SHOULD the U.S. Be a Democracy? (Y/N)

[Dragon]

I vote no.

All right, let's see if you say why.

We should remain the Constitutional Republic which has made this country the one with the most liberty for its citizens for over 300 years now.

That's quite a dubious assertion, and in any case there is no conflict between being a democracy and being a constitutional republic. Actually, "constitutional republic" is a redundancy. There is no such thing as a non-constitutional republic. On the other hand, "democratic republic" is NOT a redundancy. There are many examples in history of non-democratic republics, including ancient Rome and the Soviet Union. Personally, I wouldn't want to be under either of those governments, but if you would . . .

Democracy is like 2 wolves and a lamb voting on what is for dinner...... In other words the minority gets screwed....think about that for a minute.

Sheep always outnumber wolves. That line is generally used by wolves and wolf-sympathizers lamenting the fact that under a democracy they'd be denied a mutton dinner and forced to be vegetarians.

There is no evidence that democracies are worse than other forms of government about screwing over minorities. If you think there is, please present any democratic government, direct or representative, in the history of civilization that abused minorities worse than the Nazis did.

 

[paulitician]

Our Founding Fathers chose to create a Republic rather than a direct Democracy. There are many reasons for that.

No, actually there was only one: a direct democracy over the whole United States in 1789 was impossible. It couldn't be done.

The real question is why they some of them didn't want a REPRESENTATIVE democracy, not a direct democracy.

Well no,there was more than one reason. But one will just have to do their own research on those reasons. Starting with Benjamin Franklin is a good start. I agree with him that we should be a Republic rather than a Democracy. But that's just my opinion.

 

[westwall]

Tell that to Socrates.

He can get together with all the Holocaust victims in the afterlife and discuss whether democracy is better or worse than other government types when it comes to handing out injustice.

You made a claim that on its face is ridiculous. I pointed that out. You attempted to deflect. You failed.

 

[The T]

Our Founding Fathers chose to create a Republic rather than a direct Democracy. There are many reasons for that. Read up on what Benjamin Franklin said about being a Republic rather than a Democracy. It's very interesting.

Indeed. He did answer "A Republic if you can keep it"...when asked what form of governemnt we had as the Constitutional Convention let out...

One of the most compelling quotes I like was from John Adams..."Democracy never lasts long, There was never a democracy that 'did not commit suicide.'"

Precisely where we find ourselves now in what was changed of us in the early 20th Century...

We stand upon a preface with the decision to jump over a cliff or turn back and reconsider. Too many in this nation have decided to jump for thier own self agarandizement.

 

[Dragon]

You made a claim that on its face is ridiculous. I pointed that out. You attempted to deflect. You failed.

The claim I made is that there is no historical evidence that democracy (even direct democracy such as ancient Athens) is worse about abusing minorities or abusing justice than other types of government. You presented ONE case of injustice from ancient Athens as a counter-argument. I pointed out by example that non-democratic governments quite often have MANY such cases of injustice to consider.

In fact, if you compare the Greek democracies, flawed though they admittedly were, to non-democratic governments of their time, such as Pharaonic Egypt, the Persian Empire, the Carthaginian republic, or even the Roman republic, the Greek democracies come off as superior when it comes to protecting people's rights. Historically, the most abusive government of all is a monarchy or dictatorship under a bad king or dictator. Next down is an aristocracy, which systematically abuses everyone who isn't an aristocrat. A democracy is actually best of those, and the worst one can say about it is that it isn't completely immune to abuse. The only thing better would be a monarchy or dictatorship under a truly benign and brilliant king or emperor, a Julius Caesar. And the problem there is that any Caesar is mortal.

As Churchill said, "It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried."

 

[kwc57]

yeah... the Constitution works well....For people with money and power... because they can manipulate it for their gain... when poor, working and Middle Class people try... they get labeled Communists.

They have a one man one vote like everyone else.

Therein lies the rub, doesn't it? That's why Unions give massive amounts of money to the Dems and Corporations give even more to both parties, and the Koch Brothers fund the Tea Party... to brainwash and sway voters to vote in their direction. Why do they do this? To call in those chips and get favorable legislation that make them and their benefactors money once a candidate is elected.

Get the damned money out of politics... let Politicians run on the issues, have independent fact checkers to point out the lies, and have Publicly funded elections with a hard Spending cap. You'll save hundreds of billions of dollars in useless legislation and government handouts.

Boo freaking hoo! Do you do the same hand wringing over Soros who has out spent the Kock Brothers multpile times over? He makes them look like amateurs.

Koch family - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

David and Charles have funded conservative and libertarian policy and advocacy groups in the United States. Since the 1980s the Koch foundations have given more than $100 million to such organizations, among these think tanks like the Heritage Foundation and the Cato Institute, as well as more recently Americans for Prosperity. Americans for Prosperity and FreedomWorks are Koch-linked organizations that have been linked to the Tea Party movement.

George Soros - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

On September 21st 2011, Forbes announced that Soros, at 81, has for the first time made the list of the 10 wealthiest Americans, with a net worth estimated at $22.0 billion. According to this list, Soros is the 46th richest person in the world. Soros has given away $8 billion to various causes since 1979.

 

[Dragon]

One of the most compelling quotes I like was from John Adams..."Democracy never lasts long, There was never a democracy that 'did not commit suicide.'"

The Athenian democracy lasted almost 200 years, from 508 BC until 322 BC, and it did not "commit suicide" but was conquered by Macedonia.

