Repeal the 17th Amendment?

[ShackledNation]

Prior to the 1913 passage of the 17th amendment, Senators were elected by state legislatures. The reason for this was simple. State legislatures have more of an incentive to protect a federal system of separation of powers than do the people. Citizens of one state would be more likely to allow the federal government to expand its control over the states than the state governments themselves.

The 17th Amendment was passed because of a procedural problem in the original concept and not because of a need to alter the balance of power. The procedural problem consisted of frequent deadlocks when the state legislatures were trying to select a senator. When deadlocked, a state would go without representation in the Senate. This happened to New York in the first Congress, going without a senator for 3 months.

The 17th amendment, calling for popular election of senators, fixed the procedural problems, but also inappropriately and unintentionally altered the balance of power. Instead, the 17th Amendment should have fixed the procedural problems and left the balance of power between the states and the federal government intact. The result has been ever more massive expansion of federal power and a deterioration of individual liberty and state sovereignty. More wars are fought, more debt is accumulated, and power is centralized. Marijuana criminalization, many of these wars, the massive welfare state, and other unconstitutional actions may never have occurred with the ability of the states to check the central government.

Thoughts?

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

It was a power grab by the federal government. They knew exactly what they were doing and it will never be repealed.

 

[Avatar4321]

It can and will be repealed when the people accept that it was a mistake. Problem is everyone is always like "Oh that will never work" and no one bothers actually educating the American people on the matter.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

It can and will be repealed when the people accept that it was a mistake. Problem is everyone is always like "Oh that will never work" and no one bothers actually educating the American people on the matter.

It will not be repealed because the American people as a whole have little to no knowledge whatsoever on the history of our government and why it was originally set up the way it was.

 

[Avatar4321]

It can and will be repealed when the people accept that it was a mistake. Problem is everyone is always like "Oh that will never work" and no one bothers actually educating the American people on the matter.

It will not be repealed because the American people as a whole have little to no knowledge whatsoever on the history of our government and why it was originally set up the way it was.

And that is precisely why we need to educate them.

 

[Richard-H]

It's interesting to see all you wing nuts suddenly want to take the power away from the people and give it to government.

Senators should be elected by the people directly, not by other politicians.

Of course the only reason why your for appealing the 17th amendment is that at the moment, the Senate is controlled by Democrats. If it were controlled by Republicans you'd all be up inarms defending the 17th amendment.

You're all so full of SHIT I can smell you thru the internet!

 

[rightwinger]

Taking the right to vote for representatives away from the people will always be popular

Only idiots support repealing the 17th amendment. You have a better chance of repealing the first amendment

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

It's interesting to see all you wing nuts suddenly want to take the power away from the people and give it to government.

Taking the right to vote for representatives away from the people will always be popular

Only idiots support repealing the 17th amendment.

And the ignorant speak.

I rest my case.

 

[Greenbeard]

It was a power grab by the federal government.

If memory serves, a majority of states were already de fact popularly choosing senators at the time and support was growing in the states for calling an Article V convention to institutionalize the practice. Ultimately, of course, that's not how the amendment originated but it was ratified by three-fourths of the states, as required.

How is that a federal power grab?

 

[Moonglow]

Then we should go back to letting the president and vice president be elected by Congress also.

 

[rightwinger]

It's interesting to see all you wing nuts suddenly want to take the power away from the people and give it to government.

Taking the right to vote for representatives away from the people will always be popular

Only idiots support repealing the 17th amendment.

And the ignorant speak.

I rest my case.

You are going to go out to the American people and convince them that politicians will do a better job of selecting Senators in a back room than they will do in an open election?

You are a fucking idiot

I rest my case

 

[Greenbeard]

You are going to go out to the American people and convince them that politicians will do a better job of selecting Senators in a back room than they will do in an open election?

 

[del]

i wouldn't trust my state legislature to choose an ice cream flavor, let alone a senator

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Of course the only reason why your for appealing the 17th amendment is that at the moment, the Senate is controlled by Democrats. If it were controlled by Republicans you'd all be up inarms defending the 17th amendment.

Actually that’s the idea…

The right wants to repeal the 17th Amendment not in an effort to restore the Constitution a little more to its ‘original intent,’ but to allow the GOP to take permanent control of the Senate. They know that a majority of state houses are now in republican control, and will remain that way for the foreseeable future – particularly in the South and Mountain West. Consequently those republican controlled states will send republican senators to Congress.

Given the fact the desire to repeal the 17th Amendment is more about a partisan power grab than a desire to make Congress less dysfunctional, no one can support such an effort in good faith.

 

[rightwinger]

Hey...I got an idea!

Let's repeal the second amendment and then we can move on to the seventeenth

 

[8537]

It was a power grab by the federal government. They knew exactly what they were doing and it will never be repealed.

A power grab by the federal government? It's an amendment to the Constitution. If I remember anything from civics, I seem to recall that 2/3s of the states had to ratify it before it became law.

Did 2/3s of the states decide they wanted their power grabbed?

On a completely unrelated note: Is that your dog in your sig? I laugh my ass off everytime I read one of your posts.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

It's interesting to see all you wing nuts suddenly want to take the power away from the people and give it to government.

Taking the right to vote for representatives away from the people will always be popular

Only idiots support repealing the 17th amendment.

And the ignorant speak.

I rest my case.

You are going to go out to the American people and convince them that politicians will do a better job of selecting Senators in a back room than they will do in an open election?

You are a fucking idiot

I rest my case

No, I'm not going to do that because I already said TWICE it could never happen. So being that I'm the one who is able to read and you aren't, it's more than obvious who the fucking idiot is. You might want to stop digging your hole now.

 

[rightwinger]

It was a power grab by the federal government. They knew exactly what they were doing and it will never be repealed.

A power grab by the federal government? It's an amendment to the Constitution. If I remember anything from civics, I seem to recall that 2/3s of the states had to ratify it before it became law.

Did 2/3s of the states decide they wanted their power grabbed?

On a completely unrelated note: Is that your dog in your sig? I laugh my ass off everytime I read one of your posts.

I'm with you...

I have an Australian Shepherd like the one in the video. Trying to figure out how to teach her to get my beer

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

It was a power grab by the federal government. They knew exactly what they were doing and it will never be repealed.

A power grab by the federal government? It's an amendment to the Constitution. If I remember anything from civics, I seem to recall that 2/3s of the states had to ratify it before it became law.

Did 2/3s of the states decide they wanted their power grabbed?

Just because the states were complicit with it doesn't change what it was. The Senate was created to represent the interests of the state governments, not the people. When the 17th Amendment became law the states lost their biggest defense against the feds overpowering them. Power shifted from them to the federal government. All of these unfunded mandates that the feds say the states have to do today (Medicaid, No Child Left Behind, ObamaCare, etc.) is the result of that. None of those programs would have seen the light of day without the 17th.

 

[shintao]

It can and will be repealed when the people accept that it was a mistake. Problem is everyone is always like "Oh that will never work" and no one bothers actually educating the American people on the matter.

It will not be repealed because the American people as a whole have little to no knowledge whatsoever on the history of our government and why it was originally set up the way it was.

And that is precisely why we need to educate them.

Try it with your nonunion home schooling and let me know how it works out.