Should Gov. Walker be Recalled?

[Jarhead]

notice they never link to these polls and actually have the demographics available'

I have found a rule of thumb as it pertains to polls...

If you do not see the demographics at first glance?

It gives you MORE reason to dig and find them.

Not me. I just consider material copy and pasted without link or explanation to be blowing smoke from people who don't give a damn about whether it is defensible or not. They just hope the ignorant and gullible will swallow it whole and applaud them for their brilliance.

(Sorry. I'm grumpy today. But it is absurd to post stuff with no link or disclaimer and leave it to others to go look for the source.)

OK...here is the release of the poll:

http://www.strategictelemetry.com/docs/Walker_Budget_Survey_022811.pdf

Here is the paragraph where it makes it clear that all those polled were democratic voters or would be democratic voters (findings section...para 4):

Wisconsin does not have party registration, so it is not possible to quantify the number of
Democrats, Republicans and independents who feel that Walker should be recalled. However,there are a number of microtargeting models that predict the likelihood of any voter supportingDemocratic candidates, and the likelihood of their being willing to take actions like volunteeringfor a campaign, or going door‐to‐door to collect signatures.

And here is a link to the election results:

Wisconsin gubernatorial election, 2010 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And here is the pertinant part of the link:

Election Results
Party Candidate Votes Percentage
Democratic Tom Barrett 1,004,303 46%
Republican Scott Walker 1,128,941 52%
Totals 2,160,832 100%

And here is the link to how many wisconsin voters there are:

Answers.com - How many Wisconsin registered voters are there

Now.....someone else can do the math....but I know I am correct.....if the 608 people polled is an accurate reading oif the trend.....then 300,000 who voted for Barrett do NOT want a recall.

Oh yeah...and by the way....here is the link to the polling company.....

Strategic Telemetry, Inc. - Welcome to Strategic Telemetry

And here is what it says about itself found toward the end of the survey linked above...

About Strategic Telemetry
Strategic Telemetry provides microtargeting and strategic consulting for progressive candidates
and labor organizations. Strategic Telemetry produced the microtargeting used by Barack
Obama's 2008 campaign and for hundreds of other campaigns.

I bolded the interesting part.

There...how did I do?

 

[jgarden]

There's no "right" of collective bargaining.

The *privilege* was extended by the state...It only follows that it may be taken away.

On top if that, the only part of collective bargaining being taken away is that involving benefits, not pay.

when the state agreed to give them collective bargaining "rights" its became a given right. (not the same as an inalienable right) thats what i meant by right.

There's no "right" of collective bargaining.

The *privilege* was extended by the state...It only follows that it may be taken away.

On top if that, the only part of collective bargaining being taken away is that involving benefits, not pay.

when the state agreed to give them collective bargaining "rights" its became a given right. (not the same as an inalienable right) thats what i meant by right.

The Universal Declaration of Human Rights

Article 23

(1) Everyone has the right to work, to free choice of employment, to just and favourable conditions of work and to protection against unemployment.
(2) Everyone, without any discrimination, has the right to equal pay for equal work.
(3) Everyone who works has the right to just and favourable remuneration ensuring for himself and his family an existence worthy of human dignity, and supplemented, if necessary, by other means of social protection.
(4) Everyone has the right to form and to join trade unions for the protection of his interests.

G.A. res. 217A (III), U.N. Doc A/810 at 71 (1948)
Adopted on December 10, 1948
by the General Assembly of the United Nations (without dissent)

The Universal Declaration of Human Rights

The US voted in favor of adopting this Declaration in 1948 and is therefore on record as supporting the principle that, "Everyone has the the right to form and to join trade unions for the protection of his interests" is a ubiversal right.

"Collective bargaining" is a mechanism by which trade unions provide "protection" for the "interests" of their members. How ironic that Republicans are now instrumental in depriving the citizens in their own country of the same "human rights" that US Administrations have been encouraging other nations to adopt.

Governor Walker and the People's Republic of Wisconsin simply do not have the legal or moral authority to overrule an international commitment that the US government signed 63 years ago.

 

[Jarhead]

And this is how the poll was titled and released...

Survey shows Walker and eight Republican State Senators vulnerable to recall
An estimated 1.1 million Wisconsin voters would sign a recall petition if asked

And what it really found was that after this whole thing came to national attention, there was an increase in those that support the republicans....or at the very least....a decrease by 300,000 of those that had voted for Barrett....

