Sarah Palin: Trump's Carrier deal is 'crony capitalism'

[Vandalshandle]

I just heard from Trump. He told me that if I quit going to Nogales, Mexico, for my dental work, he will see that I don't have to pay any state income tax for the next 5 years. I have to admit that he is a tough negotiator. I wanted 7 years tax free. He started with a 4 year offer, and would not go one year further than 5. However, I did negotiate the ability to continue to buy RX in Mexico.

 

[easyt65]

Got to admire her for saying what she believes rather than demonstrating blind party loyalty.

 

[Dr Grump]

I didn't vote for Trump because at the end of the day he is a big government Liberal that has no problem with government interference in the free market.

I didn't vote for that asshole Obama because he is a big government Liberal that has no problem with government interference in the free market.

I am not the one that is inconsistent. I am consistent with my Conservative values and being against crony capitalism.

You stupid Liberals love crony capitalism when Democrats do it and bitch about it when Republicans do it.

It is like you justifying Democrat interventionism and condemning Republican interventionism.

You Moon Bat Libtards have no moral or intellectual foundation. You just wing it from one partisan issue to another.

The blatant hypocrisy is from you stupid Moon Bats that loved it when that piece of shit Obama paid back the filthy greedy unions and idiotic environmental wackos that had given him money during the campaign by using taxpayer's money for subsidies and bail out companies that couldn't make it on their own. Now you hypocrites are bitching about Trump saving Carrier jobs.

There is one difference with Trump to his credit compared to that asshole Obama. Trump's campaign was not funded by Carrier or other special interest. groups. That scumbag Obama used taxpayer's money to pay back the greedy assholes that gave him money and that is despicable.

I'm not a liberal.
That aside, I don't have a problem with either party providing stimulus if it keeps an industry open. You are not reading my post properly. I am against the hypocrisy.

According to the neocon whackos : Obama gives stimulus to car industry (that they HAVE to pay back and have almost done) to save 1.5 million jobs = Obama is a socialist

Trump offers a tax break to a company that doesn't even it to 'save' 1100 jobs = Trump is a hero.

Total, utter BS.

 

[blackhawk]

The left suddenly cares what Sarah Palin thinks you sure didn't when she was one of the first to back Trump.

 

[Maryland Patriot]

I didn't vote for Trump because at the end of the day he is a big government Liberal that has no problem with government interference in the free market.

I didn't vote for that asshole Obama because he is a big government Liberal that has no problem with government interference in the free market.

I am not the one that is inconsistent. I am consistent with my Conservative values and being against crony capitalism.

You stupid Liberals love crony capitalism when Democrats do it and bitch about it when Republicans do it.

It is like you justifying Democrat interventionism and condemning Republican interventionism.

You Moon Bat Libtards have no moral or intellectual foundation. You just wing it from one partisan issue to another.

The blatant hypocrisy is from you stupid Moon Bats that loved it when that piece of shit Obama paid back the filthy greedy unions and idiotic environmental wackos that had given him money during the campaign by using taxpayer's money for subsidies and bail out companies that couldn't make it on their own. Now you hypocrites are bitching about Trump saving Carrier jobs.

There is one difference with Trump to his credit compared to that asshole Obama. Trump's campaign was not funded by Carrier or other special interest. groups. That scumbag Obama used taxpayer's money to pay back the greedy assholes that gave him money and that is despicable.

I'm not a liberal.
That aside, I don't have a problem with either party providing stimulus if it keeps an industry open. You are not reading my post properly. I am against the hypocrisy.

According to the neocon whackos : Obama gives stimulus to car industry (that they HAVE to pay back and have almost done) to save 1.5 million jobs = Obama is a socialist

Trump offers a tax break to a company that doesn't even it to 'save' 1100 jobs = Trump is a hero.

Total, utter BS.

