“Shovel Ready Jobs”

You need to slow your roll here a bit, junior. I'm a commercial electrician and it involves a LOT of digging. How do you think that power gets from the line to the building? The Force?

With few exceptions, most of us are powered by the desire to do the job and do it right. Now if you think you can android your way into running 300 feet of 4" condiut x 4, 6 feet down and encase in concrete to a slab that hasn't been poured yet AND get it inside a wall that isn't built yet, I've got a job for you.

Then you only have to pull the wire feeders into a panel and hook them up correctly so you don't blow the building up the second you turn the power on and if you want to do that powered by drugs, alcohol, ignorance or any combination thereof I GUARANTEE your ass a SHORT career.

The biggest joke is your ignorant post. You don't know what you're talking about.

And it's getting tougher Gunny. The Electrician I've been helping for years is currently in school to get his Master Electrician. If he doesn't get it, in 2013 he won't be wiring anything anymore in Wisconsin. Funny thing is, I've been helping him study because I have a degree in Electrical Engineering, and this class and the code book reads more like electrical engineering that it does electrical wiring.
That is another big problem. We have people throughout the construction industry that know their job inside out yet there are those out there that think they should have to go get a college degree and learned loads of non applicable crap before they can perform that work?

Like I said earlier, stupid government regulations and stupid government laws.
 
If I hear the term “Shovel Ready Jobs” one more time, I think I’m going to loose it. Who the hell wants a job that includes shoveling or physical labor for that matter??? Have you ever been on a construction jobsite? Most of the workers like androids powered by alcohol, drugs, ignorance, or a combination thereof, with few exceptions. Their knowledge is limited to the repetitiveness of the tasks they’re taught to perform. Those tasks are invariably dictated to them by foremen who are little more than liaisons between an engineering company and the robots performing the actual construction tasks.

So who are all these people that are going to fill these “shovel ready jobs” that are going to save the country and what are we going to do with them when the job is done or the money runs out?

This has to be the biggest joke perpetrated on the American people since the 16th amendment was passed.
giving the fact my brother owns a contruction company and my other brother is his framer your statement may be true sometimes but not usually. My brother hires very skilled people mostly because he wants a good product. Now the people who have to clean up the site afterwords and do the shit work, is a different story.
 
Here's a job scenario for an example:
The owner of these lots wants to use the debris as base fill and pipe bedding. The base fill is allowed to be 3" material but the pipe bedding has to be 3/4" material. Neither is allowed to have any steel in it. How many Tons of usable material are in this picture? Any non-usable material must be removed from the site. How much material has to be removed? Notice the two machines in the picture. They are not rented machines but are in fact owned by an individual. The crane costs how much? The excavator costs how much?
The grapple is a 3+2. How much does it cost? What else do you see in this picture? The job calls for completion in 21 days with no bad weather clause. How many days to "get 'er done?" Also, the water, sewer and electric have to be stubbed back and connectible for re-use according to code. How many workers doing what kind of work will it take? Would you hire out of work IT professionals and out of work bankers to do this job? Perhaps out of work union school teachers, an HR person, an insurance underwriter, a wall street exec who's out on bond or maybe a self employed yoga teacher? What kind of help would you hire? Remember, you have to meet all of the state, city and federal requirements to man this job and perform the work.

rodishi-albums-stuff-picture285-rubble-pile.jpg
 
my dad never was sick, by the time he left his government job and retired, he had 60 some days or more of sicktime, in which they PAID him....
I think you can only carry over half, each year if you do not use them....
at the last corp I worked for, they did allow you to carry over half of your sick time, each year...

Corpoprations are pretty laxed with their benefits as well...as our government is...from my experience
The feds allow you to accrue all sick leave earned and up to 240 hours of annual leave can be carried over.
Government jobs have excellent benefits


most of the construction jobs are held by hispanics.. a lot of them illegal.. they work,, they work hard,, they don't pay taxes,, they send their money to mexico and they vote democrat... everybody is happy.. stimulus money make mexico happy! :clap2:

they all vote? got any proof of that? how many illegals have been caught voting?

