Silencing Abortion Protesters: Should the time fit the crime?

[Procrustes Stretched]

I'd say a relatively light sentence should be the punishment---the time spent in jail, when a citizen is found guilty of silencing hateful protesters who poison the minds of little children. Do you know what I am talking about?

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/12/us/12slay.html

 

[Father Time]

Did anyone else find it funny when the pro-lifer called him quiet and unassuming, yet police said "He tended to carry big signs with very graphic pictures of fetuses." and that he's protested multiple times?

Anyway the murderer seems mentally unstable and since he also killed someone unrelated I doubt it was entirely abortion related.

Oh and no I do not think this man should get a light sentence for this murder.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I'd say a relatively light sentence should be the punishment---the time spent in jail, when a citizen is found guilty of silencing hateful protesters who poison the minds of little children. Do you know what I am talking about?

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/12/us/12slay.html

Ya be outraged and defiant that some doctor was murdered and demand the highest price, but hey this guy was just a protester, fuck him, right? Now where is Jillian to tell us how both sides oppose murder and mayhem?

And your opinion is just that JUST an opinion. Millions disagree with your opinion, but you do not mind if they get murdered, right? Unbelievable. You are one sick puppy.

 

[eots]

sounds like these pro lifers ...like 9/11 truthers or returning vets ..are without question a domestic terror threat...when does the TV movie of the week come out on this story ??

 

[JD_2B]

I'd say a relatively light sentence should be the punishment---the time spent in jail, when a citizen is found guilty of silencing hateful protesters who poison the minds of little children. Do you know what I am talking about?

This guy killed two people, this abortion protester, and a grocer. He should spend the rest of his life in prison! How can you say "a light jail sentence"? Did you even read the article you posted???

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

I'd say a relatively light sentence should be the punishment---the time spent in jail, when a citizen is found guilty of silencing hateful protesters who poison the minds of little children. Do you know what I am talking about?

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/12/us/12slay.html

Ya be outraged and defiant that some doctor was murdered and demand the highest price, but hey this guy was just a protester, fuck him, right? Now where is Jillian to tell us how both sides oppose murder and mayhem?

And your opinion is just that JUST an opinion. Millions disagree with your opinion, but you do not mind if they get murdered, right? Unbelievable. You are one sick puppy.

woof!

facts is I can't stand bigots and haters. too bad a mentally unstable guy had to go and kill one, but hey...thin the herd

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

I'd say a relatively light sentence should be the punishment---the time spent in jail, when a citizen is found guilty of silencing hateful protesters who poison the minds of little children. Do you know what I am talking about?

This guy killed two people, this abortion protester, and a grocer. He should spend the rest of his life in prison! How can you say "a light jail sentence"? Did you even read the article you posted???

some people might say as the pro lifers do about murderers that a public service was done. Ever hear of Randal Terry?

you people completely missed the point---as usual.

mani was right about you.

 

[Ryan]

I'd say a relatively light sentence should be the punishment---the time spent in jail, when a citizen is found guilty of silencing hateful protesters who poison the minds of little children. Do you know what I am talking about?

This guy killed two people, this abortion protester, and a grocer. He should spend the rest of his life in prison! How can you say "a light jail sentence"? Did you even read the article you posted???

some people might say as the pro lifers do about murderers that a public service was done. Ever hear of Randal Terry?

you people completely missed the point---as usual.

mani was right about you.

Yeah it sure is a shame that the "pro-lifers" aren't as consistent as you are on your 'pro-death' kick.

 

[JD_2B]

I'd say a relatively light sentence should be the punishment---the time spent in jail, when a citizen is found guilty of silencing hateful protesters who poison the minds of little children. Do you know what I am talking about?

This guy killed two people, this abortion protester, and a grocer. He should spend the rest of his life in prison! How can you say "a light jail sentence"? Did you even read the article you posted???

some people might say as the pro lifers do about murderers that a public service was done. Ever hear of Randal Terry?

you people completely missed the point---as usual.

mani was right about you.

I'm pro choice...not pro death. Hence my complaint againt your vying for a light sentence.. LOL

The only point I seemed to miss there was that apparently you have a very long history of being far more pro death than pro life!

Allow me to illustrate my point here- I am pro choice- which does not make me pro abortion. To use these inappropriate and vastly oversimplified labels on people reduces them all to this, which I will now provide in a listed format:

Pro-Life- A person who wants everyone to live forever and ever and never die- and all sperm to be made into people, and all eggs to be fertilized as a female baby-oven's reproductive timeline will allow. One who is not against welfare and public support for low income and child borne families (because they dont want to see people starve to death- or they would not be pro life, now would they?) These people do exist, however rare- and only very rarely do they play an active voice in the abortion/welfare debate.

