Scientific opposition to climate change

Discussion in 'Environment' started by Saigon, Feb 17, 2013.

  1. Saigon
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    Saigon Senior Member

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    Oddball yesteray posted an overview of scientific organisations who do not accept climate change.

    It's worth taking a serious look at -

    ExxonMobil has funneled nearly $16 million between 1998 and 2005 to a network of 43 advocacy organizations that seek to confuse the public on global warming science.

    Greening Earth Society

    The Greening Earth Society (GES) was founded by the Western Fuels Association to promote the view that increasing levels of atmospheric CO2 are good for humanity. GES and Western Fuels are essentially the same organization. Both used to be located at the same office suite in Arlington, VA. The Western Fuels Assocation (WFA) is a cooperative of coal-dependent utilities in the western states that works in part to discredit climate change science and to prevent regulations that might damage coal-related industries.

    Spin: CO2 emissions are good for the planet; coal is the best energy source we have.

    Funding: The Greening Earth Society receives its funding from the Western Fuels Association, which in turn receives its funding from its coal and utility company members.


    Global Climate Coalition

    Founded in 1989 by 46 corporations and trade associations representing all major elements of US industry, the GCC presents itself as a "voice for business in the global warming debate." The group funded several flawed studies on the economics of the cost of mitigating climate change, which formed the basis of their 1997/1998 multi-million dollar advertising campaign against the Kyoto Protocol. The GCC began to unravel in 1997 when British Petroleum withdrew its membership. Since then many other corporations have followed BP s lead and left the coalition. This exodus reached a fevered pitch in the early months of 2000 when DaimlerChrysler, Texaco and General Motors all announced their exodus from the GCC. Since these desertions, the GCC restructured and remains a powerful and well-funded force focused on obstructing meaningful efforts to mitigate climate change.

    Spin: Global Warming is real, but it is too expensive to do anything about. The Kyoto Protocol is fundamentally flawed.

    Funding: Corporate members (industries, trade associations etc.)


    Science and Environmental Policy Project (SEPP)

    Founded in 1990 by widely publicized climate skeptic S. Fred Singer, SEPP s stated purpose is to "document the relationship between scientific data and the development of federal environmental policy." SEPP has mounted a sizeable media campaign -- to discredit the issues of global warming, ozone depletion, and acid rain.

    Spin: Moreover, climate change won t be bad for us anyway. Action on climate change is not warranted because of shaky science and flawed policy approaches.

    Funding: Conservative foundations including Bradley, Smith Richardson, and Forbes. SEPP has also been directly tied to ultra right-wing mogul Reverend Sung Myung Moon s Unification Church, including receipt of a year s free office space from a Moon-funded group and the participation of SEPP s director in church-sponsored conferences and on the board of a Moon-funded magazine.

    Global Warming Skeptic Organizations | Union of Concerned Scientists

    It's interesting to note - and I really hope scpetics will take note of this - that three of the best sources producing sceptical science are funded by the coal industry, the automotive industry and the Reverand Moon.
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  2. SSDD
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    SSDD Senior Member

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    $16 million between 1998 and 2005? Really? Care to take an estimate of how much money during that same time period went into the pro AGW machine?

    http://climatechange.procon.org/sourcefiles/CBO_Climate_Funding.pdf

    During that same period, according to the Congressional Budget Office, the US government alone poured 38.4 BILLION dollars into the pro AGW machine. That is the US government alone. How much more money do you suppose came from the IPCC, greenpeace, WWF, and all the other sources of Pro AGW funding?

    Another 10.5 billion owas was spent on the pro AGW machine for the years 2000, 2001, and 2002 by just the top 80 sources funding climate change projects. 10.5 billion in just 3 of the 8 years in question in addition to the 38.4 billion from the US government. If your argument is that money corrupts....and it does, then there is little doubt as to which side of this debate is more vulnerable to the corrupting influence of money. And you are waving your hands over a mere 16 million over an 8 year period? You are laugable.

    http://www.marshall.org/pdf/materials/289.pdf

    And you believe that 16 million over that same period is a sure indicator of corruption? The fact that the discussion continues considering the vast disparity in funding is prima facie evidence that there is substance to the skeptic argument.
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  3. Saigon
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    Saigon Senior Member

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    Right...so Bush, who denied climate change, was actually funding the research which confirmed climate change.