I don't care about them voting, I care that they are even allowed to live and work here. The government has failed us miserably on immigration and border security.
 
If I hear the term “Shovel Ready Jobs” one more time, I think I’m going to loose it. Who the hell wants a job that includes shoveling or physical labor for that matter??? Have you ever been on a construction jobsite? Most of the workers like androids powered by alcohol, drugs, ignorance, or a combination thereof, with few exceptions. Their knowledge is limited to the repetitiveness of the tasks they’re taught to perform. Those tasks are invariably dictated to them by foremen who are little more than liaisons between an engineering company and the robots performing the actual construction tasks.

So who are all these people that are going to fill these “shovel ready jobs” that are going to save the country and what are we going to do with them when the job is done or the money runs out?

This has to be the biggest joke perpetrated on the American people since the 16th amendment was passed.

You need to slow your roll here a bit, junior. I'm a commercial electrician and it involves a LOT of digging. How do you think that power gets from the line to the building? The Force?

With few exceptions, most of us are powered by the desire to do the job and do it right. Now if you think you can android your way into running 300 feet of 4" condiut x 4, 6 feet down and encase in concrete to a slab that hasn't been poured yet AND get it inside a wall that isn't built yet, I've got a job for you.

Then you only have to pull the wire feeders into a panel and hook them up correctly so you don't blow the building up the second you turn the power on and if you want to do that powered by drugs, alcohol, ignorance or any combination thereof I GUARANTEE your ass a SHORT career.

The biggest joke is your ignorant post. You don't know what you're talking about.

NoBrains is used to THIS:

US contractor in Iraq accused of electrocution deaths

Jul 11, 2008

WASHINGTON (AFP) — The biggest US military contractor in Iraq, KBR, was steeped in another scandal Friday as lawmakers, families and experts accused it of recklessly causing the electrocution deaths of US soldiers.

"While I had always been prepared to hear that one of my sons died by way of a firefight or a roadside bomb, I was dumbstruck to hear that my son was electrocuted while taking a shower in his living quarters," said Cheryl Harris, mother of army Staff Sergeant Ryan Maseth, who died in January.

Maseth's "burnt and smoldering" body was found under still-running, electrically charged water by a fellow soldier who kicked down the door of the bathroom at an army base in Baghdad, Harris told a hearing of the Senate Democratic policy committee.

KBR, a former subsidiary of the Halliburton energy firm which was once led by Vice President Dick Cheney, was contracted to maintain facilities at the base and had been informed of electrical problems in the building where Maseth died.

But, said Harris, KBR showed "extreme recklessness and a total disregard for public safety" by failing to fix the problem as well as others that have caused at least 13 electrocution deaths among soldiers and civilian contract workers in Iraq.

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5ggIzyaVjgrtoH9EBT4obMw3JIq4Q

That's totally unsat. "Extreme recklessness and a total disregard for public safety" translates into shortcut artists. Even then it takes a special kind of idiot to get the electricity into a water supply.
 
If I hear the term “Shovel Ready Jobs” one more time, I think I’m going to loose it. Who the hell wants a job that includes shoveling or physical labor for that matter??? Have you ever been on a construction jobsite? Most of the workers like androids powered by alcohol, drugs, ignorance, or a combination thereof, with few exceptions. Their knowledge is limited to the repetitiveness of the tasks they’re taught to perform. Those tasks are invariably dictated to them by foremen who are little more than liaisons between an engineering company and the robots performing the actual construction tasks.

So who are all these people that are going to fill these “shovel ready jobs” that are going to save the country and what are we going to do with them when the job is done or the money runs out?

This has to be the biggest joke perpetrated on the American people since the 16th amendment was passed.

You need to slow your roll here a bit, junior. I'm a commercial electrician and it involves a LOT of digging. How do you think that power gets from the line to the building? The Force?

