Sea ice extent now the third lowest on record

[code1211]

Sep 11, 2009 01:42 PM
Matt Moore, Seth Borenstein
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

FRANKFURT, Germany – Two German ships have traversed the fabled Northeast Passage, having arrived in Siberia from South Korea by travelling around Russia's Arctic coast line. Global warming and melting ice made the journey possible.

Now the German-owned ships are poised to complete their journey through the cold waters where icebergs abound, heading for Rotterdam in the Netherlands with 3,500 tons of construction parts.

The merchant ships MV Beluga Fraternity and MV Beluga Foresight arrived this week in Yamburg, Siberia, their owner Beluga Shipping GmbH said Friday. They travelled from Ulsan, South Korea, in late July to Siberia by way of the Northeast Passage, a sea lane that, in years past, was avoided because of its heavy ice floes.

Scientists report that the Arctic Ocean ice cap has been shrinking to unprecedented levels in recent summers, because of global warming, opening up many passages that were ice-choked in earlier times.

In July, new NASA satellite measurements showed that sea ice in the Arctic was not just shrinking in area, but thinning dramatically.

Niels Stolberg, the president of Beluga, which is based in the German city of Bremen, called it the first time a Western shipping company successfully transited the Northeast Passage.
TheStar.com | World | Two German freighters traverse Northeast Passage

Sorry. I misread. I thought you were saying North West passage like Amundson.

 

[Old Rocks]

The passage Amundsen took cannot be taken by modern freightors. Much of it is too shallow for large ships. The boat that he had was an 87 ton herring boat. And he took three years, not a couple of weeks.

 

[FactFinder]

The sea ice extent has grown for 2 years in a row. This correlates perfectly with the lack of sunspots and global cooling that has been happening this last 2 years.

We may even be on the edge of another ice age.

Global Cooling Chills Summer 2009
Global Cooling Chills Summer 2009 by Deroy Murdock on National Review Online

 

[KittenKoder]

The CO2 increase can be correlated to the increase in population of humanity, but nothing else from what I have seen.

 

[Chris]

The CO2 increase can be correlated to the increase in population of humanity, but nothing else from what I have seen.

CO2 warms the earth.

That is a physical fact.

The fact that you ignore this fact does not change the reality of it.

 

[DiveCon]

The CO2 increase can be correlated to the increase in population of humanity, but nothing else from what I have seen.

CO2 warms the earth.

That is a physical fact.

The fact that you ignore this fact does not change the reality of it.

that you claim it as a fact is almost sure proof it is NOT

 

[RetiredGySgt]

CO2 has a diminishing effect on the warming effect. As More accumulates in the atmosphere it has less and less effect. So at first it effects to a small degree then the effect remains but more causes even less effect to occur.

Further it is simply amazing that people are trying to use a record that is only 30 years long as some kind of indicator on the condition of the ice on the poles.

 

[FactFinder]

The CO2 increase can be correlated to the increase in population of humanity, but nothing else from what I have seen.

CO2 warms the earth.

That is a physical fact.

The fact that you ignore this fact does not change the reality of it.

Didn't you say that about 50,000 times in innumerable posts before.

Have you conviced yourself yet or does the mantra contnue?

So if CO2 so warms the earth then why the hell are we cooling? Did the CO2 go on a holiday? If so when the hell is it going back to work? Must be a liberal sucking off the gov teat.

 

[Old Rocks]

The sea ice extent has grown for 2 years in a row. This correlates perfectly with the lack of sunspots and global cooling that has been happening this last 2 years.

We may even be on the edge of another ice age.

Global Cooling Chills Summer 2009
Global Cooling Chills Summer 2009 by Deroy Murdock on National Review Online

For the year to date, the combined global land and ocean surface temperature of 58.3 degrees F tied with 2003 for the fifth-warmest January-August period on record. This value is 0.99 degree F above the 20th century average.

NOAA - National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration - NOAA: Warmest Global Sea-Surface Temperatures for August and Summer

No, we are not on the edge of an ice age, and it is not getting colder.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

The sea ice extent has grown for 2 years in a row. This correlates perfectly with the lack of sunspots and global cooling that has been happening this last 2 years.

We may even be on the edge of another ice age.

Global Cooling Chills Summer 2009
Global Cooling Chills Summer 2009 by Deroy Murdock on National Review Online

For the year to date, the combined global land and ocean surface temperature of 58.3 degrees F tied with 2003 for the fifth-warmest January-August period on record. This value is 0.99 degree F above the 20th century average.

