Russia accuses West of 'immoral' stance on Syria

[Ringel05]

Yeah, like Russian has ever had the market on "moral" stance cornered.........

BBC News - Russia accuses West of 'immoral' stance on Syria

 

[Swagger]

I agree, in the sense that it's a rather pious line to take from a country that's run by immoral gypsies and gangsters. But Russia still wields a lot of influence in the Middle East, not to mention being in possession of huge gas reserves. Like it or not, their opinion counts, regardless of how it coincides or reflects upon their undeniably tarnished reputation.

 

[ekrem]

Yeah, like Russian has ever had the market on "moral" stance cornered.........

Let's count the innocent bodies that were killed in war or hostile acts in near history and let's look at Russia's share within these numbers. Russia doesn't bomb anyone and makes a "we bring democracy" Hollywood drama out of it.
With the exception of Georgia, where body-count was very very low Russia acts like a responsible actor within International System. Definitely more responsible and with more "moral"-stance then some other countries.

 

[Ringel05]

Yeah, like Russian has ever had the market on "moral" stance cornered.........

Let's count the innocent bodies that were killed in war or hostile acts in near history and let's look at Russia's share within these numbers. Russia doesn't bomb anyone and makes a "we bring democracy" Hollywood drama out of it.
With the exception of Georgia, where body-count was very very low Russia acts like a responsible actor within International System. Definitely more responsible and with more "moral"-stance then some other countries.

Aren't you getting dizzy yet?

 

[ekrem]

Aren't you getting dizzy yet?

You made a sarcastic comment about Russia and moral-stance.
I wrote down my conviction, that there isn't anything wrong with Russia's moral-stance as Russia is a peaceful and responsible member of International Community, based on the body-count it has caused in recent history.

 

[Swagger]

To be fair, Ringel, Ekrem does have a point.

 

[Ringel05]

To be fair, Ringel, Ekrem does have a point.

Obviously he, and apparently you, have forgotten about, or ignored Russia's history through the end of the cold war not to mention their history with their own or subjected peoples.
So again Ekrem, aren't you dizzy yet.

 

[GHook93]

Let's count the innocent bodies that were killed in war or hostile acts in near history and let's look at Russia's share within these numbers. Russia doesn't bomb anyone and makes a "we bring democracy" Hollywood drama out of it.
With the exception of Georgia, where body-count was very very low Russia acts like a responsible actor within International System. Definitely more responsible and with more "moral"-stance then some other countries.

I think Ukraine would disagree! Holodomor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Probably your terrorist Chechan friends would disagree!

Stalin is said have MURDERED 20 million of his own people!

What about Afghanistan? They invaded to bring communism to their neighbor. They killed 1 million plus there.

Name a former Soviet State and they will account atrocities committed by mother Russia.


Not to mention when they invaded other countries they aren't seeking to bring Democracy, they are seeking to suppress Democracy and bring socialism!

 

[High_Gravity]

Yeah, like Russian has ever had the market on "moral" stance cornered.........

Let's count the innocent bodies that were killed in war or hostile acts in near history and let's look at Russia's share within these numbers. Russia doesn't bomb anyone and makes a "we bring democracy" Hollywood drama out of it.
With the exception of Georgia, where body-count was very very low Russia acts like a responsible actor within International System. Definitely more responsible and with more "moral"-stance then some other countries.

I think the people in Chechnya would disagree you dumb fuck. Russia definently will not hesitate to use its Military for its own interests.

 

[High_Gravity]

Aren't you getting dizzy yet?

You made a sarcastic comment about Russia and moral-stance.
I wrote down my conviction, that there isn't anything wrong with Russia's moral-stance as Russia is a peaceful and responsible member of International Community, based on the body-count it has caused in recent history.

 

[Ringel05]

Aren't you getting dizzy yet?

You made a sarcastic comment about Russia and moral-stance.
I wrote down my conviction, that there isn't anything wrong with Russia's moral-stance as Russia is a peaceful and responsible member of International Community, based on the body-count it has caused in recent history.

Considering your claim I'd recommend a book, The Fighting Never Stopped (A Comprehensive Guide to World Conflict Since 1945) by Patrick Brogan.

 

[ekrem]

To be fair, Ringel, Ekrem does have a point.

Obviously he, and apparently you, have forgotten about, or ignored Russia's history through the end of the cold war not to mention their history with their own or subjected peoples.
So again Ekrem, aren't you dizzy yet.

Times change. Roles change.
And some still see in themselves a self-perception that's not really valid anymore.

Russia has clear interests in Syria, and Syria is the only Arab country where Russia achieved to preserve a sort of client-state relationship from the vast portfolio of Soviet foreign policy. That's not only talk from Russia, but it cultivated that relationship with multi-billion $ debt-reduction directly and indirectly by other means.