With few exceptions, most of us are powered by the desire to do the job and do it right. Now if you think you can android your way into running 300 feet of 4" condiut x 4, 6 feet down and encase in concrete to a slab that hasn't been poured yet AND get it inside a wall that isn't built yet, I've got a job for you.

Then you only have to pull the wire feeders into a panel and hook them up correctly so you don't blow the building up the second you turn the power on and if you want to do that powered by drugs, alcohol, ignorance or any combination thereof I GUARANTEE your ass a SHORT career.

The biggest joke is your ignorant post. You don't know what you're talking about.
Plus how many people out there think that you should do that work for ten bucks an hour... And LIKE IT!

$10. an hour will not support a family.
 
If I hear the term “Shovel Ready Jobs” one more time, I think I’m going to loose it. Who the hell wants a job that includes shoveling or physical labor for that matter??? Have you ever been on a construction jobsite? Most of the workers like androids powered by alcohol, drugs, ignorance, or a combination thereof, with few exceptions. Their knowledge is limited to the repetitiveness of the tasks they’re taught to perform. Those tasks are invariably dictated to them by foremen who are little more than liaisons between an engineering company and the robots performing the actual construction tasks.

So who are all these people that are going to fill these “shovel ready jobs” that are going to save the country and what are we going to do with them when the job is done or the money runs out?

This has to be the biggest joke perpetrated on the American people since the 16th amendment was passed.

You need to slow your roll here a bit, junior. I'm a commercial electrician and it involves a LOT of digging. How do you think that power gets from the line to the building? The Force?

With few exceptions, most of us are powered by the desire to do the job and do it right. Now if you think you can android your way into running 300 feet of 4" condiut x 4, 6 feet down and encase in concrete to a slab that hasn't been poured yet AND get it inside a wall that isn't built yet, I've got a job for you.

Then you only have to pull the wire feeders into a panel and hook them up correctly so you don't blow the building up the second you turn the power on and if you want to do that powered by drugs, alcohol, ignorance or any combination thereof I GUARANTEE your ass a SHORT career.

The biggest joke is your ignorant post. You don't know what you're talking about.

And it's getting tougher Gunny. The Electrician I've been helping for years is currently in school to get his Master Electrician. If he doesn't get it, in 2013 he won't be wiring anything anymore in Wisconsin. Funny thing is, I've been helping him study because I have a degree in Electrical Engineering, and this class and the code book reads more like electrical engineering that it does electrical wiring.

The National Electrical Code makes military manuals look like easy stuff.:lol:

I don't see why he would not be wiring anything in WI without a Master's License. A Master's license is required to bid contracts and pull permits here. A journeyman's license is all that's needed to work for an electrical contractor.

So are you saying if he doesn't get the license he will have to work for someone else rather than himself? That I can understand. That he can't work at all without a master's I can't understand.
 
If I hear the term “Shovel Ready Jobs” one more time, I think I’m going to loose it. Who the hell wants a job that includes shoveling or physical labor for that matter??? Have you ever been on a construction jobsite? Most of the workers like androids powered by alcohol, drugs, ignorance, or a combination thereof, with few exceptions. Their knowledge is limited to the repetitiveness of the tasks they’re taught to perform. Those tasks are invariably dictated to them by foremen who are little more than liaisons between an engineering company and the robots performing the actual construction tasks.

So who are all these people that are going to fill these “shovel ready jobs” that are going to save the country and what are we going to do with them when the job is done or the money runs out?

This has to be the biggest joke perpetrated on the American people since the 16th amendment was passed.

You need to slow your roll here a bit, junior. I'm a commercial electrician and it involves a LOT of digging. How do you think that power gets from the line to the building? The Force?

With few exceptions, most of us are powered by the desire to do the job and do it right. Now if you think you can android your way into running 300 feet of 4" condiut x 4, 6 feet down and encase in concrete to a slab that hasn't been poured yet AND get it inside a wall that isn't built yet, I've got a job for you.

