CDZ Sincere Question

[EvilEyeFleegle]

Well this is off the OT but since everyone wants to blame somebody vs figuring out what to do

To be honest, I don't see you getting into the weeds of specifics about how to change the current trajectory, either.

To put a not too fine point on my argument, I see a resentment-filled, perennially enraged White conservative majority blindly lashing out against whatever and whoever, and throwing their still considerable electoral weight behind Trump exactly because of his vulgarity and resentful language. PC, women, minorities, immigrants, whatever non-white groups he points to, they hate upon. That is the main marker of the current downward trajectory. It is extensible, as the thieving Chinese, the mooching Europeans, the immigrant-sending Central and South Americans, not to mention Muslims, can just as easily be made into scapegoats for what is, essentially, a White majority soon reduced to plurality status, and an empire in decline, to be superseded by the up and coming Chinese. So, those who understood themselves to be the rulers of both society at home and the world at large are facing a dethroning, which many seem to interpret, vaguely, as some sort of personal status loss. The reaction to that is somewhat understandable anger, particularly if coupled with, mostly among White working men, a severe decline in prospects and purchasing power, in conjunction with even worse prospects for their kids.

That, I am convinced, is the situation we're facing. There is next to nothing that can be done about the rise of the Chinese, there is next to be done about demographic changes, the only aspect that might be changed is a restoration of workers' bargaining power so as to increase their size of the economic pie, and guess who is most strenuously opposed to that...

***chuckles***
"I see a resentment-filled, perennially enraged White conservative majority"
What a difference a word makes! Where you say 'majority" I say "minority." I agree with most everything else in that context. There is a whole country full of white people who are disgusted with the whole thing...but feel that they keep getting poor choices..and I agree with them.

I would point out that the single data point of Race does not define the entirety of the economic story. White people own the vast majority of wealth in this country...and most of the political apparatus..just sayin'.....and if you consider substituting "Mainstream" For "White"----not nearly as much is going to change as some might think...nor as quickly.

This is why I'm not so panicked as the OP is...I see transformation where he see's dissolution. But is still true...that if we don't solve our problems regarding population and resource the point could be moot...I'll grant you that--but I think tech is the only viable answer to that..and tech requires a high functioning society. So I don't want stupid/and or crazy running my govt..

 

[Olde Europe]

***chuckles***
"I see a resentment-filled, perennially enraged White conservative majority"
What a difference a word makes! Where you say 'majority" I say "minority."

Grinning here. Yep, I might have expressed myself a bit haplessly: What I meant is that the majority of Whites, and White men in particular, are conservative, and they form the core of Trump's electoral support. And yes, race is a constituent part of that, as a White conservative majority, used to govern it all, and feeling entitled to look down on everyone not like "us", obviously is pulled into Trump's camp because he is blowing the sugar of White supremacy up their mostly flabby white arses. There is, quite plainly, no other viable explanation for that phenomenon.

All the while the mostly White farmers, badly mauled by Trump's trade war, are suicidal to a degree like they haven't been in living memory - and it doesn't seem to make a dent in their support for Trump. Explain that one, if you can.

 

[Crepitus]

Ok, since one of you obviously thought I was saying "kill all the republicans" and reported me I will clarify:

My actual meaning was purge all republicans from powerful positions, like president, senator, and dog catcher.

Not kill them, vote them outta office.

 

[Anathema]

Question: What do you think is the best method/way of helping minimize the the inevitable?

I don’t want the minimize the chaos. I want to see it maximized. Only by truly ridding ourselves of one side or the other will this country ever return to some semblance of order. Either the Government OR the People must be in charge. They cannot both Existvthinkibg they are in charge.

 

[luchitociencia]

I think that the change -if any- must start in ourselves.

If the future becomes more darker for the next generation is because we didn't take the necessary measurements to give them something better.

We see how unjust new laws are passed and we keep electing those politicians. This simply makes no sense. There is a kind of conformism which impedes us to notice that we are doing nothing to change the decaying in society.

What can we do? First, be the good example. Second stand in your principles regardless of what. This is a good beginning.

Third, taking action.

No more consenting unjust laws against decency. Paying no attention to the corrupt making claims, be solid and demand what is right, and right is what goes with moral, decency, integrity, those values which made this country the greatest in the world.

