So You Want Jobs!!

[Samson]

I would Astonished if "DefenseNews.com" had an article that included the remote probabilities of ever using the F-22 to defend the USA from attack by either Russia or China.

But lets assume that at any moment, despite the intertwining of global mutual interests that would be forfeit by such a wild improbability, Russia or China used their "F-22 Rival" to attack the USA.

When will this arguement be ridiculous?

I have no doubt that DEFENCENews.com would not even conclude that 500 years from now, the USA should still be scraping "old" weapon systems.

 

[RodISHI]

I hardly think Obama made that decision on his own. I expect he had people that know far more about the military situation than you advising him.
No insult intended, just saying.

Insult intended, are you really this stupid in real life?

so you cliam to know moare about our military situation, new projects, etc than our military leaders?

Where the WMD's then?

I take people at their word until they lie. From that moment forward their word is useless. Stealing from the people to weaken them to a point where they believe they have no choice but to accept whatever the self appointed masters will do for them will come back to haunt those self appointed masters ten fold. Obama and/or all that are proliferating the downfall of this nation at a rapid pace.

 

[Annie]

I don't believe the folks who want this are aware of the logistical problems involved.

All the Fast trains require special steels, special ways of constructing the roadbed, special ways of laying the track, it would be killer expensive. If we use Taiwan's numbers, which are way to cheap as wages there are way less than ours, it cost 69.7 million dollars per mile. At Taiwan wages. I can't imagine what it would cost translated into US wages, but a billion a mile would still be on the cheap side.

That is just construction. You want to talk operating expenses on top of that?

Europe has huge rail subsidies, plus huge costs to alternative travel. In europe the sell gas by the quart rather than by the gallon, and taxes run up to $3 per quart in much of europe, vs 25 cents per gallon here. And still the Europeans who can, go by auto rather than by high speed train.

High speed rail is a luxury and is cute. I don't see the point.

People here in the US howl when discussing raising the tax on fuel to 50 cents from a quarter. You think folks are going to be happy with $12 a gallon taxes in order to subsidize rail?

Amtrack has been subsidized for many, many years. Hemorrhages more money each year. Americans are not keen on long distance mass transit. They'll fly for convenience, though many are rethinking that too. Driving vacations lack swiftness, but make up in flexibility to see more of the country.

FL to CHG? No way I'd take a train. We have always taken side trips one way, the other, or both. CHG to St. Louis? Same as FL, lots of interesting stops along the way. If it's for business, we'd fly, if it couldn't be completed by video conferencing.

High speed trains do not make sense for America.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

So who is going to ride this rail, chinese garment manufacturer workers or italian helicopter company ceo's?

Damn good question....government does not provide "real" jobs....real jobs create wealth....if government projects were really worthwhile the private sector would undertake them...

Obama needs to back off on taxes etc. to provide a job-making instead of a job-killing environment so the entrepreneurs and investors of America can create real jobs....and i believe workers for real jobs will no doubt manage to get to work without having to use a public wealth-sucking rail system built by socialists...

Socialists historically have always promoted mass transit systems....that way they can control the movements of the masses....someone should ask Obama why he doesn't instead promote government infrastructure jobs like repairing bridges....

 

[Navy1960]

I hardly think Obama made that decision on his own. I expect he had people that know far more about the military situation than you advising him.
No insult intended, just saying.

None taken have been out of the military for a few years, and as for the F-22 it became a political issue, usa more so than a needs one. I have more than a little experience in aviation and DoD issues. Personally, I honestly do not care if the F-22 is the aircraft or not could be the F90000 for all I care as long as the warfighter as the very best to do the mission tasked to them. The point here is that most of the aircraft in our inventory are getting old , thats a fact and the F-22 represents some movement in taking care of that issue. As I posted above, just a surface reading on the F-15SE and the new F-16 which btw will be exported to India in the configuration I mentioned if they decide to purchase it are very much an option for this. Where I part company with people is the dismissive notion of fighting war on the cheap, or lets just use what we have. Well I can tell you the let's just use what we have has been worn out. Sec. Gates made the decision on the F-22 and it's really been pretty much the same even during the Bush Adminstration with the exception of numbers. While the Air Force wanted 351 aircraft the Sec. has said sinece 2008 there was a need only for 187 of them. President Obama has made it clear her just thinks they were too expensive to begin with. Adm. Mullen told congress he thought the Airforce needed 60 more of them. The decision was made not because the aircraft was a relic as some would like to believe, it was made because the threat it was intended to counter according to the Sec. was low and would not be around till 2020 and therefor that money could be better spent on the F-35 which by the way is a disaster of an aircraft.

 

[Navy1960]

In case it has escaped anyones notice the jobs in these defense sectors are PRIVATE industry jobs and are not Govt. jobs and the workers that build the C-17 for example are being paid by Boeing not by the Federal Govt. That is Govt. doing what it should be doing, defending this nation and at the same time providing an atmosphere for commerce to flourish. Govt. cannot build C-17's as well as Boeing can so it's a little much to expect that Govt. can build high speed rail and pay the cost to maintain it. Perhaps this is a reason why Amtrak has been such a disaster all these years.

