Should the US close the land border with Mexico?

[Centrism'sVoice]

For the sake of discussion, here are the major elements of the scenario I'm thinking about.

1. Air travel between the two countries, along with any existing shipping routes and cruises, would continue normally. Either country would also be allowed to operate ferry service along the Pacific Coast and/or through the Gulf.

2. The land from the Pacific Coast to the Rio Grande near El Paso would be walled off. No water traffic would be allowed on the Rio Grande.

3. The entire length of the border would be militarized, and anyone crossing it would be subject to capture or shooting.

In my opinion, the cost of this effort would be paid for by the savings in medical treatment and other government services currently given to illegal immigrants. It would also put a major dent in the narcotics trafficking from Latin America.

Thoughts?

 

[PuckeredPete]

For the sake of discussion, here are the major elements of the scenario I'm thinking about.

1. Air travel between the two countries, along with any existing shipping routes and cruises, would continue normally. Either country would also be allowed to operate ferry service along the Pacific Coast and/or through the Gulf.

2. The land from the Pacific Coast to the Rio Grande near El Paso would be walled off. No water traffic would be allowed on the Rio Grande.

3. The entire length of the border would be militarized, and anyone crossing it would be subject to capture or shooting.

In my opinion, the cost of this effort would be paid for by the savings in medical treatment and other government services currently given to illegal immigrants. It would also put a major dent in the narcotics trafficking from Latin America.

Thoughts?

Mine field

 

[Centrism'sVoice]

Mine field

Politically or literally?

 

[SW2SILVER]

Not gonna happen in a zillion years, because, these fine people have already established colonies here, and they seem to think they have a reverse manifest destiny thing going on. They are currently using liberal sodomites to spread the propaganda that diversity means allowing Latin Americans in under ANY circumstances, period. OK, I am being a tad over the top here, but living with illegal aliens makes me a little jaded. I also don't like the Republican Party or Bill O'Reilly or that matter. Or argyle sox. I know, off topic.

 

[publicprotector]

Close the border and the American economy would collaspe. Its all that cheap labour thats keeping you going at the moment. These people are prepared to work long hours for peanuts, live in fiith and poor housing. Just how many home grown Americans are willing to do that not many. But come a depression and then there is no choice. Its a sad fact that in tmes of manufactured economic collapse cheap labour is needed.

 

[Centrism'sVoice]

Not gonna happen in a zillion years, because, these fine people have already established colonies here, and they seem to think they have a reverse manifest destiny thing going on. They are currently using liberal sodomites to spread the propaganda that diversity means allowing Latin Americans in under ANY circumstances, period. OK, I am being a tad over the top here, but living with illegal aliens makes me a little jaded. I also don't like the Republican Party or Bill O'Reilly or that matter. Or argyle sox. I know, off topic.

Fortunately, SW2S, many legal migrants in the US are very strongly opposed to this ridiculous idea of "fast-tracking" illegals toward work permits and residency. They waited in line, and so should the others, in my opinion.

(public: please reread the OP. I'm not talking about closing the entire border, just the land border.)

 

[LaLinda75]

1. Air travel between the two countries, along with any existing shipping routes and cruises, would continue normally. Either country would also be allowed to operate ferry service along the Pacific Coast and/or through the Gulf.
.........That would made it very easy to continue illegal entry.
2. The land from the Pacific Coast to the Rio Grande near El Paso would be walled off. No water traffic would be allowed on the Rio Grande.
.........Never happen - too much to lose for both countries.
3. The entire length of the border would be militarized, and anyone crossing it would be subject to capture or shooting.
.........The politicians in WA would never agree to this. Too much pandering to Mexico going on and besides the fear of Mexico becoming communist/socialist would be great - although WE will probably end up there before Mexico does.

 

[Epsilon Delta]

Militarize the whole border? How much is that going to cost? How do you know it wouldn't cost more to do that than the illegals "sucking" government services? You'd also have to take into account what the illegals give back to the economy. Economic Costs from Immigrants minus Economic Gains from Immigrants would have to be more than the total cost of militarization (soldiers, equipment, surveillance, fuel, etc.) and wall-construction (labour, materials, etc.). Unless the numbers add up, it's a pretty inane idea, without mentioning that it does not tackle the root of the problem.

 

[SW2SILVER]

Instead, lets just make it easier to report illegal aliens. Lets expect that the INS will act upon, and pursue those reports and actually deport people here without passports or legal documents. On the grassroots level. Then the US-Mexican border can remain wide open and there will be crystal clarity on this issue. Is it me, or is that just too simple? And why aren't we already doing THAT? I have found out, that the INS doesn't act that way. Instead, we get this silly " don't ask, don't tell" bullsh*t. Some kind of legalistic mumbo jumbo. It's silly, if you see someone you think is committing a crime, you call 911 and it is checked out in real time. But, illegal aliens? It should work that way. Especially now, given the abuse by these folks in the last fifteen years.

 

[Big Black Dog]

Why do any of this. It's too expensive. Why not just shoot illegal aliens on sight once it is discovered they are in the country illegally. There would be such a rush of illegal aliens running back to Mexico that it would suck the trash and dust off of the streets near the boarder. You wouldn't have to shoot but a few and the news would travel pretty fast. Problem solved. Then we could go back to labeling all of our products in just the English language and get rid of that stupid phrase, "Press 1 for English."