Demands in schools, in city council meetings, be united, no keeping silence anymore, repeat the phrase, "Enough! no more!"

Corrupt politicians won't fight for you, neither your neighbor and less your cousin. Take the initiative, first at home, later with friends, family, coworkers. This is how great changes happened in history, when the "regular" citizen woke up and decided that a change was needed.

If you are old, what more can you lose? Don't you think this last adventure is not worthy? Until when silence and bowing the head will be the answer? It is about you, your children, your grandchildren. Of course is worthy.

Fourth. Courage and be in a good mood. Best thing in the world is being in good mood, and being sure that you want what is the best for you and the rest on keeping society clean of perversion. It is not a task, it's a duty.

No worries about the economy. When you have a solid family and there is lack of funds, bread and onion taste wonderful as long as everybody feels united. Strength comes when ideals are the guidance.

The action is in us, we can wish lots of things to avoid the falling, however, our wishes won't change anything.

Your worries have a foundation, society is going down. If you want for that changing route to the opposite way, then the action starts with you.

There is no other way.

 

[Picaro]

It's pretty obvious this Country is on a downhill slide on a very slippery slope. If you don't believe that then there's no point in your posting anything.

Question: What do you think is the best method/way of helping minimize the the inevitable?

The metric I use to assess our situation is simple; when havoc is created, chaos ensues and catastrophe is inevitable. Historians will assign the time line(s) - or maybe your method/way involves addressing a particular time/grievance

Yes, I have an opinion- but, I'd like for people to stop and think about what they believe best path to take and present an implementation.

Our Founders believed in deporting traitors and deviants, and so we should have no qualms about doing that now. It's obvious Democrats have created an entire Party built on treason, ethnic cleansing, and sexual deviancy including pedophilia, so we can start by deporting all registered Democrats and others identified as 'progressives', and get rid of the main core of fifth columnists from our midst. Rebuilding the economy would be the second big project, after our population is finally reduced enough to be viable and table again. Bring back literacy and political science tests as requirements for voting is a big plus.

 

[buttercup]

Question: What do you think is the best method/way of helping minimize the the inevitable?

I agree that it’s inevitable, we’re past the point of no return. Instead of participating in the farce, all I want to do is wake people up, try to get people to see the bigger picture and what is coming.

 

[sparky]

Either the Government OR the People must be in charge

'we the people' became 'those in power' generations ago

Were our FF's to appear incarnate, i'd wager they'd be rather taken by our squandering of their doctrine

Your worries have a foundation, society is going down. If you want for that changing route to the opposite way, then the action starts with you.

That's easy for the reclusive who have no TV, don't read the news, and believe nothing from governance

~S~

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

stop voting for democrats and republicans,,,

Half right, anyway

 

[gipper]

Ok, since one of you obviously thought I was saying "kill all the republicans" and reported me I will clarify:

My actual meaning was purge all republicans from powerful positions, like president, senator, and dog catcher.

Not kill them, vote them outta office.

That won’t do much, since we would still have Democrats. Both parties need to be eliminated.

 

[Gdjjr]

I think that the change -if any- must start in ourselves.

If the future becomes more darker for the next generation is because we didn't take the necessary measurements to give them something better.

We see how unjust new laws are passed and we keep electing those politicians. This simply makes no sense. There is a kind of conformism which impedes us to notice that we are doing nothing to change the decaying in society.

What can we do? First, be the good example. Second stand in your principles regardless of what. This is a good beginning.

Third, taking action.

No more consenting unjust laws against decency. Paying no attention to the corrupt making claims, be solid and demand what is right, and right is what goes with moral, decency, integrity, those values which made this country the greatest in the world.

Demands in schools, in city council meetings, be united, no keeping silence anymore, repeat the phrase, "Enough! no more!"

Corrupt politicians won't fight for you, neither your neighbor and less your cousin. Take the initiative, first at home, later with friends, family, coworkers. This is how great changes happened in history, when the "regular" citizen woke up and decided that a change was needed.

If you are old, what more can you lose? Don't you think this last adventure is not worthy? Until when silence and bowing the head will be the answer? It is about you, your children, your grandchildren. Of course is worthy.

