Should Parents Pay the Bill

[ConHog]

Would this argument even be happening if was a 32 year old male?

No?

Then argument fail. Cuz I guarantee you this girl is probably 100 times the mariner than most men who think they are.

I would certainly argue that a 32 y/o who puts themselves into an inheritnely dangerous situation should be responsible for paying for any rescue effort which might be needed. And in fact in most European countries that is in fact the law.

 

[RadiomanATL]

Would this argument even be happening if was a 32 year old male?

No?

Then argument fail. Cuz I guarantee you this girl is probably 100 times the mariner than most men who think they are.

that's not the issue.

That is the issue.

Cuz all I'm seeing is "Oh, how awful those parents are for letting her do this".

 

[RadiomanATL]

Would this argument even be happening if was a 32 year old male?

No?

Then argument fail. Cuz I guarantee you this girl is probably 100 times the mariner than most men who think they are.

I would certainly argue that a 32 y/o who puts themselves into an inheritnely dangerous situation should be responsible for paying for any rescue effort which might be needed. And in fact in most European countries that is in fact the law.

But sailing isn't considered "inherently dangerous".

And AFAIK, there has not ever been a maritime rescue incident where the person in distress had to pay for their rescue because environmental conditions left them stranded.

 

[Gunny]

WTF are you serious???? You just hammered me for not insulting Gunny in a debate with him , then you turn around and call me a coward for not debating without insults?

Are you a real person?

Fact is, WHERE does your argument come from?

I disagree the parents should be berated. (Addressing WillowTree). US law ends where international waters begin. The rest of the world doesn't treat their children like babies until in their mid-20s like we do.

Second, maritime law is a matter of priorities and internationally recognized by civil as well as military ships. Since when did WE, as a genus, put a price tag on life?

We revere it. We revere our dead. Is making a buck more important than saving another human being? When did we get that way? I wasn't raised to believe that crap. Then again, I was raised to believe that doing the right thing, even at MY expense, IS the right thing.

Like it or not, maritime law is based on morality, not capitalism.

I didn't say a word about "babying' her. I said it's stupid to send a 16 year old out alone in a less than adequate boat into the middle of the Indian ocean during the worst of the storm season.

Do you understand being 16 in SE Asia is practically being an old maid? If you can't sell your daughter to a pimp by 14, she's worthless. Couple thou for her and the family is in good shape for several years.

The notion that 18 years old makes an adult is legislated by ignorant Americans who make them be 21 to do anything other than die for their country. You can do THAT at 18. Otherwise, no drinking or handguns 'til 21.

You're an adult at 16 in most parts of the world. Just not the pampered part of it.

 

[ConHog]

Would this argument even be happening if was a 32 year old male?

No?

Then argument fail. Cuz I guarantee you this girl is probably 100 times the mariner than most men who think they are.

that's not the issue.

That is the issue.

Cuz all I'm seeing is "Oh, how awful those parents are for letting her do this".

Not to me, they are two seperate issues. The parents being neglectful of their child has nothing to do with the fact that they should have to pay for her rescue.

 

[WillowTree]

Would this argument even be happening if was a 32 year old male?

No?

Then argument fail. Cuz I guarantee you this girl is probably 100 times the mariner than most men who think they are.

that's not the issue.

That is the issue.

Cuz all I'm seeing is "Oh, how awful those parents are for letting her do this".

not from my perspective it isn't. I offer them criticism because they let her put herself in the worst possible scenario at the worst possible time of the year. As I have stated the young aren't as equipped mentally or emotionally to deal with emergencies, they tend to panic there is an exception to every rule but why take the risk? And as you know I answered NO they should not be charged.

 

[RadiomanATL]

that's not the issue.

That is the issue.

Cuz all I'm seeing is "Oh, how awful those parents are for letting her do this".

Not to me, they are two seperate issues. The parents being neglectful of their child has nothing to do with the fact that they should have to pay for her rescue.

So you get to be wrong on two fronts instead of one then? Was that your purpose?

 

[WillowTree]

that's not the issue.

That is the issue.

Cuz all I'm seeing is "Oh, how awful those parents are for letting her do this".

Not to me, they are two seperate issues. The parents being neglectful of their child has nothing to do with the fact that they should have to pay for her rescue.

They should not have to pay, but they didn't use good reasoning either.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

now the boat size is in question....and you cant help but wonder if they didnt push her cause a kid broke her brothers record? but does all this matter at this point...a 13 yr old has summitted mt everest...

give the young ones their wings....let them fly.....even if like the young ones who was trying to fly across country and died...you still have to let them go

I wonder why the Tibetan government gave that 13 yo permission to summit Everest, that strikes me as irresponsible.

 

[RadiomanATL]

that's not the issue.

That is the issue.

Cuz all I'm seeing is "Oh, how awful those parents are for letting her do this".

not from my perspective it isn't. I offer them criticism because they let her put herself in the worst possible scenario at the worst possible time of the year. As I have stated the young aren't as equipped mentally or emotionally to deal with emergencies, they tend to panic there is an exception to every rule but why take the risk? And as you know I answered NO they should not be charged.