    That's logical, isn't it?

    btw. The funding you refer to was patently NOT given to companies which produce renewables. That is the figure for all research into the climate - a good 90% of which went to universities, quangos and federal agencies involved in this kind of thing. Again, there is no reason at all why anyone would think that research was anything else but first class.
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2013
  4. SSDD
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    FInest research money can buy and the results they wanted to....how about that.

    So we have hundreds of billions vs a paltry 16 billion over 8 years and you think skeptics are being corrupted by money. You are at least as stupid as I thought you were.
  5. TheOldSchool
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    Skeptics are not being corrupted. You can't intellectually corrupt something that didn't have an intellect in the first place.
  6. SSDD
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    Talk about not having an intellect...you thanked me for a post that you disagree with.
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    Say what now. I may have been drunk at the time.
  8. SSDD
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    SSDD Senior Member

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    Just read it again when you are sober.
  9. TheOldSchool
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    I'm sober now. Still don't get it.
  10. SSDD
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    Guess you won't.
  11. TheOldSchool
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    Alas
  12. Oddball
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    Yes...Because far be it from people who stand to have their business destroyed, by a bunch of hoaxers with a communistic energy and overall economic agenda, fight back.

    Speaking of vested financial interests, what's in it for IPCC, UCAR/NCAR, East Anglia, Jones, Mann, Trenberth, Hansen, Pachauri and the rest of the eco flim-flam artists, should they come out tomorrow and say "Sorry, our bad!...Nothing to worry about!"?

    Say bye-bye to their cushy university departments -where they don't have to produce jack shit that anyone would ever want to buy- and attendant endowments, junkets to the highest of high-end venues around the globe to hobnob with one another and all the world's displaced communists, no more nicely padded expense accounts... No more free ride gravy train on the backs of the taxpayers and college alumni, that's what.

    Vested interests indeed.
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2013
  13. Old Rocks
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    Damn, what a stupid fuckup of an asshole you are, Oddie. I have known many geologists, and have seen them at work in the lab and field. You couldn't keep up physically or intellectually with most of them.

    You continually insult a group of people that are far intellectually your superiors. You come of as one ignorant redneck, incapable of anything but standing in left doing the neener-neener act. When you are not telling outright lies concerning people far more honest and dedicated than you will ever be.
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  14. Saigon
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    Saigon Senior Member

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    How stupid Oddball is can be fairly well determined by the fact that HE posted this information on climate sceptics in the first place - obviously without having read it.

    Predictably, he now seems to have gone very quiet on the fact that even his own sources confirms that one of the few remaining bastions of sceptical science is funded by the coal industry.
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2013
  15. Saigon
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    SSDD -

    Most research is excellent.

    Funding excellent research is not the same as paying someone to produce pre-determined results.

    What Oddball has proven here is that sceptics do the latter.

    What you have not proven is that anyone else has.
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2013
  16. Oddball
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    Right, right, right....

    Energy companies are just completely heinous and biased polluters, who only want to maintain their ability to fuck up the world and get rich doing it, while the Goebbels warming "scientists", and the scam artist like Algore who pimp for them, are entirely above reproach.

    Helpful advice: If you hear a call for a gathering of everyone at the pavilion over the PA system, don't go. :lol:
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  17. longknife
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    Global Warming Consensus Looking More Like A Myth

    Posted 02/15/2013 06:09 PM ET

    Read More At IBD: Global Warming Consensus Of Scientists Looking More Like A Myth - Investors.com
    Follow us: @IBDinvestors on Twitter | InvestorsBusinessDaily on Facebook

    :eusa_liar:
  18. Saigon
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    Saigon Senior Member

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    Longknife -

    Wow. Investors.com.

    Truly a trusted name and esteemed source of information on science.

    Jesus wept....
  19. Oddball
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  20. Saigon
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    Oddball -

    If there is ever an award for Most Gullible Man in the World, you're a cert to win it.

    Honestly, if you read on the internet that Al Gore started WWI you'd be parroting it here as gospel within seconds, wouldn't you?!
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