Anti-abortion- A person who is against abortion, abortifacient contraceptives, certain contraceptives that can cause tearing in the uterine and fallopian walls, which may lead to a person even having the choice between a life saving abortion and their own demise (of course an anti abortionist will be adamantly against the life saving abortion, still), men who sit in hot tubs or wear athletic supporters while trying to conceive, as this excessive heat may cause damage to the DNA structure of the sperm, causing possible miscarriages or again, the need to choose between an abortion and a severely handicapped child (this applies to pro life too, although pro lifers and anti abortionists would clearly be more inclined to force the family to birth and raise the handicapped child, and the anti abortionist would be totally okay if the mother died during a difficult birthing process- while the pro lifer would prefer that the mother be kept alive as well as the child, by any means possible) These people do exist, and represent the majority of the people who commonly and erroneously refer to themselves as "pro life".

Pro abortion- these are people who want none other than for every single pregnancy that is not planned or is not timed right, or has any problems or is at any point just no longer wanted, to be terminated, thus ending our stint then formerly known as "humankind" here on earth. Clearly these people do not really exist, lol..

Pro Choice- WE are the people who LIKE that American women have the freedom to make decisions regarding their own bodies and all the happenings within them. We do not judge people based on what time of day they had sex, where, with whom, or for what reason. We do not judge people because they are not married. We recognize that many couples who are unmarried are having families, willingly. We also recognize that there are many couples who are up to their eyeballs in debt and who do not want any more children. We also think that adoption is a healthy choice to make, and we always hope that the person who makes their decision weighs out all of the pros and cons before committing to it. We see having children as being less of a Gift TO us, and more of a Gift FROM us, to the child. We see childbearing and parenting as a very serious responsibility filled with plenty of ups and downs, rather than being some "wonderous reward" from the heavens. WE understand that all females can DEFINITELY reproduce from the moment they begin menstruation until they are menopausal. WE know that this "period", excuse the pun, lasts women for anywhere between 25-35 years, and we do not place such high expectations of sexual gatekeeping on women, much less on the effectiveness of even long term, or even "permanent" birth control methods.
WE represent the majority. The majority DOES understand that being raped (for instance) is considered valid grounds for an abortion. The majority DOES understand that incest, and life threatening labor or pregnancy is also valid for pregnancy termination.
WE also understand that a killer is a killer, and should be punished and have his freedoms taken away for not respecting the very SANE people who walk into abortion clinics, every day of every year, to manage their very real and very understandable (by the vast majority) problem.

And that, my friend- is where YOU missed the point... and the bus.

 

[Megan_Fad]

This guy killed two people, this abortion protester, and a grocer. He should spend the rest of his life in prison! How can you say "a light jail sentence"? Did you even read the article you posted???

some people might say as the pro lifers do about murderers that a public service was done. Ever hear of Randal Terry?

you people completely missed the point---as usual.

mani was right about you.

I'm pro choice...not pro death. Hence my complaint againt your vying for a light sentence.. LOL

The only point I seemed to miss there was that apparently you have a very long history of being far more pro death than pro life!

Allow me to illustrate my point here- I am pro choice- which does not make me pro abortion. To use these inappropriate and vastly oversimplified labels on people reduces them all to this, which I will now provide in a listed format:

Pro-Life- A person who wants everyone to live forever and ever and never die- and all sperm to be made into people, and all eggs to be fertilized as a female baby-oven's reproductive timeline will allow. One who is not against welfare and public support for low income and child borne families (because they dont want to see people starve to death- or they would not be pro life, now would they?) These people do exist, however rare- and only very rarely do they play an active voice in the abortion/welfare debate.

Anti-abortion- A person who is against abortion, abortifacient contraceptives, certain contraceptives that can cause tearing in the uterine and fallopian walls, which may lead to a person even having the choice between a life saving abortion and their own demise (of course an anti abortionist will be adamantly against the life saving abortion, still), men who sit in hot tubs or wear athletic supporters while trying to conceive, as this excessive heat may cause damage to the DNA structure of the sperm, causing possible miscarriages or again, the need to choose between an abortion and a severely handicapped child (this applies to pro life too, although pro lifers and anti abortionists would clearly be more inclined to force the family to birth and raise the handicapped child, and the anti abortionist would be totally okay if the mother died during a difficult birthing process- while the pro lifer would prefer that the mother be kept alive as well as the child, by any means possible) These people do exist, and represent the majority of the people who commonly and erroneously refer to themselves as "pro life".

Pro abortion- these are people who want none other than for every single pregnancy that is not planned or is not timed right, or has any problems or is at any point just no longer wanted, to be terminated, thus ending our stint then formerly known as "humankind" here on earth. Clearly these people do not really exist, lol..