 

[SW2SILVER]

I bought a newfangled flycatcher last week. A bag with one way cap full of corruption that trapped flies. After a week, it was disgusting, the putrid smell, and the dead flies fed the cute little maggots. And, still, they just kept coming until I cut the infernal thing down. It sort of became a unpleasant metaphor for illegal aliens. in my opinion. Cheap labor, jobs, flies to crap. Please, don't hire these people! Please.

 

[Centrism'sVoice]

Militarize the whole border? How much is that going to cost?

Ballpark guess: under $10 billion. (Anyone who wants to itemize it and show that I'm off-base is more than welcome.)

How do you know it wouldn't cost more to do that than the illegals "sucking" government services?

First, I don't know that. Second, there are many other costs of having a porous border, which are probably even higher than illegals "sucking" government services. Drug, weapon, and sex slave trafficking, for a start.

You'd also have to take into account what the illegals give back to the economy. Economic Costs from Immigrants minus Economic Gains from Immigrants would have to be more than the total cost of militarization (soldiers, equipment, surveillance, fuel, etc.) and wall-construction (labour, materials, etc.).

However much immediate benefit the illegals provide, it's ultimately a false economy. A nation, whether it's the US or Costa Rica, that can't control how many foreign nationals come in each day doesn't have any national sovereignty at all. Without sovereignty, it can't have a viable economy.

 

[Againsheila]

Close the border and the American economy would collaspe. Its all that cheap labour thats keeping you going at the moment. These people are prepared to work long hours for peanuts, live in fiith and poor housing. Just how many home grown Americans are willing to do that not many. But come a depression and then there is no choice. Its a sad fact that in tmes of manufactured economic collapse cheap labour is needed.

It's the cheap labor that caused the economic collapse. When the workers can no longer afford to purchase the products they make, who are the manufacturers going to sell to?

 

[CandyMan]

Send all the beaners back to Korea.

 

[editec]

For the sake of discussion, here are the major elements of the scenario I'm thinking about.

1. Air travel between the two countries, along with any existing shipping routes and cruises, would continue normally. Either country would also be allowed to operate ferry service along the Pacific Coast and/or through the Gulf.

2. The land from the Pacific Coast to the Rio Grande near El Paso would be walled off. No water traffic would be allowed on the Rio Grande.

3. The entire length of the border would be militarized, and anyone crossing it would be subject to capture or shooting.

In my opinion, the cost of this effort would be paid for by the savings in medical treatment and other government services currently given to illegal immigrants. It would also put a major dent in the narcotics trafficking from Latin America.

Thoughts?

Controlling what and who comes across our borders is, of course, one of those absolute minimum things we expect of our government.

How that should be done I leave to those who are experts in such matters.

 

[Centrism'sVoice]

1. Air travel between the two countries, along with any existing shipping routes and cruises, would continue normally. Either country would also be allowed to operate ferry service along the Pacific Coast and/or through the Gulf.
.........That would made it very easy to continue illegal entry.

"Very easy" is a major exaggeration. Is it possible to smuggle people on planes and ships? Of course. But think about the number and sizes of planes and ships compared to the entire land border. However many people could be smuggled in by this method would be at most a tiny fraction of those who come in over land.

2. The land from the Pacific Coast to the Rio Grande near El Paso would be walled off. No water traffic would be allowed on the Rio Grande.
.........Never happen - too much to lose for both countries.
3. The entire length of the border would be militarized, and anyone crossing it would be subject to capture or shooting.
.........The politicians in WA would never agree to this. Too much pandering to Mexico going on and besides the fear of Mexico becoming communist/socialist would be great - although WE will probably end up there before Mexico does.

The point of this thread isn't whether it would pass as a congressional bill. Only to discuss whether the benefits would outweigh the costs if such a plan did go into effect.

By the way, Mexico is already on the brink of anarchy. Their leadership will have to start dealing with their problems more directly if they want to stay in power.

 

[LaLinda75]

If the border is militarized it won't be to keep the illegal peons out - it will be because of the war with the drug cartels which is taking place as we type. It just happens that the americans are still not aware of what is going on at the border - sadly!

By the way, Mexico is already on the brink of anarchy. Their leadership will have to start dealing with their problems more directly if they want to stay in power.

In the brink? It's right smack in the middle of it. Their leadership has not been able to deal with ANY of its problems in the last 40 yrs.

 

[Lonestar_logic]

For the sake of discussion, here are the major elements of the scenario I'm thinking about.

1. Air travel between the two countries, along with any existing shipping routes and cruises, would continue normally. Either country would also be allowed to operate ferry service along the Pacific Coast and/or through the Gulf.

2. The land from the Pacific Coast to the Rio Grande near El Paso would be walled off. No water traffic would be allowed on the Rio Grande.

3. The entire length of the border would be militarized, and anyone crossing it would be subject to capture or shooting.

In my opinion, the cost of this effort would be paid for by the savings in medical treatment and other government services currently given to illegal immigrants. It would also put a major dent in the narcotics trafficking from Latin America.

Thoughts?

The borders need to be secured, period!