Fourth. Courage and be in a good mood. Best thing in the world is being in good mood, and being sure that you want what is the best for you and the rest on keeping society clean of perversion. It is not a task, it's a duty.

No worries about the economy. When you have a solid family and there is lack of funds, bread and onion taste wonderful as long as everybody feels united. Strength comes when ideals are the guidance.

The action is in us, we can wish lots of things to avoid the falling, however, our wishes won't change anything.

Your worries have a foundation, society is going down. If you want for that changing route to the opposite way, then the action starts with you.

There is no other way.

Ding, ding, ding we have a winner!

 

[Gdjjr]

To be honest, I don't see you getting into the weeds of specifics about how to change the current trajectory, either.

I did that for a reason- I know and have some opinions. I wanted to see if anyone else did vs attacking the messenger.
Most have offered up some well thought out responses but there are also a lot of reactions- I wanted to create an atmosphere of thought not tainted by my opinion- I have awarded a poster as the winner. His thoughts coincide with mine.

That, I am convinced, is the situation we're facing. There is next to nothing that can be done about the rise of the Chinese, there is next to be done about demographic changes, the only aspect that might be changed is a restoration of workers' bargaining power so as to increase their size of the economic pie, and guess who is most strenuously opposed to that...

This is all superficial. There is an underlying problem that creates the mind set that says these changes are bad.

 

[Gdjjr]

Trumpism, eh? Well, in its current iteration, I suppose. But the far right has always sang the same song...from Goldwater to Trump. This is the first time they've won...this big...since the 1950's. The same thing happened to the Democrats and the Far Left of the 1960's--to some degree that is what is ailing the Democrats..they too, have their issues with extremists. If either side actually ran someone who didn't have to become a caricature to win a primary---they'd get my vote...LOL.

This isn't about politicians, per se'- it isn't a left right paradigm either- and, BTW, Nixon won in a land slide- politicians are the ones who exacerbate the situations we face, and the Democrats are absolutely no better than Republicans. It could be argued they create them so voting for a different one will fix nothing.
There is no easy fix. It is simple, but simple isn't spelled easy. Nothing easy is worth having. Instant gratification will lead to instant regret. Both sides have had ample opportunity to change things, yet here we are facing the same things, only amplified, due to "instant" access offered by the internet.
So, what do you propose to correct, or change, the problems we see- and no, it's not just change. Change is inevitable, btw, but the direction of the change can be catastrophic and "instant" change will result in a catastrophic failure-

 

[EvilEyeFleegle]

Trumpism, eh? Well, in its current iteration, I suppose. But the far right has always sang the same song...from Goldwater to Trump. This is the first time they've won...this big...since the 1950's. The same thing happened to the Democrats and the Far Left of the 1960's--to some degree that is what is ailing the Democrats..they too, have their issues with extremists. If either side actually ran someone who didn't have to become a caricature to win a primary---they'd get my vote...LOL.

This isn't about politicians, per se'- it isn't a left right paradigm either- and, BTW, Nixon won in a land slide- politicians are the ones who exacerbate the situations we face, and the Democrats are absolutely no better than Republicans. It could be argued they create them so voting for a different one will fix nothing.
There is no easy fix. It is simple, but simple isn't spelled easy. Nothing easy is worth having. Instant gratification will lead to instant regret. Both sides have had ample opportunity to change things, yet here we are facing the same things, only amplified, due to "instant" access offered by the internet.
So, what do you propose to correct, or change, the problems we see- and no, it's not just change. Change is inevitable, btw, but the direction of the change can be catastrophic and "instant" change will result in a catastrophic failure-

Not sure you and I on the same page at all. BTW, Nixon distanced himself from the Far Right..he flirted to get votes...as he had a lot of Orange County friends..but he was always very careful to keep them at arms length. He never wallowed in the mud....like Trump.

I suspect that what you see as broken..and what i see..are two very different things. As I read the post you declared the 'winner' I was struck by both the non-specificity of the issues brought up...and then..I was struck by the 'dog-whistle' elements...he was speaking to those that already knew what he was talking about...and agreed.
Phrases like, "No more consenting unjust laws against decency", and the like.

I believe that I'm getting where you are coming from....Nope--we are NOT turning the clock back--the laws granting sexual freedom to consenting adults will stand. Roe v Wade will stand. Gays in the military..and in the mainstream of American life will continue to be accepted as the norm--and we will continue to teach our children not to hate others for their consenting lifestyle choices. Gay marriage will continue to be the law of the land...