Then you only have to pull the wire feeders into a panel and hook them up correctly so you don't blow the building up the second you turn the power on and if you want to do that powered by drugs, alcohol, ignorance or any combination thereof I GUARANTEE your ass a SHORT career.

The biggest joke is your ignorant post. You don't know what you're talking about.
And you’re full of shit. On every commercial construction job I've ever been part of, those
electricians and plumbers show up with helpers that do their digging and those guys are using labor-pools for help, as well. I'm talking about grunt LABOR, not licensed tradesmen. Shovel ready jobs, what a joke.

I'm full of shit? Now YOU know what I every day for a living better than I? You're damned right we have apprentices. So. Where do you think the journeymen come from?

And we do NOT use labor pools. And when that ditch needs to be dug any journeyman worth two shits is the ditch with a shovel right alongside his helpers if need be.

What is it you claim as a profession again? I just want to see what perspective is being used to tell me my business.

And I'll be damned-sure to tell the owner of the company I work for you said I don't have to dig.:eusa_hand:
 
You need to slow your roll here a bit, junior. I'm a commercial electrician and it involves a LOT of digging. How do you think that power gets from the line to the building? The Force?

With few exceptions, most of us are powered by the desire to do the job and do it right. Now if you think you can android your way into running 300 feet of 4" condiut x 4, 6 feet down and encase in concrete to a slab that hasn't been poured yet AND get it inside a wall that isn't built yet, I've got a job for you.

Then you only have to pull the wire feeders into a panel and hook them up correctly so you don't blow the building up the second you turn the power on and if you want to do that powered by drugs, alcohol, ignorance or any combination thereof I GUARANTEE your ass a SHORT career.

The biggest joke is your ignorant post. You don't know what you're talking about.

And it's getting tougher Gunny. The Electrician I've been helping for years is currently in school to get his Master Electrician. If he doesn't get it, in 2013 he won't be wiring anything anymore in Wisconsin. Funny thing is, I've been helping him study because I have a degree in Electrical Engineering, and this class and the code book reads more like electrical engineering that it does electrical wiring.

The National Electrical Code makes military manuals look like easy stuff.:lol:

I don't see why he would not be wiring anything in WI without a Master's License. A Master's license is required to bid contracts and pull permits here. A journeyman's license is all that's needed to work for an electrical contractor.

So are you saying if he doesn't get the license he will have to work for someone else rather than himself? That I can understand. That he can't work at all without a master's I can't understand.

Yeah that's what I mean. He'd have to work under a Master, and then everything he wired would have to be inspected by a Master. He's licensed, but that won't be good enough in a few years.
 
You need to slow your roll here a bit, junior. I'm a commercial electrician and it involves a LOT of digging. How do you think that power gets from the line to the building? The Force?

With few exceptions, most of us are powered by the desire to do the job and do it right. Now if you think you can android your way into running 300 feet of 4" condiut x 4, 6 feet down and encase in concrete to a slab that hasn't been poured yet AND get it inside a wall that isn't built yet, I've got a job for you.

Then you only have to pull the wire feeders into a panel and hook them up correctly so you don't blow the building up the second you turn the power on and if you want to do that powered by drugs, alcohol, ignorance or any combination thereof I GUARANTEE your ass a SHORT career.

The biggest joke is your ignorant post. You don't know what you're talking about.
And you’re full of shit. On every commercial construction job I've ever been part of, those
electricians and plumbers show up with helpers that do their digging and those guys are using labor-pools for help, as well. I'm talking about grunt LABOR, not licensed tradesmen. Shovel ready jobs, what a joke.

I'm full of shit? Now YOU know what I every day for a living better than I? You're damned right we have apprentices. So. Where do you think the journeymen come from?

And we do NOT use labor pools. And when that ditch needs to be dug any journeyman worth two shits is the ditch with a shovel right alongside his helpers if need be.

What is it you claim as a profession again? I just want to see what perspective is being used to tell me my business.

