So guys, what was your biggest general reaction after watching the address?

[QUENTIN]

Truth, I have a lot of respect for you, but is arguing he's better than Bush really any kind of endorsement?

Among informed and reasonable people, it's clear that Obama is an improvement over Bush in a variety of significant ways and many of the problems we face are primarily the responsibility of the last administration. But, when Obama retains the bulk of Bush's aggressive militarism, surveillance state, repudiation of the rule of law, and cozy corporatism (not passively but actively adopting and advocating these policies), can he really be said to even be trying to make things better?

He sold out the progressives before he was even elected and despite all the cries of Marxism from idiots, has essentially continued to serve the same elite, monied interests he was elected to eradicate.

Smart, moral people try to hold ourselves to a higher standard than Al Qaeda and don't fall back on "Well they're worse, so atrocities we commit are justified!" So too should we hold the President to a higher standard than "He's better than the record-breakingly awful last guy, so he deserves our support!"

With a few exceptions, Obama's young presidency has been a complete failure. Not just because an obstructionist Republican Congress has tried to prevent the adoption of any new policies, but because Obama has squandered a supermajority by proposing and adopting policies that are terrible in their own right.

I understand frustration at the self-serving hypocrisy from most conservatives on this, but bigger picture, do you really think Obama warrants defending?

 

[Truthmatters]

Dr Smith, I love it when they blame Clinton for the first WTT attack that happened 20 days into Clintons term but blame Clinton for 911 when it happened 98 months into Bushs term.

 

[Vel]

Oh yeah, 15 BILLION saved out of a 4 TRILLION budget is ballsy. What an ass. He sure thinks his supporters are STUPID.

WELLLLL....

 

[Dr.Traveler]

Oh, I agreed with much of what he said. I just have serious doubts this administration can follow through with their promises.

-TSO

I agree. I believe Obama means well and will "not quit".

I agree. I think the problem with last night's speech wasn't the policies. A lot of the stuff he put out there is downright reasonable on both sides.

The problem is that the stuff Democrats should support won't get done. He had a 60 seat supermajority and couldn't accomplish that stuff, how do you accomplish it now you only have a 59 seat philibuster prone majority?

The stuff the GOP supports won't get done. You'll never get Reid or Pelosi to line up enough support for anything the liberal base doesn't want.

Both sides are all too willing to lockdown the government if they don't get their way, so anything he suggested that is distasteful to a career politician is dead out of the gate.

On top of that, it seemed clear that the SCOTUS was ticked off by his comments on campaign finance. To a man (and woman) they looked like they just wanted him to butt out. Add in the JCS looked less than thrilled with Obama wanting to toss "Don't Ask, Don't Tell."

I think he's lost control and lost all his allies. Last night was the first time since he won that I thought he could be a one termer. He just seems too isolated up there.

Say what you will about Bush, but even at his worst he had his party's support. I'm not sure Obama even has that now.

 

[drsmith1072]

The right doesn't want a little, they want it all. They want things done the way they want it done and if not they will continue to filibuster. For the dishonest and hypocritcal right a compromise consists of their opposition giving the right everything they want when they offer NOTHING in return. You give them a little and then they move the goal posts asking for more and they will continue to do so.

DR. FREUD, PLEASE CALL YOUR OFFICE!

I know the truth hurts but it's time you faced reality and accepted the truth.

Oh and if you have anything specific to offer to counter anything I said then please present it. Otherwise it appears that all you have to offer are baseless and lame personal attacks that show you to be nothing but a troll who attacks posters personally in lieu of presenting a real argument because you have none. LOL

Oh and you avoided this part of my post and ran away from commenting on it.

Yeah and the hypocritical right will never be satisfied with anything he or the left does. They took the public option out of the senate bill which was a compromise and against what the liberal base supported and the right still voted as one partisan packed lemming block against it.

I wonder why?? LOL

 

[drsmith1072]

Dr Smith, I love it when they blame Clinton for the first WTT attack that happened 20 days into Clintons term but blame Clinton for 911 when it happened 98 months into Bushs term.

Yeah, but logic, reason and integrity have never been a part of being a good conservative lemming. They just do what they are told and don't seem to care how dishonest and hypocrtical they have to be as long as they believe it will get them what they want.

For instance, look back at how they claimed under clinton that embassies count as US soil so they could attack clinton and then under W they refused to apply that same standard to W so they could claim that W kept us safe despite the fact that the shoe bomber, the DC sniper and attacks on US embassies overseas occured on W's watch.

