debt - which is why NaziCons would like to fuck it over.

if the Social Security "surplus" is actually there.....why is raising the debt ceiling to send out the SS checks so important...?

Obama said.... “I cannot guarantee that those checks [he included veterans and the disabled, in addition to Social Security] go out on August 3rd if we haven’t resolved this issue. Because there may simply not be the money in the coffers to do it.”

What Happened to the $2.6 Trillion Social Security Trust Fund? - Forbes
 
I knew it was bad, but it turns out that the numbers I have been looking at depend on an erroneous assumption about life expectancy. It seems they expect everyone my age to be dead by 2028.

CONGRESS and President Obama have pushed through a relatively modest stopgap measure to avoid the “fiscal cliff,” but over the coming years, the United States will confront another huge cliff: Social Security. In the first presidential debate, Mr. Obama described Social Security as “structurally sound,” and Mitt Romney said that “neither the president nor I are proposing any changes” to the program. It was a rare issue on which both men agreed — and both were utterly wrong.
For the first time in more than a quarter-century, Social Security ran a deficit in 2010: It spent $49 billion dollars more in benefits than it received in revenues, and drew from its trust funds to cover the shortfall. Those funds — a $2.7 trillion buffer built in anticipation of retiring baby boomers — will be exhausted by 2033, the government currently projects.
Those facts are widely known. What’s not is that the Social Security Administration underestimates how long Americans will live and how much the trust funds will need to pay out — to the tune of $800 billion by 2031, more than the current annual defense budget — and that the trust funds will run out, if nothing is done, two years earlier than the government has predicted.
We reached these conclusions, and presented them in an article in the journal Demography, after finding that the government’s methods for forecasting Americans’ longevity were outdated and omitted crucial health and demographic factors. Historic declines in smoking and improvements in the prevention and treatment of cardiovascular disease are adding years of life that the government hasn’t accounted for. (While obesity has rapidly increased, it is not likely, at this point, to offset these public health and medical successes.) More retirees will receive benefits for longer than predicted, supported by the payroll taxes of relatively fewer working adults than projected.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/06/opinion/sunday/social-security-its-worse-than-you-think.html?_r=1&

There are charts at this link.

Social Security?s Flawed Forecasting - Graphic - NYTimes.com

Your figures are wrong. Get it right or move on.
 
Only a wingnut will keep believing there is a surplus with SS... the fed keeps raping from SS, spending even more, increasing debt, never paying back $0.01 of what it has taken, and never will pay it back unless there is a DRASTIC change in how things are run... This is why government spending must be drastically cut (upwards of 40-50%) and a plan to phase out SS must be made to eventually get it out of the federal government where it does not belong
 
It's hard to get through to the left because they don't think. They imagine John Lennon songs and trust government to support them (as long as it's a democrat) and reason with their emotions. The truth still isn't hard to find but you have to work at it. The federal government has been stealing from social security since it was enacted. LBJ made it official that FICA taxes would be placed in the general fund and spent by congress. There is no locked box and there never has been a locked box. Government is broke (some would say broken). The fools who make the rules spent it all and the 3,000 page monstrosity that nobody read and was passed in the middle of the night will drain the wealth from future generations until the greatest super power feels what it's like to be in the 3rd world.
 
Well perhaps after pot is legalized nationally life expectancy will decline as lung cancer prevails.

See, you need to begin to appreciate the silver lining of unintended consequences
While smoking marijuana (or anything else) certainly isn't good for the lungs there is absolutely no evidence of it being the direct cause of lung cancer. The NIDA once published a pseudo-scientific report citing "evidence" of marijuana being carcinogenic, but what the report didn't reveal is the samples they routinely test come from batches seized by DEA in illegal grows. These samples are almost always contaminated with insecticides and growth inducing hormones, all of which are carcinogens.

Marijuana which is cleanly grown is benign. Whereas the tobacco used in producing ordinary cigarettes contains numerous chemicals known to be carcinogenic but which enhance the effect of nicotine. Also, If you closely examine any ordinary cigarette you will see faint grey rings circling its entire length. This is dried potassium nitrate. It is used to keep the cigarette burning. It is carcinogenic when burned.

The average cigarette smoker consumes between 20 and 30 cigarettes per day, which is an extreme irritant. The average pot smoker consumes three to five joints in a week.

Last, smoking marijuana is neither the only way to enjoy its benefit, nor is it the best way. Smoking it is the most common means only because of the suppressive effect of the prohibition. If marijuana is legalized you will see many interesting food products made with it and the rate of smoking it will gradually and significantly diminish.

So your fear, which derives from federal propaganda, is wholly unfounded.
 
Plus, Social Security doesn't cost the government one penny -

Then why does not raising the debt ceiling result in Social Security payments not going out?

I really wish you folks would get your stories aligned.
 
Social Security still has a $2.7 trillion surplus and is good to around 2033 - even with no changes.

Plus, Social Security doesn't cost the government one penny - other than the interest paid on the government bonds held by Social Security - just like China and other holders of U.S. debt.

Social Security is the largest holder of U.S. debt - which is why NaziCons would like to fuck it over.

So, what if the U.S. can't pay back the debt owed SS... ever consider that? WTF is $2T of IOU's actually worth if the guarantor is already $16T in debt and climbing?

Use your head for once.
 
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Soggy, the fault is a Congress that uses SS money for other things. The Congress can put the money back easily enough by cutting significantly without harming our national security's defense budget.

Tell your congress critters if they do not vote to put back the SS money you will vote against them. Make it a one topic only reason for vote at election time.
 