Russia also saw how a mandated "no-fly"-zone in Libya turned into a bombing mission with civilian and military targets and a resulting regime-change.
Russia is criticizing the stance of West vis-a-vis the Syrian opposition "fighters". And when you follow that conflict those fighters clearly raised their ability to hit the Syrian Army.

 

[High_Gravity]

To be fair, Ringel, Ekrem does have a point.

Obviously he, and apparently you, have forgotten about, or ignored Russia's history through the end of the cold war not to mention their history with their own or subjected peoples.
So again Ekrem, aren't you dizzy yet.

Times change. Roles change.
And some still see in themselves a self-perception that's not really valid anymore.

Russia has clear interests in Syria, and Syria is the only Arab country where Russia achieved to preserve a sort of client-state relationship from the vast portfolio of Soviet foreign policy. That's not only talk from Russia, but it cultivated that relationship with multi-billion $ debt-reduction directly and indirectly by other means.

Russia also saw how a mandated "no-fly"-zone in Libya turned into a bombing mission with civilian and military targets and a resulting regime-change.
Russia is criticizing the stance of West vis-a-vis the Syrian opposition "fighters". And when you follow that conflict those fighters clearly raised their ability to hit the Syrian Army.

Thats basically why Russia opposes regime change in Syria idiot, not because of any "moral" stance, Russia has no problem bombing the shit out of people when it serves their interest.

 

[ekrem]

Considering your claim I'd recommend a book, The Fighting Never Stopped (A Comprehensive Guide to World Conflict Since 1945) by Patrick Brogan.

I don't need to read a book to know what's going on in recent history.
It was not Russia, that invaded Iraq or bombed Libya.

Russia is a responsible member of I. Community. I don't expect, that Americans who were raised with Anti-Soviet feelings share my view. There's anyway a big discrepancy of how Americans view themselves and how their actions are perceived by world.

 

[ekrem]

Stalin is said have MURDERED 20 million of his own people!

Neither are modern day Russians responsible for what Stalin did nor are modern-day leaders of Russians behaving in any kind resembling Stalin.

 

[Ringel05]

Considering your claim I'd recommend a book, The Fighting Never Stopped (A Comprehensive Guide to World Conflict Since 1945) by Patrick Brogan.

I don't need to read a book to know what's going on in recent history.
It was not Russia, that invaded Iraq or bombed Libya.

Russia is a responsible member of I. Community. I don't expect, that Americans who were raised with Anti-Soviet feelings share my view. There's anyway a big discrepancy of how Americans view themselves and how their actions are perceived by world.

There's a great disparity on how Russia's allies perceive Russia and themselves as opposed to the rest of the world views them.
Oh and Libya was a NATO (mostly French) thing. The only real (potential) mistake we made was Iraq. BTW how I was raised to view Russia and how I have come to view them based on historical and social history/knowledge are two different things.
You really have to be getting dizzy by now.

 

[ekrem]

Oh and Libya was a NATO (mostly French) thing.

Agreed, others were dragged into it. But from Russia's point of view it does not matter who really is responsible for Libya. Russia just knows, that if it OKs any UNSC resolution on Syria it will be misused like the way it has been in Libya.

The only real (potential) mistake we made was Iraq.

Big time.

 

[Ringel05]

Stalin is said have MURDERED 20 million of his own people!

Neither are modern day Russians responsible for what Stalin did nor are modern-day leaders of Russians behaving in any kind resembling Stalin.

I wonder what the Chetznians (and a few others) would say about that. Check with the Russian state news agencies, they'd be more then happy to tell you how coddled and loved they are by the Russians.

 

[Ringel05]

Oh and Libya was a NATO (mostly French) thing.

Agreed, others were dragged into it. But from Russia's point of view it does not matter who really is responsible for Libya. Russia just knows, that if it OKs any UNSC resolution on Syria it will be misused like the way it has been in Libya.

The only real (potential) mistake we made was Iraq.

Big time.

Yeah, so? How does that have anything to do with the US other than there are some who want us to get involved?

 

[GHook93]

Stalin is said have MURDERED 20 million of his own people!

Neither are modern day Russians responsible for what Stalin did nor are modern-day leaders of Russians behaving in any kind resembling Stalin.

Sure they are!

I do find Turkey's stance on Syria ironic and hypocritical considering the inhumanities they continue inflict on people:
(1) Cyprus Occupation
(2) Kurdish Oppression
(3) Invasion of Kurdish Iraq
(4) Armenian Blockade, Oppression and Current Armenian Holocaust Denial
(5) Turkish Christian Persecution