As usual with the right, the end justifies the means.

p.s. not a Dr. D and R are my intitials.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Is the Presidency really a big enough job for someone as grandiose as Obama?

Can you imagine FDR saying, "I don't quit" after Pearl Harbor?

Or Abe Lincoln telling the Democrat controlled stated who rather quit the USA and kill their brothers instead of giving up their slaves, "I don't quit"

No, Obama needs a bigger forum

 

[WillowTree]

Poll: 83% of Speech Watchers Approve of Obama's State of the Union Proposals - Political Hotsheet - CBS News

Poll: 83% of Speech Watchers Approve of Obama's State of the Union Proposals

Exactly how can you agree or disagree with the proposals if you are not aware of what needs to be done to acheive them?

I mean...who would disagree with the idea of increasing employment...
Who would disagree with ensuring no one is hungry?
Who would disagree with decreasing the debt?

Give me the "sacrifices" that are attached to those "plans" and then I can say the sacrifices are worth the results...or not worth the results.

This that poll is garbage to me.....it is simply 83% of the people saying they like the way he said what he said.

You don't see what you refuse to look at. He said, for example SPECIFICALLY, that government should tighten it's belt along with Americans who are doing the same. In fantasy land, or from the mouth of a conservative, this statement would set your kind into an epileptic seizure of affectionate agreeableness... yet, when your political enemy says it.. well.. again, you refuse to see it.


But, by all means.. ignore polls that don't correlate to your prefab opinion. I'm sure you'll do well during the next election.

I don't think CBS or CNN or MSNBC or Fox polls should be taken seriously..l. of course 83% of the obamalamasheeps are gonna say they agree with his speech..

 

[WillowTree]

Oh yeah, 15 BILLION saved out of a 4 TRILLION budget is ballsy. What an ass. He sure thinks his supporters are STUPID.

no sir... he knows his supporters are stupid..... that's the way he likes it uh huh uh huh

 

[drsmith1072]

Oh, I agreed with much of what he said. I just have serious doubts this administration can follow through with their promises.

-TSO

I agree. I believe Obama means well and will "not quit".

I agree. I think the problem with last night's speech wasn't the policies. A lot of the stuff he put out there is downright reasonable on both sides.

The problem is that the stuff Democrats should support won't get done. He had a 60 seat supermajority and couldn't accomplish that stuff, how do you accomplish it now you only have a 59 seat philibuster prone majority?

The stuff the GOP supports won't get done. You'll never get Reid or Pelosi to line up enough support for anything the liberal base doesn't want.

Both sides are all too willing to lockdown the government if they don't get their way, so anything he suggested that is distasteful to a career politician is dead out of the gate.

On top of that, it seemed clear that the SCOTUS was ticked off by his comments on campaign finance. To a man (and woman) they looked like they just wanted him to butt out. Add in the JCS looked less than thrilled with Obama wanting to toss "Don't Ask, Don't Tell."

I think he's lost control and lost all his allies. Last night was the first time since he won that I thought he could be a one termer. He just seems too isolated up there.

Say what you will about Bush, but even at his worst he had his party's support. I'm not sure Obama even has that now.

If democrats made one mistake with their 58 + two independent majority, it was trying to compromise and debate healthcare with the republicans on the senate floor who were going to vote against it no matter what. That was a waste of time and the bill could have already been passed had they not done that.

As for your claim that reid would never go against the liberal base, that was shot down by the FACT that the public option was removed from the senate bill against the wishes of the liberal base. The republicans want all or nothing, then move the goal posts and even if the democrats compromise the right will not vote to support the legislation. The right whines about being exluded but they put themselves in that position by not being willing to compromise.

So now you speak for the ENTIRE supreme court?? WOW. LOL

As for the JCs have you ever been on a military installation and looked at photos of military personnel?? They always look like that. LOL

I have to disagree on the isolation thing. I know that is what you wish to believe but UI don't see it. I don't see disagreement as isolation. I see it as part of the process that brings about compromise. If only republicans could understand and grasp that concept.

Then to finish it off on your comment concerning bush and his lemming followers. LOL Does a leopard change his spots?? NO. So then why would you expect a party of lemmings, who follow a leader without question no matter how bad he gets, to change their ways ?? The republicans voted as a block then and they continue to follow marching orders and vote as a block today. There is NO individuality and there is NO original thought. They just follow along, do what they are told and parrot talking points over and over in the hopes that repetition will make their comments valid.

LOL No matter how bad bush got he still had the support of his party. (sarcams follows) Now that is something worthy of praise. LOL

 

[TheSuaveOne]

but blame Clinton for 911 when it happened 98 months into Bushs term.