NOAA - National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration - NOAA: Warmest Global Sea-Surface Temperatures for August and Summer

No, we are not on the edge of an ice age, and it is not getting colder.

And you have yet to answer me, HOW OLD IS THE RECORD? How many years do they have measurements for that are meaningful? This is akin to the ignorant 30 year record of satellite coverage you put so much faith in. The earth is Billions of years old and man has been around how long? A lot longer then 30 years or even 100 years. Your information is so not scientific. It is NOT scientific to make estimates of any worth on such a small slice of the time involved. It is meaningless.

 

[FactFinder]

The sea ice extent has grown for 2 years in a row. This correlates perfectly with the lack of sunspots and global cooling that has been happening this last 2 years.

We may even be on the edge of another ice age.

Global Cooling Chills Summer 2009
Global Cooling Chills Summer 2009 by Deroy Murdock on National Review Online

For the year to date, the combined global land and ocean surface temperature of 58.3 degrees F tied with 2003 for the fifth-warmest January-August period on record. This value is 0.99 degree F above the 20th century average.

NOAA - National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration - NOAA: Warmest Global Sea-Surface Temperatures for August and Summer

No, we are not on the edge of an ice age, and it is not getting colder.

You folks better find a stat that sounds scarier then 58.3 degrees. Must have been a fear mongering oversight. 58.3 degrees just makes me wish for more warming. And yes once water is naturally heated (due to a period of heightened solar activity) it dissipates that heat more slowly than the air. But lets not have science and common sense get in the way of manipulative stats.
Good thing it does dissipate more slowly. That has a moderating effect on all the cooling that is going on. Have you also taken into account the heightened amount of undersea volcanic activity?

Does man master the earth? Ask the Indonesians.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Since NONE of our resident " the sky is falling" crowd could answer my simple question I did some research.

Temperature Data

The Government only has Sea Temperature numbers since 1955. A grand total of 55 years worth of DATA for our friends to claim they have world shattering news from.

So once again Old Rocks and Chris and their buddies are having cows because of a 30 year record of Satellite data and a 55 year record of all measurements. 55 years, that is all they have and they are making predictions about what the earth is and will do based on a record so slim as to be meaningless.

This fits precisely with the 20 year prediction base they use for Man made global warming. They are making predictions out to 100 years based on data that is 20 years old, 30 years old and 55 years old. And they call this science.

 

[FactFinder]

Since NONE of our resident " the sky is falling" crowd could answer my simple question I did some research.

Temperature Data

The Government only has Sea Temperature numbers since 1955. A grand total of 55 years worth of DATA for our friends to claim they have world shattering news from.

So once again Old Rocks and Chris and their buddies are having cows because of a 30 year record of Satellite data and a 55 year record of all measurements. 55 years, that is all they have and they are making predictions about what the earth is and will do based on a record so slim as to be meaningless.

This fits precisely with the 20 year prediction base they use for Man made global warming. They are making predictions out to 100 years based on data that is 20 years old, 30 years old and 55 years old. And they call this science.

They can't possibly touch that one Gunny. It leaves their stats so naked..

 

[DiveCon]

Since NONE of our resident " the sky is falling" crowd could answer my simple question I did some research.

Temperature Data

The Government only has Sea Temperature numbers since 1955. A grand total of 55 years worth of DATA for our friends to claim they have world shattering news from.

So once again Old Rocks and Chris and their buddies are having cows because of a 30 year record of Satellite data and a 55 year record of all measurements. 55 years, that is all they have and they are making predictions about what the earth is and will do based on a record so slim as to be meaningless.

This fits precisely with the 20 year prediction base they use for Man made global warming. They are making predictions out to 100 years based on data that is 20 years old, 30 years old and 55 years old. And they call this science.

and then, how many data points have they actually had for those 50 years?
i bet they have MORE now than they did back in 1955

 

[Old Rocks]

Damn, do you understand what the word 'proxy' means?

http://www.physics.ohio-state.edu/~wilkins/energy/Companion/E16.3.pdf.xpdf

ScienceDirect - Palaeogeography, Palaeoclimatology, Palaeoecology : Multi-proxy reconstructions of northeastern Pacific sea surface temperature data from trees and Pacific geoduck