although Im not sure where the 1.5 million dollar number comes in, I did agree with bailing out GM when it was done. It was the right thing to do in some cases. But this is different than the Carrier issue, Gm was failing due to what I would consider mismanagememt, Carrier was moving production to mexico for economic reasons, not the same.
But lets look at the carrier issue for just a minute.
Trump negotiates a 700.000 dollar tax break for carrier to stay in the U.S, lets call it 1000 jobs saved.
The left claims that the public is going to end up paying that 700,000 out of their pockets,while this may be true to some extent lets look at how it actually plays out.
Lets say carrier moves, 1000 jobs lost. The public is not on the hook for 700,000 however, now they have lost whatever tax revenue was generated by carrier profits, they have lost the tax from emplyee wages from the 1000 people laid off. They lose the taxes paid by those people that would have been generated by spending their money at local businesses. and to top it off, they will now be contributing to government assistance and retraining programs for those 1000 people. The cost of all that is much greater than 700,000 dollars. right?
Now lets give the 700,000 to carrier and put those people back to work, assume the average pay is somewhere around 50k a year for these people. To cover that 700,000 it would take 700 in taxes collected from each of those 1000 people, Im pretty sure that the tax revenue is greater than 700 a year on 50k income. These people are spending their money in the community generating tax and paychecks for others not associated with carrier, carrier itself is still going to pay something on its profits so that is a benefit also, and no money is being spent in assistance or retraining for the 1000 that did not lose their jobs.
Over all, if you look at the numbers as they trickle down, the public is not on the hook for the 700,000 and the benefits outweigh the negative effects of Carrier moving.
You might not like that a deal was cut, but in the end, it does work out as a benefit to the state.

 

[Dr Grump]

[
although Im not sure where the 1.5 million dollar number comes in, I did agree with bailing out GM when it was done. It was the right thing to do in some cases. But this is different than the Carrier issue, Gm was failing due to what I would consider mismanagememt, Carrier was moving production to mexico for economic reasons, not the same.
But lets look at the carrier issue for just a minute.
Trump negotiates a 700.000 dollar tax break for carrier to stay in the U.S, lets call it 1000 jobs saved.
The left claims that the public is going to end up paying that 700,000 out of their pockets,while this may be true to some extent lets look at how it actually plays out.
Lets say carrier moves, 1000 jobs lost. The public is not on the hook for 700,000 however, now they have lost whatever tax revenue was generated by carrier profits, they have lost the tax from emplyee wages from the 1000 people laid off. They lose the taxes paid by those people that would have been generated by spending their money at local businesses. and to top it off, they will now be contributing to government assistance and retraining programs for those 1000 people. The cost of all that is much greater than 700,000 dollars. right?
Now lets give the 700,000 to carrier and put those people back to work, assume the average pay is somewhere around 50k a year for these people. To cover that 700,000 it would take 700 in taxes collected from each of those 1000 people, Im pretty sure that the tax revenue is greater than 700 a year on 50k income. These people are spending their money in the community generating tax and paychecks for others not associated with carrier, carrier itself is still going to pay something on its profits so that is a benefit also, and no money is being spent in assistance or retraining for the 1000 that did not lose their jobs.
Over all, if you look at the numbers as they trickle down, the public is not on the hook for the 700,000 and the benefits outweigh the negative effects of Carrier moving.
You might not like that a deal was cut, but in the end, it does work out as a benefit to the state.

I agree with all of that, but at the end of the day it is a false economy. It may keep your domestic employees in work, but there will come a time when other products will be much cheaper. We get Carrier air-conditioning units down here. Good quality product. However, we also get Akai and Samsung. Just as good. Much cheaper.

 

[Maryland Patriot]

[
although Im not sure where the 1.5 million dollar number comes in, I did agree with bailing out GM when it was done. It was the right thing to do in some cases. But this is different than the Carrier issue, Gm was failing due to what I would consider mismanagememt, Carrier was moving production to mexico for economic reasons, not the same.
But lets look at the carrier issue for just a minute.
Trump negotiates a 700.000 dollar tax break for carrier to stay in the U.S, lets call it 1000 jobs saved.
The left claims that the public is going to end up paying that 700,000 out of their pockets,while this may be true to some extent lets look at how it actually plays out.
Lets say carrier moves, 1000 jobs lost. The public is not on the hook for 700,000 however, now they have lost whatever tax revenue was generated by carrier profits, they have lost the tax from emplyee wages from the 1000 people laid off. They lose the taxes paid by those people that would have been generated by spending their money at local businesses. and to top it off, they will now be contributing to government assistance and retraining programs for those 1000 people. The cost of all that is much greater than 700,000 dollars. right?
Now lets give the 700,000 to carrier and put those people back to work, assume the average pay is somewhere around 50k a year for these people. To cover that 700,000 it would take 700 in taxes collected from each of those 1000 people, Im pretty sure that the tax revenue is greater than 700 a year on 50k income. These people are spending their money in the community generating tax and paychecks for others not associated with carrier, carrier itself is still going to pay something on its profits so that is a benefit also, and no money is being spent in assistance or retraining for the 1000 that did not lose their jobs.
Over all, if you look at the numbers as they trickle down, the public is not on the hook for the 700,000 and the benefits outweigh the negative effects of Carrier moving.
You might not like that a deal was cut, but in the end, it does work out as a benefit to the state.