Ummm, President Bush only served 96 months as president.

-TSO

 

[beowolfe]

Oh yeah, 15 BILLION saved out of a 4 TRILLION budget is ballsy. What an ass. He sure thinks his supporters are STUPID.

WELLLLL....

You do realize that that wasn't aimed at his supporters, don't you? It was aimed at his detractors.....hehehehe.......

 

[drsmith1072]

Exactly how can you agree or disagree with the proposals if you are not aware of what needs to be done to acheive them?

I mean...who would disagree with the idea of increasing employment...
Who would disagree with ensuring no one is hungry?
Who would disagree with decreasing the debt?

Give me the "sacrifices" that are attached to those "plans" and then I can say the sacrifices are worth the results...or not worth the results.

This that poll is garbage to me.....it is simply 83% of the people saying they like the way he said what he said.

You don't see what you refuse to look at. He said, for example SPECIFICALLY, that government should tighten it's belt along with Americans who are doing the same. In fantasy land, or from the mouth of a conservative, this statement would set your kind into an epileptic seizure of affectionate agreeableness... yet, when your political enemy says it.. well.. again, you refuse to see it.


But, by all means.. ignore polls that don't correlate to your prefab opinion. I'm sure you'll do well during the next election.

I don't think CBS or CNN or MSNBC or Fox polls should be taken seriously..l. of course 83% of the obamalamasheeps are gonna say they agree with his speech..

LOL This was a random poll taken before and after the speech and included republicans, democrats and independents. The same group was polled before the speech and only 57 % said they shared obama's prioities that was up to 70% after the speech.
It wasn't like the one done by hannity last night where he asked his viewers to text his program so he could dishonestly try to claim that it was the voice of the people when 80+% of his viewers that bothered to text in (no number of how many actually responded) thought the speech was terrible. LOL

Although it is funny that you would try to put this random poll on the same level with foxnews "polls". LOL Seems to me that you are discarding it merely because it differs from your own personal views.

 

[HUGGY]

I agree. I believe Obama means well and will "not quit".

I agree. I think the problem with last night's speech wasn't the policies. A lot of the stuff he put out there is downright reasonable on both sides.

The problem is that the stuff Democrats should support won't get done. He had a 60 seat supermajority and couldn't accomplish that stuff, how do you accomplish it now you only have a 59 seat philibuster prone majority?

The stuff the GOP supports won't get done. You'll never get Reid or Pelosi to line up enough support for anything the liberal base doesn't want.

Both sides are all too willing to lockdown the government if they don't get their way, so anything he suggested that is distasteful to a career politician is dead out of the gate.

On top of that, it seemed clear that the SCOTUS was ticked off by his comments on campaign finance. To a man (and woman) they looked like they just wanted him to butt out. Add in the JCS looked less than thrilled with Obama wanting to toss "Don't Ask, Don't Tell."

I think he's lost control and lost all his allies. Last night was the first time since he won that I thought he could be a one termer. He just seems too isolated up there.

Say what you will about Bush, but even at his worst he had his party's support. I'm not sure Obama even has that now.

If democrats made one mistake with their 58 + two independent majority, it was trying to compromise and debate healthcare with the republicans on the senate floor who were going to vote against it no matter what. That was a waste of time and the bill could have already been passed had they not done that.

As for your claim that reid would never go against the liberal base, that was shot down by the FACT that the public option was removed from the senate bill against the wishes of the liberal base. The republicans want all or nothing, then move the goal posts and even if the democrats compromise the right will not vote to support the legislation. The right whines about being exluded but they put themselves in that position by not being willing to compromise.

So now you speak for the ENTIRE supreme court?? WOW. LOL

As for the JCs have you ever been on a military installation and looked at photos of military personnel?? They always look like that. LOL

I have to disagree on the isolation thing. I know that is what you wish to believe but UI don't see it. I don't see disagreement as isolation. I see it as part of the process that brings about compromise. If only republicans could understand and grasp that concept.

Then to finish it off on your comment concerning bush and his lemming followers. LOL Does a leopard change his spots?? NO. So then why would you expect a party of lemmings, who follow a leader without question no matter how bad he gets, to change their ways ?? The republicans voted as a block then and they continue to follow marching orders and vote as a block today. There is NO individuality and there is NO original thought. They just follow along, do what they are told and parrot talking points over and over in the hopes that repetition will make their comments valid.

LOL No matter how bad bush got he still had the support of his party. (sarcams follows) Now that is something worthy of praise. LOL

Why is it that somehow the media and the public try to redefine what a democrat is and try to foward this "new" meaning parallel to the republican party in comparison as it is now configured.

