Russia Overhauls Military Doctrine

[bendog]

Guys, i am new here and having read the russian opinion about about the friends of Russia in Europe written in interfax and translated here( Putinside.com - In addition to the Army and Navy Does have Russia remained friends in Europe Russia still has several countries that can support them even now. and the reason of tension is that Russia is streghtening its power both in water and in air, and that scares Baltics and east Europe as well

And that is in tension with a very real move by the US to reduce Russian influence. We've now had two presidents who naively thought Russia could support free market based approaches, and accept a nominal role of a non-superpower on the UN Security Council, only to have two invasions by Russia of former soviet republics, and then there was Snowden, which shook the US intelligence folks to their knees, and caused the hawks to take supremacy of for policy towards Russia.

there's not necessarily a good or bad guy here.

 

[Sonc]

Guys, i am new here and having read the russian opinion about about the friends of Russia in Europe written in interfax and translated here( Putinside.com - In addition to the Army and Navy Does have Russia remained friends in Europe Russia still has several countries that can support them even now. and the reason of tension is that Russia is streghtening its power both in water and in air, and that scares Baltics and east Europe as well

the intensity reason - FASCISM.
The Ukrainian fascists threatened Russians =)
And the USA supports fascists.
The U.S. Government kills Russians in Ukraine.
Also shits in the heads to Americans.
It is the real problem.

 

[Sonc]

1 Video

2

 

[Drang nach Osten]

Kiev forced Putin to send troops to crimea. (-:\

Look Stratford, I know you're a Putin apologist who couldn't give a straight answer if you life depended on it, and I know Putin got into this spot by reacting to the West, and there is a very real move by the West to "defang" or deny Russia superpower status, and to prevent any re-emergence of the Russian/Soviet empire.

But this could end tomorrow if Putin stopped it. His game is carve out as much as possible. The questions are whether sanctions themselves will destabilize him, whether the West has the stones to arm the Ukranians and even send in special forces, or whether he'll outlast the sanctions.

But why is the West just sitting on its hands allowing Kremlin to invade Ukraine?

 

[Sonc]

Burn the city by way of these hordes.
Destroyed villages, trampled rye.
And everywhere, quickly and eagerly, like a wolf,
These people are doing robbery and burglary.

But unless there is people? No one will believe
Upon meeting dressed in uniforms of the beast.
They do not eat people - like animals,
Swallows steam pork raw materials.

They and habits are not human,
Tell me, can anyone of the people
Attempting an old man on a rope dragging,
Raping his mother in front of children?

Bury residents live peaceful,
For what guise with you not one.
No! You're lying! Someone else was named!
People have no one believed for a long time.

You honor the war and in the field this
So you know who you are:
Targeting the wounded, burn hospitals,
Yes bomb school honor your soldiers?

We have learned in the short term,
And we understood that leads you into battle.
Cool, happy, stupid and cruel,
But the meek and miserable as the time comes.

And you, what you stand before me without a belt,
Palm himself in the chest thumping,
Popping me a card with his wife's son,
You think I believe you? Not at all!

I can clearly see women with children face
When you're shooting in an area of them.
Their blood is on a hastily torn buttonholes,
On cold sweaty palms yours.

As long as you are with those who have heaven and earth
We want to take, freedom and honor,
As long as you're with them - you're an enemy,
And long live the punishment and revenge.

You, gray ash from the burned villages,
Over the life of canopy shade of their wings.
You thought we crawled on his knees?
Do not fear - you rage awakened in us.

We will beat you all the stronger hour by hour:
Bayonet and a projectile with a knife and dubem.
We 'll beat you, you turn off your land mine,
We mouth the Soviet land you'll score!

And let to the last hour of reckoning
Celebration of the day, close of the day,
I do not live like many guys,
That were better than me.

I'm always your duty soldier-object
And if we choose death of friends
That's better than death for their native land
And you can not choose ... (C) Konstantin Simonov

 

[Stratford57]

But why is the West just sitting on its hands allowing Kremlin to invade Ukraine?

Millions of Russian speaking people in Ukraine are fighting with almost all the world for a possible privilege to be with Russia, thousands are already killed, thousand have been injured and thousands of their homes have been ruined, while you take that privilege already for granted and don’t even seem to appreciate it.

To hate Russia and its president so much (let me guess): you must be a gay, a crook, an oligarch or a “fifth column”, paid from abroad. Or even all the above. Or just an ordinary kozyol...

 

[Drang nach Osten]

But why is the West just sitting on its hands allowing Kremlin to invade Ukraine?

Millions of Russian speaking people in Ukraine are fighting with almost all the world for a possible privilege to be with Russia, thousands are already killed, thousand have been injured and thousands of their homes have been ruined, while you take that privilege already for granted and don’t even seem to appreciate it.