I agree with all of that, but at the end of the day it is a false economy. It may keep your domestic employees in work, but there will come a time when other products will be much cheaper. We get Carrier air-conditioning units down here. Good quality product. However, we also get Akai and Samsung. Just as good. Much cheaper.

I dont have room to talk, I have 2 Rheems cooling my house in the summer. No carrier.

 

[thereisnospoon]

There is hardly a state in the union that does not use its taxing power to attract business.
Indiana is giving Carrier a whopping $700k per per year for 10 years to keep those jobs in Indianapolis.
The fact is if Trump or any other Republican had ENCOURAGED Carrier to move all the jobs out, the lefties would be all over this....

Again, the top five executives of United Technologies make 50 million a year. The CEO Of UT left in 2014 with a $172,000,000 severance package.

United Technologies’ CEO Leaves With $172 Million Pay Package

But they JUST HAD TO HAVE THAT $700K TAX BREAK, or we are going to totally fire all these nice people in Indiania. Instead, we are only going to fire half of them.

Welcome to Trump's America, where we bend over working people to make the rich richer...

Why are any of you surprised?

Wanna cut the pay of Corp Board members? Don't buy stock in the company. If you have a 401k or IRA, close it. Cash out. Don't invest.
Simple.

 

[Vandalshandle]

...and Trane is run by a bunch of fools if they don't threaten to move to Mexico, and find out what Trump will offer if they don't.

 

[Lewdog]

...and Trane is run by a bunch of fools if they don't threaten to move to Mexico, and find out what Trump will offer if they don't.

Oh don't give them any ideas... then we'll hear nothing but headlines about getting on the "Trump Trane"

...

 

[Boss]

I'm not a liberal.
That aside, I don't have a problem with either party providing stimulus if it keeps an industry open. You are not reading my post properly. I am against the hypocrisy.

According to the neocon whackos : Obama gives stimulus to car industry (that they HAVE to pay back and have almost done) to save 1.5 million jobs = Obama is a socialist

Trump offers a tax break to a company that doesn't even it to 'save' 1100 jobs = Trump is a hero.

Total, utter BS.

First of all, parties do not provide stimulus. Congress can pass a stimulus bill but this generally requires votes from both parties because spending bills require super-majority. Stimulus bills are generally not the same as a bailout for an industry. They usually involve sending money to states for infrastructure projects and such, in an attempt to stimulate the economy. Bailouts are sometimes given to certain industries to keep them from going under but again, the parties don't do this, Congress does.

When you have the government stepping in to bail capitalist businesses out, that is an affront to free market capitalist principles. There should never be "too big to fail" in free market capitalism. That's the whole deal with free market capitalism, sometimes businesses fail... they have to be allowed to fail so that something better can rise up and fill their gap. Or maybe they're forced to downsize, restructure their debt or go into receivership. They might even consider selling out to another larger company or consolidating with another company to keep from going under. These are the ways free market capitalism work in accordance with supply and demand. When the government steps in, it interrupts the process and puts the "too big to fail" company at an advantage over it's lesser competitors who didn't get bailed out.

Tax breaks are also not given by parties OR by presidents-elect. They are given by governments who collect taxes. The Federal government has no business giving certain businesses a tax break because, again, this unfairly advantages that company over their free market competition who doesn't get the tax break. State governments can, and often do, offer tax breaks or incentives to certain companies in exchange for the company locating in their state and providing jobs for their people. It poses the same problem for free market capitalism but it's a little more understanding because there is a benefit gained by the state retaining the jobs.

None of this is Socialism but it is interference with free market capitalism, and that isn't a good thing. In certain circumstances it may not be that bad of a thing, but it's not good. But the situation right now is, businesses across the board are being taxed and regulated out of business and that's why we're losing jobs. The way you save jobs is by getting government out of the way and removing the tax burdens so free market capitalism can do it's thing.

 

[JoeB131]

As a Moon Bat Libtard you don't have the moral or intellectual courage to condemn Obama's crony capitalism and that makes you a hypocrite. It is this partisan pig bullshit game that you stupid Moon Bats love to play. You condemn Republicans for doing what you applauded the Democrats for doing. Like bitching about Bush's debt and justifying Obama's debt. .Bitching about Bush and Iraq and then voting for Crooked Hillary that supported the war and voting for Obama who fought the war for three years and still have troops over there.