And that, folks...is how polls and those who use them simply assume you are too stupid to see through them.

I got a kick out of Truthmatters and MarcATl gloating at the results......

They had no idea it was actually BAD NEWS for them.

LMAO...even the polling compnay that sides with them see them as too stupid to see thru the spin.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

And this is how the poll was titled and released...

Survey shows Walker and eight Republican State Senators vulnerable to recall
An estimated 1.1 million Wisconsin voters would sign a recall petition if asked

And what it really found was that after this whole thing came to national attention, there was an increase in those that support the republicans....or at the very least....a decrease by 300,000 of those that had voted for Barrett....

And that, folks...is how polls and those who use them simply assume you are too stupid to see through them.

I got a kick out of Truthmatters and MarcATl gloating at the results......

They had no idea it was actually BAD NEWS for them.

LMAO...even the polling compnay that sides with them see them as too stupid to see thru the spin.

Marc & TM ain't the sharpest tools in the shed my friend.

 

[Jarhead]

And this is how the poll was titled and released...

Survey shows Walker and eight Republican State Senators vulnerable to recall
An estimated 1.1 million Wisconsin voters would sign a recall petition if asked

And what it really found was that after this whole thing came to national attention, there was an increase in those that support the republicans....or at the very least....a decrease by 300,000 of those that had voted for Barrett....

And that, folks...is how polls and those who use them simply assume you are too stupid to see through them.

I got a kick out of Truthmatters and MarcATl gloating at the results......

They had no idea it was actually BAD NEWS for them.

LMAO...even the polling compnay that sides with them see them as too stupid to see thru the spin.

Marc & TM ain't the sharpest tools in the shed my friend.

yes...and obviously even those they support see them as idiots.

 

[DiveCon]

And this is how the poll was titled and released...

Survey shows Walker and eight Republican State Senators vulnerable to recall
An estimated 1.1 million Wisconsin voters would sign a recall petition if asked

And what it really found was that after this whole thing came to national attention, there was an increase in those that support the republicans....or at the very least....a decrease by 300,000 of those that had voted for Barrett....

And that, folks...is how polls and those who use them simply assume you are too stupid to see through them.

I got a kick out of Truthmatters and MarcATl gloating at the results......

They had no idea it was actually BAD NEWS for them.

LMAO...even the polling compnay that sides with them see them as too stupid to see thru the spin.

Marc & TM ain't the sharpest tools in the shed my friend.

and art15 seems to want to join them

 

[grunt11b]

With all the protest going on in WI, and Walker not willing to negotiate his hardline stance, do you think he will be recalled?

He's an elected official who was put into office with a mandate, if he should be recalled then Obama should be impeached. Elections have consequences, just because you may not like the outcome doesn't mean the man should go. If that where the case 80% of the congress from 2008 to 2010 would have been gone a long time ago according to 70% of Americans "Over the healthcare law". Time to get over it already.

 

[grunt11b]

With all the protest going on in WI, and Walker not willing to negotiate his hardline stance, do you think he will face a recall vote?

Not my state. When we recalled Grey Davis here, we got AH-nold....with Darryl Issa crying, crying, crying.

Ah-Nold is a progressive Democrat in disguise as a Conservative Republican.

 

[grunt11b]

There's no "right" of collective bargaining.

The *privilege* was extended by the state...It only follows that it may be taken away.

On top if that, the only part of collective bargaining being taken away is that involving benefits, not pay.

when the state agreed to give them collective bargaining "rights" its became a given right. (not the same as an inalienable right) thats what i meant by right.

It's not a right, if it is not in the Bill of rights, it's plain and simply not a right. It's time we get back to the Constitution in America and stop pretending people owe us shit that we don't deserve. If we don't get back to it, this country is done for.
If it's not on the document, it's not law. No matter what the morons at Berkley say, they are wrong.

 

[Oddball]

There's no "right" of collective bargaining.

The *privilege* was extended by the state...It only follows that it may be taken away.

On top if that, the only part of collective bargaining being taken away is that involving benefits, not pay.

when the state agreed to give them collective bargaining "rights" its became a given right. (not the same as an inalienable right) thats what i meant by right.

when the state agreed to give them collective bargaining "rights" its became a given right. (not the same as an inalienable right) thats what i meant by right.

