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If that's the truth, we'd be watching the indictment of a president.
Watch the ads. It really is that simple.
If the ads were really about the stimulus, not Obama, they would have aired on more than just Madcow and Obelfart's shows.
Wait a second
I live in Florida--the economy in Florida sucks!!
That is why I am voting for Romney--unless Gary Johnson can win my vote.
Gross State Domestic Product (in millions):
- $680,277 - 2005
- $730,191 - 2006
- $759,572 - 2007
- $747,770 - 2008
- $732,782 - 2009
- $747,735 - 2010
Mr. Roberts and Mr. Volpe also said Labor Department research showed that advertisements would reach the target demographic of business owners and managers interested in hiring green-trained employees through a programming list that initially also included shows hosted by CNNs Larry King and public televisions Jim Lehrer as well as the two MSNBC programs where the ads eventually appeared.
Maybe it's me...
Where does this prove anything underhanded?
Well, they said it was fine so it must be fine. or... alternatively, one could watch the ads and decide for oneself whether it was appropriate use of stimulus funds... personally, I was supportive of the theory of the stimulus... it was the application and distribution of it that was a clusterfuck.
Wait a second
I live in Florida--the economy in Florida sucks!!
That is why I am voting for Romney--unless Gary Johnson can win my vote.
Until Romney told him to keep his trap shut, your governor was saying something a bit different not too long ago...
On Fla's own website (StateofFlorida.com)
Gross State Domestic Product (in millions):
- $680,277 - 2005
- $730,191 - 2006
- $759,572 - 2007
- $747,770 - 2008
- $732,782 - 2009
- $747,735 - 2010
Maybe it's me...
Where does this prove anything underhanded?
Well, they said it was fine so it must be fine. or... alternatively, one could watch the ads and decide for oneself whether it was appropriate use of stimulus funds... personally, I was supportive of the theory of the stimulus... it was the application and distribution of it that was a clusterfuck.
I would be interested in seeing those ads - got a link?
Application and distribution is done at the state level though, just the way most conservatives like it. Who ought to get blamed if it's mishandled? The Feds who tried to help, or the States who used the funds in way that were unintended?
Watch the ads. It really is that simple.
If the ads were really about the stimulus, not Obama, they would have aired on more than just Madcow and Obelfart's shows.
Particularly considering their ratings... a genuine 'stimulus' advertising campaign would have spent considerably more and gone for more appropriate 'opportunity to see' ratings. Liberals just go along with whatever they're told. They seem to have lost their ability to reason, question or investigate.
If the ads were really about the stimulus, not Obama, they would have aired on more than just Madcow and Obelfart's shows.
Particularly considering their ratings... a genuine 'stimulus' advertising campaign would have spent considerably more and gone for more appropriate 'opportunity to see' ratings. Liberals just go along with whatever they're told. They seem to have lost their ability to reason, question or investigate.
Only Liberals?
Now let's be fair and paint the whole issue with the same brush.
The same article which is being used to allege campaign fund misappropriation also goes on to state that several shows were considered for targeting the ads, NPR being rejected due to it's high prices. If this were truly a political statement, it would stand to reason that the targets wouldn't be a national audience but directed to areas where it would make a political difference. Again - the claim is that they were trying to stimulate job growth targeting greenies who would most likely be watching liberal TV. I know how you folks hate being reasonable, but...
IMO, the right is equally guilty of not thinking critically about the things it gets fed as well.
I don't know about you, I tend to go directly to the source before I make up my mind. The data tells you a pretty good story, and you don't have to try to figure out when an apple is being compared to a gorilla.
Case in point would be the country's unemployment rate. The news tells you that even though there was a stimulus, our unemployment rate stays at 8.3% for this year. The Bureau of Labor Statistics bears that out with it's monthly report (Employment Situation Summary). Here, they also tell you that 1,208,000 jobs were created since the beginning of the year (well - they actually give it as a monthly average...). This would tend to say that business itself has stagnated - they are laying off and outsourcing just as fast as new companies are joining the ranks.
This isn't about politics, so much as it's about profits. It won't matter much who you choose as a scapegoat, it won't get "fixed" in any election.
So your scapegoat are those damn evil companies and corporations. Yes, a horrible economy is exactly what businessmen want. The rhetoric of the left when it comes to their hatred of the private sector is astounding. The government holds no culpability in the housing crisis, it was all some Gordon Geko type asshole. Obama's policies have not worked because those damn bastards are sabotaging him.
What you are saying is absurd, and is a flimsy attempt to excuse the policies that have directly caused and contributed to the stagnant unemployment (which in reality is way above 8% had the numbers not been manipulated) and glacial economic growth.
In fact, when Romney/Ryan win the in November, I believe that alone will greatly increase businesses confidence in what the regulatory and tax situation will be under his administration. I think overnight the economy will begin showing signs of actual growth and recovery.
You're saying that it was "lack of confidence" that lead to the stagnation of business? How much cash could the administration have thrown to those folks to "improve" their confidence? The facts are that the smallest ventures are doing quite nicely now due to the tax breaks they've been given - although Faux news would have you believe differently.
