Revolution!!!

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by Foxfyre, Aug 3, 2012.

?

So do you ever think about some sort of revolution per the OP?

  1. Yes. Sometimes I really do.

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  2. No way. Never!

    7 vote(s)
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  3. Not exactly, but we sure need a good overhaul.

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  4. No, but we need some new rules. I'll explain in my post.

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  1. Foxfyre
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    Foxfyre Eternal optimist Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    REVOLUTION!!!!

    (Disclaimer: This should not now or ever be construed that I am advocating an overthrow of our government. I would just as soon not have black helicopters hovering over the house and I don't want to wind up on the no fly list.)

    But for speculation and discussion only:

    From time to time in these political conversations, we have one or more members who think we are so completely screwed in this country, the only way out is to scrap the government we have, dust off the Constitution, and start over as it was in the beginning. (Hmmm, that sounds almost Biblical doesn't it?)

    Thomas Jefferson is quoted as noting the possibility that such would be necessary from time to time, and the concept is also included in the opening remarks of The Declaration of Independence.:

    "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. . . ."

    What do you think. Deep down where you keep your most heartfelt convictions, fears, and longings, do you harbor such thoughts?
     
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  2. there4eyeM
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    there4eyeM unlicensed metaphysician

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    The only possibly significant revolution cannot happen in the streets.

    It has to happen between the ears.
     
  3. Valerie
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    Valerie Gold Member

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    No :puke:
     
  4. Swagger
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    Swagger Gold Member

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    I've always wanted to an answer to this question. Do you think a revolutionary could successfully dismiss charges of terrorism and/or murder upon referring to the clause contained in what you've quoted in a court of law?

    Also, do you think that the U.S. military would sympathise, Constitutionally speaking, with revolutionaries they'd been tasked with confronting, and disobey their orders accordingly?
     
  5. Swagger
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    Swagger Gold Member

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    Coincidentally, though without wanting to distract from the OP, I've often contemplated the outcome of revolution within the EU, and the consequences/benefits of its dissolvement.
     
  6. Foxfyre
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    Foxfyre Eternal optimist Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    To your first question no. I can say it with impunity (though I would probably go on the government watch list), but should I act on it, I would be committing treason under our existing laws and subject to very severe penalities.

    As to the second question, I don't know how the military would act if they were convinced an unconstitutional government was overthrown by the people--I rather think they would side with the people. But. . . .the operative word is 'convinced' and that might be a tall order to accomplish.
     
  7. there4eyeM
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    there4eyeM unlicensed metaphysician

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    No.
     
  8. Foxfyre
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    Foxfyre Eternal optimist Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    And yes, you would be dealing with many of the same kinds of issues and consequences that we would should you attempt to remove what you believed was a corrupt and/or ineffective government. The relationships within the E.U. would likely complicate that too. The U.S. has no such relationship with any other country however so our would most likely be strictly a civil thing.

    I'm sure it would generate a huge amount of interest from all other countries however. :)
     
  9. JakeStarkey
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    JakeStarkey Diamond Member Supporting Member

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    Excellent OP.

    Couple of observations: revolutions can happen democratically (Nazi Germany).

    Military units normally follow the officers appointed over them. I don't think that a conspiracy within the general staff officership or among the division and corps commanders would withstand its own internal security requirements. Somebodies would out the coup plotters far too early for them to have a chance.
     
  10. Vast LWC
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    Vast LWC <-Mohammed

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    I imagine one would have to ask what grounds would you be fomenting said revolution on?

    Certainly not any of the trivial disagreements that partisans have been basing their political campaigns on recently...

    There would have to be some pretty damn serious grounds for an actual uprising, and I can't see anything that's going on right now that would warrant it.
     

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