No, guy, I don't have a problem with tax breaks and bailouts in general. I applauded Obama doing it because it saved 1.5 million jobs, including my own. (At the time, I worked for a company that provided parts to GM). Given the CIRCUMSTANCES - Worst recession in 80 years that would have been made a lot worse if a major industry collapsed- it was called for.

This wasn't called for. UT has more than enough money to keep those plants open if they wanted to. They just saw an opportunity to shake down a state government for tax breaks. Instead, what should have happened is that UT should have been informed that if they moved that plant, all 10 Billion in defense and government contractors would be put out for rebid. Then there would be an IRS audit of all their executives.

That's what SHOULD have been done.

Instead Trump and Pence totally caved in for a deal where most of those 1000 people could have probably found other jobs.

 

[JoeB131]

It was absolutely despicable that the asshole Obama gave taxpayer's money to GM and Chrysler and stole money from the bond holders to save filthy greedy ass UAW jobs after the unions contributed so heavily to Obama's 2008 campaign. And no they didn't pay a substantial amount back. It cost the taxpayer's tens of billions of dollars. Giving money to the executives of Solyndra, who had done campaign funding bundling for the Democrats was deplorable. There are other examples just as bad.

Okay, let's look at a chart.

So GM got 50 billion and they paid 39 billion of it back (so far). Given that the government also didn't have to spend billions on unemployment insurance and other benefits that would have done along with losing 1.5 million mostly NON-Union jobs, it was still a pretty good deal.

I should also point out the program of R&D that involve Solyndra actually MADE money back for the government. Yes, some companies lost, some companies gained. That's what happens when you invest in new technologies

 

[Flash]

As a Moon Bat Libtard you don't have the moral or intellectual courage to condemn Obama's crony capitalism and that makes you a hypocrite. It is this partisan pig bullshit game that you stupid Moon Bats love to play. You condemn Republicans for doing what you applauded the Democrats for doing. Like bitching about Bush's debt and justifying Obama's debt. .Bitching about Bush and Iraq and then voting for Crooked Hillary that supported the war and voting for Obama who fought the war for three years and still have troops over there.

No, guy, I don't have a problem with tax breaks and bailouts in general. I applauded Obama doing it because it saved 1.5 million jobs, including my own. (At the time, I worked for a company that provided parts to GM). Given the CIRCUMSTANCES - Worst recession in 80 years that would have been made a lot worse if a major industry collapsed- it was called for.

This wasn't called for. UT has more than enough money to keep those plants open if they wanted to. They just saw an opportunity to shake down a state government for tax breaks. Instead, what should have happened is that UT should have been informed that if they moved that plant, all 10 Billion in defense and government contractors would be put out for rebid. Then there would be an IRS audit of all their executives.

That's what SHOULD have been done.

Instead Trump and Pence totally caved in for a deal where most of those 1000 people could have probably found other jobs.

Obama didn't save jackshit. All he did was steal taxpayer's money to pay off the greedy unions that had contributed to his filthy campaign. If you are the beneficiary of one of Obama's government subsidized jobs then you are nothing more than a welfare queen and that is despicable.

What should be done is for the government to stay out of the business of subsidizing anything. That includes both Republican and Democrat initiatives.

While we are at it we should also cut out welfare, entitlements and bailouts. The government should never be in the business of taking money from somebody that earned it and giving it away to somebody that didn't earn it. That includes giving it to you so that you can kep your job that should have gone away. Your job cost somebody else the money that they earned and that is thievery and you should be ashamed of yourself for being a sorry ass welfare queen. Of course you Moon Bats have no shame, do you?

 

[xband]

As a Moon Bat Libtard you don't have the moral or intellectual courage to condemn Obama's crony capitalism and that makes you a hypocrite. It is this partisan pig bullshit game that you stupid Moon Bats love to play. You condemn Republicans for doing what you applauded the Democrats for doing. Like bitching about Bush's debt and justifying Obama's debt. .Bitching about Bush and Iraq and then voting for Crooked Hillary that supported the war and voting for Obama who fought the war for three years and still have troops over there.

No, guy, I don't have a problem with tax breaks and bailouts in general. I applauded Obama doing it because it saved 1.5 million jobs, including my own. (At the time, I worked for a company that provided parts to GM). Given the CIRCUMSTANCES - Worst recession in 80 years that would have been made a lot worse if a major industry collapsed- it was called for.