The Universal Declaration of Human Rights

Article 23

(1) Everyone has the right to work, to free choice of employment, to just and favourable conditions of work and to protection against unemployment.
(2) Everyone, without any discrimination, has the right to equal pay for equal work.
(3) Everyone who works has the right to just and favourable remuneration ensuring for himself and his family an existence worthy of human dignity, and supplemented, if necessary, by other means of social protection.
(4) Everyone has the right to form and to join trade unions for the protection of his interests.

G.A. res. 217A (III), U.N. Doc A/810 at 71 (1948)
Adopted on December 10, 1948
by the General Assembly of the United Nations (without dissent)

The Universal Declaration of Human Rights

The US voted in favor of adopting this Declaration in 1948 and is therefore on record as supporting the principle that, "Everyone has the the right to form and to join trade unions for the protection of his interests" is a ubiversal right.

"Collective bargaining" is a mechanism by which trade unions provide "protection" for the "interests" of their members. How ironic that Republicans are now instrumental in depriving the citizens in their own country of the same "human rights" that US Administrations have been encouraging other nations to adopt.

Governor Walker and the People's Republic of Wisconsin simply do not have the legal or moral authority to overrule an international commitment that the US government signed 63 years ago.

Article 30.

* Nothing in this Declaration may be interpreted as implying for any State, group or person any right to engage in any activity or to perform any act aimed at the destruction of any of the rights and freedoms set forth herein.

Translation: If we suddenly decide that the aforementioned "rights" don't count, then they don't....Deal with it.


Moreover, the UN has no jurisdiction over American law.

Fail.

 

[grunt11b]

im just wondering what the opinion is. it seems the majority of the WI public doesnt like his hardline stance. if he keeps pushing to take away rights, how long will people accept this..

Actually, it was proven on here that it is the exact opposite.

The poll that was touted to show that there is support to recall?

Actually showed that of the 1.1 million people that voted for Barrett? Only 700,000 wanted a recall.

which means that 1/3 of those that voted for Barrett are happy with Walker as governor.

Interesting how poll results are presnted in a way that decieves the public.....no?

True, but the bottom line is, they cannot vote someone in, just for that person not to bend over backwards to every need they want, and then expect to just recall the man when it doesn't happen. Doesn't work that way, as long as walker stays within the law, Socal is just going to have to suck it up and get over it.

 

[AllieBaba]

As if Berkley elitists ever cornered the market on truth to begin with...

 

[grunt11b]

there's no "right" of collective bargaining.

The *privilege* was extended by the state...it only follows that it may be taken away.

On top if that, the only part of collective bargaining being taken away is that involving benefits, not pay.

when the state agreed to give them collective bargaining "rights" its because a give right. (not the same as an inalienable right) thats what i meant by right.

haha!!!!

 

[jgarden]

With all the protest going on in WI, and Walker not willing to negotiate his hardline stance, do you think he will be recalled?

Politicians in Wisconsin are not subject to "recall" for the first year after taking office, so Walker will be exempt until January 2012.

8 Republican state senators, however, have held office for more than 1 year and are subject to recall. A loss of only 3 Republican state senators would result in a shift of power back in favor of the Democrats.

The private abd public unions that oppose Walker are already well organized so getting the minimuum number of signatures should not represent a major obstacle.

It should be clear by now that Wisconsin needs a leader who should be attempting to provide statesmanship and concensus during this difficult time. Refusing to negotiate and ruling by decree has proven to be counterproductive thusfar.

 

[grunt11b]

when the state agreed to give them collective bargaining "rights" its became a given right. (not the same as an inalienable right) thats what i meant by right.

The US voted in favor of adopting this Declaration in 1948 and is therefore on record as supporting the principle that, "Everyone has the the right to form and to join trade unions for the protection of his interests" is a ubiversal right.

"Collective bargaining" is a mechanism by which trade unions provide "protection" for the "interests" of their members. How ironic that Republicans are now instrumental in depriving the citizens in their own country of the same "human rights" that US Administrations have been encouraging other nations to adopt.

Governor Walker and the People's Republic of Wisconsin simply do not have the legal or moral authority to overrule an international commitment that the US government signed 63 years ago.

Article 30.