 

[Navy1960]

I would Astonished if "DefenseNews.com" had an article that included the remote probabilities of ever using the F-22 to defend the USA from attack by either Russia or China.

But lets assume that at any moment, despite the intertwining of global mutual interests that would be forfeit by such a wild improbability, Russia or China used their "F-22 Rival" to attack the USA.

When will this arguement be ridiculous?

I have no doubt that DEFENCENews.com would not even conclude that 500 years from now, the USA should still be scraping "old" weapon systems.

Samson, you and I have spoken on many topics and I am sure you understand that the nature of the use of weapons systems is often times not a direct one but is more so an indirect one. It is more a possibility that in the future an F-22 will be engaged with an opponent that is not Chinese or Russian but rather are flying aircraft from those nations and visa versa. However in the case of the F-22 as there is an export ban on the aircraft that is a remote possibility. The F-35 is another story.

 

[RodISHI]

So who is going to ride this rail, chinese garment manufacturer workers or italian helicopter company ceo's?

Damn good question....government does not provide "real" jobs....real jobs create wealth....if government projects were really worthwhile the private sector would undertake them...

Obama needs to back off on taxes etc. to provide a job-making instead of a job-killing environment so the entrepreneurs and investors of America can create real jobs....and i believe workers for real jobs will no doubt manage to get to work without having to use a public wealth-sucking rail system built by socialists...

Socialists historically have always promoted mass transit systems....that way they can control the movements of the masses....someone should ask Obama why he doesn't instead promote government infrastructure jobs like repairing bridges....

Sending military's uniform garment works to China when a company here just laid off a whole factory pisses me off. American tax dollars belong to American companies that spend those tax dollars here. I'm sorry but Reagan was no hero helping to initiate and establish this multi national corporate culture that would strip the poor and middle class of this country and every president and legislator after that helped create this mess is responsible regardless if they are Rep or Dem or in between. It takes a multitude of talents to keep a population working. From the poor garment worker to the head ceo and everything in between. The legislators of this country are helping to toppling this country with the overload of the top tier. They can't undermine the foundation and expect it to hold the overinflated top tier. It won't work!

Tell me this would China or any other country let American's make their government uniforms or do they?

 

[uscitizen]

America was designed around cheap individualized transportation. Ie the auto.
So yes mass transit will not work well for us except in a few areas.

This will also be our downfall as oil gets more expensive.

 

[Mr Natural]

So who is going to ride this rail, chinese garment manufacturer workers or italian helicopter company ceo's?

Damn good question....government does not provide "real" jobs....real jobs create wealth....if government projects were really worthwhile the private sector would undertake them...

Obama needs to back off on taxes etc. to provide a job-making instead of a job-killing environment so the entrepreneurs and investors of America can create real jobs....and i believe workers for real jobs will no doubt manage to get to work without having to use a public wealth-sucking rail system built by socialists...

Socialists historically have always promoted mass transit systems....that way they can control the movements of the masses....someone should ask Obama why he doesn't instead promote government infrastructure jobs like repairing bridges....

Sending military's uniform garment works to China when a company here just laid off a whole factory pisses me off. American tax dollars belong to American companies that spend those tax dollars here. I'm sorry but Reagan was no hero helping to initiate and establish this multi national corporate culture that would strip the poor and middle class of this country and every president and legislator after that helped create this mess is responsible regardless if they are Rep or Dem or in between. It takes a multitude of talents to keep a population working. From the poor garment worker to the head ceo and everything in between. The legislators of this country are helping to toppling this country with the overload of the top tier. They can't undermine the foundation and expect it to hold the overinflated top tier. It won't work!

Tell me this would China or any other country let American's make their government uniforms or do they?

Is this for real? Are they really making our US military uniforms in China now or are you just making that up?

If it's true, that that goes beyond wrong. I thought I've see it all with the Chinese made US flags, but military uniforms?

Good grief, is there any hope for us at all? I don't think so.

 

[Navy1960]

Damn good question....government does not provide "real" jobs....real jobs create wealth....if government projects were really worthwhile the private sector would undertake them...

Obama needs to back off on taxes etc. to provide a job-making instead of a job-killing environment so the entrepreneurs and investors of America can create real jobs....and i believe workers for real jobs will no doubt manage to get to work without having to use a public wealth-sucking rail system built by socialists...

Socialists historically have always promoted mass transit systems....that way they can control the movements of the masses....someone should ask Obama why he doesn't instead promote government infrastructure jobs like repairing bridges....

Sending military's uniform garment works to China when a company here just laid off a whole factory pisses me off. American tax dollars belong to American companies that spend those tax dollars here. I'm sorry but Reagan was no hero helping to initiate and establish this multi national corporate culture that would strip the poor and middle class of this country and every president and legislator after that helped create this mess is responsible regardless if they are Rep or Dem or in between. It takes a multitude of talents to keep a population working. From the poor garment worker to the head ceo and everything in between. The legislators of this country are helping to toppling this country with the overload of the top tier. They can't undermine the foundation and expect it to hold the overinflated top tier. It won't work!

