San Diego County officials shut down home Bible study

[KittenKoder]

Unbelievable. And the usual Lefties, that proclaim to support personal freedoms are defending this or saying that a local MSM source isn't credible. What would be a credible source???

Here's a link to the video... Video

Something that explains the laws and permits, as well as the statutes which were used instead of just crying and whining about it, like they were also hurt by it ....

... just saying.

 

[Amanda]

Just saying? What?

Like usual you're not making any sense.

 

[KittenKoder]

Just saying? What?

Like usual you're not making any sense.

This is why kids shouldn't drink.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Just saying? What?

Like usual you're not making any sense.

This is why kids shouldn't drink.

Let's play your game, shall we? Are you saying that if a law exists to allow San Diego to shut down a small home bible study by demanding THOUSANDS of dollars for a permit you have no problem then?

Are you saying that it was just fine that the entire line of questioning was about religion and that then San Diego demanded THOUSANDS for a permit for MAJOR religious activity, That this activity is fine with you?

1st Amendment protection is INCORPORATED, that means the Federal 1st Amendment applies to ALL jurisdictions. That amendment provides the right for peaceful assembly and for freedom of religion.

15 people gathering at a friends house once or more a week is not any threat to a City or County, if it were they could arrest gang bangers that do it all the time.

If the problem was parking laws, then they would be citing the cars on the nights or days they meet.

15 people are not a LARGE crowd nor are they a large meeting. It does not raise to the level of requiring a permit for MAJOR activities, which is what they were told they had to purchase. Those permits are designed to cover parking and security and other incidentals for a MAJOR activity.

So lets get it straight, shall we?

You have no problem if 15 of your buddies come over for a party but have a problem if 15 people meet at a friends house to have bible study?

If you do not see a problem with this, YOU are the problem.

San Diego did not tell the house owner to get a permit for a small meeting, they ordered them to stop having a peaceful small bible meeting in a private home unless they paid THOUSANDS of dollars for permit for a MAJOR event. And I am betting the permit is one time use.

 

[KittenKoder]

Just saying? What?

Like usual you're not making any sense.

This is why kids shouldn't drink.

Let's play your game, shall we? Are you saying that if a law exists to allow San Diego to shut down a small home bible study by demanding THOUSANDS of dollars for a permit you have no problem then?

Are you saying that it was just fine that the entire line of questioning was about religion and that then San Diego demanded THOUSANDS for a permit for MAJOR religious activity, That this activity is fine with you?

1st Amendment protection is INCORPORATED, that means the Federal 1st Amendment applies to ALL jurisdictions. That amendment provides the right for peaceful assembly and for freedom of religion.

15 people gathering at a friends house once or more a week is not any threat to a City or County, if it were they could arrest gang bangers that do it all the time.

If the problem was parking laws, then they would be citing the cars on the nights or days they meet.

15 people are not a LARGE crowd nor are they a large meeting. It does not raise to the level of requiring a permit for MAJOR activities, which is what they were told they had to purchase. Those permits are designed to cover parking and security and other incidentals for a MAJOR activity.

So lets get it straight, shall we?

You have no problem if 15 of your buddies come over for a party but have a problem if 15 people meet at a friends house to have bible study?

If you do not see a problem with this, YOU are the problem.

San Diego did not tell the house owner to get a permit for a small meeting, they ordered them to stop having a peaceful small bible meeting in a private home unless they paid THOUSANDS of dollars for permit for a MAJOR event. And I am betting the permit is one time use.

Really ... the permits cost thousands of dollars ... well, what permits are they talking about so I can look up how much they cost first. Thus, a non-biased source would be nice, you know, one that actually gives the details and facts instead of just whining.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

This is why kids shouldn't drink.

Let's play your game, shall we? Are you saying that if a law exists to allow San Diego to shut down a small home bible study by demanding THOUSANDS of dollars for a permit you have no problem then?

Are you saying that it was just fine that the entire line of questioning was about religion and that then San Diego demanded THOUSANDS for a permit for MAJOR religious activity, That this activity is fine with you?

1st Amendment protection is INCORPORATED, that means the Federal 1st Amendment applies to ALL jurisdictions. That amendment provides the right for peaceful assembly and for freedom of religion.

15 people gathering at a friends house once or more a week is not any threat to a City or County, if it were they could arrest gang bangers that do it all the time.

If the problem was parking laws, then they would be citing the cars on the nights or days they meet.