* Nothing in this Declaration may be interpreted as implying for any State, group or person any right to engage in any activity or to perform any act aimed at the destruction of any of the rights and freedoms set forth herein.

Translation: If we suddenly decide that the aforementioned "rights" don't count, then they don't....Deal with it.


Moreover, the UN has no jurisdiction over American law.

Fail.

Nice.

 

[DiveCon]

With all the protest going on in WI, and Walker not willing to negotiate his hardline stance, do you think he will be recalled?

Politicians in Wisconsin are not subject to "recall" for the first year after taking office, so Walker will be exempt until January 2012.

8 Republican state senators, however, have held office for more than 1 year and are subject to recall. A loss of only 3 Republican state senators would result in a shift of power back in favor of the Democrats.

The private abd public unions that oppose Walker are already well organized so getting the minimuum number of signatures should not represent a major obstacle.

It should be clear by now that Wisconsin needs a leader who should be attempting to provide statesmanship and concensus during this difficult time. Refusing to negotiate and ruling by decree has proven to be counterproductive thusfar.

yeah and 8 dem senators face the same thing, and require fewer signatures to initiate

have fun with them apples

 

[Foxfyre]

I have found a rule of thumb as it pertains to polls...

If you do not see the demographics at first glance?

It gives you MORE reason to dig and find them.

Not me. I just consider material copy and pasted without link or explanation to be blowing smoke from people who don't give a damn about whether it is defensible or not. They just hope the ignorant and gullible will swallow it whole and applaud them for their brilliance.

(Sorry. I'm grumpy today. But it is absurd to post stuff with no link or disclaimer and leave it to others to go look for the source.)

OK...here is the release of the poll:

http://www.strategictelemetry.com/docs/Walker_Budget_Survey_022811.pdf

Here is the paragraph where it makes it clear that all those polled were democratic voters or would be democratic voters (findings section...para 4):

Wisconsin does not have party registration, so it is not possible to quantify the number of
Democrats, Republicans and independents who feel that Walker should be recalled. However,there are a number of microtargeting models that predict the likelihood of any voter supportingDemocratic candidates, and the likelihood of their being willing to take actions like volunteeringfor a campaign, or going door‐to‐door to collect signatures.

And here is a link to the election results:

Wisconsin gubernatorial election, 2010 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And here is the pertinant part of the link:

Election Results
Party Candidate Votes Percentage
Democratic Tom Barrett 1,004,303 46%
Republican Scott Walker 1,128,941 52%
Totals 2,160,832 100%

And here is the link to how many wisconsin voters there are:

Answers.com - How many Wisconsin registered voters are there

Now.....someone else can do the math....but I know I am correct.....if the 608 people polled is an accurate reading oif the trend.....then 300,000 who voted for Barrett do NOT want a recall.

Oh yeah...and by the way....here is the link to the polling company.....

Strategic Telemetry, Inc. - Welcome to Strategic Telemetry

And here is what it says about itself found toward the end of the survey linked above...

About Strategic Telemetry
Strategic Telemetry provides microtargeting and strategic consulting for progressive candidates
and labor organizations. Strategic Telemetry produced the microtargeting used by Barack
Obama's 2008 campaign and for hundreds of other campaigns.

I bolded the interesting part.

There...how did I do?

You did well. You turned a numbnut post into a good solid post there. As an old debate coach/judge here, I would have to give you points for that. Well done.

And I think we would all need to at least add the information you have provided to the bucket of knowledge we're developing on this subject. It deserves to be there despite the fact that I found several leftwing Democrats who have used Strategic Telemetry but no conservatives. That adds an element of bias that does NOT disqualify the information, but does suggest that some additional corroboration is needed before it is accepted as gospel.

 

[Jarhead]

With all the protest going on in WI, and Walker not willing to negotiate his hardline stance, do you think he will be recalled?

Politicians in Wisconsin are not subject to "recall" for the first year after taking office, so Walker will be exempt until January 2012.

8 Republican state senators, however, have held office for more than 1 year and are subject to recall. A loss of only 3 Republican state senators would result in a shift of power back in favor of the Democrats.

The private abd public unions that oppose Walker are already well organized so getting the minimuum number of signatures should not represent a major obstacle.

It should be clear by now that Wisconsin needs a leader who should be attempting to provide statesmanship and concensus during this difficult time. Refusing to negotiate and ruling by decree has proven to be counterproductive thusfar.