Maybe americans are just for the most part morons. The democratic party is made up of at least three almost seperate constichuants. Left or truly liberal , Progressives and southern democrats. The only thing they all believe in is that they are not republicans. These groups mostly mean well but for the most part they are all cowards. The republicans that stole the party of Eisenhower and Goldwater and currently use this moniker to work in lock step like the crime family they are. They are if not straight up criminals ..they are at the very least sociopaths. I'm not really sure who I would invite over to the house. The GOPers would steal everything that was not chained down and the Dems would try to help with the cooking and burn down your house. Neither group ever admits the damage they cause.

 

[Dr.Traveler]

If democrats made one mistake with their 58 + two independent majority, it was trying to compromise and debate healthcare with the republicans on the senate floor who were going to vote against it no matter what. That was a waste of time and the bill could have already been passed had they not done that.

I agree. If you're handed a 60 seat majority, you're handed a mandate. People will expect you to do something with that kind of leverage.

The Senate Democratic Caucus couldn't deliver on that. I think that in a nutshell is the biggest issue they'll face in 2010 from their base, and even the moderates.

As for your claim that reid would never go against the liberal base, that was shot down by the FACT that the public option was removed from the senate bill against the wishes of the liberal base. The republicans want all or nothing, then move the goal posts and even if the democrats compromise the right will not vote to support the legislation. The right whines about being exluded but they put themselves in that position by not being willing to compromise.

I agree that the GOP brought their isolation from the bill on themselves.

As for the liberal base, Reid proved that he can't control the Senate. My point is this: if the GOP wants something and the liberal base won't stomach it, I doubt very seriously it will happen. If Reid doesn't have the votes, he doesn't appear to have the strength to get those votes.

The public option wasn't completely dead until Brown's victory in Massachusets. I don't think the bill would have come out of conference without a public option, but that falls into the relm of speculation now.

So now you speak for the ENTIRE supreme court?? WOW. LOL

Nope. I can only tell you how it looked. Calling out the SCOTUS isn't something that usually goes well for a President at the best of times. Alito was clearly put off (which isn't surprising considering his leaning), but none of the rest of the Justices looked particularly pleased either.

I'll concede I can't know for sure how things will go with the SCOTUS.

As for the JCs have you ever been on a military installation and looked at photos of military personnel?? They always look like that. LOL

To be honest, I felt that way prior to the SotU address. After how the Afghanistan troop decision played out, its clear that the JCS have enough issues with him to "leak" things to the press. Calling for an end to "Don't Ask Don't Tell" won't make them any happier.

Lets be clear, I don't expect any kind of action by the military to unseat him, I just came away from last night feeling he's lost their support.

Again, I'll concede there's no way to know for sure though.

I have to disagree on the isolation thing. I know that is what you wish to believe but UI don't see it. I don't see disagreement as isolation. I see it as part of the process that brings about compromise. If only republicans could understand and grasp that concept.

Politically I'm a moderate the voted for him hoping he could find a middle path. I don't wish for him to fail. In fact, I consider Health Care Reform to be one of the most important domestic issues we face. I grew up without health insurance. My parents lived most of their life one medical disaster away from financial ruin. It is ridiculous that the rest of the world can figure out how to make Health Care work but the most advanced nation in the world can barely figure out how to produce doctors.

I just think that he's dangerously close to losing support on both sides. A lot of folks on the Left that I know are absolutely frustrated that he even bothered trying to bringing the GOP into the fold. The GOP seems bound and determined to lockstep oppose anything he's going to try. He's in a dangerous position.

Then to finish it off on your comment concerning bush and his lemming followers. LOL Does a leopard change his spots?? NO. So then why would you expect a party of lemmings, who follow a leader without question no matter how bad he gets, to change their ways ?? The republicans voted as a block then and they continue to follow marching orders and vote as a block today. There is NO individuality and there is NO original thought. They just follow along, do what they are told and parrot talking points over and over in the hopes that repetition will make their comments valid.

LOL No matter how bad bush got he still had the support of his party. (sarcams follows) Now that is something worthy of praise. LOL

Part of my issue with the GOP is that they supported GWB no matter what he did, right or wrong. That's isn't a selling point in my eyes. I'm just saying that Bush was never truly isolated in the Oval Office. That's a good news/bad news thing.

We'll see. I still hope he gets his second term, especially with the way the GOP seems to be determined to cater to the fringes. But after last night I didn't walk away reassured.