Shared Sacrifice: Eliminating Obama Care saves $2 Trillion- do it for the US Obama

[Sallow]

You mean with the 500 billion cuts in Medicare to help pay for it?

Well the Republicans could cut 500 billion as well from Medicare, if you want

They aren't cuts. They are eliminating fraud, waste, abuse and redundancy.

Which conservatives hate..because that's how they make money.

 

[hellofromwarsaw]

HHahahahahahahaha. GD pub dupes! Sorry I've had it

 

[Neotrotsky]

I support moving already socialized system towards the market; sometimes you have to take the good with bad.

I don't know how to interpret this. Are you saying exchanges are or are not markets? Do you approve or disapprove of Paul Ryan's proposal to organize the private insurance markets in states using state-based exchanges (similar to the ACA)?

Papa ObamaCare's gov't interjection is more than just the exchanges

What are you referring to?

Plus his exchanges are bringing more socialized efforts into the market

I don't know what this means. Buzzwords and gibberish do not a discussion make. What are you referring to?

While the exchanges in the two programs are similar, they represent different motives and different levels of regulation.


Medicare is basically a failing single payer "socialized" system that Ryan is trying to correct with a movement back towards market forces with the reimbursements and exchanges.

His movement to the exchange is a movement from single payer towards market forces.
Movement in the right direction
~

PapaObama Care is just the opposite
Indeed, with his plan, basically a "Medicare lite", it is a movement towards a more socialized system. The wrong direction.

So while the plans may have some similar things, they are opposite in attempts

 

[Greenbeard]

While the exchanges in the two programs are similar, they represent different motives and different levels of regulation.

Medicare is basically a failing single payer "socialized" system that Ryan is trying to correct with a movement back towards market forces with the reimbursements and exchanges.

I'm not talking about his scheme to end Medicare, I'm talking about his comprehensive health reform bill from the last go around (introduced a few weeks before the Democratic bills that became the ACA). In Ryan's bill, private insurance markets were to be organized into state-based exchanges (note this has nothing to do with Medicare). His proposal took the existing private individual market and organized it into an exchange structure, just as the ACA does.

Do you support that?

His movement to the exchange is a movement from single payer towards market forces.

Again, no. I'm not talking about the Medicare exchange in his budget, I'm talking about the state-based exchanges for the non-Medicare population in the individual insurance market in his Patients' Choice Act.

These are indeed movements in the same direction as the ACA: from disorganized, poorly functioning individual markets to organized, competitive state exchanges. Do you support that concept?

 

[Neotrotsky]

Again, it is the same thing

Knowing that the Left would use procedure gimmicks to pass PapaObama as opposed to a proper vote,
it was a proper response to involve the State's more

I have no disagreement with states trying whatever they want. I have no issue
with Romney Care was imposed, outside of the fact it is failing.

In fact, I would say it is more in line the Constitution and the 10th amendment:

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.​

So Ryan Plan is this case represents a movement that is more in line with
our Constitution and the role of the Federal gov't and the role of States

 

[Greenbeard]

So Ryan Plan is this case represents a movement that is more in line with our Constitution and the role of the Federal gov't and the role of States

Federal legislation establishing state-based exchanges is all right with you? Well, that's good. What's your problem with the ACA again, then?

 

[Neotrotsky]

So Ryan Plan is this case represents a movement that is more in line with our Constitution and the role of the Federal gov't and the role of States

Federal legislation establishing state-based exchanges is all right with you? Well, that's good. What's your problem with the ACA again, then?

ACA?

Oh PapaObama care

Not mine, the US Constitution


Funny how the Left does not even want to associate it with his name

 

[Greenbeard]

ACA?

Oh PapaObama care

Not mine, the US Constitution

This is bizarre. You just endorsed its central concept--state-designed and operated health insurance exchanges-- of the ACA as "more in line the Constitution and the 10th amendment" and "more in line with our Constitution and the role of the Federal gov't and the role of States."