And I'll be damned-sure to tell the owner of the company I work for you said I don't have to dig.:eusa_hand:

Show me where in this thread where I even came close insinuating that I know your job better than you. Maybe in your neck of the woods small businesses can’t or don’t use temps, but down here in the south its not uncommon, especially in smaller mom and pop type businesses, including electrical companies. They’ll put their journeymen on a job with a temp. It happens all the time, especially when they get behind.

Thanks for answering my question though. Now I know who’s going to fill all these "shovel ready jobs" your boy up there in the white House keeps talking about. ELECTRICIANS!
 
And you’re full of shit. On every commercial construction job I've ever been part of, those
electricians and plumbers show up with helpers that do their digging and those guys are using labor-pools for help, as well. I'm talking about grunt LABOR, not licensed tradesmen. Shovel ready jobs, what a joke.

I'm full of shit? Now YOU know what I every day for a living better than I? You're damned right we have apprentices. So. Where do you think the journeymen come from?

And we do NOT use labor pools. And when that ditch needs to be dug any journeyman worth two shits is the ditch with a shovel right alongside his helpers if need be.

What is it you claim as a profession again? I just want to see what perspective is being used to tell me my business.

And I'll be damned-sure to tell the owner of the company I work for you said I don't have to dig.:eusa_hand:

Show me where in this thread where I even came close insinuating that I know your job better than you. Maybe in your neck of the woods small businesses can’t or don’t use temps, but down here in the south its not uncommon, especially in smaller mom and pop type businesses, including electrical companies. They’ll put their journeymen on a job with a temp. It happens all the time, especially when they get behind.

Thanks for answering my question though. Now I know who’s going to fill all these "shovel ready jobs" your boy up there in the white House keeps talking about. ELECTRICIANS!

Boohoo ... some US citizens will have to get their hands dirty even though they have degrees ... the horror! ... the horror!
 
Boohoo ... some US citizens will have to get their hands dirty even though they have degrees ... the horror! ... the horror!

We've got crane operators with masters' - why not ditch-diggers? Beats waiting in line for a handout and complaining about the lack of jobs while you're waiting. ;)
 
Boohoo ... some US citizens will have to get their hands dirty even though they have degrees ... the horror! ... the horror!

We've got crane operators with masters' - why not ditch-diggers? Beats waiting in line for a handout and complaining about the lack of jobs while you're waiting. ;)

Yep. It's annoying that so many Americans have no work ethic anymore, when everything is roses they rant and rave they aren't getting paid enough while sitting at a desk posting on Youtube like AOLers (Weird Al reference) but when a recession hits they just whine and complain about it in the unemployment line instead of getting out an picking up the slack they caused in the first place.
 
And it's getting tougher Gunny. The Electrician I've been helping for years is currently in school to get his Master Electrician. If he doesn't get it, in 2013 he won't be wiring anything anymore in Wisconsin. Funny thing is, I've been helping him study because I have a degree in Electrical Engineering, and this class and the code book reads more like electrical engineering that it does electrical wiring.
That is another big problem. We have people throughout the construction industry that know their job inside out yet there are those out there that think they should have to go get a college degree and learned loads of non applicable crap before they can perform that work?[/QUOTE]




I've a family member who has only a high school education but has managed to move up astoundingly high in construction, etc. and is regularly getting new job offers because they spent 20+ years on the job. They know it inside and out (as employee, employer, management) and that has made them extremely valuable and marketable.

But that is definitely an exception to the rule. Odd thing - they know so much more than others who have a lovely degree on the wall. There is no substitute for OJT.
 
And you’re full of shit. On every commercial construction job I've ever been part of, those
electricians and plumbers show up with helpers that do their digging and those guys are using labor-pools for help, as well. I'm talking about grunt LABOR, not licensed tradesmen. Shovel ready jobs, what a joke.

I'm full of shit? Now YOU know what I every day for a living better than I? You're damned right we have apprentices. So. Where do you think the journeymen come from?