Pro Choice- WE are the people who LIKE that American women have the freedom to make decisions regarding their own bodies and all the happenings within them. We do not judge people based on what time of day they had sex, where, with whom, or for what reason. We do not judge people because they are not married. We recognize that many couples who are unmarried are having families, willingly. We also recognize that there are many couples who are up to their eyeballs in debt and who do not want any more children. We also think that adoption is a healthy choice to make, and we always hope that the person who makes their decision weighs out all of the pros and cons before committing to it. We see having children as being less of a Gift TO us, and more of a Gift FROM us, to the child. We see childbearing and parenting as a very serious responsibility filled with plenty of ups and downs, rather than being some "wonderous reward" from the heavens. WE understand that all females can DEFINITELY reproduce from the moment they begin menstruation until they are menopausal. WE know that this "period", excuse the pun, lasts women for anywhere between 25-35 years, and we do not place such high expectations of sexual gatekeeping on women, much less on the effectiveness of even long term, or even "permanent" birth control methods.
WE represent the majority. The majority DOES understand that being raped (for instance) is considered valid grounds for an abortion. The majority DOES understand that incest, and life threatening labor or pregnancy is also valid for pregnancy termination.
WE also understand that a killer is a killer, and should be punished and have his freedoms taken away for not respecting the very SANE people who walk into abortion clinics, every day of every year, to manage their very real and very understandable (by the vast majority) problem.

And that, my friend- is where YOU missed the point... and the bus.

Actually, you missed something here...that being that you should not pretend to speak for everyone who identifies themselves with the aforementioned groups. You have some very specific criteria listed above that not everyone who affiliates themselves with these groups will agree with. For instance, I happen to know some "pro-choice" people who DO judge people that have sex and are not married and have many other "judgmental" ideas. The idea I guess is they are all for choice on the abortion issue, but not on certain others.

Also you say that "pro-abortion" people do not exist by your above criteria, however I can most likely dig up a misanthrope or two would say they agree with your statement and consider themselves "pro-abortion" by your definition.

One thing you forgot however is to mention that although "pro-choice" people support all the choices you listed, the one choice they do not support is women making the choice to simply be born once conceived. Although the "post-birth" woman has the right to say "my body, may choice", the "pre-birth" woman has no say whatsoever over her body and is at the mercy of women who for the most part only see abortion as typical contraception, yet chose to throw arguments of rape and life and death in the faces of everyone else in an effort to legitimize their selfish "choice" of simply "erasing their mistake".

Oh yeah, you also forgot to mention the group of people who understand and support the idea of abortion for rape and medically confirmed life and death situations, but don't support it as an alternative for every day common sense, maturity, responsibility or contraceptive.

And before you start in on me about the whole "unwanted children and welfare" side of that argument, let me just say right now that no, I do not have all the answers to give you on a silver platter but I don't think that I have to have to have all the answers to know that some "choices" are just not right on a fundamental level. Perhaps if some irresponsible women couldn't just "erase their mistakes", they would have been forced to come up with the right answers by now. Then again maybe not. I am still in high school and haven't figured everything out yet like you have, so oh well..

 

[JD_2B]

Actually, you missed something here...that being that you should not pretend to speak for everyone who identifies themselves with the aforementioned groups. You have some very specific criteria listed above that not everyone who affiliates themselves with these groups will agree with. For instance, I happen to know some "pro-choice" people who DO judge people that have sex and are not married and have many other "judgmental" ideas. The idea I guess is they are all for choice on the abortion issue, but not on certain others.

Then you see- they are not pro choice.. lol

Also you say that "pro-abortion" people do not exist by your above criteria, however I can most likely dig up a misanthrope or two would say they agree with your statement and consider themselves "pro-abortion" by your definition.

That everyone has an abortion? That's ridiculous... But I believe you- no doubt you have some seriously twisted friends.

One thing you forgot however is to mention that although "pro-choice" people support all the choices you listed, the one choice they do not support is women making the choice to simply be born once conceived. Although the "post-birth" woman has the right to say "my body, may choice", the "pre-birth" woman has no say whatsoever over her body and is at the mercy of women who for the most part only see abortion as typical contraception, yet chose to throw arguments of rape and life and death in the faces of everyone else in an effort to legitimize their selfish "choice" of simply "erasing their mistake".

Yeah I did fail to add that in there, sorry- I thought that even the average bear could wrap its mind around that concept, without me having to type it out. Whoops!! My bad. Excuuuuse me!

Oh yeah, you also forgot to mention the group of people who understand and support the idea of abortion for rape and medically confirmed life and death situations, but don't support it as an alternative for every day common sense, maturity, responsibility or contraceptive.

Again- They are pro choice. Choice involves a persons ability to reason and decide for themselves for what reason they find adequate to terminate a pregnancy. And as long as we are on the topic of the reasons listed that this group (you among them, perhaps?) deems worthy of terminating a pregnancy, or as they would consider it- "kills the baby"- why are those reasons so big and other reasons, like not being informed about antibiotics causing birth control to fail- be so minor or irresponsible? Also, who are you to pass judgment on responsibility to those who choose to have sex without contraception? Catholics are taught at length how to have sex without contraception, and you are going to tell the ones who get pregnant that they were being irresponsible, so they should be forced through 9 months of pregnancy, 18 hours of excruciating labor, and 25-35 pounds of weight gain??? Really! Guess what- that is all very pro choice, still, even if that is a conservative, rather than liberal pro choice mindset.