As a mariner, she's probably much more well equipped than most adults in terms of handling an emergency on the water.

 

[ConHog]

Fact is, WHERE does your argument come from?

I disagree the parents should be berated. (Addressing WillowTree). US law ends where international waters begin. The rest of the world doesn't treat their children like babies until in their mid-20s like we do.

Second, maritime law is a matter of priorities and internationally recognized by civil as well as military ships. Since when did WE, as a genus, put a price tag on life?

We revere it. We revere our dead. Is making a buck more important than saving another human being? When did we get that way? I wasn't raised to believe that crap. Then again, I was raised to believe that doing the right thing, even at MY expense, IS the right thing.

Like it or not, maritime law is based on morality, not capitalism.

I didn't say a word about "babying' her. I said it's stupid to send a 16 year old out alone in a less than adequate boat into the middle of the Indian ocean during the worst of the storm season.

Do you understand being 16 in SE Asia is practically being an old maid? If you can't sell your daughter to a pimp by 14, she's worthless. Couple thou for her and the family is in good shape for several years.

The notion that 18 years old makes an adult is legislated by ignorant Americans who make them be 21 to do anything other than die for their country. You can do THAT at 18. Otherwise, no drinking or handguns 'til 21.

You're an adult at 16 in most parts of the world. Just not the pampered part of it.

Do you understand that the notion of protecting our young until the admittedly arbitrary age of 18 is one of the things which separates us from the barbarians of the world?

 

[Gunny]

WTF are you serious???? You just hammered me for not insulting Gunny in a debate with him , then you turn around and call me a coward for not debating without insults?

Are you a real person?

Fact is, WHERE does your argument come from?

I disagree the parents should be berated. (Addressing WillowTree). US law ends where international waters begin. The rest of the world doesn't treat their children like babies until in their mid-20s like we do.

Second, maritime law is a matter of priorities and internationally recognized by civil as well as military ships. Since when did WE, as a genus, put a price tag on life?

We revere it. We revere our dead. Is making a buck more important than saving another human being? When did we get that way? I wasn't raised to believe that crap. Then again, I was raised to believe that doing the right thing, even at MY expense, IS the right thing.

Like it or not, maritime law is based on morality, not capitalism.

Ok Gunny , I don't disagree with that at ALL, BUT when you intentionally put yourself, or in this case your child, in a situation where the likely outcome is that someone else will have to save her that is another situation entirely. If not for a bad decision on the parent's part here the rescue wouldn't have been necessary and so the parents should be financially responsible. I am NOT saying the girl shouldn't have been saved

Financial responsibility has not historically been an issue. "Parents" is subjective.

In CA, if your kid is caught smoking, you get fined. Yet CA is one of the worst states for empowering children and emasculating parents. Go figure.

I'd rather save save a life than make a coin.

 

[WillowTree]

Fact is, WHERE does your argument come from?

I disagree the parents should be berated. (Addressing WillowTree). US law ends where international waters begin. The rest of the world doesn't treat their children like babies until in their mid-20s like we do.

Second, maritime law is a matter of priorities and internationally recognized by civil as well as military ships. Since when did WE, as a genus, put a price tag on life?

We revere it. We revere our dead. Is making a buck more important than saving another human being? When did we get that way? I wasn't raised to believe that crap. Then again, I was raised to believe that doing the right thing, even at MY expense, IS the right thing.

Like it or not, maritime law is based on morality, not capitalism.

I didn't say a word about "babying' her. I said it's stupid to send a 16 year old out alone in a less than adequate boat into the middle of the Indian ocean during the worst of the storm season.

Do you understand being 16 in SE Asia is practically being an old maid? If you can't sell your daughter to a pimp by 14, she's worthless. Couple thou for her and the family is in good shape for several years.

The notion that 18 years old makes an adult is legislated by ignorant Americans who make them be 21 to do anything other than die for their country. You can do THAT at 18. Otherwise, no drinking or handguns 'til 21.

You're an adult at 16 in most parts of the world. Just not the pampered part of it.

Here you go.. black and white and no shades of gray. You surely don't maintain that we in America should treat our girl children as they do in SE Asia? I know you don't.. and as for going to battle at 18,, give the man a beer for god's sake. but that a deflection. Answer my question. Any idea why the FAA puts an age limit on pilots?

 

[Gunny]

i think the kid did a brave thing...and gunny is correct why do we keep kids ...like we do...other countries at 18 they are out of the house....etc.

i think its great they found her.....now she has to stay on the boat with all them horney french sailors....

o my

Full of shit you and Gunny izz. as I have already explained.

You haven't explained shit but that you don't have a clue.

 

[ConHog]

That is the issue.