To hate Russia and its president so much (let me guess): you must be a gay, a crook, an oligarch or a “fifth column”, paid from abroad. Or even all the above. Or just an ordinary kozyol...

I don't hate whether Russia nor its president. And you guessed nothing aforesaid.

 

[bendog]

Kiev forced Putin to send troops to crimea. (-:\

Look Stratford, I know you're a Putin apologist who couldn't give a straight answer if you life depended on it, and I know Putin got into this spot by reacting to the West, and there is a very real move by the West to "defang" or deny Russia superpower status, and to prevent any re-emergence of the Russian/Soviet empire.

But this could end tomorrow if Putin stopped it. His game is carve out as much as possible. The questions are whether sanctions themselves will destabilize him, whether the West has the stones to arm the Ukranians and even send in special forces, or whether he'll outlast the sanctions.

But why is the West just sitting on its hands allowing Kremlin to invade Ukraine?

Well, there is the question of just what the West can do to oppose the invasion(s). First, I think we have to admit that Putin and Russia do have some historical and geopolitical claim to Crimea. But, what exactly are the ties to Ukraine are more debateable. The Czars did not control the Cossacks until fairly recent history, and the Poles .. and I think even the Latvians had a spoon in the soup, so to speak. Still, there's an economic argument, and Russia correctly perceives a Ukraine in the EU affecting its trade agreements with Western private corporations. But, no rational person wants Russian goods over Western goods, unless perhaps they are Volkswagens built by Russians under license.

To be clear, I think there are distinct differences between the US and the West on the issue. Britain is probably in the middle, as usual. The US doesn't really have any trade issue, but we do have a perception of whether Russia is acting as a strategic enemy in cold war terms. The Russians can, and do, still arm those who oppose free global markets. The invasions of Moldova and Georgia had an effect, and made the US question exactly what Putin's goals, and limits, were. Snowden was clearly a turning point. What would Russians think if the US gave sanctuary to a Russian defector who then spilled their secrets of dealing with terrorists from Chechnya, and it's ties to Syria and Iran ... and what secrets we knew about Russia's military? They'd be outraged and believe the US was a strategic enemy. It's the same here. Putin is not crazy, so why would he do this. The answer is he clearly thinks the US's goal is to harm him. The irony is that the last two presidents largely thought Putin was more or less irrelevant... so long as he didn't arm terrorists. He has no real economy, and no real govt. He's a Mafioso with an oil field. The reason the Saudis are supporting cheap oil is that they, unlike Putin, are invested in the West, and only succeed when the rest of us do as well. With Snowden, the US aim clearly became removing Putin.

The West perceived the end of the cold war differently than the US. Over here we love the myth of Reagan as being the guy who won the Cold War with American military might. That is a myth. The EU perceives it more as an economic integration, and that is really closer to reality. And, Merkel doesn't really want to remove Putin simply to that end.

I was going to post my question of how much longer Putin can wait to play the oil card?

Russia Preparing To Use Energy in Economic War DB
But, to answer your question, I'm sure a majority in the US congress wants to arm Ukraine yesterday. I'm pretty sure the intelligence and military want to do so too.

But Europe doesn't see this as the same military issue as the US. And Putin can shut off the gas. Sanctions are an effort to make him see cooperation can lead to both Russia and Europe having economic prosperity.

 

[Stratford57]

Drang Nuch Osten, thanks, that's at least a good news. Then what makes you think Kremlin is invading Ukraine? I'm from Ukraine, by the way, and can tell you: to us looks like USA officials are trying to invade Ukraine and to use it like a pawn to give Russia an additional headache. They sure don't care how many people in Ukraine will die in this dirty game. Go to Donbass and ask the people, they will quickly explain to you who's trying to invade them.



By the way, the guy, who interviews the people in the street, is Graham Phillips, a British journalist. He personally arrived to Donbass (SE Ukraine) to find out what's the truth and what's not. He even spent 36 hours in Ukrainian detention.

 

[Drang nach Osten]

Drang Nuch Osten, thanks, that's at least a good news. Then what makes you think Kremlin is invading Ukraine? I'm from Ukraine, by the way, and can tell you: to us looks like USA officials are trying to invade Ukraine and to use it like a pawn to give Russia an additional headache. They sure don't care how many people in Ukraine will die in this dirty game. Go to Donbass and ask the people, they will quickly explain to you who's trying to invade them.



By the way, the guy, who interviews the people in the street, is Graham Phillips, a British journalist. He personally arrived to Donbass (SE Ukraine) to find out what's the truth and what's not. He even spent 36 hours in Ukrainian detention.

Then what makes you think Kremlin is invading Ukraine?