And before you start in on me about the whole "unwanted children and welfare" side of that argument, let me just say right now that no, I do not have all the answers to give you on a silver platter but I don't think that I have to have to have all the answers to know that some "choices" are just not right on a fundamental level. Perhaps if some irresponsible women couldn't just "erase their mistakes", they would have been forced to come up with the right answers by now. Then again maybe not. I am still in high school and haven't figured everything out yet like you have, so oh well..

If answers came on a silver platter, then maybe you are right- maybe those women would have magically gotten their ducks in a row in the 8 months between finding out they were pregnant and being forced to birth.. Maybe the one who was getting her ass kicked by her boyfriend would suddenly meet Mr Right-who-doesn't-mind-and-can-and-will-support-her-and-another-man's-kid, and even be nice enough to not kick her ass as much as the last guy did.. Gee wouldnt that be just peachy? Or the one who already has 3 kids, but has no insurance, and cannot afford to get her tubes tied, who is in the sandwich generation, taking care of her mom who had a stroke, and cannot do anything for herself, and the out of work father.. Yeah a silver platter of answers is what we all need.. all those women need that. You teenagers really do know everything dont you?

By the way, the majority of women who abort already have kids, and just do not want to be like the women of Madagascar who all have a herd of people to feed- and a herd of people to, consequently, take care of them in their old age. The majority of women (who abort) tend to be making a very informed, and very responsible decision when they do so.

You are aware that you will have menses (your period) for between 25 and 35 years, right? You really and truly think that it is humanly possible to be responsible enough, rich enough, and have access to perfect working contraceptives, through that entire time?

Megan- you are going to have to learn to forgive, someday.. And these women who abort do forgive, especially themselves- not for aborting, but for getting pregnant in the first place. That is their only "mistake", and one that is VERY common. Did you also know that 50% of all women, worldwide will experience an unplanned pregnancy at some point in their lifetime? That doesn't mean that every one of these women will abort, and it doesnt mean that the ones whose bodies happen to function properly are irresponsible, and it doesnt mean that they should necessarily want to have even a first kid, much less a third or fourth. And it doesnt mean that they are heartless senseless people for deciding that they simply do not want to be PREGNANT.

A fetus is a fetus.. A baby is a person. You are not alive until you are born and breathing, IMHO. If you don't start breathing, you are stillborn. Even pro lifers call it that. (I base that on 1st- biblical teachings and 2nd- the law, of course)

 

[Yukon]

FACTOID: Abortion is legal and will remian so. In fact abortion has had the effect of reducing overall crime statistics.

 

[bodecea]

Did anyone else find it funny when the pro-lifer called him quiet and unassuming, yet police said "He tended to carry big signs with very graphic pictures of fetuses." and that he's protested multiple times?

Anyway the murderer seems mentally unstable and since he also killed someone unrelated I doubt it was entirely abortion related.

Oh and no I do not think this man should get a light sentence for this murder.

The man committed murder...two people as a matter of fact. Max him out.

 

[logical4u]

Actually, you missed something here...that being that you should not pretend to speak for everyone who identifies themselves with the aforementioned groups. You have some very specific criteria listed above that not everyone who affiliates themselves with these groups will agree with. For instance, I happen to know some "pro-choice" people who DO judge people that have sex and are not married and have many other "judgmental" ideas. The idea I guess is they are all for choice on the abortion issue, but not on certain others.

Then you see- they are not pro choice.. lol

Also you say that "pro-abortion" people do not exist by your above criteria, however I can most likely dig up a misanthrope or two would say they agree with your statement and consider themselves "pro-abortion" by your definition.

That everyone has an abortion? That's ridiculous... But I believe you- no doubt you have some seriously twisted friends.



Yeah I did fail to add that in there, sorry- I thought that even the average bear could wrap its mind around that concept, without me having to type it out. Whoops!! My bad. Excuuuuse me!

Oh yeah, you also forgot to mention the group of people who understand and support the idea of abortion for rape and medically confirmed life and death situations, but don't support it as an alternative for every day common sense, maturity, responsibility or contraceptive.

Again- They are pro choice. Choice involves a persons ability to reason and decide for themselves for what reason they find adequate to terminate a pregnancy. And as long as we are on the topic of the reasons listed that this group (you among them, perhaps?) deems worthy of terminating a pregnancy, or as they would consider it- "kills the baby"- why are those reasons so big and other reasons, like not being informed about antibiotics causing birth control to fail- be so minor or irresponsible? Also, who are you to pass judgment on responsibility to those who choose to have sex without contraception? Catholics are taught at length how to have sex without contraception, and you are going to tell the ones who get pregnant that they were being irresponsible, so they should be forced through 9 months of pregnancy, 18 hours of excruciating labor, and 25-35 pounds of weight gain??? Really! Guess what- that is all very pro choice, still, even if that is a conservative, rather than liberal pro choice mindset.

And before you start in on me about the whole "unwanted children and welfare" side of that argument, let me just say right now that no, I do not have all the answers to give you on a silver platter but I don't think that I have to have to have all the answers to know that some "choices" are just not right on a fundamental level. Perhaps if some irresponsible women couldn't just "erase their mistakes", they would have been forced to come up with the right answers by now. Then again maybe not. I am still in high school and haven't figured everything out yet like you have, so oh well..