Cuz all I'm seeing is "Oh, how awful those parents are for letting her do this".

not from my perspective it isn't. I offer them criticism because they let her put herself in the worst possible scenario at the worst possible time of the year. As I have stated the young aren't as equipped mentally or emotionally to deal with emergencies, they tend to panic there is an exception to every rule but why take the risk? And as you know I answered NO they should not be charged.

As a mariner, she's probably much more well equipped than most adults in terms of handling an emergency on the water.

BULLSHIT

IF she's so experienced and able to handle that situation, why did she

A) choose to sail into a sea at a time when most acknowledged experts say she shouldn't have been near

B) choose to sail a boat which was having mechanical issues and which it is now being rumored was not repaired correctly before departing her last port

C) choose to sail in a boat which again experts have said was just too small to be in that part of the ocean.


Seems like she just made bad decision after bad decision and yet you want to say she did everything right here??????????

 

[WillowTree]

i think the kid did a brave thing...and gunny is correct why do we keep kids ...like we do...other countries at 18 they are out of the house....etc.

i think its great they found her.....now she has to stay on the boat with all them horney french sailors....

o my

Full of shit you and Gunny izz. as I have already explained.

You haven't explained shit but that you don't have a clue.

sez you

 

[ConHog]

Fact is, WHERE does your argument come from?

I disagree the parents should be berated. (Addressing WillowTree). US law ends where international waters begin. The rest of the world doesn't treat their children like babies until in their mid-20s like we do.

Second, maritime law is a matter of priorities and internationally recognized by civil as well as military ships. Since when did WE, as a genus, put a price tag on life?

We revere it. We revere our dead. Is making a buck more important than saving another human being? When did we get that way? I wasn't raised to believe that crap. Then again, I was raised to believe that doing the right thing, even at MY expense, IS the right thing.

Like it or not, maritime law is based on morality, not capitalism.

Ok Gunny , I don't disagree with that at ALL, BUT when you intentionally put yourself, or in this case your child, in a situation where the likely outcome is that someone else will have to save her that is another situation entirely. If not for a bad decision on the parent's part here the rescue wouldn't have been necessary and so the parents should be financially responsible. I am NOT saying the girl shouldn't have been saved

Financial responsibility has not historically been an issue. "Parents" is subjective.

In CA, if your kid is caught smoking, you get fined. Yet CA is one of the worst states for empowering children and emasculating parents. Go figure.

I'd rather save save a life than make a coin.

Who's saying the girl shouldn't have been saved?

 

[Gunny]

I didn't say a word about "babying' her. I said it's stupid to send a 16 year old out alone in a less than adequate boat into the middle of the Indian ocean during the worst of the storm season.

Do you understand being 16 in SE Asia is practically being an old maid? If you can't sell your daughter to a pimp by 14, she's worthless. Couple thou for her and the family is in good shape for several years.

The notion that 18 years old makes an adult is legislated by ignorant Americans who make them be 21 to do anything other than die for their country. You can do THAT at 18. Otherwise, no drinking or handguns 'til 21.

You're an adult at 16 in most parts of the world. Just not the pampered part of it.

Do you understand that the notion of protecting our young until the admittedly arbitrary age of 18 is one of the things which separates us from the barbarians of the world?

I understand the notion of letting them be supported and blamed on the parents WAY longer than time to grow up.

 

[RadiomanATL]

not from my perspective it isn't. I offer them criticism because they let her put herself in the worst possible scenario at the worst possible time of the year. As I have stated the young aren't as equipped mentally or emotionally to deal with emergencies, they tend to panic there is an exception to every rule but why take the risk? And as you know I answered NO they should not be charged.

As a mariner, she's probably much more well equipped than most adults in terms of handling an emergency on the water.

BULLSHIT

IF she's so experienced and able to handle that situation, why did she

A) choose to sail into a sea at a time when most acknowledged experts say she shouldn't have been near

B) choose to sail a boat which was having mechanical issues and which it is now being rumored was not repaired correctly before departing her last port

C) choose to sail in a boat which again experts have said was just too small to be in that part of the ocean.


Seems like she just made bad decision after bad decision and yet you want to say she did everything right here??????????

Nice strawman.

Nothing close to what I said....but kudos for giving it the old college try. Better find someone else to play your logical fallacy games with, cuz I don't play them.

If you would like to, ya know, actually address the statement I made I'll let you give it a second try.

 

[WillowTree]

Ok Gunny , I don't disagree with that at ALL, BUT when you intentionally put yourself, or in this case your child, in a situation where the likely outcome is that someone else will have to save her that is another situation entirely. If not for a bad decision on the parent's part here the rescue wouldn't have been necessary and so the parents should be financially responsible. I am NOT saying the girl shouldn't have been saved

Financial responsibility has not historically been an issue. "Parents" is subjective.

In CA, if your kid is caught smoking, you get fined. Yet CA is one of the worst states for empowering children and emasculating parents. Go figure.

I'd rather save save a life than make a coin.

Who's saying the girl shouldn't have been saved?

No one, they are just "screaming" to be "right."