 

[The T]

One of the most compelling quotes I like was from John Adams..."Democracy never lasts long, There was never a democracy that 'did not commit suicide.'"

The Athenian democracy lasted almost 200 years, from 508 BC until 322 BC, and it did not "commit suicide" but was conquered by Macedonia.

You cite one of many and seem to revel in the demise...WHY...

That's right...you are a self-avowed Communist.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

This is the question that Amelia should have asked in her thread, in my opinion. It gets all confused to ask whether it IS one, because of the observable corruption of democracy by corporate money. Those of us who are part of Occupy or at least agree with the movements aims recognize (and bitch about) that no, the U.S. is not a democracy -- but we think it should be one and is supposed to be one.

So here we go. SHOULD the U.S. be a democracy?

Now, a definition: a government is a DEMOCRACY if its decisions are made with reference to the will of the majority of the people. Democracy takes two forms:

1) Pure or direct democracy, in which the people vote directly on laws or policies.

2) Representative democracy or democratic republic, in which the people elect representatives who then vote on laws or make policies.

Thanks for the dumbfuck thread where you once again, lamely meander through a semi-cogent thought.

 

[Photonic]

One of the most compelling quotes I like was from John Adams..."Democracy never lasts long, There was never a democracy that 'did not commit suicide.'"

The Athenian democracy lasted almost 200 years, from 508 BC until 322 BC, and it did not "commit suicide" but was conquered by Macedonia.

You cite one of many and seem to revel in the demise...WHY...

That's right...you are a self-avowed Communist.

Umm, you do realize he is supporting democracy, and you are supporting communism by having a dissenting opinion.

 

[The T]

This is the question that Amelia should have asked in her thread, in my opinion. It gets all confused to ask whether it IS one, because of the observable corruption of democracy by corporate money. Those of us who are part of Occupy or at least agree with the movements aims recognize (and bitch about) that no, the U.S. is not a democracy -- but we think it should be one and is supposed to be one.

So here we go. SHOULD the U.S. be a democracy?

Now, a definition: a government is a DEMOCRACY if its decisions are made with reference to the will of the majority of the people. Democracy takes two forms:

1) Pure or direct democracy, in which the people vote directly on laws or policies.

2) Representative democracy or democratic republic, in which the people elect representatives who then vote on laws or make policies.

Thanks for the dumbfuck thread where you once again, lamely meander through a semi-cogent thought.

Suprised the brainpower was there for his use...

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

One of the most compelling quotes I like was from John Adams..."Democracy never lasts long, There was never a democracy that 'did not commit suicide.'"

The Athenian democracy lasted almost 200 years, from 508 BC until 322 BC, and it did not "commit suicide" but was conquered by Macedonia.

Is there a point in our immediate future other than you demonstrating your stranglehold on useless minutia?

 

[The T]

The Athenian democracy lasted almost 200 years, from 508 BC until 322 BC, and it did not "commit suicide" but was conquered by Macedonia.

You cite one of many and seem to revel in the demise...WHY...

That's right...you are a self-avowed Communist.

Umm, you do realize he is supporting democracy, and you are supporting communism by having a dissenting opinion.

He is supporting the wrong thing regardless.

Nice try.

 

[Photonic]

One of the most compelling quotes I like was from John Adams..."Democracy never lasts long, There was never a democracy that 'did not commit suicide.'"

The Athenian democracy lasted almost 200 years, from 508 BC until 322 BC, and it did not "commit suicide" but was conquered by Macedonia.

Is there a point in our immediate future other than you demonstrating your stranglehold on useless minutia?

Yea, because history has never repeated itself.

History is worthless.

 

[Photonic]

You cite one of many and seem to revel in the demise...WHY...

That's right...you are a self-avowed Communist.

Umm, you do realize he is supporting democracy, and you are supporting communism by having a dissenting opinion.

He is supporting the wrong thing regardless.

Nice try.

If supporting democracy is the wrong thing to do, then here's a big middle finger for your trouble. I'm happy in the wrong.

 

[Dragon]

Is there a point in our immediate future

Just a rebuttal of the claim by Adams that democracy never lasts long and always commits suicide. Obviously Adams was wrong.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

The Athenian democracy lasted almost 200 years, from 508 BC until 322 BC, and it did not "commit suicide" but was conquered by Macedonia.

Is there a point in our immediate future other than you demonstrating your stranglehold on useless minutia?

Yea, because history has never repeated itself.

History is worthless.

That's just dumb.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Is there a point in our immediate future

Just a rebuttal of the claim by Adams that democracy never lasts long and always commits suicide. Obviously Adams was wrong.

No, Adams was not wrong, you are wrong. You obviously don't understand to what Adams was referring.

 

[The T]

Is there a point in our immediate future

Just a rebuttal of the claim by Adams that democracy never lasts long and always commits suicide. Obviously Adams was wrong.

No, Adams was not wrong, you are wrong. You obviously don't understand to what Adams was referring.

As if the EU...and the Incarnation of what was replaced in the Early 1900's from what the Founders gave us courtesy of the Progressives carries no weight... Dragoon...is an idiot.

No perspective on real history...only revisionist files.

 

[The T]

The Athenian democracy lasted almost 200 years, from 508 BC until 322 BC, and it did not "commit suicide" but was conquered by Macedonia.

Is there a point in our immediate future other than you demonstrating your stranglehold on useless minutia?

Yea, because history has never repeated itself.

History is worthless.

It is worthless to those that don't heed the message...and investigate the cause. Too bad we have so many so willing to repeat it.