15 people are not a LARGE crowd nor are they a large meeting. It does not raise to the level of requiring a permit for MAJOR activities, which is what they were told they had to purchase. Those permits are designed to cover parking and security and other incidentals for a MAJOR activity.

So lets get it straight, shall we?

You have no problem if 15 of your buddies come over for a party but have a problem if 15 people meet at a friends house to have bible study?

If you do not see a problem with this, YOU are the problem.

San Diego did not tell the house owner to get a permit for a small meeting, they ordered them to stop having a peaceful small bible meeting in a private home unless they paid THOUSANDS of dollars for permit for a MAJOR event. And I am betting the permit is one time use.

Really ... the permits cost thousands of dollars ... well, what permits are they talking about so I can look up how much they cost first. Thus, a non-biased source would be nice, you know, one that actually gives the details and facts instead of just whining.

The article listed what Permit was required. If you had BOTHERED to read it we wouldn't be having this conversation.

 

[BrokenAngel]

I was shocked when I read this article earlier today. Jaw about hit the floor. Then I took a step back and looked a little more openly at the story. There are a couple of possibilities as to why this got singled out.

1. Perhaps they all drove their own cars to the Pastor's house. This would DEFFINATELY cause an uproar with the neighbors and end up with complaints to the city officials. 15 cars regularly blocking the streets? Talk about annoying. Easy fix? A Pastor tends to live within 5 minutes of his parish. Just have everyone meet at church and then drive over in two or three larger cars. Keeps the streets clear and the neighbors appeased.

2. This did happen in California. That state is BEYOND broke. Honestly, although the way they are going about this is awful.. they are probably up everyone's rears trying to make some sort of cash flow for their city. Situations where permits may have been overlooked before are probably getting cracked down upon now. Easy fix? Just meet in church itself. The land doesn't require any extra permits.

No matter their reasons, due to the questions asked and the approach that seems to have been taken the police are in the wrong here. With the way they are going after a Pastor and his wife (btw.. for those of you who aren't religious.. most every Pastor I have ever known holds a Bible study session at their home) I would be sad to not see articles this summer about them harassing a couple of kids with a lemonaide stand for not having the proper permits. I look forward to those articles.. I will print them and frame them in my home when they come out. ^_^

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Actually here is the answer. San Diego believes they have the RIGHT to REQUIRE a permit for ANYONE to hold a bible study in side their own homes.

major use permit - docstoc

 

[KittenKoder]

Let's play your game, shall we? Are you saying that if a law exists to allow San Diego to shut down a small home bible study by demanding THOUSANDS of dollars for a permit you have no problem then?

Are you saying that it was just fine that the entire line of questioning was about religion and that then San Diego demanded THOUSANDS for a permit for MAJOR religious activity, That this activity is fine with you?

1st Amendment protection is INCORPORATED, that means the Federal 1st Amendment applies to ALL jurisdictions. That amendment provides the right for peaceful assembly and for freedom of religion.

15 people gathering at a friends house once or more a week is not any threat to a City or County, if it were they could arrest gang bangers that do it all the time.

If the problem was parking laws, then they would be citing the cars on the nights or days they meet.

15 people are not a LARGE crowd nor are they a large meeting. It does not raise to the level of requiring a permit for MAJOR activities, which is what they were told they had to purchase. Those permits are designed to cover parking and security and other incidentals for a MAJOR activity.

So lets get it straight, shall we?

You have no problem if 15 of your buddies come over for a party but have a problem if 15 people meet at a friends house to have bible study?

If you do not see a problem with this, YOU are the problem.

San Diego did not tell the house owner to get a permit for a small meeting, they ordered them to stop having a peaceful small bible meeting in a private home unless they paid THOUSANDS of dollars for permit for a MAJOR event. And I am betting the permit is one time use.

Really ... the permits cost thousands of dollars ... well, what permits are they talking about so I can look up how much they cost first. Thus, a non-biased source would be nice, you know, one that actually gives the details and facts instead of just whining.

The article listed what Permit was required. If you had BOTHERED to read it we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Okay ... read it again, no where does it give the permit they have to apply for, just says a "a process that could cost tens of thousands of dollars" ... which just makes it look less than credible. No detail, thus no way to double check their facts. Dishonest really, but then I expect no less from media. The most expensive ones I know of for public gatherings are no more than a few hundred, and last all year.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Really ... the permits cost thousands of dollars ... well, what permits are they talking about so I can look up how much they cost first. Thus, a non-biased source would be nice, you know, one that actually gives the details and facts instead of just whining.