This wasn't called for. UT has more than enough money to keep those plants open if they wanted to. They just saw an opportunity to shake down a state government for tax breaks. Instead, what should have happened is that UT should have been informed that if they moved that plant, all 10 Billion in defense and government contractors would be put out for rebid. Then there would be an IRS audit of all their executives.

That's what SHOULD have been done.

Instead Trump and Pence totally caved in for a deal where most of those 1000 people could have probably found other jobs.

The military and civilian military contracts that I kept in working order, the contract lasted for five years and no longer when rebid starts at September 30 (new fiscal year) and awarded on October 1, low bidder or bottom feeder that has an established track record wins the new contract.

 

[Flash]

[


So GM got 50 billion and they paid 39 billion of it back (so far). Given that the government also didn't have to spend billions on unemployment insurance and other benefits that would have done along with losing 1.5 million mostly NON-Union jobs, it was still a pretty good deal.

I should also point out the program of R&D that involve Solyndra actually MADE money back for the government. Yes, some companies lost, some companies gained. That's what happens when you invest in new technologies

The only reason GM got one cent was because the UAW and other greedy unions contributed to Obama's campaign and the taxpayer's money was return on that investment and that is very wrong.

Going to church now and when I get back I will address the rest of your Moon Bat confusion.

 

[xband]

[


So GM got 50 billion and they paid 39 billion of it back (so far). Given that the government also didn't have to spend billions on unemployment insurance and other benefits that would have done along with losing 1.5 million mostly NON-Union jobs, it was still a pretty good deal.

I should also point out the program of R&D that involve Solyndra actually MADE money back for the government. Yes, some companies lost, some companies gained. That's what happens when you invest in new technologies

The only reason GM got one cent was because the UAW and other greedy unions contributed to Obama's campaign and the taxpayer's money was return on that investment and that is very wrong.

Going to church now and when I get back I will address the rest of your Moon Bat confusion.

Ford refused a bailout but GM accepted it. I only bought Ford automobile products from then on. I used to be a Chevy man but now am a Ford man.

 

[JoeB131]

Obama didn't save jackshit. All he did was steal taxpayer's money to pay off the greedy unions that had contributed to his filthy campaign. If you are the beneficiary of one of Obama's government subsidized jobs then you are nothing more than a welfare queen and that is despicable.

Okay, guy, saying the word "filthy" 100 times kind of shows you have issues. The fact is, the Unions made serious concessions to keep SOME jobs, as did the shareholders and the government.

But 1.5 million jobs and the US Auto industry were saved, and frankly, that's a good thing.

What should be done is for the government to stay out of the business of subsidizing anything. That includes both Republican and Democrat initiatives.

And when businesses agree to go out of business on that principle, you can get back to me. But GM asked for that bailout, before Obama ever got there.

Going to church now and when I get back I will address the rest of your Moon Bat confusion.

Yes, I'm sure your imaginary Fairy in the sky will sort this out for you.

 

[xband]

Obama didn't save jackshit. All he did was steal taxpayer's money to pay off the greedy unions that had contributed to his filthy campaign. If you are the beneficiary of one of Obama's government subsidized jobs then you are nothing more than a welfare queen and that is despicable.

Okay, guy, saying the word "filthy" 100 times kind of shows you have issues. The fact is, the Unions made serious concessions to keep SOME jobs, as did the shareholders and the government.

But 1.5 million jobs and the US Auto industry were saved, and frankly, that's a good thing.

What should be done is for the government to stay out of the business of subsidizing anything. That includes both Republican and Democrat initiatives.

And when businesses agree to go out of business on that principle, you can get back to me. But GM asked for that bailout, before Obama ever got there.

Going to church now and when I get back I will address the rest of your Moon Bat confusion.

Yes, I'm sure your imaginary Fairy in the sky will sort this out for you.

The majority of auto workers are unskilled but make a lot of money. Robots have taken over the skilled auto workers jobs but somebody has to fix the robots.

 

[JoeB131]

The majority of auto workers are unskilled but make a lot of money. Robots have taken over the skilled auto workers jobs but somebody has to fix the robots.

So if I dropped a bunch of car parts in front of you, you'd have the "skills" to assemble a functioning car, then?

I'm curious what this bias is that people you classify as 'unskilled" (you or I wouldn't last a day in one of those jobs) aren't deserving to make a living wage.

But you guys are perfectly fine with the CEO of United Technologies getting a $172,000,000 severance package.

I think your priorities are a little screwed up there, buddy.