Tell me this would China or any other country let American's make their government uniforms or do they?

Is this for real? Are they really making our US military uniforms in China now or are you just making that up?

If it's true, that that goes beyond wrong. I thought I've see it all with the Chinese made US flags, but military uniforms?

Good grief, is there any hope for us at all? I don't think so.

The "Berry Amendment," 10 U.S.C. 2533a requires that the Department of Defense give preference in procurement to domestically produced, manufactured, or home grown products. This specifically applies to metals, food, fabrics and clothing. Congress originally passed the restrictions in 1941 in order to protect the U.S. domestic industrial base during time of war.

Although the law has been revised several times since then, the provisions concerning clothing and fabrics remain the same requiring all U.S. Military uniforms be manufactured in the United States by U.S. firms.

The American Recovery and Reinvestment Act (H.R. 1), passed by both houses of congress on February 13, 2009, included legislation offered by Congressman Larry Kissell (D-NC) mandating that any textile and apparel products contracted by the U.S. Department of Homeland Security’s (DHS) be manufactured in the United States with 100 percent U.S. inputs. The "Kissell Amendment" was modeled on and picks up, with little or no modification, many of the specific provisions of the Berry Amendment.
Military Uniform Gouge: US Military Uniforms MADE IN THE USA

Congressman Ronnie Shows
Mississippi's 4th Congressional District

Press Release
For Immediate Release

Contact: Burns Strider
202-225-5865, office
202-225-5886, fax
202-225-4271, cell
[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>

Shows Shocked, Jobs Lost in Mississippi's 4th Congressional District Over
Last Eight Years and the Department of Defense Grants Contracts for Head
Gear to Communist China!

Congressman Ronnie Shows Says to Department of Defense: "BUY AMERICAN!"
after Learning that Lucrative Contracts for Head Gear are Going to Places
Such as Communist China

United States Department of Defense Grants Contracts to Foreign Powers for
Berets Totaling More than $26 Million

[WASHINGTON] - Congressman Ronnie Shows today blasted the Department of
Defense for granting more than $26 million in contracts to foreign powers
for the manufacturing of berets to be worn by American soldiers. These
contracts were granted to companies in China, Romania, Sri Lanka, India,
South Africa and Canada
Governor's Office: Administration of Ronnie Musgrove

 

[Navy1960]

&#8226;Of the surveyed firms which indicated that they rely on foreign sources of textile and apparel inputs, 73 percent reported that they were &#8220;dependent&#8221; on foreign sources for at least one good or service. However, a substantial number of these firms acknowledged that there were, in fact, domestic producers of the goods/services currently obtained from foreign sources, but that the foreign source was &#8220;relied upon&#8221; because of lower costs.
Textile and Apparel Industry Base Assessment

 

[beowolfe]

Producing obsolete weapons for jobs?

Better to produce alternative energy soloutions.

Produce alternative energy solutions when people can afford to implement alternative energy solutions...otherwise their is no demand for the alternative energy solutions.

SO exactly what do they do with the alternative energy solutions when they sit in warehouses? And what do all of those new employees do with their time after they have i9ncreased inventory to the maximum amount?

You may as well employ people to dig holes and fill them again...at least there is no "ending point".

People will 'afford' energy (clean or not) no matter how much they are charged. Look at oil/gasoline last summer. We'll make adjustments in our use of the energy, but we'll continue to buy it because there is no other choice.

 

[RodISHI]

Is this for real? Are they really making our US military uniforms in China now or are you just making that up?

If it's true, that that goes beyond wrong. I thought I've see it all with the Chinese made US flags, but military uniforms?

Good grief, is there any hope for us at all? I don't think so.

You did not fully read the OP I take it? I suppose one can fact check that by contacting them.


http://assets.opencrs.com/rpts/RS20550_20091210.pdf

According to the procurement data sheet there are exceptions for procurement under the BA and BAA acts respectively . I linked it if you'd like to read it.

 

[uscitizen]

LOL we do not even have enough industry left to provide for our military.

Really secure.

 

[keee keee]

Producing obsolete weapons for jobs?

Better to produce alternative energy soloutions.

Better producing energy that is drilled here by American workers. this energy could then be refined and used here in the United States maybe at a cheaper cost than the energy we are buying right now from the middle east you know the countries that are not to friendly to us and sponsor terrorism. building a few nukes for each state would also create thousands of badly needed jobs. all this fuells and jobs would also create tax revenue from sales and employment, and corp taxes on profits. DRILL OIL NOW BUILD NUKE POWER PLANTS!!!!!!!!

 

[Samson]

LOL we do not even have enough industry left to provide for our military.

Really secure.

As long as government's in the loop:

$Govt=>$Boeing/Lockheed/GM=>$taxpayers=>$Govt

I guarantee:

There will never be an unbias source that concludes the USA needs no new weapons system.