If answers came on a silver platter, then maybe you are right- maybe those women would have magically gotten their ducks in a row in the 8 months between finding out they were pregnant and being forced to birth.. Maybe the one who was getting her ass kicked by her boyfriend would suddenly meet Mr Right-who-doesn't-mind-and-can-and-will-support-her-and-another-man's-kid, and even be nice enough to not kick her ass as much as the last guy did.. Gee wouldnt that be just peachy? Or the one who already has 3 kids, but has no insurance, and cannot afford to get her tubes tied, who is in the sandwich generation, taking care of her mom who had a stroke, and cannot do anything for herself, and the out of work father.. Yeah a silver platter of answers is what we all need.. all those women need that. You teenagers really do know everything dont you?

By the way, the majority of women who abort already have kids, and just do not want to be like the women of Madagascar who all have a herd of people to feed- and a herd of people to, consequently, take care of them in their old age. The majority of women (who abort) tend to be making a very informed, and very responsible decision when they do so.

You are aware that you will have menses (your period) for between 25 and 35 years, right? You really and truly think that it is humanly possible to be responsible enough, rich enough, and have access to perfect working contraceptives, through that entire time?

Megan- you are going to have to learn to forgive, someday.. And these women who abort do forgive, especially themselves- not for aborting, but for getting pregnant in the first place. That is their only "mistake", and one that is VERY common. Did you also know that 50% of all women, worldwide will experience an unplanned pregnancy at some point in their lifetime? That doesn't mean that every one of these women will abort, and it doesnt mean that the ones whose bodies happen to function properly are irresponsible, and it doesnt mean that they should necessarily want to have even a first kid, much less a third or fourth. And it doesnt mean that they are heartless senseless people for deciding that they simply do not want to be PREGNANT.

A fetus is a fetus.. A baby is a person. You are not alive until you are born and breathing, IMHO. If you don't start breathing, you are stillborn. Even pro lifers call it that. (I base that on 1st- biblical teachings and 2nd- the law, of course)

Pro-life is not about judgement. Christians are trying to educate women about their own spirituality. Abortion is murder of your own child. You will not hear about the guilt or feeling of resentment over being deceived (into believing that "thing" growing inside you has the possibility as maturing into something other than "human") from the "pro-choice" groups. They will not tell you that after the "proceedure" you will feel guilt for the rest of your life and that you will measure the time your "child" would have had with others' children of the same "age". They will not tell you at some point, you will see yourself as a murderer, and feel that there is no hope for "your" salvation, that you will be condemned to burn in hell, because you "chose" to kill your own child. They will not tell you that you may never forgive yourself or the ones that deceived you.
Pro-life is about helping women make fully "educated" decisions when it comes to "choice".
It is funny the pro-choicers never discuss the consequences of "choice" for either sex (consequence could be child, STD, feeling of inferiority) or of killing your own child. They work really hard to convince the public that an embryo and a fetus is not a human. If this is mentioned, they go off on "all" eggs and "all" sperm. They will not consider the statistics of one egg and one sperm actually joining at the right time to make a very, very, young human. Why do pro-choicers think life hinges on age?

 

[bodecea]

Actually, you missed something here...that being that you should not pretend to speak for everyone who identifies themselves with the aforementioned groups. You have some very specific criteria listed above that not everyone who affiliates themselves with these groups will agree with. For instance, I happen to know some "pro-choice" people who DO judge people that have sex and are not married and have many other "judgmental" ideas. The idea I guess is they are all for choice on the abortion issue, but not on certain others.

Then you see- they are not pro choice.. lol



That everyone has an abortion? That's ridiculous... But I believe you- no doubt you have some seriously twisted friends.



Yeah I did fail to add that in there, sorry- I thought that even the average bear could wrap its mind around that concept, without me having to type it out. Whoops!! My bad. Excuuuuse me!



Again- They are pro choice. Choice involves a persons ability to reason and decide for themselves for what reason they find adequate to terminate a pregnancy. And as long as we are on the topic of the reasons listed that this group (you among them, perhaps?) deems worthy of terminating a pregnancy, or as they would consider it- "kills the baby"- why are those reasons so big and other reasons, like not being informed about antibiotics causing birth control to fail- be so minor or irresponsible? Also, who are you to pass judgment on responsibility to those who choose to have sex without contraception? Catholics are taught at length how to have sex without contraception, and you are going to tell the ones who get pregnant that they were being irresponsible, so they should be forced through 9 months of pregnancy, 18 hours of excruciating labor, and 25-35 pounds of weight gain??? Really! Guess what- that is all very pro choice, still, even if that is a conservative, rather than liberal pro choice mindset.