And we do NOT use labor pools. And when that ditch needs to be dug any journeyman worth two shits is the ditch with a shovel right alongside his helpers if need be.

What is it you claim as a profession again? I just want to see what perspective is being used to tell me my business.

And I'll be damned-sure to tell the owner of the company I work for you said I don't have to dig.:eusa_hand:

Show me where in this thread where I even came close insinuating that I know your job better than you. Maybe in your neck of the woods small businesses can’t or don’t use temps, but down here in the south its not uncommon, especially in smaller mom and pop type businesses, including electrical companies. They’ll put their journeymen on a job with a temp. It happens all the time, especially when they get behind.

Thanks for answering my question though. Now I know who’s going to fill all these "shovel ready jobs" your boy up there in the white House keeps talking about. ELECTRICIANS!

Are you under some impression that Texas is not in the South? In your post I responded to prior to this one you distinctly disputed my word about who does the digging. That's telling me my business.

A temp is no good to me. I need someone with electrical knowledge that's worked with me long enough that I don't have to spend my time babysitting. Using a temp would require exactly that, and the one time at a previous company I actually had one, I did have to redo almost all of his work. I can't imagine any electrician that was actually trying to meet a schedule wanting one.

My original point is you talking out your ass and insulting an entire industry with your broad, sweeping and derogatory generalizations.

Obama's my "boy" now? Dude, please ....
 
I'm full of shit? Now YOU know what I every day for a living better than I? You're damned right we have apprentices. So. Where do you think the journeymen come from?

And we do NOT use labor pools. And when that ditch needs to be dug any journeyman worth two shits is the ditch with a shovel right alongside his helpers if need be.

What is it you claim as a profession again? I just want to see what perspective is being used to tell me my business.

And I'll be damned-sure to tell the owner of the company I work for you said I don't have to dig.:eusa_hand:

Show me where in this thread where I even came close insinuating that I know your job better than you. Maybe in your neck of the woods small businesses can’t or don’t use temps, but down here in the south its not uncommon, especially in smaller mom and pop type businesses, including electrical companies. They’ll put their journeymen on a job with a temp. It happens all the time, especially when they get behind.

Thanks for answering my question though. Now I know who’s going to fill all these "shovel ready jobs" your boy up there in the white House keeps talking about. ELECTRICIANS!

Are you under some impression that Texas is not in the South? In your post I responded to prior to this one you distinctly disputed my word about who does the digging. That's telling me my business.

A temp is no good to me. I need someone with electrical knowledge that's worked with me long enough that I don't have to spend my time babysitting. Using a temp would require exactly that, and the one time at a previous company I actually had one, I did have to redo almost all of his work. I can't imagine any electrician that was actually trying to meet a schedule wanting one.

My original point is you talking out your ass and insulting an entire industry with your broad, sweeping and derogatory generalizations.

Obama's my "boy" now? Dude, please ....

You’re claiming that Texas don’t use temp agency’s, eh? It took longer to write this message than it did to find temp electrical help in Texas. Google search: Results 1 - 10 of about 193,000 for temp electricians helper in texas. (0.25 seconds). The first one I clicked on was a temp agency.Maybe you didn’t use temps, but their real popular these days and you can find skilled people that you don’t have to train to fill those jobs, because we’ve gotten to the point where there are more people than there are jobs. It’s a FACT.

Here in Florida you’ll find temps working for every type of trade in the construction industry, bar none. So as far as that goes, if you want to find somebody talking out their ass, go look in a mirror.

As far as my opinion about the construction workers, I developed it when I got out of the Coast Guard and went to work for a construction company nearly 35 years ago. It didn’t take long to figure out that I’d rather own those buildings we were building rather than build them. So I worked my ass off for four years with societies rejects while I went to school at night to get the degree that made it possible.

Oh, the BO's "boy" comment was just payback for the "junior" comment. :eusa_whistle:
 

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