Russia, not the USA, promotes separation of Luhansk and Donetsk from Ukraine.

 

[indiajo]

"My problem would be to produce the necessary evidence."

He should just ask Rumsfeld how to.

 

[indiajo]

Russia, not the USA, promotes separation of Luhansk and Donetsk from Ukraine.

Of course. The USA want the whole thing.

 

[Stratford57]

Russia, not the USA, promotes separation of Luhansk and Donetsk from Ukraine.

As far as I understand English, the verbs "to invade" and "to promote" have different meaning. Last May during referendum in Donbass 85% of its population voted for separation from Ukraine. It was their decision, not Putin's. And official Washington, who likes to talk a lot about democracy, prefers to call the free will of 85% of Donbass people and 95% of Crimean people "Russian aggression". And at the same time encourages Kiev to start the war against its own people in Donbass. Pretty primitive, but it works so far.

 

[Drang nach Osten]

Kiev forced Putin to send troops to crimea. (-:\

Look Stratford, I know you're a Putin apologist who couldn't give a straight answer if you life depended on it, and I know Putin got into this spot by reacting to the West, and there is a very real move by the West to "defang" or deny Russia superpower status, and to prevent any re-emergence of the Russian/Soviet empire.

But this could end tomorrow if Putin stopped it. His game is carve out as much as possible. The questions are whether sanctions themselves will destabilize him, whether the West has the stones to arm the Ukranians and even send in special forces, or whether he'll outlast the sanctions.

But why is the West just sitting on its hands allowing Kremlin to invade Ukraine?

Well, there is the question of just what the West can do to oppose the invasion(s). First, I think we have to admit that Putin and Russia do have some historical and geopolitical claim to Crimea. But, what exactly are the ties to Ukraine are more debateable. The Czars did not control the Cossacks until fairly recent history, and the Poles .. and I think even the Latvians had a spoon in the soup, so to speak. Still, there's an economic argument, and Russia correctly perceives a Ukraine in the EU affecting its trade agreements with Western private corporations. But, no rational person wants Russian goods over Western goods, unless perhaps they are Volkswagens built by Russians under license.

To be clear, I think there are distinct differences between the US and the West on the issue. Britain is probably in the middle, as usual. The US doesn't really have any trade issue, but we do have a perception of whether Russia is acting as a strategic enemy in cold war terms. The Russians can, and do, still arm those who oppose free global markets. The invasions of Moldova and Georgia had an effect, and made the US question exactly what Putin's goals, and limits, were. Snowden was clearly a turning point. What would Russians think if the US gave sanctuary to a Russian defector who then spilled their secrets of dealing with terrorists from Chechnya, and it's ties to Syria and Iran ... and what secrets we knew about Russia's military? They'd be outraged and believe the US was a strategic enemy. It's the same here. Putin is not crazy, so why would he do this. The answer is he clearly thinks the US's goal is to harm him. The irony is that the last two presidents largely thought Putin was more or less irrelevant... so long as he didn't arm terrorists. He has no real economy, and no real govt. He's a Mafioso with an oil field. The reason the Saudis are supporting cheap oil is that they, unlike Putin, are invested in the West, and only succeed when the rest of us do as well. With Snowden, the US aim clearly became removing Putin.

The West perceived the end of the cold war differently than the US. Over here we love the myth of Reagan as being the guy who won the Cold War with American military might. That is a myth. The EU perceives it more as an economic integration, and that is really closer to reality. And, Merkel doesn't really want to remove Putin simply to that end.

I was going to post my question of how much longer Putin can wait to play the oil card?

Russia Preparing To Use Energy in Economic War DB
But, to answer your question, I'm sure a majority in the US congress wants to arm Ukraine yesterday. I'm pretty sure the intelligence and military want to do so too.

But Europe doesn't see this as the same military issue as the US. And Putin can shut off the gas. Sanctions are an effort to make him see cooperation can lead to both Russia and Europe having economic prosperity.

Kiev forced Putin to send troops to crimea. (-:\

Look Stratford, I know you're a Putin apologist who couldn't give a straight answer if you life depended on it, and I know Putin got into this spot by reacting to the West, and there is a very real move by the West to "defang" or deny Russia superpower status, and to prevent any re-emergence of the Russian/Soviet empire.

But this could end tomorrow if Putin stopped it. His game is carve out as much as possible. The questions are whether sanctions themselves will destabilize him, whether the West has the stones to arm the Ukranians and even send in special forces, or whether he'll outlast the sanctions.

But why is the West just sitting on its hands allowing Kremlin to invade Ukraine?