And before you start in on me about the whole "unwanted children and welfare" side of that argument, let me just say right now that no, I do not have all the answers to give you on a silver platter but I don't think that I have to have to have all the answers to know that some "choices" are just not right on a fundamental level. Perhaps if some irresponsible women couldn't just "erase their mistakes", they would have been forced to come up with the right answers by now. Then again maybe not. I am still in high school and haven't figured everything out yet like you have, so oh well..

If answers came on a silver platter, then maybe you are right- maybe those women would have magically gotten their ducks in a row in the 8 months between finding out they were pregnant and being forced to birth.. Maybe the one who was getting her ass kicked by her boyfriend would suddenly meet Mr Right-who-doesn't-mind-and-can-and-will-support-her-and-another-man's-kid, and even be nice enough to not kick her ass as much as the last guy did.. Gee wouldnt that be just peachy? Or the one who already has 3 kids, but has no insurance, and cannot afford to get her tubes tied, who is in the sandwich generation, taking care of her mom who had a stroke, and cannot do anything for herself, and the out of work father.. Yeah a silver platter of answers is what we all need.. all those women need that. You teenagers really do know everything dont you?

By the way, the majority of women who abort already have kids, and just do not want to be like the women of Madagascar who all have a herd of people to feed- and a herd of people to, consequently, take care of them in their old age. The majority of women (who abort) tend to be making a very informed, and very responsible decision when they do so.

You are aware that you will have menses (your period) for between 25 and 35 years, right? You really and truly think that it is humanly possible to be responsible enough, rich enough, and have access to perfect working contraceptives, through that entire time?

Megan- you are going to have to learn to forgive, someday.. And these women who abort do forgive, especially themselves- not for aborting, but for getting pregnant in the first place. That is their only "mistake", and one that is VERY common. Did you also know that 50% of all women, worldwide will experience an unplanned pregnancy at some point in their lifetime? That doesn't mean that every one of these women will abort, and it doesnt mean that the ones whose bodies happen to function properly are irresponsible, and it doesnt mean that they should necessarily want to have even a first kid, much less a third or fourth. And it doesnt mean that they are heartless senseless people for deciding that they simply do not want to be PREGNANT.

A fetus is a fetus.. A baby is a person. You are not alive until you are born and breathing, IMHO. If you don't start breathing, you are stillborn. Even pro lifers call it that. (I base that on 1st- biblical teachings and 2nd- the law, of course)

Pro-life is not about judgement. Christians are trying to educate women about their own spirituality. Abortion is murder of your own child. You will not hear about the guilt or feeling of resentment over being deceived (into believing that "thing" growing inside you has the possibility as maturing into something other than "human") from the "pro-choice" groups. They will not tell you that after the "proceedure" you will feel guilt for the rest of your life and that you will measure the time your "child" would have had with others' children of the same "age". They will not tell you at some point, you will see yourself as a murderer, and feel that there is no hope for "your" salvation, that you will be condemned to burn in hell, because you "chose" to kill your own child. They will not tell you that you may never forgive yourself or the ones that deceived you.

Um, not everyone agrees with you on the god, murder, going to hell stuff, you know.

Pro-life is about helping women make fully "educated" decisions when it comes to "choice".
It is funny the pro-choicers never discuss the consequences of "choice" for either sex (consequence could be child, STD, feeling of inferiority) or of killing your own child. They work really hard to convince the public that an embryo and a fetus is not a human. If this is mentioned, they go off on "all" eggs and "all" sperm. They will not consider the statistics of one egg and one sperm actually joining at the right time to make a very, very, young human. Why do pro-choicers think life hinges on age?

It's not a child until it is viable. Or else all pregnant women would be able to drive in the car pool lane...they'd get two for one deals in places, etc.

 

[Megan_Fad]

Then you see- they are not pro choice.. lol

Oh well, how convenient for your argument then huh? Oh what a world it would be if we could all just pick and choose who fits what criteria for all of our arguments.

That everyone has an abortion? That's ridiculous... But I believe you- no doubt you have some seriously twisted friends.

Did I say they were my "friends"? I said they were misanthropes, go look up the definition. Next time either learn to read or do not twist my words.

Yeah I did fail to add that in there, sorry- I thought that even the average bear could wrap its mind around that concept, without me having to type it out. Whoops!! My bad. Excuuuuse me!

Actually I think the reason you left it out is because you didn't think of it first.

Again- They are pro choice. Choice involves a persons ability to reason and decide for themselves for what reason they find adequate to terminate a pregnancy.

So let me get this straight, someone can be "pro choice" even if they are against all abortions that are practiced for no other reason than regular contraceptive?

And as long as we are on the topic of the reasons listed that this group (you among them, perhaps?) deems worthy of terminating a pregnancy, or as they would consider it- "kills the baby"- why are those reasons so big and other reasons, like not being informed about antibiotics causing birth control to fail- be so minor or irresponsible?

Because rape is usually not done by consent? Even if someone says "I didn't know I would get pregnant", if they performed the act with consent then they need to know that act could have consequences and once again...people making adult decisions....you know.

Also, who are you to pass judgment on responsibility to those who choose to have sex without contraception?

Um...a free thinking, intelligent individual with the ability to form opinions and ideas about the world around me and the society I live in?