We demonstrate the potential for developing sea surface temperature (SST) reconstructions in the northeast Pacific from combinations of tree-ring and growth-increment chronologies of the long-lived marine bivalve, the Pacific geoduck. Six Pacific geoduck chronologies developed from site along the Washington–British Columbia coast are compared and combined with tree-ring chronologies from California to Alaska. All chronologies are annually resolved and strongly relate to local to regional-scale SST, though differences in the response season as well as the spectral properties of the two proxies are observed. Both proxy types closely track SST and when used in combination, yield a more robust SST reconstruction than tree-ring or geoduck chronologies could provide alone. In total, variance explained in SST is 63.9% at the regional-scale and 68.2% at a local scale, providing SST estimates for more than 60 years prior to the start of continuous instrumental records in this region. This study represents one of the few climate reconstructions where both proxies are annually resolved, and is the first to integrate regional networks of geoduck chronologies and tree-ring chronologies.

 

[DiveCon]

Damn, do you understand what the word 'proxy' means?

http://www.physics.ohio-state.edu/~wilkins/energy/Companion/E16.3.pdf.xpdf

ScienceDirect - Palaeogeography, Palaeoclimatology, Palaeoecology : Multi-proxy reconstructions of northeastern Pacific sea surface temperature data from trees and Pacific geoduck

We demonstrate the potential for developing sea surface temperature (SST) reconstructions in the northeast Pacific from combinations of tree-ring and growth-increment chronologies of the long-lived marine bivalve, the Pacific geoduck. Six Pacific geoduck chronologies developed from site along the Washington–British Columbia coast are compared and combined with tree-ring chronologies from California to Alaska. All chronologies are annually resolved and strongly relate to local to regional-scale SST, though differences in the response season as well as the spectral properties of the two proxies are observed. Both proxy types closely track SST and when used in combination, yield a more robust SST reconstruction than tree-ring or geoduck chronologies could provide alone. In total, variance explained in SST is 63.9% at the regional-scale and 68.2% at a local scale, providing SST estimates for more than 60 years prior to the start of continuous instrumental records in this region. This study represents one of the few climate reconstructions where both proxies are annually resolved, and is the first to integrate regional networks of geoduck chronologies and tree-ring chronologies.

i understand proxy likely WAY more than you ever could
but you will still ignore the facts and cling to your religious dogma

worship at the alter of AlGore

 

[Old Rocks]

Since you are answering with insults rather than articles supporting your position, I take it you cannot support that position. And I seriously doubt that you understand proxy data at all.

 

[DiveCon]

Since you are answering with insults rather than articles supporting your position, I take it you cannot support that position. And I seriously doubt that you understand proxy data at all.

sure thing, go say another prayer to AlGore

 

[FactFinder]

Damn, do you understand what the word 'proxy' means?

http://www.physics.ohio-state.edu/~wilkins/energy/Companion/E16.3.pdf.xpdf

ScienceDirect - Palaeogeography, Palaeoclimatology, Palaeoecology : Multi-proxy reconstructions of northeastern Pacific sea surface temperature data from trees and Pacific geoduck

We demonstrate the potential for developing sea surface temperature (SST) reconstructions in the northeast Pacific from combinations of tree-ring and growth-increment chronologies of the long-lived marine bivalve, the Pacific geoduck. Six Pacific geoduck chronologies developed from site along the Washington–British Columbia coast are compared and combined with tree-ring chronologies from California to Alaska. All chronologies are annually resolved and strongly relate to local to regional-scale SST, though differences in the response season as well as the spectral properties of the two proxies are observed. Both proxy types closely track SST and when used in combination, yield a more robust SST reconstruction than tree-ring or geoduck chronologies could provide alone. In total, variance explained in SST is 63.9% at the regional-scale and 68.2% at a local scale, providing SST estimates for more than 60 years prior to the start of continuous instrumental records in this region. This study represents one of the few climate reconstructions where both proxies are annually resolved, and is the first to integrate regional networks of geoduck chronologies and tree-ring chronologies.

Oh I see...You then take this theoretical method that has no absolutes to calibrate its accuracy then extrapolate the finding to not only include the northeast Pacific but the whole ocean. Talk about your quantum leaps, huh?

 

[mal]

Since you are answering with insults rather than articles supporting your position, I take it you cannot support that position. And I seriously doubt that you understand proxy data at all.

sure thing, go say another prayer to AlGore

Are you Playing on our Fears again?...



peace...