And the world will not end because of it....

 

[dblack]

It's pretty obvious this Country is on a downhill slide on a very slippery slope. If you don't believe that then there's no point in your posting anything.

Question: What do you think is the best method/way of helping minimize the the inevitable?

The metric I use to assess our situation is simple; when havoc is created, chaos ensues and catastrophe is inevitable. Historians will assign the time line(s) - or maybe your method/way involves addressing a particular time/grievance

Yes, I have an opinion- but, I'd like for people to stop and think about what they believe best path to take and present an implementation.

I think it's probably too late, but the most important thing would be to change the way we do elections. Winner-take-all, plurality elections discourage consensus build encourage partisanship. We need a system that will favor candidates with wide appeal, like approval voting, or ranked-choice voting.

 

[Gdjjr]

Nope--we are NOT turning the clock back--the laws granting sexual freedom to consenting adults will stand. Roe v Wade will stand. Gays in the military..and in the mainstream of American life will continue to be accepted as the norm--and we will continue to teach our children not to hate others for their consenting lifestyle choices. Gay marriage will continue to be the law of the land...

That "straw man" introduction is just that- if that's what you read into the post I awarded the winner title to, you might consider wanting to did a little deeper than superficial straw men- superficial being key.

Not sure you and I on the same page at all. BTW, Nixon distanced himself from the Far Right

That's immaterial to what I said- he won in a land slide.

I suspect that what you see as broken..and what i see..are two very different things.

No kiddin-

To begin with, I don't see "broken" and nowhere have I said I do- I clearly said, 1) we have a problem, and 2) it's a slippery slope- the "laws" are just examples of the slope we're sliding down- the post I awarded the winner tag to said it pretty well, but not the words I would have used and have used elsewhere- the "problem" is; when havoc is created, chaos ensues and catastrophe is inevitable- it can't be avoided, only minimized- so, how do you propose minimizing the inevitable? I assure you it's not more laws against something because "we have to do something", which in most cases makes criminals of people who have caused no harm- but, I digress- there are 3 phases of natural disasters- havoc,chaos and catastrophe- we are living chaos so that leaves the inevitable catastrophe- like I said, Historians will assign the time lines and they can be argued all day long or til the cows get home whichever comes first- at this point they are immaterial- determining when and why comes at reconstructing so the next users are made aware and at least know what to avoid-

 

[sparky]

I wanted to see if anyone else did vs attacking the messenger.

well.....your going to find a lot of that here

Nixon won in a land slide

ah, i was a teen in HS when he flew off in his chopper

i didn't really have much political awareness then, what i do recall is the 'group relief' everyone seemed to have

kinda like the whole country took a dump at once....

~S~

 

[Gdjjr]

I wanted to see if anyone else did vs attacking the messenger.

well.....your going to find a lot of that here

Nixon won in a land slide

ah, i was a teen in HS when he flew off in his chopper

i didn't really have much political awareness then, what i do recall is the 'group relief' everyone seemed to have

kinda like the whole country took a dump at once....

~S~

I voted for him in that land slide- long before I was even aware, never mind politically aware LOL

 

[sartre play]

Think the country is going down the same path as this board, some want a discussion maybe learn or understand something. Most just want a verbal fist fight or spread as much mud on those they disagree with as possible.

 

[Andylusion]

It's pretty obvious this Country is on a downhill slide on a very slippery slope. If you don't believe that then there's no point in your posting anything.

Question: What do you think is the best method/way of helping minimize the the inevitable?

The metric I use to assess our situation is simple; when havoc is created, chaos ensues and catastrophe is inevitable. Historians will assign the time line(s) - or maybe your method/way involves addressing a particular time/grievance

Yes, I have an opinion- but, I'd like for people to stop and think about what they believe best path to take and present an implementation.

So I'm a Christian.... I stating that up front, so everyone knows my bias.

I think the solution that can turn the American culture, and thus country around, is for Christian men and women, to get married, stay married, and have lots of kids. 6 or more per family.

By teaching inherent Christian values to the next generation, and by out-breeding the pagans, we can reverse the decline of America.

That is my opinion.