Well, there is the question of just what the West can do to oppose the invasion(s). First, I think we have to admit that Putin and Russia do have some historical and geopolitical claim to Crimea. But, what exactly are the ties to Ukraine are more debateable. The Czars did not control the Cossacks until fairly recent history, and the Poles .. and I think even the Latvians had a spoon in the soup, so to speak. Still, there's an economic argument, and Russia correctly perceives a Ukraine in the EU affecting its trade agreements with Western private corporations. But, no rational person wants Russian goods over Western goods, unless perhaps they are Volkswagens built by Russians under license.

To be clear, I think there are distinct differences between the US and the West on the issue. Britain is probably in the middle, as usual. The US doesn't really have any trade issue, but we do have a perception of whether Russia is acting as a strategic enemy in cold war terms. The Russians can, and do, still arm those who oppose free global markets. The invasions of Moldova and Georgia had an effect, and made the US question exactly what Putin's goals, and limits, were. Snowden was clearly a turning point. What would Russians think if the US gave sanctuary to a Russian defector who then spilled their secrets of dealing with terrorists from Chechnya, and it's ties to Syria and Iran ... and what secrets we knew about Russia's military? They'd be outraged and believe the US was a strategic enemy. It's the same here. Putin is not crazy, so why would he do this. The answer is he clearly thinks the US's goal is to harm him. The irony is that the last two presidents largely thought Putin was more or less irrelevant... so long as he didn't arm terrorists. He has no real economy, and no real govt. He's a Mafioso with an oil field. The reason the Saudis are supporting cheap oil is that they, unlike Putin, are invested in the West, and only succeed when the rest of us do as well. With Snowden, the US aim clearly became removing Putin.

The West perceived the end of the cold war differently than the US. Over here we love the myth of Reagan as being the guy who won the Cold War with American military might. That is a myth. The EU perceives it more as an economic integration, and that is really closer to reality. And, Merkel doesn't really want to remove Putin simply to that end.

I was going to post my question of how much longer Putin can wait to play the oil card?

Russia Preparing To Use Energy in Economic War DB
But, to answer your question, I'm sure a majority in the US congress wants to arm Ukraine yesterday. I'm pretty sure the intelligence and military want to do so too.

But Europe doesn't see this as the same military issue as the US. And Putin can shut off the gas. Sanctions are an effort to make him see cooperation can lead to both Russia and Europe having economic prosperity.

There's going on a civil war in the SE Ukraine and people are dying. NATO intervention to the conflict zone can stop it.

 

[bendog]

I admit, I didn't foresee Putin putting tanks into Ukraine. I'd thought it might end with the eastern most areas semi-autonomous and on the Russian dole, with Ukraine economically tied to the EU but without Nato membership. But damned if I see where Vlad wants this clusterfk to go.

 

[Drang nach Osten]

I admit, I didn't foresee Putin putting tanks into Ukraine. I'd thought it might end with the eastern most areas semi-autonomous and on the Russian dole, with Ukraine economically tied to the EU but without Nato membership. But damned if I see where Vlad wants this clusterfk to go.

Russian imperialism is not something that can satisfy its appetite with autonomy. It will demand more and more.
You had to stop this plague in Chechnya yet.

 

[Sonc]

"You had to stop this plague in Chechnya yet."
Many who have tried. All sucking dick =)))

 

[Drang nach Osten]

"You had to stop this plague in Chechnya yet."
Many who have tried. All sucking dick =)))

It depends. For example during the 1st Chechen War Chechen militia organized an impressive slaughterhouse for the occupiers.

 

[Sonc]

"You had to stop this plague in Chechnya yet."
Many who have tried. All sucking dick =)))

It depends. For example during the 1st Chechen War Chechen militia organized an impressive slaughterhouse for the occupiers.

We lost a few battles. So what?

Battle of Stalingrad
"... it was the single largest and bloodiest battle in the history of warfare".

Battle of Kursk - largest armoured clashes in history.
===============
Suvorov is one of the few generals in history who never lost a battle, being undefeated in over 60 (!!!) large battles while always having numerical disadvantage

We have a very rich military history. You found 1-2 small-small loss=)))

 

[Drang nach Osten]

"You had to stop this plague in Chechnya yet."
Many who have tried. All sucking dick =)))

It depends. For example during the 1st Chechen War Chechen militia organized an impressive slaughterhouse for the occupiers.

We lost a few battles. So what?

Battle of Stalingrad
"... it was the single largest and bloodiest battle in the history of warfare".

Battle of Kursk - largest armoured clashes in history.
===============
Suvorov is one of the few generals in history who never lost a battle, being undefeated in over 60 (!!!) large battles while always having numerical disadvantage

We have a very rich military history. You found 1-2 small-small loss=)))

Beyond any doubt. After all how can one be a bad soldier after such professional training course?

Training of Donbass militia by Kadyrov instructors.