Now - let's look at the whole picture.
The current administration has dumped more cash into the economy than anyone ever has. It propped up 2 major corporations who - by all rights - should have tanked. It held up the banking infrastructure to forestall a full-scale depression - and continues to pay exorbitant amounts of cash now that the banks are solvent again.
Republicans have been using stalling and obstruction tactics more during this administration than in any other. They get most of their campaign financing from the "evil corporations", which fund the superPACs, who are using their own stalling and obstruction tactics to hold the economy at bay. While screaming over and over how it's all Obama's fault.
To my way of thinking, we paid business a huge amount of cash to push our economy and get us all back to work again. They took that cash and went on vacation. They defaulted. They reneged. The very tactic that worked in every administration facing a recession failed this time - and my opinion is that the failure was deliberate. And so what? No one can vote a CEO out of office. The corporate profits continue regardless. And, at least according to the Dow, investments are WAY up there.
I think it's time to wake up to the fact that it wouldn't matter which party holds office any more. "Business" now OWNS this country, and they've proved it very convincingly so far.
Well, they said it was fine so it must be fine. or... alternatively, one could watch the ads and decide for oneself whether it was appropriate use of stimulus funds... personally, I was supportive of the theory of the stimulus... it was the application and distribution of it that was a clusterfuck.
I would be interested in seeing those ads - got a link?
Application and distribution is done at the state level though, just the way most conservatives like it. Who ought to get blamed if it's mishandled? The Feds who tried to help, or the States who used the funds in way that were unintended?
Oh, please. All the credit, none of the blame. Your allegiance to your messiah is sweet - but laughable. Are you gonna blame Bush next?
His stimulus... his problem.
And... if you want to see the fucking ads - do what I did - research it for yourself. I don't spoon feed lazy assclowns. Educate yourself. I ain't your teacher.
I would be interested in seeing those ads - got a link?
Application and distribution is done at the state level though, just the way most conservatives like it. Who ought to get blamed if it's mishandled? The Feds who tried to help, or the States who used the funds in way that were unintended?
Oh, please. All the credit, none of the blame. Your allegiance to your messiah is sweet - but laughable. Are you gonna blame Bush next?
His stimulus... his problem.
And... if you want to see the fucking ads - do what I did - research it for yourself. I don't spoon feed lazy assclowns. Educate yourself. I ain't your teacher.
And here we go from having a discussion to trading barbs... Predictable for you, darlin. Unable to support your conspiracy theory, you drop the pretenses. I only asked if you had the link - back when all this was going down, I wasn't all that interested in the Democratic party so I didn't watch MSNBC all that much.
I AM educating myself - every day. Most of the lessons have been how far the conservatives have been misleading the public. FAR MORE than the liberals who do the same damn thing. Just once, I'd like to have a discussion without it breaking down into insults and vulgarity when I find out how much you DON'T know.
Particularly considering their ratings... a genuine 'stimulus' advertising campaign would have spent considerably more and gone for more appropriate 'opportunity to see' ratings. Liberals just go along with whatever they're told. They seem to have lost their ability to reason, question or investigate.
Only Liberals?
Now let's be fair and paint the whole issue with the same brush.
The same article which is being used to allege campaign fund misappropriation also goes on to state that several shows were considered for targeting the ads, NPR being rejected due to it's high prices. If this were truly a political statement, it would stand to reason that the targets wouldn't be a national audience but directed to areas where it would make a political difference. Again - the claim is that they were trying to stimulate job growth targeting greenies who would most likely be watching liberal TV. I know how you folks hate being reasonable, but...
Again, for the slow kids, if your targeting a specific audience - say small business owners - you target your ads with the greatest 'opportunity to see' (you might need to google that to understand the term).... you don't slot ads into two of the very left wing talking heads available... given that small business owners are not a rabid liberals. You do get the basic logic of that, right?
And... fyi.... I am not 'you folks'. I am an independent conservative.... I generally despise both GOP and Dems equally.... except Romney... because he's smart.
Oh, please. All the credit, none of the blame. Your allegiance to your messiah is sweet - but laughable. Are you gonna blame Bush next?
His stimulus... his problem.
And... if you want to see the fucking ads - do what I did - research it for yourself. I don't spoon feed lazy assclowns. Educate yourself. I ain't your teacher.
And here we go from having a discussion to trading barbs... Predictable for you, darlin. Unable to support your conspiracy theory, you drop the pretenses. I only asked if you had the link - back when all this was going down, I wasn't all that interested in the Democratic party so I didn't watch MSNBC all that much.
I AM educating myself - every day. Most of the lessons have been how far the conservatives have been misleading the public. FAR MORE than the liberals who do the same damn thing. Just once, I'd like to have a discussion without it breaking down into insults and vulgarity when I find out how much you DON'T know.
I'm not your 'darlin'. And I don't do 'conspiracy theories', I use critical thought to evaluate evidence and form opinions... that means I don't watch MSNBC, Fox, etc etc etc. I don't accept sentences without knowing the full context. I don't automatically believe one side or the other... I find out for myself.