SS should be run like a real pension fund. And those who want to invest their own savings should be allowed to do so.

The problem with any real changes to SS or Medicare is, the people don't want it. Those programs are very popular, just the way they are.

Except when they are not.. as stated so many times before.. if it is SO popular, why make it that there is no choice but to participate?? If it is that good, it would be flocked to even if there is an opt out for other choices
 
I knew it was bad, but it turns out that the numbers I have been looking at depend on an erroneous assumption about life expectancy. It seems they expect everyone my age to be dead by 2028.

CONGRESS and President Obama have pushed through a relatively modest stopgap measure to avoid the “fiscal cliff,” but over the coming years, the United States will confront another huge cliff: Social Security. In the first presidential debate, Mr. Obama described Social Security as “structurally sound,” and Mitt Romney said that “neither the president nor I are proposing any changes” to the program. It was a rare issue on which both men agreed — and both were utterly wrong.
For the first time in more than a quarter-century, Social Security ran a deficit in 2010: It spent $49 billion dollars more in benefits than it received in revenues, and drew from its trust funds to cover the shortfall. Those funds — a $2.7 trillion buffer built in anticipation of retiring baby boomers — will be exhausted by 2033, the government currently projects.
Those facts are widely known. What’s not is that the Social Security Administration underestimates how long Americans will live and how much the trust funds will need to pay out — to the tune of $800 billion by 2031, more than the current annual defense budget — and that the trust funds will run out, if nothing is done, two years earlier than the government has predicted.
We reached these conclusions, and presented them in an article in the journal Demography, after finding that the government’s methods for forecasting Americans’ longevity were outdated and omitted crucial health and demographic factors. Historic declines in smoking and improvements in the prevention and treatment of cardiovascular disease are adding years of life that the government hasn’t accounted for. (While obesity has rapidly increased, it is not likely, at this point, to offset these public health and medical successes.) More retirees will receive benefits for longer than predicted, supported by the payroll taxes of relatively fewer working adults than projected.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/06/opinion/sunday/social-security-its-worse-than-you-think.html?_r=1&

There are charts at this link.

Social Security?s Flawed Forecasting - Graphic - NYTimes.com

Your figures are wrong. Get it right or move on.

Try doing something novel, use math to prove that the figures are wrong.
 
SS should be run like a real pension fund. And those who want to invest their own savings should be allowed to do so.

The problem with any real changes to SS or Medicare is, the people don't want it. Those programs are very popular, just the way they are.

Except when they are not.. as stated so many times before.. if it is SO popular, why make it that there is no choice but to participate?? If it is that good, it would be flocked to even if there is an opt out for other choices

Poll: Social Security still popular - Maggie Haberman - POLITICO.com

8 in 10 adults like SS.

Those programs are wildly popular, despite how either of us feel about them.
 
The problem with any real changes to SS or Medicare is, the people don't want it. Those programs are very popular, just the way they are.

Except when they are not.. as stated so many times before.. if it is SO popular, why make it that there is no choice but to participate?? If it is that good, it would be flocked to even if there is an opt out for other choices

Poll: Social Security still popular - Maggie Haberman - POLITICO.com

8 in 10 adults like SS.

Those programs are wildly popular, despite how either of us feel about them.

Again.. except when they are not... (20% of the population is nothing to sneeze at in number)... and this is probably another poll that does not offer a different choice, only asking how they like it now....

Anyway.. as stated.. if it is SO popular, why make it mandatory?? What is the fear of making it opt out??
 
Except when they are not.. as stated so many times before.. if it is SO popular, why make it that there is no choice but to participate?? If it is that good, it would be flocked to even if there is an opt out for other choices

Poll: Social Security still popular - Maggie Haberman - POLITICO.com

8 in 10 adults like SS.

Those programs are wildly popular, despite how either of us feel about them.

Again.. except when they are not... (20% of the population is nothing to sneeze at in number)... and this is probably another poll that does not offer a different choice, only asking how they like it now....

Anyway.. as stated.. if it is SO popular, why make it mandatory?? What is the fear of making it opt out??

It's mandatory for several reasons, one of which would be those who feel that'd never use it not paying in then getting old and broke and needing assistance.
 
Poll: Social Security still popular - Maggie Haberman - POLITICO.com

8 in 10 adults like SS.

Those programs are wildly popular, despite how either of us feel about them.

Again.. except when they are not... (20% of the population is nothing to sneeze at in number)... and this is probably another poll that does not offer a different choice, only asking how they like it now....

Anyway.. as stated.. if it is SO popular, why make it mandatory?? What is the fear of making it opt out??

It's mandatory for several reasons, one of which would be those who feel that'd never use it not paying in then getting old and broke and needing assistance.

You opt out, you are on your own... it is that simple.. It is not government's job to give you assistance because you fuck up, you don't keep working, you make dumb investment choices, etc

Again.. if so popular, EVERYONE would want in on it.. yet there are still MANY who would like another option or the chance to opt out all together... and govt makes it mandatory...

You know the reason why, you just don't want to say it..

Forced participation and contribution to their slush fund...
 
SS should be run like a real pension fund. And those who want to invest their own savings should be allowed to do so.

The problem with any real changes to SS or Medicare is, the people don't want it. Those programs are very popular, just the way they are.

Everyone should have a one time chance to opt in or out. I wouldn't end it, just make it an option. Many people can manage their money with a greater return than a govt pittance. Plus, SS doesn't even allow one to pass their own money to their loved ones, besides your spouse. Basically, SS is a glorified ponzi scheme with a horrible return.
 

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