But you were OK with it as it pertained to healthcare at the federal level.....right?

And by the way...so far polls conducted by the democrats show that they would fail at a recall and those 8 senators would stay intact....but they want to waste the tax payer money doing it anyway?

Sure...go ahead...they have plenty of money there in Wisconsin to throw around for no reason.

 

[DiveCon]

With all the protest going on in WI, and Walker not willing to negotiate his hardline stance, do you think he will be recalled?

Politicians in Wisconsin are not subject to "recall" for the first year after taking office, so Walker will be exempt until January 2012.

8 Republican state senators, however, have held office for more than 1 year and are subject to recall. A loss of only 3 Republican state senators would result in a shift of power back in favor of the Democrats.

The private abd public unions that oppose Walker are already well organized so getting the minimuum number of signatures should not represent a major obstacle.

It should be clear by now that Wisconsin needs a leader who should be attempting to provide statesmanship and concensus during this difficult time. Refusing to negotiate and ruling by decree has proven to be counterproductive thusfar.

But you were OK with it as it pertained to healthcare at the federal level.....right?

And by the way...so far polls conducted by the democrats show that they would fail at a recall and those 8 senators would stay intact....but they want to waste the tax payer money doing it anyway?

Sure...go ahead...they have plenty of money there in Wisconsin to throw around for no reason.

hey, it will be a summer of dueling recalls in WI

8 GOP state senators vs 8 dem runaway senators

 

[Jarhead]

Not me. I just consider material copy and pasted without link or explanation to be blowing smoke from people who don't give a damn about whether it is defensible or not. They just hope the ignorant and gullible will swallow it whole and applaud them for their brilliance.

(Sorry. I'm grumpy today. But it is absurd to post stuff with no link or disclaimer and leave it to others to go look for the source.)

OK...here is the release of the poll:

http://www.strategictelemetry.com/docs/Walker_Budget_Survey_022811.pdf

Here is the paragraph where it makes it clear that all those polled were democratic voters or would be democratic voters (findings section...para 4):

Wisconsin does not have party registration, so it is not possible to quantify the number of
Democrats, Republicans and independents who feel that Walker should be recalled. However,there are a number of microtargeting models that predict the likelihood of any voter supportingDemocratic candidates, and the likelihood of their being willing to take actions like volunteeringfor a campaign, or going door‐to‐door to collect signatures.

And here is a link to the election results:

Wisconsin gubernatorial election, 2010 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And here is the pertinant part of the link:

Election Results
Party Candidate Votes Percentage
Democratic Tom Barrett 1,004,303 46%
Republican Scott Walker 1,128,941 52%
Totals 2,160,832 100%

And here is the link to how many wisconsin voters there are:

Answers.com - How many Wisconsin registered voters are there

Now.....someone else can do the math....but I know I am correct.....if the 608 people polled is an accurate reading oif the trend.....then 300,000 who voted for Barrett do NOT want a recall.

Oh yeah...and by the way....here is the link to the polling company.....

Strategic Telemetry, Inc. - Welcome to Strategic Telemetry

And here is what it says about itself found toward the end of the survey linked above...

About Strategic Telemetry
Strategic Telemetry provides microtargeting and strategic consulting for progressive candidates
and labor organizations. Strategic Telemetry produced the microtargeting used by Barack
Obama's 2008 campaign and for hundreds of other campaigns.

I bolded the interesting part.

There...how did I do?

You did well. You turned a numbnut post into a good solid post there. As an old debate coach/judge here, I would have to give you points for that. Well done.

And I think we would all need to at least add the information you have provided to the bucket of knowledge we're developing on this subject. It deserves to be there despite the fact that I found several leftwing Democrats who have used Strategic Telemetry but no conservatives. That adds an element of bias that does NOT disqualify the information, but does suggest that some additional corroboration is needed before it is accepted as gospel.

Seeing as strategic telemetry markets itself as a service to progressice candidates and labor organizations...I doubt they would conduct a survey for a conservative....and likely a conservatiove would not trust them to be accurate.

But seeing as the one who hadcontracted this survey TOUTED it...I must assume it was the best they can find.....and since it actually shows "BAD NEWS" if you disect it, it is likely the best of the bad that they could come up with.

To me? It speaks volumes. The people of Wisconsin are happy with what is happening.