The ads were, in my considered opinion, misuse of government funds for campaigning. I read the accusation, I found the ads for myself, I looked at where those ads were placed - on two left wing talking head shows - and concluded that it was not about targeting a message to small business... it was about preaching to the ObamaNation, masquerading as green energy ads. It's not overly complicated.
If you want to have discussions without it breaking down into insults, stay in the kindergarten area - or the 'clean debate forum'.
No, the report does not state that stimulus worked. It says that Florida benefited from the extra money provided. Any state or locality would benefit from extra money supplied from the federal government.
The stimulus did not jumpstart the economy, or even provide jobs, beyond keeping state and local union members employed. Like most left wing ideas, it flopped. FDR turned a recession into a depression, and it appears that Obama, using the same tactics, is repeating history. Who woulda thunk it?
That's right he is only responsible for the good things that happen in Republican states.
That's not what I said at all. Just wondering how folks can nit-pick the "OMG" stuff out of what a Democrat president did for the economy, hold it up as proof of his unworthiness to hold the office, and completely disregard the fact that the mismanagement they blame on a Democrat was actually the fault of a Republican governor.
That's pretty specific, isn't it?
The fact is that the billions of dollars spent under a Democrat controlled Congress and White House failed, and from the top down fraud is rampant on a national scale.
The only way that the massive federal spending, contributing to continual record breaking deficit spending under this administration, can be labelled a success is if you believe the illogical proving of a negative, ie it saved or created millions, oh F-it billions of jobs.
I'm sure you do believe that, but lets not forget that the Bush Tax Cuts, that that same Congress and White House extended, saved or created millions of jobs as well.
Wait a second
I live in Florida--the economy in Florida sucks!!
That is why I am voting for Romney--unless Gary Johnson can win my vote.
Until Romney told him to keep his trap shut, your governor was saying something a bit different not too long ago...
On Fla's own website (StateofFlorida.com)
Gross State Domestic Product (in millions):
- $680,277 - 2005
- $730,191 - 2006
- $759,572 - 2007
- $747,770 - 2008
- $732,782 - 2009
- $747,735 - 2010
IMO, the right is equally guilty of not thinking critically about the things it gets fed as well.
I don't know about you, I tend to go directly to the source before I make up my mind. The data tells you a pretty good story, and you don't have to try to figure out when an apple is being compared to a gorilla.
Case in point would be the country's unemployment rate. The news tells you that even though there was a stimulus, our unemployment rate stays at 8.3% for this year. The Bureau of Labor Statistics bears that out with it's monthly report (Employment Situation Summary). Here, they also tell you that 1,208,000 jobs were created since the beginning of the year (well - they actually give it as a monthly average...). This would tend to say that business itself has stagnated - they are laying off and outsourcing just as fast as new companies are joining the ranks.
This isn't about politics, so much as it's about profits. It won't matter much who you choose as a scapegoat, it won't get "fixed" in any election.
So your scapegoat are those damn evil companies and corporations. Yes, a horrible economy is exactly what businessmen want. The rhetoric of the left when it comes to their hatred of the private sector is astounding. The government holds no culpability in the housing crisis, it was all some Gordon Geko type asshole. Obama's policies have not worked because those damn bastards are sabotaging him.
What you are saying is absurd, and is a flimsy attempt to excuse the policies that have directly caused and contributed to the stagnant unemployment (which in reality is way above 8% had the numbers not been manipulated) and glacial economic growth.
In fact, when Romney/Ryan win the in November, I believe that alone will greatly increase businesses confidence in what the regulatory and tax situation will be under his administration. I think overnight the economy will begin showing signs of actual growth and recovery.
You're saying that it was "lack of confidence" that lead to the stagnation of business? How much cash could the administration have thrown to those folks to "improve" their confidence? The facts are that the smallest ventures are doing quite nicely now due to the tax breaks they've been given - although Faux news would have you believe differently.
Now - let's look at the whole picture.
The current administration has dumped more cash into the economy than anyone ever has. It propped up 2 major corporations who - by all rights - should have tanked. It held up the banking infrastructure to forestall a full-scale depression - and continues to pay exorbitant amounts of cash now that the banks are solvent again.
Republicans have been using stalling and obstruction tactics more during this administration than in any other. They get most of their campaign financing from the "evil corporations", which fund the superPACs, who are using their own stalling and obstruction tactics to hold the economy at bay. While screaming over and over how it's all Obama's fault.
To my way of thinking, we paid business a huge amount of cash to push our economy and get us all back to work again. They took that cash and went on vacation. They defaulted. They reneged. The very tactic that worked in every administration facing a recession failed this time - and my opinion is that the failure was deliberate. And so what? No one can vote a CEO out of office. The corporate profits continue regardless. And, at least according to the Dow, investments are WAY up there.
I think it's time to wake up to the fact that it wouldn't matter which party holds office any more. "Business" now OWNS this country, and they've proved it very convincingly so far.
Very few people are going to buy new automobiles, or other durable items, when they worry whether they are going to have a job next week, or next month.