Now, let me ask you who YOU are to pass judgment on those same people. Like it or not, you have done the same thing I have, only your judgment is of the differing side of the topic. That does not make it any less of a judgment though.

Catholics are taught at length how to have sex without contraception, and you are going to tell the ones who get pregnant that they were being irresponsible, so they should be forced through 9 months of pregnancy, 18 hours of excruciating labor, and 25-35 pounds of weight gain??? Really! Guess what- that is all very pro choice, still, even if that is a conservative, rather than liberal pro choice mindset.

Um..the Catholics who are taught not to use contraceptive are also taught to not have abortions. So if they are going to go against one of those two church teachings anyway...well...guess which I wold prefer?

If answers came on a silver platter, then maybe you are right- maybe those women would have magically gotten their ducks in a row in the 8 months between finding out they were pregnant and being forced to birth.

Well good thing I don't believe in leprechauns and starlight sprinkles then huh? I never said magically. Once again, please learn to read or stop putting words in my mouth. What I said was, if they did not have the option to just "erase their mistakes", then perhaps in the last 30 or 40 years, someone would have come up with an answer.

Maybe the one who was getting her ass kicked by her boyfriend would suddenly meet Mr Right-who-doesn't-mind-and-can-and-will-support-her-and-another-man's-kid, and even be nice enough to not kick her ass as much as the last guy did.. Gee wouldnt that be just peachy? Or the one who already has 3 kids, but has no insurance, and cannot afford to get her tubes tied, who is in the sandwich generation, taking care of her mom who had a stroke, and cannot do anything for herself, and the out of work father.. Yeah a silver platter of answers is what we all need.. all those women need that.

Just because I, a teenage high school student, do not have the answer to this rather complicated and complex social and political issue does not mean the current solution that you support is the right one.

You teenagers really do know everything dont you?

I could swear that I admitted, more than once, that I do not have the answers to everything. Are you sure that you know how to read? Because the other option is that you have to selectively ignore certain parts of my posts to prove your point.

By the way, the majority of women who abort already have kids, and just do not want to be like the women of Madagascar who all have a herd of people to feed- and a herd of people to, consequently, take care of them in their old age. The majority of women (who abort) tend to be making a very informed, and very responsible decision when they do so.

Now if we can just get them to make a "very informed, and very responsible decision" a couple of months sooner, things will be better.

You are aware that you will have menses (your period) for between 25 and 35 years, right? You really and truly think that it is humanly possible to be responsible enough, rich enough, and have access to perfect working contraceptives, through that entire time?

Even if I am not, in my way of thinking, it does not give me the right to erase a life just to make myself feel better.

Megan- you are going to have to learn to forgive, someday.. And these women who abort do forgive, especially themselves- not for aborting, but for getting pregnant in the first place. That is their only "mistake", and one that is VERY common. Did you also know that 50% of all women, worldwide will experience an unplanned pregnancy at some point in their lifetime? That doesn't mean that every one of these women will abort, and it doesnt mean that the ones whose bodies happen to function properly are irresponsible, and it doesnt mean that they should necessarily want to have even a first kid, much less a third or fourth. And it doesnt mean that they are heartless senseless people for deciding that they simply do not want to be PREGNANT.

Actually, if they don't want kids and they still get pregnant, it DOES mean they are irresponsible. It is a tough argument to push on me that these women do not know that sex can lead to pregnancy, even if you are on birth control.

A fetus is a fetus.. A baby is a person. You are not alive until you are born and breathing, IMHO. If you don't start breathing, you are stillborn. Even pro lifers call it that. (I base that on 1st- biblical teachings and 2nd- the law, of course)

Well as you stated, that is your opinion. Mine just so happens to be different.

 

[Yukon]

If you dont want to have an abortion than dont have one. If you want an abortion than have one. It's called FREE CHOICE - something Conservatives just dont understand.

Fr. Yukon
(ex-RC Rriest foir 16 years?

 

[Megan_Fad]

If you dont want to have an abortion than dont have one. If you want an abortion than have one. It's called FREE CHOICE - something Conservatives just dont understand.

Fr. Yukon
(ex-RC Rriest foir 16 years?

THATS RIGHT! Damn conservatives! If you want to rape, plunder, murder, burn old women, stomp on new born babies, sodomize puppies and shove baby seals into blenders, it is called FREE CHOICE! You bunch of right wing nut job assholes...who do you think you are? Telling me to have some decency and morals in my life and learn how to make responsible decisions... damn buzz kills. I have FREE CHOICE...don't infringe on my right to choose!

 

[logical4u]

Then you see- they are not pro choice.. lol



That everyone has an abortion? That's ridiculous... But I believe you- no doubt you have some seriously twisted friends.



Yeah I did fail to add that in there, sorry- I thought that even the average bear could wrap its mind around that concept, without me having to type it out. Whoops!! My bad. Excuuuuse me!