The article listed what Permit was required. If you had BOTHERED to read it we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Okay ... read it again, no where does it give the permit they have to apply for, just says a "a process that could cost tens of thousands of dollars" ... which just makes it look less than credible. No detail, thus no way to double check their facts. Dishonest really, but then I expect no less from media. The most expensive ones I know of for public gatherings are no more than a few hundred, and last all year.

Wrong it STATES " Major Use" permit.

And I just posted the link to the fact the County thinks they have the right to require a permit of ANYONE holding a bible study in their home.

I would call that a direct violation of the 1st Amendment.

 

[KittenKoder]

The article listed what Permit was required. If you had BOTHERED to read it we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Okay ... read it again, no where does it give the permit they have to apply for, just says a "a process that could cost tens of thousands of dollars" ... which just makes it look less than credible. No detail, thus no way to double check their facts. Dishonest really, but then I expect no less from media. The most expensive ones I know of for public gatherings are no more than a few hundred, and last all year.

Wrong it STATES " Major Use" permit.

And I just posted the link to the fact the County thinks they have the right to require a permit of ANYONE holding a bible study in their home.

I would call that a direct violation of the 1st Amendment.

"Major Use" is not a permit, it's a type of permit.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Okay ... read it again, no where does it give the permit they have to apply for, just says a "a process that could cost tens of thousands of dollars" ... which just makes it look less than credible. No detail, thus no way to double check their facts. Dishonest really, but then I expect no less from media. The most expensive ones I know of for public gatherings are no more than a few hundred, and last all year.

Wrong it STATES " Major Use" permit.

And I just posted the link to the fact the County thinks they have the right to require a permit of ANYONE holding a bible study in their home.

I would call that a direct violation of the 1st Amendment.

"Major Use" is not a permit, it's a type of permit.

Funny how I just found the permit I was looking for by typing in Major Use permit. Now isn't it?

 

[Amanda]

Just saying? What?

Like usual you're not making any sense.

This is why kids shouldn't drink.

Hey don't answer if you got nothing. No one will be surprised.

 

[KittenKoder]

Wrong it STATES " Major Use" permit.

And I just posted the link to the fact the County thinks they have the right to require a permit of ANYONE holding a bible study in their home.

I would call that a direct violation of the 1st Amendment.

"Major Use" is not a permit, it's a type of permit.

Funny how I just found the permit I was looking for by typing in Major Use permit. Now isn't it?

Odd, didn't know California actually used that as a name ... oh well, still seems pretty routine, nothing odd about it. Permits pay for the roads used in parking, and many other things, when something is "regular" ... and the costs are not even close to "tens of thousands" ... the article is still being dishonest.

Just looks like a way for them to make money is all.

 

[Amanda]

Wrong it STATES " Major Use" permit.

And I just posted the link to the fact the County thinks they have the right to require a permit of ANYONE holding a bible study in their home.

I would call that a direct violation of the 1st Amendment.

"Major Use" is not a permit, it's a type of permit.

Funny how I just found the permit I was looking for by typing in Major Use permit. Now isn't it?

I was able to Google the info without much issue. I'm guessing KK hasn't even bothered or she wouldn't be taking issue. It's pretty easy to see, even for a drunk teen, what's going on here. Is Google working for you KK?

 

[KittenKoder]

"Major Use" is not a permit, it's a type of permit.

Funny how I just found the permit I was looking for by typing in Major Use permit. Now isn't it?

I was able to Google the info without much issue. I'm guessing KK hasn't even bothered or she wouldn't be taking issue. It's pretty easy to see, even for a drunk teen, what's going on here. Is Google working for you KK?

Remember, Google tailors your search results based on what you typically search for, for me it came up around page 10, there are several "major use" permits in Washington state, and since I live here most of my searches include the word Washington or Seattle, so those all came up first, Seattle, followed by Renton and other cities, all of which had several within the "major use" type. Many of which were construction permits (which is odd but meh) and some were for event planning. All were Major Use: something-or-other.

 

[Amanda]

Funny how I just found the permit I was looking for by typing in Major Use permit. Now isn't it?

I was able to Google the info without much issue. I'm guessing KK hasn't even bothered or she wouldn't be taking issue. It's pretty easy to see, even for a drunk teen, what's going on here. Is Google working for you KK?