I suppose we're back to where we've been all along: It might help to familiarize yourself with the actual legislation. Then you'll be able to form self-consistent, informed opinions about it instead of just relying on knee-jerk reactions to the name on the marquee (it's good if Ryan proposes it, bad if Obama proposes the same thing!).

 

[Neotrotsky]

ACA?

Oh PapaObama care

Not mine, the US Constitution

This is bizarre. You just endorsed its central concept--state-designed and operated health insurance exchanges-- of the ACA as "more in line the Constitution and the 10th amendment" and "more in line with our Constitution and the role of the Federal gov't and the role of States."

I suppose we're back to where we've been all along: It might help to familiarize yourself with the actual legislation. Then you'll be able to form self-consistent, informed opinions about it instead of just relying on knee-jerk reactions to the name on the marquee (it's good if Ryan proposes it, bad if Obama proposes the same thing!).

Well, the question will be up to the SCOTUS, ultimately
Bizarre, is your non appreciation of the 10 amendment
and limiting powers of the US Constitution on Federal gov't.


We are back to where we started
Indeed, if you familiarized yourself with the US Constitution and the whole Left for that
matter, we would not be here today. As well, your comments would be appear to
be more than just "shill" acting on the behalf of PapaObama Care


As I predicted,
we can agree to disagree
otherwise, it will just be discussed
ad nauseum

 

[Greenbeard]

As I predicted,
we can agree to disagree

But we don't disagree. That's my point. We both like state-based health insurance exchanges. In your case, I just have to tell you that Ryan proposed them (and omit the fact that Obama is associated with their passage into law). Paragons of federalism and Constitutionalism, those are.

You dislike Obama, not the policies in the Affordable Care Act. My interest is in the latter. Thus there's no need for us to agree to disagree, as we already agree.

 

[Neotrotsky]

As I predicted,
we can agree to disagree

But we don't disagree. That's my point. We both like state-based health insurance exchanges. In your case, I just have to tell you that Ryan proposed them (and omit the fact that Obama is associated with their passage into law). Paragons of federalism and Constitutionalism, those are.

You dislike Obama, not the policies in the Affordable Care Act. My interest is in the latter. Thus there's no need for us to agree to disagree, as we already agree.

I never said I "like" them

I said Ryan's plans represent movement towards free markets
and are more in line with the Constitution

Papa Obama's are not; it appears you think they are
that is our disagreement

Really, using the Left template here is not working
But hey, it is your story and
you can tell it anyway you want

 

[rdean]

Shared Sacrifice: Eliminating Obama Care saves $2 Trillion- do it for the US Obama

So what would Republicans put in it's place?

Die quickly? We know they want to end Medicare and slash funding that helps middle class Americans. When those people get sick, what's the answer? Where do they go? To Emergency rooms at 10 to 50 times the cost?

I mean besides "Die Quickly"? What are they expected to do?

 

[rdean]

As I predicted,
we can agree to disagree

But we don't disagree. That's my point. We both like state-based health insurance exchanges. In your case, I just have to tell you that Ryan proposed them (and omit the fact that Obama is associated with their passage into law). Paragons of federalism and Constitutionalism, those are.

You dislike Obama, not the policies in the Affordable Care Act. My interest is in the latter. Thus there's no need for us to agree to disagree, as we already agree.

I never said I "like" them

I said Ryan's plans represent movement towards free markets
and are more in line with the Constitution

Papa Obama's are not; it appears you think they are
that is our disagreement

Really, using the Left template here is not working
But hey, it is your story and
you can tell it anyway you want

Insurance companies don't make anything. They don't create anything. They only skim money off policies. Is that how you see the "free market"? You don't need to sell anything? You just scam people? Take advantage of sick people? That's your answer? How can you not see that as anything but disgusting?

 

[Lovebears65]

My insurance cost went up by 2200 thanks to Obamacare. I say repeal it