Again- They are pro choice. Choice involves a persons ability to reason and decide for themselves for what reason they find adequate to terminate a pregnancy. And as long as we are on the topic of the reasons listed that this group (you among them, perhaps?) deems worthy of terminating a pregnancy, or as they would consider it- "kills the baby"- why are those reasons so big and other reasons, like not being informed about antibiotics causing birth control to fail- be so minor or irresponsible? Also, who are you to pass judgment on responsibility to those who choose to have sex without contraception? Catholics are taught at length how to have sex without contraception, and you are going to tell the ones who get pregnant that they were being irresponsible, so they should be forced through 9 months of pregnancy, 18 hours of excruciating labor, and 25-35 pounds of weight gain??? Really! Guess what- that is all very pro choice, still, even if that is a conservative, rather than liberal pro choice mindset.



If answers came on a silver platter, then maybe you are right- maybe those women would have magically gotten their ducks in a row in the 8 months between finding out they were pregnant and being forced to birth.. Maybe the one who was getting her ass kicked by her boyfriend would suddenly meet Mr Right-who-doesn't-mind-and-can-and-will-support-her-and-another-man's-kid, and even be nice enough to not kick her ass as much as the last guy did.. Gee wouldnt that be just peachy? Or the one who already has 3 kids, but has no insurance, and cannot afford to get her tubes tied, who is in the sandwich generation, taking care of her mom who had a stroke, and cannot do anything for herself, and the out of work father.. Yeah a silver platter of answers is what we all need.. all those women need that. You teenagers really do know everything dont you?

By the way, the majority of women who abort already have kids, and just do not want to be like the women of Madagascar who all have a herd of people to feed- and a herd of people to, consequently, take care of them in their old age. The majority of women (who abort) tend to be making a very informed, and very responsible decision when they do so.

You are aware that you will have menses (your period) for between 25 and 35 years, right? You really and truly think that it is humanly possible to be responsible enough, rich enough, and have access to perfect working contraceptives, through that entire time?

Megan- you are going to have to learn to forgive, someday.. And these women who abort do forgive, especially themselves- not for aborting, but for getting pregnant in the first place. That is their only "mistake", and one that is VERY common. Did you also know that 50% of all women, worldwide will experience an unplanned pregnancy at some point in their lifetime? That doesn't mean that every one of these women will abort, and it doesnt mean that the ones whose bodies happen to function properly are irresponsible, and it doesnt mean that they should necessarily want to have even a first kid, much less a third or fourth. And it doesnt mean that they are heartless senseless people for deciding that they simply do not want to be PREGNANT.

A fetus is a fetus.. A baby is a person. You are not alive until you are born and breathing, IMHO. If you don't start breathing, you are stillborn. Even pro lifers call it that. (I base that on 1st- biblical teachings and 2nd- the law, of course)

Pro-life is not about judgement. Christians are trying to educate women about their own spirituality. Abortion is murder of your own child. You will not hear about the guilt or feeling of resentment over being deceived (into believing that "thing" growing inside you has the possibility as maturing into something other than "human") from the "pro-choice" groups. They will not tell you that after the "proceedure" you will feel guilt for the rest of your life and that you will measure the time your "child" would have had with others' children of the same "age". They will not tell you at some point, you will see yourself as a murderer, and feel that there is no hope for "your" salvation, that you will be condemned to burn in hell, because you "chose" to kill your own child. They will not tell you that you may never forgive yourself or the ones that deceived you.

Um, not everyone agrees with you on the god, murder, going to hell stuff, you know.


It's not a child until it is viable. Or else all pregnant women would be able to drive in the car pool lane...they'd get two for one deals in places, etc.

If you kill a living child, is it murder? If you kill a teen, is it murder? If you kill an adult, is it murder? Your definition of "human" depends on the age. You, in your infinite wisdom have decided that since a different term can be used for a person before they exist the womb alive, allows, you, to redefine life. If a human embryo is in a woman's womb and survives (without killing) the womb, is there any chance that embryo will evolve into another species? Or will that tiny, tiny life become a little girl or boy (if they are not killed)?

You don't have to agree with me on G*d, murder and going to hell stuff, to experience many of those feelings. I was pointing out that those that think abortion is a good thing (pro-choice), never consider the affects that an abortion will have on the "mother".

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

If you dont want to have an abortion than dont have one. If you want an abortion than have one. It's called FREE CHOICE - something Conservatives just dont understand.

Fr. Yukon
(ex-RC Rriest foir 16 years?

THATS RIGHT! Damn conservatives! If you want to rape, plunder, murder, burn old women, stomp on new born babies, sodomize puppies and shove baby seals into blenders, it is called FREE CHOICE! You bunch of right wing nut job assholes...who do you think you are? Telling me to have some decency and morals in my life and learn how to make responsible decisions... damn buzz kills. I have FREE CHOICE...don't infringe on my right to choose!

your critical thinking skills are in the toilet. now about that shit you call responsible decisions...where do you get the info/data to back up your opinions and world view of what is responsible and what is not? are you a holy roller or some kind of busy body who keeps a score card of how you rate against those heathen masses?