Remember, Google tailors your search results based on what you typically search for, for me it came up around page 10, there are several "major use" permits in Washington state, and since I live here most of my searches include the word Washington or Seattle, so those all came up first, Seattle, followed by Renton and other cities, all of which had several within the "major use" type. Many of which were construction permits (which is odd but meh) and some were for event planning. All were Major Use: something-or-other.

Um... ok KK, whatever.

Some of us will grasp at any excuse... i guess you fall into that category. I'm a 'drunken teen in KC' and had no trouble finding the info but for you it's impossible. Sure.... whateva.

 

[KittenKoder]

I was able to Google the info without much issue. I'm guessing KK hasn't even bothered or she wouldn't be taking issue. It's pretty easy to see, even for a drunk teen, what's going on here. Is Google working for you KK?

Remember, Google tailors your search results based on what you typically search for, for me it came up around page 10, there are several "major use" permits in Washington state, and since I live here most of my searches include the word Washington or Seattle, so those all came up first, Seattle, followed by Renton and other cities, all of which had several within the "major use" type. Many of which were construction permits (which is odd but meh) and some were for event planning. All were Major Use: something-or-other.

Um... ok KK, whatever.

Some of us will grasp at any excuse... i guess you fall into that category. I'm a 'drunken teen in KC' and had no trouble finding the info but for you it's impossible. Sure.... whateva.

You must be drunk, since I didn't say impossible, just slower. Page 10, that's a lot of search pages to look through since I forgot to add the word California thinking that they would have the same permits. I was wrong in thinking they would all be the same, but that doesn't mean I was lying. You are however being dishonest. This whole issue is still not about religion, and so far only the reports on the story are all with religious whining, no one is stating "just the facts", but what more can I expect from a bunch of American Idol worshipers.

 

[Amanda]

Remember, Google tailors your search results based on what you typically search for, for me it came up around page 10, there are several "major use" permits in Washington state, and since I live here most of my searches include the word Washington or Seattle, so those all came up first, Seattle, followed by Renton and other cities, all of which had several within the "major use" type. Many of which were construction permits (which is odd but meh) and some were for event planning. All were Major Use: something-or-other.

Um... ok KK, whatever.

Some of us will grasp at any excuse... i guess you fall into that category. I'm a 'drunken teen in KC' and had no trouble finding the info but for you it's impossible. Sure.... whateva.

You must be drunk, since I didn't say impossible, just slower. Page 10, that's a lot of search pages to look through since I forgot to add the word California thinking that they would have the same permits. I was wrong in thinking they would all be the same, but that doesn't mean I was lying. You are however being dishonest. This whole issue is still not about religion, and so far only the reports on the story are all with religious whining, no one is stating "just the facts", but what more can I expect from a bunch of American Idol worshipers.

So what's your take now?

 

[KittenKoder]

Um... ok KK, whatever.

Some of us will grasp at any excuse... i guess you fall into that category. I'm a 'drunken teen in KC' and had no trouble finding the info but for you it's impossible. Sure.... whateva.

You must be drunk, since I didn't say impossible, just slower. Page 10, that's a lot of search pages to look through since I forgot to add the word California thinking that they would have the same permits. I was wrong in thinking they would all be the same, but that doesn't mean I was lying. You are however being dishonest. This whole issue is still not about religion, and so far only the reports on the story are all with religious whining, no one is stating "just the facts", but what more can I expect from a bunch of American Idol worshipers.

So what's your take now?

Still media hype. The costs do not come near "tens of thousands" for the permit, the cost is variable depending on what is needed for the event and can go anywhere between 100 to 10,000 depending on what is utilized. It looks pretty standard, many churches have these permits on retainer already, to prevent such clashes with the local governments. The thing is, parking is expensive, and road work required for areas where people park frequently costs tax dollars, thus why many areas have parking fees (meters). So if they are using the street for parking regularly, it is reasonable to ask them to pay for a portion of the upkeep. Instead of having separate permits (like most places) California appears to just use the one and customize the provisions with each individual case. Religious groups do get discounts on the costs of permits, in most areas, so the fact that they are a religious group would more likely decrease the cost, and thus why such questions would come up. They are whining and twisting the reality of the situation to make the city look bad just because they don't want to do their homework, when all that really seems to be going on is that the city does not want to make the tax payers who are not involved front the whole bill for land maintenance.